Tokina 11-16 focus

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adamroberts

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 12:20 am

Interesting... modifying the mount?
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Christian Schmeer

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 12:33 am

adamroberts wrote:Interesting... modifying the mount?


The mount doesn't have to be modified at all, only three screws on the focus ring have to be shifted. Tokina seems to have left some room for adjustment on purpose. If you do it properly and take your time, it shouldn't scratch the exterior of the lens body.
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bpullman

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 5:05 am

Thank you Peter. I was actually beginning to think the same thing the other day, that it might be best to get the camera in my hands before I decide on lenses. By that time it should be pretty clear what works and what doesn't. I really wanted the Tokina though..ha. Maybe I should switch and get the EF mount BMCC, still debating that one.
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CaptainHook

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 6:18 am

Christian Schmeer wrote:The mount doesn't have to be modified at all, only three screws on the focus ring have to be shifted. Tokina seems to have left some room for adjustment on purpose. If you do it properly and take your time, it shouldn't scratch the exterior of the lens body.

Great news if so Christian!! Nice work!
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Thomas Schumacher

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 8:28 am

CaptainHook wrote:
Christian Schmeer wrote:The mount doesn't have to be modified at all, only three screws on the focus ring have to be shifted. Tokina seems to have left some room for adjustment on purpose. If you do it properly and take your time, it shouldn't scratch the exterior of the lens body.

Great news if so Christian!! Nice work!


+1, great work and great news, indeed!
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danap

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 9:28 am

The mount doesn't have to be modified at all, only three screws on the focus ring have to be shifted. Tokina seems to have left some room for adjustment on purpose. If you do it properly and take your time, it shouldn't scratch the exterior of the lens body.


Could you Christian explain us the step by step DIY procedure. My mechanical skills are not that great ...
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Cam Macduff

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 10:30 am

+1 for that request. I have the Nikon version of the lens with the novoflex adapter.
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Cameron Mckinlay

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 11:06 am

Lookkng forward to yoir solution! I was worried i would have to sell my tokina! Thanks for your help!

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Craig

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 11:42 am

Really glad to read this. Was gonna part exchange it today to buy Nikon version with a decent adapter...sounds like Nikon users have same issues. Doing all that and finding same problem then reading this thread would have given me a nosebleed. Lol
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adamroberts

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 1:15 pm

I believe he said he'd be doing a blog post with step by step photos.

Patience people... You should be good at this by now after waiting so long for your cameras. :-)
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Craig

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 2:15 pm

Hi Christian,
Well done, I know you are putting a blog tutorial together on how to do this.
Patience is apparently a virtue but I have the lens in the same place you have it in photo and just wondering which screws you need to loosen/move? In the photo you have removed the recessed screw...
Just wondering whether the other screws you move are the brass connectors to focus ring? Or the screws closer to zoom ring?
Nice website too by the way. :)

Edit..ok there are 3 of those recessed screws, do you mean those?


Craig
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Christian Schmeer

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 4:12 pm

Craig wrote:Hi Christian,
Well done, I know you are putting a blog tutorial together on how to do this.
Patience is apparently a virtue but I have the lens in the same place you have it in photo and just wondering which screws you need to loosen/move? In the photo you have removed the recessed screw...
Just wondering whether the other screws you move are the brass connectors to focus ring? Or the screws closer to zoom ring?
Nice website too by the way. :)

Edit..ok there are 3 of those recessed screws, do you mean those?


Craig


Hi Craig, there are 3 recessed screws. I removed them to be able to push the screw holes to the right, rotating an inner part of the lens (to right, holding the front of the lens forward). By default, the three screw holes were in the middle.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 4:24 pm

Thanks Christian, you are a star.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 4:29 pm

Christian Schmeer wrote:
Craig wrote:Hi Christian,
Well done, I know you are putting a blog tutorial together on how to do this.
Patience is apparently a virtue but I have the lens in the same place you have it in photo and just wondering which screws you need to loosen/move? In the photo you have removed the recessed screw...
Just wondering whether the other screws you move are the brass connectors to focus ring? Or the screws closer to zoom ring?
Nice website too by the way. :)

Edit..ok there are 3 of those recessed screws, do you mean those?


Craig


Hi Craig, there are 3 recessed screws. I removed them to be able to push the screw holes to the right, rotating an inner part of the lens (to right, holding the front of the lens forward). By default, the three screw holes were in the middle.


