Ursa Mini!

Anna, the new cameras all have external battery/power only. No internal battery options. However, the URAS and URSA Mini both have a 4-pin external power connection that works in conjunction with the external battery plate, to provide uninterrupted power for longer continious takes. Mathis is how the ENG cameras were powered. Modern flash ram for firmware eliminates the need for an internal memory battery found on older cameras.

BM web site has tech specs for the cameras.

Thanks, Denny! We are just interested to minimize camera weight for gimbal usage.

I'm looking at the Mini and had a few questions I can't find answers to. Does anyone have answers to any of the following..? All questions pertaining to the 4.6k EF version:

1. Can the Ursa Mini record RAW CinemaDNG at lower resolutions than 4.6k or 4k? These are the only two resolutions listed on the website. What I want to know is, will it record 3k RAW CinemaDNG or HD RAW CinemaDNG? In some cases I'd like the RAW capabilities at lower resolutions for added storage space, etc.

Yes, the new sensor can record raw from a windowed sensor area.

2. The ProRes format says it has "film dynamic range," but isn't the RAW info lost when recording to ProRes since ProRes is not a RAW codec?

When recording raw, Film mode is the only option and gives the widest dynamic range. When recording ProRes, you can select Film mode which gives the widest dynamic range and a flatter look or you can record Video which is like Rec.709 with higher contrast and would appear to have less dynamic range.

3. Will the Usra Mini 4.6k record 60 fps at full 4.6k RAW CinemaDNG? Or is it only with ProRes?

With global shutter, the URSA MINOR records up to 30 fps full sensor; above 30 fps, the camera records up to 60 fps in rolling shutter. The URSA doubles those rates to 60 fps and 120 fps. The URSA MINOR can record a HD window at 160 fps.

4. Can I adjust the compression ration of the RAW CinemaDNG from 4:1 to a higher ratio, like 5:1, 6:1 or higher? This is a big deal! CF cards are insanely expensive and CinemaDNG codec seems to be bloated beyond belief. I'm coming from the RED world so Im used to getting 30 minutes of 4k on a 64GB card, and the Ursa Mini can only get 17 minutes on a 128GB card twice the size! What's up with that!?

The raw can be mathematically lossless compressed as 'raw' or visually lossless compressed as 3:1 or 4:1. BMD won't go to higher compression ratios if they believe the compression would no longer qualify as visually lossless. BMD is all about image quality trumping convenience. If you want much higher compression, record in ProRes LT. It can be surprising how good that may look even though it's a small fraction of the data rate of ProRes 444 XQ.

5. Anyone have a recommended CF2.0 card they would use with the Ursa Mini? Or cards to stay away from? Or a reseller that has good deals on CF cards?

Thanks for the help!

So far I've only seen one negative concern about Lexar 3400x CFast cards. I'd recommend those in either 128GB or 256GB capacities. I'm buying two Lexar 3400x 128GB or 256 GB CFast cards. Once Digistor has BMD certified cards, I'd recommend those too.

Rick Lang
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If black magic still wants to sell the production 4k camera. I suggest if they reduce its price , coz this and the Ursa mini costs the same. Like me many who are planning to buy the production 4k can, have postponed their decision to buy, hoping for a price drop else to go for the Ursa mini.

Anyone in this plan here ?

Has anybody got a good video link or picture of the handgrip? I'm curious how you control Iris etc as I can't seem to see a click wheel.

I can live in hope but I'd really love an MFT mount option of the Ursa mini. It opens the doors to so many lensing options both vintage and modern.

Any chance or plans for this?

Has anybody got a good video link or picture of the handgrip? I'm curious how you control Iris etc as I can't seem to see a click wheel.

There are only three buttons that I can see. Record, (auto) iris, focus. Until the manual is issued, presumably in July, we won't know if they are only simple toggles or if 'double clicking' does anything differently.

Rick Lang
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Has anybody got a good video link or picture of the handgrip? I'm curious how you control Iris etc as I can't seem to see a click wheel.

Here's a link that may help. They show the hand grip starting around 3:52

I've had confirmed by two different people at NAB who have asked Blackmagic reps directly and gotten the same answer: The side handle only offers the same "auto iris" button found on the BMCC. There is no manual iris control offered from the side handle.

This means that Canon EF lenses (and any other lens with electronic internal iris control) will be rendered useless for any shoulder mounted or handheld shooting. Only lenses with an iris ring will offer the shooter actual control of the iris. It is an awfully shortsighted limitation that I believe Blackmagic needs to remedy before shipping. It really shouldn't be that difficult for them to build and offer a side handle with an iris control wheel like the C100/C300/FS7.

useless? lol...a little extreme.

I don't change the iris much once the camera is on my shoulder and you can still control the iris from the camera body.

