HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

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Xtreemtec

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostFri May 12, 2017 11:06 am

Well it is good they could reproduce it..

We will see when and how it gets solved..
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Andy Coulthurst

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostSat May 13, 2017 2:01 pm

Steinar H. Gunderson wrote:
Well maybe really maybe you could get the HEX source if you try really hard.. But then.. Hex source to readable code is really hard..

By “HEX source”, I assume you mean machine code? A disassembler will turn it into assembly code easily enough.

There is software that does a good job.. But never 100%.. So getting it back to C/C++ for read-able code will not be easy at all.....

I assume you're talking about Hex-Rays? (That's the only really good decompiler, at any rate. There's other stuff like Hopper that claims to be “decompilers”, but Hex-Rays is a totally different league.) That works with x86, PowerPC and ARM only, so not applicable here.

I think it will take more time then start from scratch honestly..

As someone who's done a fair bit of software reverse-engineering, I'm pretty sure this isn't the case; monkey-patching in one bugfix is vastly less work than making a program from scratch. But I agree Blackmagic should just fix it themselves, so I don't plan to make an attempt. :-) (For all I know, the firmware could be encrypted and/or signed, making it impossible to flash modified firmware.)


Well - HexRays is my day job ( broadcast was my day job - but is now just a hobby )

The results with HexRays are hugely variable - it depends on what metadata you have available ( symbols / hardware documentation ). It also depends on the cpu type and how well supported that is in the HexRays plugin ( x86/Arm well supported - PowerPC support just introduced - anything else you'll have to manually convert the disassembly to pseudocode ).
I would say that patching such a simple function would be the easiest - but back to source may be the most useful.

Back to compileable sourcecode is definitely possible - the decision is whether it is the most efficient solution and if it is legal in your particular country / circumstances.
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Steinar H. Gunderson

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostSun May 14, 2017 11:13 am

Andy Coulthurst wrote:The results with HexRays are hugely variable - it depends on what metadata you have available ( symbols / hardware documentation ). It also depends on the cpu type and how well supported that is in the HexRays plugin ( x86/Arm well supported - PowerPC support just introduced - anything else you'll have to manually convert the disassembly to pseudocode ).

Well, the BM converters use an Atmel chip and the Chinese converters an STM8S; neither is supported by Hex-Rays. (The latter is not even supported by IDA.) So like I said, it's not applicable here.

But you can certainly run a regular disassembler and work from there. You don't need to understand all of the code, and you certainly don't need to translate everything back to C before doing modifications (as long as you're comfortable writing assembler and patching in a jump or two).
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Andy Coulthurst

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostSun May 14, 2017 2:07 pm

Steinar H. Gunderson wrote:
Andy Coulthurst wrote:The results with HexRays are hugely variable - it depends on what metadata you have available ( symbols / hardware documentation ). It also depends on the cpu type and how well supported that is in the HexRays plugin ( x86/Arm well supported - PowerPC support just introduced - anything else you'll have to manually convert the disassembly to pseudocode ).

Well, the BM converters use an Atmel chip and the Chinese converters an STM8S; neither is supported by Hex-Rays. (The latter is not even supported by IDA.) So like I said, it's not applicable here.

But you can certainly run a regular disassembler and work from there. You don't need to understand all of the code, and you certainly don't need to translate everything back to C before doing modifications (as long as you're comfortable writing assembler and patching in a jump or two).

Yep - stm8s/atmel are tiny :D ( in codesize ) , certainly wouldn't bother converting to C for those ( even if the code originated as C ). These cpus are supported by IDA for disassembly ( which is still far nicer to use than a standard disassembler ) but as you rightly say - not the hexrays plugin.
I have some of the cheap chinese converters - and will have a look at abusing one when I have some spare time ( perhaps useful as a cheap VANC/HANC extractor - time for play )
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Andy Coulthurst

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostSun May 14, 2017 2:10 pm

Steinar H. Gunderson wrote:Well, the BM converters use an Atmel chip and the Chinese converters an STM8S; neither is supported by Hex-Rays. (The latter is not even supported by IDA.) So like I said, it's not applicable here.

But you can certainly run a regular disassembler and work from there. You don't need to understand all of the code, and you certainly don't need to translate everything back to C before doing modifications (as long as you're comfortable writing assembler and patching in a jump or two).

Fairly sure I have an STM8S plugin for IDA hanging around ( I have written several processor plugins - not too difficult ). Must go and check.
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Andy Coulthurst

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostSun May 14, 2017 2:14 pm

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Steinar H. Gunderson

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostMon May 15, 2017 8:41 pm

Thanks!

My development kit arrived today, but I need to get help with some soldering, and then install the software… Might be a while, but if I actually get a readout, I'll be sure to test your plugin.
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Andy Coulthurst

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostTue May 16, 2017 4:37 am

Steinar H. Gunderson wrote:Thanks!

My development kit arrived today, but I need to get help with some soldering, and then install the software… Might be a while, but if I actually get a readout, I'll be sure to test your plugin.


Not my plugin :-)
I am unable to release any of my projects due to confidentiality.
So - the linked plugin is untested by me.
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Steinar H. Gunderson

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostTue May 16, 2017 8:14 pm

I got my STM8S kit, and managed to contact one of the devices (the one that I know positively is an STM8S). Unsurprisingly, readout protection was enabled, so that drew a complete blank.

The other one doesn't have any markings, and I just get “cannot communicate with the device” when trying to talk to it. No idea what the status is on that one.
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Steinar H. Gunderson

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostSat May 20, 2017 7:22 pm

I got in contact with the AY31 as well; the pinout was 4312, for whatever reason. Unsurprisingly, it's readout-protected, too.

So basically patching the Chinese converters won't be working. We'll need to wait until Blackmagic fixes their four-times-as-expensive converters, and then buy those.
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Steinar H. Gunderson

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostThu Jul 20, 2017 11:17 am

There's a new converter update going, with one of the points in the changelog going: “Improved EDID handshaking for Micro Converter HDMI to SDI”. I wonder if this is relevant to the problem?
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Peter Schams

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostMon Jul 24, 2017 7:31 pm

I also had another look at the support page recently. It was the day after the update was posted and available. I downloaded it and tried it out.

The setup with Canon Legria (and I assume other devices, too) works with 1080p50 now right away after powerup. No need of pre-triggering the converter with some receiver device to get it working.

So, finally BM solved the hilarious bug or problem (at least mine). But it took them 4 months :(

What I still dont like with BM is that their communication on open tickets is equal to zero. Also, when an update might now solve a problem, there is no email or anything. You need to come back to the support page to see, if there are updates available.
But some dealer at a product show prewarned me that BM has this kind of behaviour.
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Steinar H. Gunderson

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostFri Jul 28, 2017 1:37 pm

Nice. I can't test easily myself right now, but perhaps there's hope…

What annoys me the most is that it took me literally months to convince support that this was a real problem and not just me doing something wrong.
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Steinar H. Gunderson

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Re: HDMI-SDI micro converter problem

PostSat Oct 07, 2017 10:50 am

Much belatedly, I got to test 7.0.9, and it fixes the problem for me, too.
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