New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

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rainer

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New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostMon Jun 10, 2013 7:07 pm

Hi !

So as Apple has announced its new cylindric "barebone" Mac Pro, what now?

Currently its not clear if the GPUs could be changed to a Nvidia....

Will it be possible to get GPUs in external Thunderbolt to PCIe chassis running?
As what I know its currently not possible with the OSX drivers, only under Windows,
and current chassis don't support the new v2 thunderbolt standard....
so currently maximum 4 Lanes...

http://www.engadget.com/2013/06/10/appl ... -redesign/

Whats your thoughts... ???

Rainer
Rainer Fritz, k-effects | Postproduction, VFX, Animation, Design
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Grant Petty

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostMon Jun 10, 2013 7:33 pm

Hi,

I think this new MacPro is amazing and those 2 GPUs are incredibly powerful. I am not sure what I can say however there is a whole new OpenCL and DaVinci Resolve 10 is having lots of performance work done to integrate it and its really really fast. Those GPUs are very high performance and each GPU has lots of graphics memory so this is the Mac we have been waiting for! We have lots of Thunderbolt products too so video in and out is taken care of.

We will have more details once the engineering guys get back from WWDC and we know more.

Overall we could not be happier!

Regards,

Grant Petty
Blackmagic Design
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anders hoft

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostMon Jun 10, 2013 7:44 pm

Grant Petty wrote:Hi,

I think this new MacPro is amazing and those 2 GPUs are incredibly powerful. I am not sure what I can say however there is a whole new OpenCL and DaVinci Resolve 10 is having lots of performance work done to integrate it and its really really fast. Those GPUs are very high performance and each GPU has lots of graphics memory so this is the Mac we have been waiting for! We have lots of Thunderbolt products too so video in and out is taken care of.

We will have more details once the engineering guys get back from WWDC and we know more.

Overall we could not be happier!

Regards,

Grant Petty
Blackmagic Design


Thanks Grant, this is great news!!
Anders Hoft
CINEMATOGRAPHER from Norway /// Studying Cinematography at The National Polish Film School in Łódź

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rainer

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostMon Jun 10, 2013 7:54 pm

Thanks Grant for this first information....
Rainer Fritz, k-effects | Postproduction, VFX, Animation, Design
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Anthony Vescio

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostMon Jun 10, 2013 9:33 pm

Great to hear Grant, thank you for posting!!
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ChrisBee

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostMon Jun 10, 2013 10:31 pm

That *is* great to hear. And expected.

Today, one of the messages that I took home was this:

Apple is listening. We are not.

Did you notice all the quips about leaks, rumours and general opinion of them. If I didn't know any better I'd say they're hanging out the same places online that we do. After all, how hard would it be for them to monitor their own forums plus come here and reduser, creativecow etc.

It's really just the case of people wanting a bigger horse instead of a car.
In spite of CUDA being well-supported by some popular apps, it's kind of the Adobe Flash of GPUs.
Just as CUDA has evolved, so will OpenCL and support for it.

This (Resolve 10) should serve as a good example of where things are going.
What is it that the majority really want CUDA for anyway? Resolve + Smoke, Premiere and After Effects.
We can now scratch Resolve off the list of "neeed CUUUDAAA" applications.
There is already some OpenCL acceleration in Premiere and I'm betting we will see more of that in Smoke and After Effects as well.

Again, excellent news, and I for one can't wait to get one and race around in Resolve.
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Jules Bushell

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostMon Jun 10, 2013 11:58 pm

ChrisBee wrote:In spite of CUDA being well-supported by some popular apps, it's kind of the Adobe Flash of GPUs.

What!? No it is not. Let's not confuse people with what CUDA is.
First all all CUDA is NVIDIA's GPU programming language that works on only their own video cards and doesn't have to support other brands.
It is not bloated but lean, more closer to the metal than OpenCL. Uses a mixture C++ and device level functions for better performance possibilities than OpenCL. The former compiled by a C++ compiler, the latter using NVIDIA libraries.
CUDA is extremely stable with excellent debugging tools, such a NSight, that are again free.

CUDA and Flash are just not similar or anything close.