I don't know that many camera grips that have iris control wheels on the grip. My FS700 doesn't. Where on the FS7 handgrip is there a iris control wheel?

Besides, why can't you use your left hand to change the iris on the side of the camera? Even while holding it on your shoulder? The buttons are right there. Activate the iris function with the handgrip and then dial in your exact need with the two buttons. Seems simple enough to me.

I just want to check to see if there has been any confirmation that the new 4.6K Sensor in the URSA and URSA Mini have fixed the black sun spot issue? In the video Captain Hook posted I saw a lot of shots of the sun, and wonder if that was to show it was fixed or if the black sun dot was fixed in Resolve in post. Thanks you anyone who gets an answer out to us.

Overall, I love the URSA Mini and want to save up the $11K I would need to buy it, the accessories, and the media.

I just want to check to see if there has been any confirmation that the new 4.6K Sensor in the URSA and URSA Mini have fixed the black sun spot issue? In the video Captain Hook posted I saw a lot of shots of the sun, and wonder if that was to show it was fixed or if the black sun dot was fixed in Resolve in post. Thanks you anyone who gets an answer out to us.

Overall, I love the URSA Mini and want to save up the $11K I would need to buy it, the accessories, and the media.

I don't know about a fix on the camera, but they are working on a tool in Resolve that fixes it.

Anyone know how Anton Bauer plate would be attached?
BM don't seem to offer one like the Sony so one would need to attach the AB plate ourselves I guess.
No news of which plate yet.

One of these I guess: http://video.antonbauer.com/Products/QRC-BMURSA

Paul, you can get an AB to V lock adapter, I have one, and it is very thin and light, so would not add much bulk either.

useless? lol...a little extreme.
Where on the FS7 handgrip is there a iris control wheel?

Besides, why can't you use your left hand to change the iris on the side of the camera? Even while holding it on your shoulder? The buttons are right there. Activate the iris function with the handgrip and then dial in your exact need with the two buttons. Seems simple enough to me.

When using Sony E-mount zooms the FS7 can assign either focus or iris control to the control dial on the grip. And the FS100/700 are not relevant here other than as an example of how never to design a camera.

So, the left hand would be used by right handed shooters to reach behind the lens and between the camera and their own head to blindly push the iris buttons? Seriously? That sounds mighty difficult and stupidly inconvenient. And left handed shooters would have to take their right hand and reach around to the opposite side.

Why can't we just be honest about the fact that it is simply a poor design and they should change it?

I just want to check to see if there has been any confirmation that the new 4.6K Sensor in the URSA and URSA Mini have fixed the black sun spot issue? In the video Captain Hook posted I saw a lot of shots of the sun, and wonder if that was to show it was fixed or if the black sun dot was fixed in Resolve in post. Thanks you anyone who gets an answer out to us.

Overall, I love the URSA Mini and want to save up the $11K I would need to buy it, the accessories, and the media.

Tim, the 4.6K sensor does not suffer from the black sun! The fix in Resolve 12 was designed to fix the problem with the black sun found in the other cameras that exhibit it. CaptainHook has posted this elsewhere.

Rick Lang
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They should have named it URSA Minor...

As far as I'm concerned, they could name it URSA Humperdink or URSA Grzlbrmft, as long as I get 15 stops and Fairchild colors.

So, the left hand would be used by right handed shooters to reach behind the lens and between the camera and their own head to blindly push the iris buttons? Seriously? That sounds mighty difficult and stupidly inconvenient. And left handed shooters would have to take their right hand and reach around to the opposite side.

Why can't we just be honest about the fact that it is simply a poor design and they should change it?

So it's only LANC on the handle. I'm predicting it won't be long before we see other handles.

I'm looking forward to getting of these which is re-programable for most cameras and has at least three buttons and works to control Iris in the way you want today.

https://www.shootingmachine.net/product ... rip-mark-3

I didn't find changing exposure on EF that difficult. Kind of like tickling your cheek.

And since when did handedness affect camera operations. Most evfs barely work with left eye shooters. Don't we all just make do already ?

I don't really use EF lenses so it doesn't seem much of a deal breaker to me but maybe I'm wrong.

It's not like you'll get seamless exposure ramps anyway as the damn Iris jump through its values.

JB

I guessing that when in handheld mode (I'm thinking on shoulder with EVF here) the buttons on the side of the closed monitor control the Iris in a similar fashion to my pocket camera. Left, Right = more open, less open etc. If that's the case I'm not as worried.

As JB says no doubt someone will come out with a new handle that does more. Seems like a new market waiting to happen...

They should have named it URSA Minor...

As far as I'm concerned, they could name it URSA Humperdink or URSA Grzlbrmft, as long as I get 15 stops and Fairchild colors.

Frank, I think we should call it Taschen-URSA

BTW: Maybe I am missing something but what are BMD's plans with the gyro and gps sensors in the URSA m?

