Video Assist audio and HDMI?

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ChrisNunan

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Video Assist audio and HDMI?

PostTue Oct 11, 2016 11:18 am

I just bought Black Magic Video Assist and hooked it up on my Olympus OM-D EM-5 MK 2 via a high quality HDMI cable. The video recording is fine but I get no sound. I was under the impression that sound would be transferred through the HDI feed too?

Am I doing it right or do I need to change some setting ?
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Denny Smith

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Re: Video Assist audio and HDMI?

PostTue Oct 11, 2016 5:29 pm

Which model did you buy? If it is the VA 4K, in the menu under Audio, you will find a selection for audio inputs, select HDMI, then, if the camera is sending audio, you should get it. You can check the camera by connecting it to a TV monitor via HDMI and see if the TV gets audio.
DS
Denny Smith
SHA Productions
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ChrisNunan

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Re: Video Assist audio and HDMI?

PostTue Oct 11, 2016 8:13 pm

Hi Dennis

Thanks

It's the non 4 k model.

Chris
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ChrisNunan

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Re: Video Assist audio and HDMI?

PostTue Oct 11, 2016 8:14 pm

I did check my cable on a TV and it does send audio

Chris
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Tony Rivera

Blackmagic Design

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Re: Video Assist audio and HDMI?

PostTue Oct 11, 2016 9:26 pm

According to the manfacturers website, the camera does not support audio over HDMI.
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Denny Smith

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Re: Video Assist audio and HDMI?

PostTue Oct 11, 2016 11:55 pm

Chris, getting audio via HDMI during playback and record are two different things. According to what Tony found, the OM ED, like the PenF, does not send audio via HDMI during "clean" record mode, so you are not going to get audio on the VA-5 inch model. You could use the VA 4K/7-inch model, which has a direct audio input and bypass the camera for audio altogether.

Here is a review by John Brawley on the Om ED Mk2: https://johnbrawley.wordpress.com/2015/ ... ilderness/
Cheers
Denny Smith
SHA Productions
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ChrisNunan

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Re: Video Assist audio and HDMI?

PostWed Oct 12, 2016 7:42 am

Hi Denny

Thank You for your help. The John Brawley video was the reason I was attracted to BM VA-5 and if I had done my research right I should have noticed this :-(

Is there any way the SDI input could do the same and record audio? - This seems to be my last option I don't see - right now anyway - the use for my BM VA-5 as I was planning to use it for interviews a now there's no sound I can't even synchronise clips in my editing software.

I'm greatful for your help guys

Chris, Denmark






Denny Smith wrote:Chris, getting audio via HDMI during playback and record are two different things. According to what Tony found, the OM ED, like the PenF, does not send audio via HDMI during "clean" record mode, so you are not going to get audio on the VA-5 inch model. You could use the VA 4K/7-inch model, which has a direct audio input and bypass the camera for audio altogether.

Here is a review by John Brawley on the Om ED Mk2: https://johnbrawley.wordpress.com/2015/ ... ilderness/
Cheers
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Denny Smith

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Re: Video Assist audio and HDMI?

PostWed Oct 12, 2016 4:05 pm

Chris, since the camera does not output audio while outputting a clean video feed for recording to an external monitor, you have two options, get an external audio recorder like a Zoom, or trade the VA5 in for a VA 7, which has a direct audio input, so you can record audio from an external mic to the VA, while the HDMI provides the video feed. Converting your camera's HDMI to SDI is not going to magically give you audio, when it is not there in the first place.

You cloud get a HDMI to SDI mini converter that has its own audio input, so you could add audio to the stream in the converter and output both video and audio to SDI, then record that signal in the VA ($200 for BM Mini Converter). Video feed should be from the HDMI out of the camera to HDMI input on the converter, Audio is line level from a preamp (so you will need a small mic preamps, like a Sound Devices Mic Pre) then feed the audio out of the preamp to the converter and it will mix the video and audio into a single SDI output stream, which the VA can record.

Your other option is to use the Oly OM's internal recorder, recording to its SD card in the highest quality available at 1080p60, like JB did for the short clips. When he used the VA, he was just recording video B Roll to edit in with main camera footage. And use the VA as a nice monitor to pull focus and frame the shot. The Oly is still a 8-bit camera, regardless of recording method.

If you need 4.2.2, 10-bit video for heavy post production, or to get a flat film log recording, the Oly is the wrong camera. You can get a BM Micro Cinema camera ($995) or the Micro Studio camera ($1200) for Rec 709 saturated color recording, and pair it with the VA to get higher quality video and feed audio to the camera with an external lav mic/preamp setup (which is what I use) or use a simple mic like the Rhode VideoMic Pro, which can plug directly into the Micro Camera for nice useable audio. The Micro is also a MFT mount, si it will use your existing lenses for the OMED.

