SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

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Logan Vollmers

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SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSat Sep 09, 2017 2:29 pm

Hey all,

New UMP owner here. Wondering when the announced SSD module for the Ursa cameras will be available and shipping? Originally I heard an August release. Just curious, as I think it would be a perfect compliment to the cam.
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rick.lang

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostMon Sep 11, 2017 7:10 pm

BMD was hoping the delivery would occur about the same time as the F mount, but that may not be the case. The F mount shipped about month-end, but no estimated date for the SSD has been provided yet AFAIK.


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Tim Schumann

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostTue Sep 12, 2017 1:04 am

We will be showing it at IBC and shipping shortly after.
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Logan Vollmers

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostTue Sep 12, 2017 1:59 pm

:D
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James Alexander Barnett

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostTue Sep 12, 2017 9:10 pm

Tim Schumann wrote:We will be showing it at IBC and shipping shortly after.


Hi Tim,

Can you tell us if it will have an SDI loop out so we can still connect a directors monitor for example?
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Tim Schumann

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostWed Sep 13, 2017 12:14 am

No the SDI In and Out connect to the camera's rear SDI connectors as a data link to and from the camera.

This means you can record in 4.6K RAW or ProRes, not just ProRes and play back from the SSD.
It also means that you get full feedback from the SSD recorder about time remaining on it, formatting disks, dropped frames, so essentially it works like another media slot on your camera that you can choose from.
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MatSliwinski

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostWed Sep 13, 2017 7:00 am

Will you be annoucning any higher frame rates at IBC by any chance?
I know that the SSD module will allow you capture higher frame rates which was mentioned before!
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rick.lang

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostWed Sep 13, 2017 7:29 pm

Thanks for the timely update, Tim. Looking forward to seeing it.


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Nate Follmer

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 2:30 pm

Does this mean I'll be able to ditch the Atoch and actually close my LCD? I don't care what it costs then... Ship it! I'll buy it :D
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JasonFinnigan

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 2:40 pm

Wonder how many people will give up their SDI out for the SSD Module?
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Denny Smith

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 4:30 pm

Anyone wanting to record directly to SSDs. You still have the monitor SDI output on the front of the camera for EVF or external monitors.
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thomas bruegger

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 4:36 pm

JasonFinnigan wrote:Wonder how many people will give up their SDI out for the SSD Module?


yeah true, i probably wont.
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Keith Babineaux

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 4:48 pm

Tim Schumann wrote:We will be showing it at IBC and shipping shortly after.


Tim,

Will it be available for the original URSA Mini 4.6K?
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Denny Smith

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 5:10 pm

From what I understand, same unit works on both cameras, as they both have the needed SDI in/out ports, run the same firmware. Not sure about the Mini 4K however, wounder if it wil, work with it also?
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Paul Kapp

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 6:45 pm

Nate Follmer wrote:Does this mean I'll be able to ditch the Atoch and actually close my LCD? I don't care what it costs then... Ship it! I'll buy it :D

+1
The Atoch works but it is flimsy and inelegant. The 1/4 20 mount on mine broke the first time I used it on a shoot. It is also massively over priced for what it is. It is made(badly) from $100 in parts you can buy yourself on the internet, and you would get a better case/enclosure.
The BM SSD recorder will sell for the same price. I'll be getting one.
One thing though, it will only take one SSD so no 4.6K 60p raw, though I can't imagine the need for that on a long shoot.
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Nate Follmer

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 7:08 pm

Paul Kapp wrote:
Nate Follmer wrote:Does this mean I'll be able to ditch the Atoch and actually close my LCD? I don't care what it costs then... Ship it! I'll buy it :D

+1
The Atoch works but it is flimsy and inelegant. The 1/4 20 mount on mine broke the first time I used it on a shoot. It is also massively over priced for what it is. It is made(badly) from $100 in parts you can buy yourself on the internet, and you would get a better case/enclosure.
The BM SSD recorder will sell for the same price. I'll be getting one.
One thing though, it will only take one SSD so no 4.6K 60p raw, though I can't imagine the need for that on a long shoot.


I ended up putting velcro on all my V-Mount batteries and the back of the Atoch. I couldn't mount it anywhere else without it being in the way. I really only went SSD because 90% of my shooting is longer format interview stuff, so I need the space.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 9:38 pm

The front SDI is 3G while the rear SDI is 12G - so quesrion for the Ursa mini 4.6k Users (or anyone who might know lol) WILL the front SDI work sufficently to ONLY MONITOR - not record - with the 5" or 7" Video assist. I need to be able to use an external monitor with my easy rig but also want that SSD. More like NEED SSD lol. THanks guys!!
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Krzysztof Gluszek

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 9:46 pm

I am using ssd enclosure with cfast to esata cable, ssd is powered with light 5v powerbank - it is exactly the setup from Tom Antos tutorial.