BTW: Maybe I am missing something but what are BMD's plans with the gyro and gps sensors in the URSA m?

I would expect some kind of stabilization in Resolve and/or Fusion perhaps who can make use of that data directly? At least that would make sense...
Or more robust 3D tracking not mainly relaying on image content tracking... would be neat

They should have named it URSA Minor...

As far as I'm concerned, they could name it URSA Humperdink or URSA Grzlbrmft, as long as I get 15 stops and Fairchild colors.

Frank, I think we should call it Taschen-URSA

BTW: Maybe I am missing something but what are BMD's plans with the gyro and gps sensors in the URSA m?

Think about the fact they now own Fusion.

Think about recording the cameras movements in 3D space as metadata...

JB

Paul, you can get an AB to V lock adapter, I have one, and it is very thin and light, so would not add much bulk either.

Thanks Denny

Sorry I may be being a complete prat here and just missed the information somewhere but will the Ursa Minor be able to have it's sensor upgraded as well?

Sorry I may be being a complete prat here and just missed the information somewhere but will the Ursa Minor be able to have it's sensor upgraded as well?

URSA is capable of sensor upgrades.

URSA Mini is not.

JB

So, the left hand would be used by right handed shooters to reach behind the lens and between the camera and their own head to blindly push the iris buttons? Seriously? That sounds mighty difficult and stupidly inconvenient. And left handed shooters would have to take their right hand and reach around to the opposite side.

Why can't we just be honest about the fact that it is simply a poor design and they should change it?

So it's only LANC on the handle. I'm predicting it won't be long before we see other handles.

I'm looking forward to getting of these which is re-programable for most cameras and has at least three buttons and works to control Iris in the way you want today.

https://www.shootingmachine.net/product ... rip-mark-3

I didn't find changing exposure on EF that difficult. Kind of like tickling your cheek.

And since when did handedness affect camera operations. Most evfs barely work with left eye shooters. Don't we all just make do already ?

I don't really use EF lenses so it doesn't seem much of a deal breaker to me but maybe I'm wrong.

It's not like you'll get seamless exposure ramps anyway as the damn Iris jump through its values.

JB

Thank you very much for the reply John. Your account is the first I've heard from anyone who has actually been able to test it shoulder mounted with EF lenses. It's good to know that the iris buttons on the body are still accessible, if a tickle.

I own a lot of Canon EF lenses and have been using them on both the C300, BMCC EF and BMPCC (with metabones adaptor) since their release to shoot mostly verité and was beyond excited to see the design of the URSA mini. Then, when I found out that the side handle didn't have an iris wheel like the C300 and is limited to auto iris only, it was certainly a let down. I find that having manual iris control of EF lenses from the side handle on the C300 (especially the IS lenses) to be unbelievably useful for handheld shooting in uncontrolled situations.

The handle you linked to looks great! If it works, then problem solved! Many many thanks!

Think about the fact they now own Fusion.

Think about recording the cameras movements in 3D space as metadata...

I can imagine that. I just have no idea about the quality of the gyro sensor, how precise does it work.
If BMD gets this right this would be indeed a unique and powerful feature, not only for post production but also on set - if it is possible to read the data in realtime. In connection with a servo image stabilization system (like some of the Sony consumer cameras have). Or on a crane were the camera could help you with kind of an on screen tracker/cross-hair to get repeatable movements or hit a mark.

Sorry I may be being a complete prat here and just missed the information somewhere but will the Ursa Minor be able to have it's sensor upgraded as well?

URSA is capable of sensor upgrades.

URSA Mini is not.

JB

Cheers JB

Ursa Mini seems front heavy with the new shoulder kit. I wonder how far back you can slide the camera? Can you get the lens mount directly over the shoulder?

I'm trying to find out how they map 15 stops of DR to 12-bit raw. Is this explained anywhere?

Can user turn on RS mode for a normal frame rates like 30p?
Could someone post a menu screenshots with camera settings, please?

Can user turn on RS mode for a normal frame rates like 30p?

Yes.
Switching to Rolling Shutter will not just allow for higher Framerates but also increase the Dynamic range. (15 Stops DR refer to Rolling, it's about 1,5 Stops less on Global)

Thanks, thats good.

As far as I'm concerned, they could name it URSA Humperdink or URSA Grzlbrmft, as long as I get 15 stops and Fairchild colors.

Hi,

what do you mean with Fairchild colors? (does it refer to fairchild semiconductor as sensor producer?)

What the crop factor will be when shooting 1080?

What the crop factor will be when shooting 1080?

Horizontal crop is 3.4x for HD, 3.2x for 2K.

Rick Lang
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Ursa Mini seems front heavy with the new shoulder kit. I wonder how far back you can slide the camera? Can you get the lens mount directly over the shoulder?