Jules
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Anthony Torres

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 11, 2013 12:36 am

Thanks for posting, Grant! Great to hear this new Mac Pro is good for running Resolve 9/10 and the forthcoming Production Camera. Thanks again!
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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 11, 2013 5:58 am

Resolve 9 will not run really good on this machine, because of missing CUDA hardware in it, but when the new Mac Pro will come, Resolve 10 will hit the ground.
The GPUs seems to be manufactured in a special design as shown here: http://www.apple.com/mac-pro/
So it seems it is not a standard form factor and replace it with an other one.
For me it is more the fact, that we have now for all us really pro users connecting storage etc. via external PCIe boxes. How do you want to connect your SAS RAID or your 10GbE network? The PCI Flash Memory in there will be extremely fast, but will be not that big and extremely expensive.
Think of the formfactor of the machine it self in our 19inch racks. Where do you want to put your RedRocket etc. Or if you using Avid hardware... Or a simple BluRay drive... everything will hang around on cables of the machine... Sorry that I must say that, but a real professional machine would offer at least PCIe sockets. Why we don't see from beginning the possibility to choose our GPU of choice? A small cylinder with tons of thunderbolt cables and external boxes thats now pro? Completely closed systems seems to be the new way... It looks like a blown up iMac...
Rainer Fritz, k-effects | Postproduction, VFX, Animation, Design
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Roman Pytkin Pekarek

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 11, 2013 7:00 am

yes U r right ..

Does anybody know , that apple will stop old "silver" MAC PRO models ? Or will be manufactured paralel ?
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Joerg Baczko

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 11, 2013 8:14 am

Pytkin wrote:yes U r right ..

Does anybody know , that apple will stop old "silver" MAC PRO models ? Or will be manufactured paralel ?



are you kidding...of course not
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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 11, 2013 3:49 pm

Hi guys.

Does it mean that Resolve 10 is going to use OpenCL as well as CUDA?

I have 2010 MP with ATI card and I was thinking about buying Nvidia Graphics and now I hear that it can be that I will don't have to.

Thanks
Tom
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vondoomliff

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 11, 2013 4:14 pm

Will noise reduction now work without a CUDA capable card in Resolve 10?
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Rohit Gupta

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 11, 2013 5:31 pm

vondoomliff wrote:Will noise reduction now work without a CUDA capable card in Resolve 10?


Yes it will.
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vondoomliff

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 11, 2013 5:57 pm

Will existing Mac Pro owners with one f the current AMD cards (5770/5870) be able to leverage this capability or is it only going to work with the FirePro cards in the forthcoming Pro?
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rick.lang

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 11, 2013 6:14 pm

vondoomliff wrote:Will existing Mac Pro owners with one f the current AMD cards (5770/5870) be able to leverage this capability or is it only going to work with the FirePro cards in the forthcoming Pro?


I think Grant Petty said they are tuning Resolve 10 to take advantage of the latest version of OpenCL. So that may be the limiting factor for older OpenCL cards achieving full functionality.

Rick Lang
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sean mclennan

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 11, 2013 9:43 pm

Grant / Rohit / anyone at BM....will Resolve 10 still support CUDA?
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Rohit Gupta

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 11, 2013 10:13 pm

sean mclennan wrote:Grant / Rohit / anyone at BM....will Resolve 10 still support CUDA?


Yes of course!
Rohit Gupta

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sean mclennan

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostWed Jun 12, 2013 2:10 am

Rohit Gupta wrote:
sean mclennan wrote:Grant / Rohit / anyone at BM....will Resolve 10 still support CUDA?


Yes of course!


Thank you for the prompt reply!
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Grant Petty

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostWed Jun 12, 2013 5:38 am

Hi,

Yes we will still do CUDA of course and thats very powerful. I guess with Resolve working to get maximum performance on three different platforms and two brands of GPU, plus of course all those file formats we need to support natively, the big issue for Resolve will be that we just need to work harder to make everything work well. So we have quite a lot of engineers just working on performance tuning for all these things! So CUDA is still very important and so we will keep up with that too.

Grant
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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostWed Jun 12, 2013 6:48 am

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rainer

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostWed Jun 12, 2013 2:14 pm

Thats great, that you invest so much work into Resolve. It's a great Software.
If I had a wish, I would wish a Linux version which runs with the Tangent Panels and on Debian or Ubuntu ;)
even when we only get it as dongle version... since there is already a Linux version... and the decklink cards working great in the linux boxes... so when we get the special mac pro edition it would be great to see that as well !
best,
rainer
Rainer Fritz, k-effects | Postproduction, VFX, Animation, Design
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Willem Timmersma

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostWed Jun 12, 2013 5:23 pm

So if i understand correctly, Davinci Resolve 10 will run better then Resolve 9 on my AMD Radeon HD 6970M 2048 MB Card?
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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostWed Jun 12, 2013 7:53 pm

I've always viewed CUDA as an extremely powerful, but very specific band-aid.
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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostFri Jun 14, 2013 4:10 am

Grant, perhaps BMD could save the day and come up with some Thunderbolt external enclosures at BMD prices? One for housing a 4 drive RAID and one for housing PCI cards would be great please! Or maybe do it all in the one rack mounted case designed to sit under and secure the new iCan case and throw in some extra front and rear mounted USB ports please. And if you want to go real crazy a built in UPS too!