Absolutely amazing. You guys rock. I think I noticed this during a shoot but just thought it was the LCD screen. I'll check when I get my own BMCC, which should be very soon. If it doesn't hit infinitely, Christian, I'm going to be looking out for your mod and applying that to my Tokina.
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Eric Santiago

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 5:07 pm

Im ready anytime to hack mine :)
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Craig

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Jan 30, 2013 6:28 pm

I have tried and tested this all day and I think all I have been doing is adjusting the infinity stop which does help a small amount but did not completely fix the issue.
However I have the canon version and Christian has the Nikon.
I really hope I have been doing something wrong.
I look forward to Christian's blog.
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Christian Schmeer

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostThu Jan 31, 2013 9:33 pm

Hey everyone, I didn't have much time, but I have posted an initial version of the how to: http://blog.christianschmeer.com/tokina ... djustment/

I will make it better and post better pictures next week.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostThu Jan 31, 2013 9:37 pm

Yahoooo!
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Marshall Harrington

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostThu Jan 31, 2013 9:41 pm

Thanks Christian. Really appreciate your effort here.

Let's hope that someone from Tokina has got their eyes open on this and will make everyone's life better in regards to their product.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostThu Jan 31, 2013 11:40 pm

i actually did this last night. just figured it out myself. it didn't work for me. i was hoping i did it wrong and the tutorial would reveal my mistake, but i did mine exactly like you said. i guess if your lens is just slightly out, this will work. in my case, my lens must have been too far off for this tiny adjustment to fix.
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Christian Schmeer

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostFri Feb 01, 2013 12:25 am

cheezweezl wrote:i actually did this last night. just figured it out myself. it didn't work for me. i was hoping i did it wrong and the tutorial would reveal my mistake, but i did mine exactly like you said. i guess if your lens is just slightly out, this will work. in my case, my lens must have been too far off for this tiny adjustment to fix.


Which version do you have, Canon or Nikon? My Nikon version was actually pretty badly out of focus and the effect of the modification was quite dramatic.

Pre-modification, using the Kiwifotos adapter, it was just plain unusable. Between 11-16mm at F/2.8 "infinity focus" went 5 meters max.

Pre-modification, using the Novoflex adapter, focus between 15-16mm at F/2.8 was fine, but between 11-14mm the focus only went up to about 50 meters.

Post-modification, using the Novoflex adapter, it now goes slightly beyond infinity focus between 12-16mm and just about reaches infinity focus at 11mm. 11mm F/2.8 is slightly soft, but not out of focus. I guess some softness at 11mm and wide open at F/2.8 is to be expected.

If anyone tries this modification, make sure to push the screw holes to the very right of the oval hole (front of the lens facing forward). Pushing them to the left worsens the infinity focus issue, as you're moving it closer, rather than further away.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostFri Feb 01, 2013 1:40 am

Christian Schmeer wrote:[

Which version do you have, Canon or Nikon? My Nikon version was actually pretty badly out of focus and the effect of the modification was quite dramatic.

Pre-modification, using the Kiwifotos adapter, it was just plain unusable. Between 11-16mm at F/2.8 "infinity focus" went 5 meters max.

Pre-modification, using the Novoflex adapter, focus between 15-16mm at F/2.8 was fine, but between 11-14mm the focus only went up to about 50 meters.

Post-modification, using the Novoflex adapter, it now goes slightly beyond infinity focus between 12-16mm and just about reaches infinity focus at 11mm. 11mm F/2.8 is slightly soft, but not out of focus. I guess some softness at 11mm and wide open at F/2.8 is to be expected.

If anyone tries this modification, make sure to push the screw holes to the very right of the oval hole (front of the lens facing forward). Pushing them to the left worsens the infinity focus issue, as you're moving it closer, rather than further away.


i have the canon version. just thought of this, if focus is backwards on a nikon, would i have to push the screw hole to the left instead? if this is the case, i may be hosed anyway. the screw was already on the left, not in the middle like yours.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostFri Feb 01, 2013 2:22 am

cheezweezl wrote:i have the canon version. just thought of this, if focus is backwards on a nikon, would i have to push the screw hole to the left instead? if this is the case, i may be hosed anyway. the screw was already on the left, not in the middle like yours.