I record 50/60p 4.6 raw 3:1 and 4:1 without any problems and no dropped frames to 500gb samsung 850evo SSDs. I didnt test uncompressed 60p raw though. I was using this setup during summer in 30-35 degrees celcius and during winter in -20 degrees. It worked without any flaws.
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Keith Babineaux

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 10:15 pm

Krzysztof Gluszek wrote:I am using ssd enclosure with cfast to esata cable, ssd is powered with light 5v powerbank - it is exactly the setup from Tom Antos tutorial.

I record 50/60p 4.6 raw 3:1 and 4:1 without any problems and no dropped frames to 500gb samsung 850evo SSDs. I didnt test uncompressed 60p raw though. I was using this setup during summer in 30-35 degrees celcius and during winter in -20 degrees. It worked without any flaws.


I use the same setup and never had any problems. I added velcro to the back of my batteries and use a Dtap to power the SSD enclosure. It all cost me less than $100. Only thing that I don't like is the fact that you can't close the screen. That's why I'm also awaiting the release of the SSD module.
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rick.lang

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostFri Sep 15, 2017 3:58 am

Chris, the front SDI handles HD video so will be adequate to use for feeding a monitor like the BM Video Assist.


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Earl R. Thurston

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostFri Sep 15, 2017 4:40 am

Denny Smith wrote:From what I understand, same unit works on both cameras...Not sure about the Mini 4K however, wounder if it wil, work with it also?

Been wondering that myself. Would be cool if it did.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostFri Sep 15, 2017 2:17 pm

rick.lang wrote:Chris, the front SDI handles HD video so will be adequate to use for feeding a monitor like the BM Video Assist.


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Not only that - you can use a BNC splitter to split the signal to both the viewfinder and a video assist to use as a directors monitor.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostFri Sep 15, 2017 3:30 pm

Chris Gosling wrote:
rick.lang wrote:Chris, the front SDI handles HD video so will be adequate to use for feeding a monitor like the BM Video Assist.


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Not only that - you can use a BNC splitter to split the signal to both the viewfinder and a video assist to use as a directors monitor.


I guess that depends but Directors don't usually want all the extra crap on their monitors.

Also for HD-SDI you don't want to use a BNC splitter. It needs to be a Distro Amp or Loop out, or HD-SDI Splitter

http://www.belden.com/blog/broadcastav/ ... -Video.cfm
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSat Sep 16, 2017 1:29 pm

There is 1 unit on the IBC.
It is an engineering sample and did not work yet at the booth..

As you can see it will be bolted between the Vlock plate and the Ursa body..

And yes you will loose those 2 SDI ports on the backside.
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Keith Babineaux

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSat Sep 16, 2017 3:43 pm

Xtreemtec wrote:There is 1 unit on the IBC.
It is an engineering sample and did not work yet at the booth..

As you can see it will be bolted between the Vlock plate and the Ursa body..

And yes you will loose those 2 SDI ports on the backside.


Thanks for the images. It looks like it might hold 2 SSD cards. It looks too bulky to hold just 1. It also looks like it's going to be a bit pricey.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSat Sep 16, 2017 5:01 pm

No, probably just one, as their is only one SSD ready light on the side... time will tell.
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Last edited by Denny Smith on Sat Sep 16, 2017 5:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSat Sep 16, 2017 5:12 pm

i will check monday.. I'm there again
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSat Sep 16, 2017 5:16 pm

Great, thanks Daniel. Looks like a recased Hyperdeck Shuttle with a new control board added, looks about the right size?
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSat Sep 16, 2017 7:48 pm

Xtreemtec wrote:And yes you will loose those 2 SDI ports on the backside.

If you have a monitor with SDI passthrough you could use the front SDI port and still use the EVF, though I would tend to use one or the other.

Keith Babineaux wrote:Thanks for the images. It looks like it might hold 2 SSD cards. It looks too bulky to hold just 1. It also looks like it's going to be a bit pricey.

It only holds one SSD.

The price will be AU$600, about US$480.
(Over US$100 less than an Atoch)

I saw this in Sydney in July at our SMPTE exhibition.
Last edited by Paul Kapp on Sat Sep 16, 2017 8:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSat Sep 16, 2017 8:10 pm

Denny Smith wrote:Great, thanks Daniel. Looks like a recased Hyperdeck Shuttle with a new control board added, looks about the right size?
Cheers

Denny it matches the footprint of a V-Lock mount which is smaller than the shuttle, but it is a bit thicker.
Same idea, but it converts 12G SDI into raw.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSat Sep 16, 2017 8:52 pm

Paul Kapp wrote:
Xtreemtec wrote:And yes you will loose those 2 SDI ports on the backside.