While your Thunderbolt I/O products are great (and we have several) they arent the answer to everything. What about where we might want to run a Decklink Quad or a couple of Decklink Studios for a playout or ingest server? Given that an Ultrastudio cant be daisy-chained we will run out of TB ports real quick. We could move to a PC but no-one has really developed decent PC software for these purposes yet such as the Softron range (which is OSX only).

However you spin it, and despite the CPU and graphics horsepower on offer, the new Mac Pro is actually a deal-breaker for us. No internal storage, no internal PCI and no real rack-mount potential. Where the #$%& am I going to mount the iCan in my OB truck? All our Mac Pro suites (that we have been waiting on this announcement to upgrade) will require costly external enclosures and a forced upgrade of many of our existing peripherals to suit. It's interesting that within 24 hours of it being announced Softron were out there trying to ally fears as well.

Pat Sproule.
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Bruce Payan

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostMon Jun 17, 2013 12:26 pm

"We have lots of Thunderbolt products too so video in and out is taken care of. "

With the new Mac Pro, I would be looking for a 1080p60 HDMI output solution. This is currently (really) available only to pre-2013 MacPro users via Decklink Extreme 4K PCIe.

What would really get me excited?

A Mini-Monitor-type solution, compatible with Thunderbolt2, that could do 1080p60. That would rock.
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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostMon Jun 17, 2013 7:32 pm

What we will need is a 4k thunderbolt solution.. and machine control as well. Tape is not dead yet..
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Luis Otero

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 18, 2013 2:07 pm

Grant / Rohit / Peter,

Any clarification on the external IO options for 4K that will provide support for both, RGB and X'Y'Z'? Or are you going to offer an external (affordable) chassis with TB/USB 3 connectivity, with enough bandwidth for real-time playback and monitoring?

Please advise,
Luis
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rainer

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostTue Jun 18, 2013 6:48 pm

So as we see that there will be the new TB chipset implemented in the new mac pros. Three chips with two interfaces each. So every two IFs will share one chipset. The TB v2 will make it possible to give out a 4k signal plus a storage signal, what's with the current implementation not possible. So it will be also a question regarding bandwidth what you connect on which interface to get your desired performance when you want to do 4k, specialy when you want to work with uncompressed or RAW footage.
So yes, it would be great to have one of the awesome BlackMagic TB video interfaces with a HDMI 1.4 and a 3g/6g dual HD-SDI interface to be 4k fit.
As Pat stated, all the interfaces would be needed to put it into a professional surrounding. Displays, Video Interfaces, Storage Connection, 10GbE, RedRockets, etc...
So you could give Linux an additional chance. You did it with your High End Resolve Version, so please give us the chance with the Desktop Distros (Debian/Ubuntu). For all people which will be not satisfied with the way Apple goes, it would be a great alternative and would put Resolve at least on an additional, broader platform.
As said, Windows is not the alternative...
Rainer Fritz, k-effects | Postproduction, VFX, Animation, Design
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qchatmonkey

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostWed Jun 25, 2014 3:36 pm

I have the new Mac PRO: 12 Cores, 64G RAM, D700 Graphics cards and I can't get Davinci to work with the NEW 4K RAW Update. With 10.9.3 I get Hard Reset Crashes with DR 10.x and the 11 Beta, with OSX 10.94 Beta I get weird CUDA errors (Having CUDA installed or NOT even though the graphics cards are AMD??!!)

What is going on??? I can make Davinci resolve work on my giant beast, but it works fine on my laptop???

I just want to make sure 4K is working and not dropping frames but I can't male DR work on my main machine.
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Helge Tjelta

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Re: New Mac Pro with AMD GPUs and now?

PostWed Jun 25, 2014 5:33 pm

You have to make a 10.9.2 system on you're mac. (just take a macbookPro with 10.9.2), check to see if you macpro will start from it (set it into targetmode). If is starts, then you can copy this over to a partition on the macpro, install resolve on this, and you'll be happy. I did.

Waiting for a 10.9.4 to work, so I'll guess you will to !

:)

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