This may the case actually since focus rings on Nikon lenses rotate the other way around. Try to get it as much as possible to the left hand side and see if it makes any difference.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostFri Feb 01, 2013 4:42 am

cheezweezl,
It might be that its only a Nikon fix. There are no reports of any Canon versions working, as far as I know. The Nikon version does, so it might be that Christian just got his working like all the other Nikons. Can anyone verify that they can fix infinity focus on the Canon version?
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Abobakr M. Alshiblie

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostSun Feb 03, 2013 10:11 am

anyone did the modification on a canon lens and worked?
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostSun Feb 03, 2013 11:37 am

There's a couple of people i think at the BMC user forum that have reported success with the canon version, can't link to the thread because of the policy here but you should find it easy. :) Mixed reports so far though.
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Abobakr M. Alshiblie

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostSun Feb 03, 2013 5:34 pm

Thanks CaptainHook.. i will look in the forum there
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostSun Feb 03, 2013 6:50 pm

i moved mine back to the left and shoved it as far left as possible. it gets closer now when wide open. if i stop down to 5.6 or higher, it gets sharp at infinity. before i did anything, it took f8 to get sharp, so i guess there is an improvement.

on the other hand (and i will bring this up in my "flange distance" thread) i just found another lens that won't hit infinity, my canon 28mm f2.8. i'm starting to think there may be a flange distance problem with the camera.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostMon Feb 04, 2013 12:27 am

28/1.8 hits infinite wide open, FYI. Canon USM.

I think that certain glass' designed to perform better at certain flange distances, some of the lenses are likely tuned to the ragged edge of the flange distance.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostMon Feb 04, 2013 10:05 am

@cheezweezl I think if you have multiple lenses not hitting infinity on the BMCC, and those lenses work fine on other cameras, you should contact Blackmagic support.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostMon Feb 04, 2013 3:52 pm

Hi all,

I had the issue with a canon version of the lens. I moved the screws as far to the left as I could and it has improved it hugely (from virtually unusable at 11mm and wide open). The screws were very far to left when I first opened it. Thanks Christian!!

cheers,

Scott
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostTue Feb 05, 2013 3:12 pm

Scott wrote:Hi all,

I had the issue with a canon version of the lens. I moved the screws as far to the left as I could and it has improved it hugely (from virtually unusable at 11mm and wide open). The screws were very far to left when I first opened it. Thanks Christian!!

cheers,

Scott


I'm glad it works on the Canon version as well, at least for some. One thing I don't like about the Tokina 11-16mm F/2.8 lens is that it seems to produce pronounced chromatic aberrations, which is well known about this lens. However, it seems to make moiré more apparent on the BMCC. Has anyone else noticed this?
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostSat Feb 09, 2013 11:48 am

I wish I had seen this before buying the Tokina 11-16... I have the infinity focus problem too.
I'm gonna send it back but I wonder what ultra wide angle options we still have.
For almost the same price, there is the Sigma 8-16 which seems nice, but is only 4.5 - 5.6.
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Adrian Musto

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostSat Feb 09, 2013 12:26 pm

Jeez... I'm glad I bought the Sigma 8-16 after reading this. Sure the Sigma is not so fast, but at least it works well for those wide outdoor shots. The only issue I really have with the Sigma is using my Heliopan Variable ND which does screw onto the front of the lens (with the extra removable part that the lens cap attaches to), but this does mean at 8mm, the is a fair bit of vignetting which does disappear at the 10mm mark which isn't the end of the world.

Such a shame there is so many problems with the Tokina, but I'm sure its only a matter of time before we start seeing some proper wide and fast lenses made especially for the BMCC EF mount.
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Cam Macduff

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostSun Feb 10, 2013 9:47 am

Well have tried the fix this evening and dismantled my lens to adjust the screws, but no luck.
Already adjusted over as far as they'll go.
Guess that's the end of my Tokina on my BMCC. Works fine on my old DSLR.
Mine's a Nikon mount and I'm using the Novaflex adapter.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostSun Feb 10, 2013 3:06 pm

Well I can also chime in on this EF version lens NOT infinity focusing on the BMCC.
It focuses wonderfully on our 7D.

So will try the fix that has worked for some. But how do you access those screws?

OOPS! Finally found Christian's post reference to his step by step procedure on his blog. Sorry.
Wondering how many have had success with this mod for the EF version.

It is difficult to understand how this lens performs on the 7D just fine, but not on the BMCC. Has to be a simple mechanical - distance function. Is there something different in the locked positioning of this particular lens that is slightly different than all the other lenses? Maybe there is something just slightly different in the Tokina to BMCC mount that does not allow the Tokina to match up exactly on the BMCC?

It cannot be optics or electronics... it is a mechanical match up difference.
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Cam Macduff

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostSun Feb 10, 2013 8:32 pm

Yea, I do wonder if it's the fit.
My Tokina has a tiny bit of movement / play in its fit with the adapter that it doesn't have on my DSLR. And my plastic 35mm Nikon fits snug as bug with the adapter on the BMCC and is pin sharp. Compared to the Tokina it's way sharper through the entire focal range.
But stick the Tokina on my DSLR and it's just as sharp.
This gets weirder and weirder!
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostSun Feb 10, 2013 9:04 pm

Ok- just got finished following the 3 screw adjustment noted on Christian's blog:
This is an EF Canon Tokina 11-16:

- when first opened up to get to the 3 screws, found that you must move the 2 brass sleeved screws to move under the cover to gain access to ALL 3 screws.