If you have a monitor with SDI passthrough you could use the front SDI port and still use the EVF, though I would tend to use one or the other.

Keith Babineaux wrote:Thanks for the images. It looks like it might hold 2 SSD cards. It looks too bulky to hold just 1. It also looks like it's going to be a bit pricey.

It only holds one SSD.

The price will be AU$600, about US$480.
(Over US$100 less than an Atoch)

I saw this in Sydney in July at our SMPTE exhibition.


$480 isn't bad at all compared to the Atoch. It just looks bulky to me. I was using a SSD enclosure with a dummy Cfast connector for $100 anyway. This will make things easier and make the camera look professional. It will also save a lot of money in the future. I have 4 960GB SSD Cards. I'm waiting for it to start shipping next week.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSat Sep 16, 2017 8:54 pm

Denny Smith wrote:No, probably just one, as their is only one SSD ready light on the side... time will tell.
Cheers


I see it now. It has a SDI and SSD light. Why is it so bulky? My SSD enclosure is almost the same size as my SSD card.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSun Sep 17, 2017 1:28 am

JasonFinnigan wrote:
Chris Gosling wrote:
rick.lang wrote:Chris, the front SDI handles HD video so will be adequate to use for feeding a monitor like the BM Video Assist.


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Not only that - you can use a BNC splitter to split the signal to both the viewfinder and a video assist to use as a directors monitor.


I guess that depends but Directors don't usually want all the extra crap on their monitors.

Also for HD-SDI you don't want to use a BNC splitter. It needs to be a Distro Amp or Loop out, or HD-SDI Splitter

http://www.belden.com/blog/broadcastav/ ... -Video.cfm


Tried using a BNC splitter yesterday and it seemed to work just fine for adding a 5" Video Assist.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSun Sep 17, 2017 5:09 am

Thanks Paul, it is hard to see in a photo.

Keith, I think the extra thick case is for the Video processor board and cooling to convert the 12G DNGs to Raw files.
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Robert Niessner

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSun Sep 17, 2017 10:55 am

Archibaldo, was going to post the same video - you were faster :)

Anyway, bad news for us UM46k users - SSD module won't be supported. It's UMP only.

To be honest I am a bit disappointed that BMD again starts to let the camera firmeware features drift between very similar models. It almost feels like UMP as the latest and greatest gets all the attention.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSun Sep 17, 2017 1:08 pm

Robert Niessner wrote:bad news for us UM46k users - SSD module won't be supported. It's UMP only.


Thumbs down, BM. This is extremely disappointing!
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Denny Smith

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSun Sep 17, 2017 3:48 pm

So there you have it, one SSD, will not work as a stand alone recorder or record a different codec from the internal drives (Raw in one and ProRes in the other). Cost under $400.

From a Pro workflow perspective, the SSD drive is designed as a redundant/backup recording of what is being recorded by the camera's internal media (CFast/SD). It is not a separate recording option, but rather a data backup system, which is good.

What it does not do is allow recording to just the SSD, as you need to have either SD or CFast media in the camera beforemthe record button will work. The SSD drive lacks its own record button, as in the Shuttle or Video Assist. The Pro has a selectable recording media internally, and must have its own record trigger signal/function that is output the SDI to the SSD dock, which is perhaps the difference between the Pro and the UM4.6, restricting the new SSD dick to just the Pro.

Thanks Tim for answering the questions about the SSD Dock that have been floating around.
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Earl R. Thurston

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSun Sep 17, 2017 4:09 pm

Tim also mentions that the SSD cannot record the higher frame rates that the CFast can. They "hope" to be able to record up to 4K at 30 fps, which means it's not even capable of that yet.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSun Sep 17, 2017 4:11 pm

Tim Schumann wrote:URSA Mini Pro at launch. Hoping to support the other Mini's in a firmware update in the coming months.


As a big ursa owner I've learnt to take any trade show info it with a pinch of salt.