To start, I would just use the camera to record an interview, use the VA to monitor (recording to the camera) and see how it comes out, before buying any more kit. If you do not like the results, then add the kit that will works best for you.

Cheers
Denny Smith
SHA Productions
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ChrisNunan

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Re: Video Assist audio and HDMI?

PostWed Oct 12, 2016 4:46 pm

Hi Denny

I much appreciate your awesome help. I'm a newbie in this area and thought that I would get a 10 bit recording using the BM VA - I gather that what you are saying I will never get 10 bit with my camera, but I guess that it's possible to record in Pro Res and get a better quality than with the internal recorder - right?

I'm looking in to the Zoom option and who knows I might get another camera down the line ;-)

I have a Juiced Link preamp so that might work with a BM Mini converter - but wouldn't that have to be battery powered too? One of the reasons I chose the Olympus EM-5 MK2 is that it has a fantastic 5 Axis stabilisation so doing hand held shots are a breeze and adding more devises would be a bit problematic - LOL

Chris ;)






Denny Smith wrote:Chris, since the camera does not output audio while outputting a clean video feed for recording to an external monitor, you have two options, get an external audio recorder like a Zoom, or trade the VA5 in for a VA 7, which has a direct audio input, so you can record audio from an external mic to the VA, while the HDMI provides the video feed. Converting your camera's HDMI to SDI is not going to magically give you audio, when it is not there in the first place.

You cloud get a HDMI to SDI mini converter that has its own audio input, so you could add audio to the stream in the converter and output both video and audio to SDI, then record that signal in the VA ($200 for BM Mini Converter). Video feed should be from the HDMI out of the camera to HDMI input on the converter, Audio is line level from a preamp (so you will need a small mic preamps, like a Sound Devices Mic Pre) then feed the audio out of the preamp to the converter and it will mix the video and audio into a single SDI output stream, which the VA can record.

Your other option is to use the Oly OM's internal recorder, recording to its SD card in the highest quality available at 1080p60, like JB did for the short clips. When he used the VA, he was just recording video B Roll to edit in with main camera footage. And use the VA as a nice monitor to pull focus and frame the shot. The Oly is still a 8-bit camera, regardless of recording method.

If you need 4.2.2, 10-bit video for heavy post production, or to get a flat film log recording, the Oly is the wrong camera. You can get a BM Micro Cinema camera ($995) or the Micro Studio camera ($1200) for Rec 709 saturated color recording, and pair it with the VA to get higher quality video and feed audio to the camera with an external lav mic/preamp setup (which is what I use) or use a simple mic like the Rhode VideoMic Pro, which can plug directly into the Micro Camera for nice useable audio. The Micro is also a MFT mount, si it will use your existing lenses for the OMED.

To start, I would just use the camera to record an interview, use the VA to monitor (recording to the camera) and see how it comes out, before buying any more kit. If you do not like the results, then add the kit that will works best for you.

Cheers
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Denny Smith

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Re: Video Assist audio and HDMI?

PostWed Oct 12, 2016 11:01 pm

Yes you can stil, record in ProRes, and gain a less compressed video file. That said, I would just run a quick test, shoot the same scene, with a person in it, or a staged interview type shot, record it in camera on the best video setting, then record it on the VA. Take both files into your NLE of choice, and see which one looks best, and if there is any real gain in recording to the larger ProRes files. Then you can make an educated decision on the best way to go.

When I got the AF100 (also a 8-bit camera), we did green screen tests recording HD to the camera codec SD card (which is a lower bitrate than the OMED), and outputting live SD to our Video Switcher for a live key, recorded this, and then recorded a HD signal to a Hyperdeck Shuttle. Bottom line, the in camera HD 1080p30 recording aced out the live key for ease of keying and image IQ, and the Shuttle was a close match, with a much bigger file size, but once the project was rendered back to SD, there was no real difference.

So it all depends on how much you want to change the image in post, the ProRes file wil, be more robust here, and allow for greater changes. But if you are only making small changes, outputting for DVD or Web distribution, then you might not see any real difference or benefit.

Adding the Micro Converter (battery model has it own battery, the original mini will need 12 VDC from an external source, the Juice Link PreAmp, your rig is grown in size and complexity, and you have lost your hand holding 5-axis shooting ability, or at least dimished it.

I shoot interviews with the AF 100 or the Micro Cinema camera on a tripod, then use my PenF (similar camera inside as the OMED) handheld for B-roll to endit into the main shoot, with audio on the main camera. This way you get the "Best of both Worlds", which is what JB does on a shoot. The Oly OMED Mk2 is a great little camera, use it well, but understand its limitations, and you are "golden" :mrgreen:
Cheers
Denny Smith
SHA Productions
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Emilian Dechev

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Re: Video Assist audio and HDMI?

PostSun Jun 11, 2017 4:37 pm

On the VA 4K, in the AUDIO menu, I cant find anything about "input" and "output". What am I missing?
Thanks.

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