- thought I would be in luck as all 3 screws were originally located to right of center in the ovals at the start (remember for Canons you want to adjust the location of these 3 screws as far left as you can get them to improve infinity focus; Nikons you want to move far right to improve infinity focus)

- after moving all 3 screws LEFT as far as cover would allow (one screw was starting to locate under the cover which would no longer allow tightening with a small jeweler's driver), the infinity focus was somewhat improved, but not perfect at 11mm as it is on the 7D.

- at 12mm I can get pretty good infinity focus

- at 13-16mm I get very good infinity focus

(all these were done at wide open 2.8 iris)

Unless it is something about the optics that I don't understand, I believe it is something in the machining of the Tokina EF mount that slightly throws off the flange distance on the BMCC. There is something in the way these two mount that isn't right. There appears to be some mechanical conflict unique to the Tokina/BMCC mounting match up.)

(I used Resolve and the Sizing feature to zoom into "1.500 to compare the same tripod located shots before and after adjustments.)

So until the full fix is found for this very popular and previously useful lens, here is what I recommend:

+ at 11mm stay way stopped down. Have not experimented how far down, but maybe 5.6 or more if you are trying for a landscape shot with deep depth of field

+ at 11mm for a CU with background thrown out of focus, you are good to go

+ for Infinity deep depth of field, stay 12mm to 16mm with closed down apertures - do your own experimentation - difficult in the field even with a quality SmallHD DP6 and sunhood.
Last edited by John Richard on Mon Feb 11, 2013 1:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostMon Feb 11, 2013 12:22 am

John Richard wrote:after moving all 3 screws right as far as cover would allow


Did you push them towards the right or left? I thought you had a Canon mount version.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostMon Feb 11, 2013 10:07 am

BLACKMAGIC, give us a fix, please.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostMon Feb 11, 2013 1:42 pm

Christian Schmeer wrote:
John Richard wrote:after moving all 3 screws right as far as cover would allow


Did you push them towards the right or left? I thought you had a Canon mount version.



OOOPS! Sorry - I moved them left as per your helpful instructions. And it did help some.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Feb 13, 2013 2:20 pm

Another infinity focus report:

http://www.dslrnewsshooter.com/2013/02/ ... us-issues/

Cheers.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Feb 13, 2013 2:46 pm

What version its issued? DX or DX2 ?
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Alex Tissot

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Feb 13, 2013 3:50 pm

I'm impatient to test my Sigma 10-20mm f3.5 to check the infinity!

According to this article:
http://www.dslrnewsshooter.com/2013/02/ ... us-issues/

There would have the same problem with Zeiss Ze lenses!!!

So where does the problem comes from?
The lenses or the new sensor of the BMC?

Only Blackmagic or BMC users can tell us!!!
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Feb 13, 2013 4:53 pm

My new Tokina 11-16 will not focus to infinity. S---!
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Craig

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostWed Feb 13, 2013 6:13 pm

Eyes seem to be turning on the mount rather than blaming the lens.
Not just this lens.
Hope this can be sorted ASAP.
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Alex Tissot

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostThu Feb 14, 2013 10:13 am

Craig wrote:Eyes seem to be turning on the mount rather than blaming the lens.
Not just this lens.
Hope this can be sorted ASAP.


I hope so!!!!!!

But if it's a problem of mount that will confuse the issue...

The MFT model shouldn't have this problem.
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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostThu Feb 14, 2013 2:26 pm

alexvideo23 wrote:
Craig wrote:Eyes seem to be turning on the mount rather than blaming the lens.
Not just this lens.
Hope this can be sorted ASAP.


I hope so!!!!!!

But if it's a problem of mount that will confuse the issue...

The MFT model shouldn't have this problem.


Why do you think the BMCC MFT will not have this problem?

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostThu Feb 14, 2013 3:19 pm

Why do you think the BMCC MFT will not have this problem?

Rick Lang
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Because if it is a flange distance causing the issue, they would not ship the MFT models until they have fixed at the factory?
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rick.lang

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Re: Tokina 11-16 focus

PostFri Feb 15, 2013 12:35 am

John Richard wrote:Why do you think the BMCC MFT will not have this problem?

Rick Lang
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Because if it is a flange distance causing the issue, they would not ship the MFT models until they have fixed at the factory?[/quote]

Let us hope you are right! I thought that might be your rationale but just wondered if you had additional insight. Thanks.

Rick Lang
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Rick Lang
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