Firmware 1.3 better audio performance

From what I can deduce from my simple tests, the digital attenuation level has changed.

Noise performance seems better too - and no DC offset!


It seems the old 20-30% advisory in camera setting needs to now go out of the window.

For comparison: here are two recordings I did with the exact same circumstances, before and after the firmware update:

Upper: Firmware 1.3 - +20dB on Video Mic Pro - 30% In camera gain
Lower: Firmware 1.2 - +20dB on Video Mic Pro - 30% In camera gain

ScreenHunter_42 Apr. 25 09.34.jpg (224.08 KiB) Viewed 20665 times

If Mr Juiced Link himself is reading this, please can you re-do your tests!

Wow, phantatstic, thanks for heads up!

Wonder why they don't advertise this?

Tom,

Just to clarify for me...

Same input level and settings on both tests gave you different actual gain in the recorded signal?

Nothing changed at all on the input or settings in the camera?

Just the firmware change gave you that much gain difference?

Or

Was the program material a different gain/level/volume going to the camera?

Thanks for any insight...

Dave

Thanks Tom.

Tom,

Just to clarify for me...

Same input level and settings on both tests gave you different actual gain in the recorded signal?

Nothing changed at all on the input or settings in the camera?

Just the firmware change gave you that much gain difference?

Or

Was the program material a different gain/level/volume going to the camera?

Thanks for any insight...

Dave

I placed a rode video mic pro pointing towards some speakers. Set the camera to 30%, the mic to +20gain. Played 10 seconds from an audiobook through the speakers.

Then, keeping the mic in the exact same place, the speakers the same level, the camera still at 30% and the mic still at +20gain, updated the camera to 1.3 and recorded the exact same 10 seconds from the audiobook.

In short- yes, every single detail stayed the same except for the firmware version.

You might be just able to make out that the waveform is the same pattern, just more quiet in the 1.3.

Tom,

Thanks for your post and follow up! That is quite a difference...

I haven't put 1.3 on yet, and was reluctant to only get interlaced output.

Now, I have a much better reason.

Tom,

Thanks for your post and follow up! That is quite a difference...

I haven't put 1.4 on yet, and was reluctant to only get interlaced output.

Now, I have a much better reason.

Probably just a typo - but to avoid confusion from others- I assume you meant to say 1.3?





In addition to my testing and others on a different forum, it has been suggested that the noise performance didnt really change from 0-100% but bellow 100% it seems impossible to clip.

So, here is my current theory (if anyone knows better, specifically someone from BMD - please correct me)

100% = 0 Gain, 0 Attenuation.
80% = 0 Gain, -20% Attenuation.
50% = 0Gain, -50% Attenuation

and so on.

This would be more logical than the previous configuration. And also unless the camera has its own built in amp - much more sensible.

Previously it was something like this:

0-25% digital attenuation
25-100% digital gain was applied.



Could anyone from BMD care to comment? I have already emailed JuicedLink.

Tom,

Yup, typo... corrected.

Hi Tom, I'm reluctant to upgrade the firmware even though I hate DC-offset and I will to do in the next time.
But one time you update then we lose the out progressive?
thx

Hi Tom, I'm reluctant to upgrade the firmware even though I hate DC-offset and I will to do in the next time.
But one time you update then we lose the out progressive?
thx

I am not sure about the sdi output, but for audio - this update does seem like an improvement.

Hi Tom, I'm reluctant to upgrade the firmware even though I hate DC-offset and I will to do in the next time.
But one time you update then we lose the out progressive?
thx

Yes

Wow - this is very cool, if it has indeed been fixed!

I've been doing lots of audio tests over the last week or so - so I can't wait to do the same tests with this newer firmware! Hopefully it actually makes a difference!

Like others here, I was reluctant to upgrade, as I don't want to loose the progressive SDI output. But if it fixes the audio, I think it's worth the interlaced feed!

Typical... instead of just fixing the problem, BMD has reinstated the old battle between sound recordist and camera assistant!

I've just done some tests:

BMC (Running 1.2)
Microphone Input: 0%
Ch 1 and Ch 2 Input Levels: Line
Ch 1 Input: 76%
Ch 2 uses Ch 1 Input: Off
Ch 2 Input: 76%
Headphone Volume: 100%

302
XLR Atten. Level: 0dB
Everything else is factory default.

When sending out "factory default" tone (1kHz tone at 0dBu) from the 302 I get the following...

UltraScope 1.6.3

ultrascope_76_line_tone.png (604.08 KiB) Viewed 21418 times

Media Express 3.2

mediaexpress_76_line_tone.png (609.77 KiB) Viewed 21418 times

Adobe Audition 5.0.2 - Captured from Media Express

audition_76_line_tone.png (179.44 KiB) Viewed 21418 times

BMC (Running 1.2)
Microphone Input: 0%
Ch 1 and Ch 2 Input Levels: Line
Ch 1 Input: 76%
Ch 2 uses Ch 1 Input: Off
Ch 2 Input: 76%
Headphone Volume: 100%

302
XLR Atten. Level: 0dB
Everything else is factory default.

When sending out "full scale" tone (i.e. clipping level) from the 302 I get the following...