BTW, in case you're still concerned about this, the Ursa Mini in its pre-production model felt nearly as good as a Cion on my shoulder. The arm is pretty adjustable, and there are a couple of spots where you can attach it, so I'm pretty sure that it will have enough flexibility for proper balance with most lenses. Some truly monstrous lenses might require counterweights, but I suspect that with a Compact Prime or comparable size/weight lens (e.g. Cooke, Schnieder prime) that it's going to feel very nice.

Also, the rear mounted battery adds a counterbalance to the rig, so you only need the main camera body centered over your shoulder, with some adjustability for various lens sizes.

Ursa Mini seems front heavy with the new shoulder kit. I wonder how far back you can slide the camera? Can you get the lens mount directly over the shoulder?

Beware of the shoulderpad / evf distance. In your second pic, I think the EVF would be inside the head of the user.

The shoulder to EVF eyepiece is somewhat "constant" measure.

Also, the rear mounted battery adds a counterbalance to the rig, so you only need the main camera body centered over your shoulder, with some adjustability for various lens sizes.

True. The camera I put up on my shoulder had mains power connected via XLR, so IIRC it wasn't one with a battery on it. They had several out, but it was rare to get to actually interact with one, since the BMD booth was so busy, and most people were crowded around the cameras. I was able to get more time playing with Resolve 12 (which is awesome) than I was with the cameras.

Can user turn on RS mode for a normal frame rates like 30p?

Yes.
Switching to Rolling Shutter will not just allow for higher Framerates but also increase the Dynamic range. (15 Stops DR refer to Rolling, it's about 1,5 Stops less on Global)

I know that rolling shutter has an increase in dynamic range over global shutter -- this makes me wonder, will we have the full 15 stops of dynamic range with the global shutter up to 30fps? Is the full 15 stops of DR only available if we are shooting in rolling shutter (even if its below 30fps)?

I know that rolling shutter has an increase in dynamic range over global shutter -- this makes me wonder, will we have the full 15 stops of dynamic range with the global shutter up to 30fps? Is the full 15 stops of DR only available if we are shooting in rolling shutter (even if its below 30fps)?

AFAIK, up to 30fps you can choose between rolling and global shutter, and above that you can only use rolling.

Can user turn on RS mode for a normal frame rates like 30p?

Yes.
Switching to Rolling Shutter will not just allow for higher Framerates but also increase the Dynamic range. (15 Stops DR refer to Rolling, it's about 1,5 Stops less on Global)

I know that rolling shutter has an increase in dynamic range over global shutter -- this makes me wonder, will we have the full 15 stops of dynamic range with the global shutter up to 30fps? Is the full 15 stops of DR only available if we are shooting in rolling shutter (even if its below 30fps)?

going global shutter you will lose some DR (and BMD confirmed this). At this point, how much we don't know. But expect from 1-2stops (being realistic here). Still pretty good I would say.
And also we don't know how fast is the sensor read times, so if they invested in this area, using rolling shutter might not be as bad as previous version (like having alexa rolling shutter read time would be really good, and non issue IMO).

yes Im aware of that. But what I was asking is, will the full 15 stops of dynamic range be available to us when shooting with the global shutter..?

Another question..

Does anybody know if we can format CFast cards in the camera for shooting? Or do we have to format cards with a computer?

What exactly is the deal with scopes on the Ursa Mini? Is it just a histogram or might it incude others as well? It looks like an awesome camera for VFX with its gyroscope and 4.6K global shutter, but I would at least hope for a built in waveform and possibly false color for doing chromakey.

yes Im aware of that. But what I was asking is, will the full 15 stops of dynamic range be available to us when shooting with the global shutter..?

Almost certainly the dynamic range is less in GS mode compared to RS mode. How much less is yet to be determined ... the camera isn't finished yet and is far from shipping. But based on past experience might be about a stop or so difference. TBD.

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... Does anybody know if we can format CFast cards in the camera for shooting? Or do we have to format cards with a computer?

All Blackmagic cameras running current firmware can format media in-camera. Why would you expect the URSA Mini to be different?

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what do you mean with Fairchild colors? (does it refer to fairchild semiconductor as sensor producer?)

Yes I think that's exactly what Frank meant... totally agree with him - so I guess the rumors were true that BM made pretty much an exclusive deal to get the bigger high-res "successor" of the original BMCC 2.5k sensor.. yay!

Almost certainly the dynamic range is less in GS mode compared to RS mode. How much less is yet to be determined ... the camera isn't finished yet and is far from shipping. But based on past experience might be about a stop or so difference. TBD.

The folks in Black Magic's booth at NAB said it was around 2.5 stops.

I'm trying to find out how they map 15 stops of DR to 12-bit raw. Is this explained anywhere?

The same way Arri do.

JB