As to whether this will be available for the other ursa minis, Tim from the camera development team did say they were hoping too, so we can hopefully remain hopeful

Maybe they'll ship on the same day as my turret upgrade ;)
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSun Sep 17, 2017 4:53 pm

Do not get your hopes up, Tim did say the SSD Dock Recorder is for the Ursa Mini Pro only, the only hoping was about the SSD recorder's frame rate recording ability, that they were still working on.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSun Sep 17, 2017 5:29 pm

Something I found a bit puzzling -- Tim mentions that one of the benefits the SSD recorder will be that it will support higher capacity than the CFast cards. But if one can only record to CFast and SSD at the same time, what happens when the CFast card(s) get full? Would it stop recording to all of the media, meaning the extra SSD capacity is pointless? Or does it keep recording to the SSD after the CFast cards stop?

Something doesn't quite add up.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSun Sep 17, 2017 6:43 pm

Tim said the SSD was firma backup,recorders riding, so yiumwould need to change the CFast/SD cards S they filled to keep recording, but you would not need to change the SSD until it reached max capacity. One less thing to do, one SSD for backups, is what I think he meant.
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Earl R. Thurston

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSun Sep 17, 2017 10:05 pm

Denny Smith wrote:...[you] would need to change the CFast/SD cards [as] they filled to keep recording, but you would not need to change the SSD until it reached max capacity

Ahh yes, okay, that makes sense then.
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Tim Schumann

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostSun Sep 17, 2017 10:59 pm

There are some major factual errors in that video so we will have to take it down.

Will post some info to clarify shortly. Apologies for the confusion.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostMon Sep 18, 2017 1:48 am

Ah.... thanks Tim, will appreciate all the help with this we can get.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostMon Sep 18, 2017 2:43 am

Tim Schumann wrote:There are some major factual errors in that video so we will have to take it down.

Will post some info to clarify shortly. Apologies for the confusion.


I'm confused - if there are factual errors why run the video? The fact that the Um 4.6k is being ignored is beyond disappointing - especially when KNOWING that SSD is MUCH MORE COST EFFICIENT THAN CFAST cards. We all bought the lie knowing that fact while secretly hoping that there would be a SSD module released in the near future. NOW, only being released for the UMP basically makes me feel like the 5K I shelled out for the UM4.6k was a waste.... I like BM. I like that for the price you get a wonderful image. But c'mon guys...this is bush league.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostMon Sep 18, 2017 6:54 am

Chris Carter wrote:
Tim Schumann wrote:There are some major factual errors in that video so we will have to take it down.

Will post some info to clarify shortly. Apologies for the confusion.


I'm confused - if there are factual errors why run the video? The fact that the Um 4.6k is being ignored is beyond disappointing - especially when KNOWING that SSD is MUCH MORE COST EFFICIENT THAN CFAST cards. We all bought the lie knowing that fact while secretly hoping that there would be a SSD module released in the near future. NOW, only being released for the UMP basically makes me feel like the 5K I shelled out for the UM4.6k was a waste.... I like BM. I like that for the price you get a wonderful image. But c'mon guys...this is bush league.

Technically they announced the SSD Module in the same video they announced the UMP in march of 2017 and they stated in the announcement video it will work for the UMP but they will try to see if they can get it to work with the Ursa Mini but no promises. They never promised or stated it would ever work with the Ursa Mini, only the Pro.
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Robert Niessner

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostMon Sep 18, 2017 8:34 am

Chris Carter wrote:
Tim Schumann wrote:There are some major factual errors in that video so we will have to take it down.

Will post some info to clarify shortly. Apologies for the confusion.


I'm confused - if there are factual errors why run the video? The fact that the Um 4.6k is being ignored is beyond disappointing - especially when KNOWING that SSD is MUCH MORE COST EFFICIENT THAN CFAST cards. We all bought the lie knowing that fact while secretly hoping that there would be a SSD module released in the near future. NOW, only being released for the UMP basically makes me feel like the 5K I shelled out for the UM4.6k was a waste.... I like BM. I like that for the price you get a wonderful image. But c'mon guys...this is bush league.


Chris, this video was not a marketing video made by BMD but by Slashcam.de - a German filmmaking forum. Seems like the BMD guy at IBC had wrong or old infos about the device. Those things can happen in a big company where the flow of information is not always as fast as one would like.
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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostMon Sep 18, 2017 12:06 pm

the Molded in BNC cables are going to be a weakness of this just like it is on the viewfinder unfortunately.
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Michael Odhiambo

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Re: SSD MODULE AVAILABILITY?

PostTue Sep 19, 2017 5:14 am

JasonFinnigan wrote:the Molded in BNC cables are going to be a weakness of this just like it is on the viewfinder unfortunately.


:? Snap. If one of the cable becomes faulty...yes.

BM, since its still an engineering mould, feature request. Can it be SDI connectors and leave a 12G loop through? Thats what your customers here REALLY want.
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