UltraScope 1.6.3

ultrascope_76_line_fulltone.png (609.3 KiB) Viewed 21417 times

Media Express 3.2

mediaexpress_76_line_fulltone.png (608.02 KiB) Viewed 21417 times

Adobe Audition 5.0.2 - Captured from Media Express

audition_76_line_fulltone.png (183.11 KiB) Viewed 21417 times

BMC (Running 1.3)
Microphone Input: 0%
Ch 1 and Ch 2 Input Levels: Line
Ch 1 Input: 76%
Ch 2 uses Ch 1 Input: Off
Ch 2 Input: 76%
Headphone Volume: 100%

302
XLR Atten. Level: 0dB
Everything else is factory default.

When sending out "factory default" tone (1kHz tone at 0dBu) from the 302 I get the following...

UltraScope 1.6.3

ultrascope_76_line_tone.png (664.48 KiB) Viewed 21416 times

Media Express 3.2

mediaexpress_76_line_tone.png (605.12 KiB) Viewed 21416 times

Adobe Audition 5.0.2 - Captured from Media Express

audition_76_line_tone.png (178.05 KiB) Viewed 21416 times

BMC (Running 1.3)
Microphone Input: 0%
Ch 1 and Ch 2 Input Levels: Line
Ch 1 Input: 76%
Ch 2 uses Ch 1 Input: Off
Ch 2 Input: 76%
Headphone Volume: 100%

302
XLR Atten. Level: 0dB
Everything else is factory default.

When sending out "full scale" tone (i.e. clipping level) from the 302 I get the following...

UltraScope 1.6.3

ultrascope_76_line_fulltone.png (611.47 KiB) Viewed 21416 times

Media Express 3.2

mediaexpress_76_line_fulltone.png (604.86 KiB) Viewed 21416 times

Adobe Audition 5.0.2 - Captured from Media Express

audition_76_line_fulltone.png (184.35 KiB) Viewed 21416 times

BMC (Running 1.3)
Microphone Input: 0%
Ch 1 and Ch 2 Input Levels: Line
Ch 1 Input: 100%
Ch 2 uses Ch 1 Input: Off
Ch 2 Input: 100%
Headphone Volume: 100%

302
XLR Atten. Level: 0dB
Everything else is factory default.

When sending out "factory default" tone (1kHz tone at 0dBu) from the 302 I get the following...

UltraScope 1.6.3

ultrascope_100_line_tone.png (610.62 KiB) Viewed 21416 times

Media Express 3.2

mediaexpress_100_line_tone.png (612.15 KiB) Viewed 21416 times

Adobe Audition 5.0.2 - Captured from Media Express

audition_100_line_tone.png (178.92 KiB) Viewed 21416 times

BMC (Running 1.3)
Microphone Input: 0%
Ch 1 and Ch 2 Input Levels: Line
Ch 1 Input: 100%
Ch 2 uses Ch 1 Input: Off
Ch 2 Input: 100%
Headphone Volume: 100%

302
XLR Atten. Level: 0dB
Everything else is factory default.

When sending out "full scale" tone (i.e. clipping level) from the 302 I get the following...

UltraScope 1.6.3

ultrascope_100_line_fulltone.png (611.21 KiB) Viewed 21416 times

Media Express 3.2

mediaexpress_100_line_fulltone.png (615.22 KiB) Viewed 21416 times

Adobe Audition 5.0.2 - Captured from Media Express

audition_100_line_fulltone.png (184.27 KiB) Viewed 21416 times

So... 1.3 has less white noise? Sorry, I'm totally audio challenged, I have no idea what those tests above mean!

So, here is my current theory (if anyone knows better, specifically someone from BMD - please correct me)

100% = 0 Gain, 0 Attenuation.
80% = 0 Gain, -20% Attenuation.
50% = 0Gain, -50% Attenuation

This is exactly what I'm seeing. Using the 1.3 Firmware, if you set the Input Level to 100% on the camera, and set the Ch 1 and Ch2 Input Levels to Line - you're essentially getting 0dB gain and 0dB attenuation, which is FANTASTIC news! The DC Offset is also fixed.

I'm still doing some more detailed tests - so will come back with my findings soon.

But yes, I can definitely confirm that BMD has revised the audio functionality on this new firmware - and so far, it looks like it's vastly improved.

Here's another quick test, this time using Mic Level instead of Line Level.

BMC (Running 1.3)
Microphone Input: 0%
Ch 1 and Ch 2 Input Levels: Mic
Ch 1 Input: 76%
Ch 2 uses Ch 1 Input: Off
Ch 2 Input: 76%
Headphone Volume: 100%

302
XLR Atten. Level: -40 dB
Everything else is factory default.

When sending out "factory default" tone (1kHz tone at 0dBu) from the 302 I get the following...

UltraScope 1.6.3

ultrascope_76_mic_tone.png (605.51 KiB) Viewed 21706 times

Media Express 3.2

mediaexpress_76_mic_tone.png (610.46 KiB) Viewed 21706 times

Adobe Audition 5.0.2 - Captured from Media Express

audition_76_mic_tone.png (172.85 KiB) Viewed 21706 times

BMC (Running 1.3)
Microphone Input: 0%
Ch 1 and Ch 2 Input Levels: Mic
Ch 1 Input: 76%
Ch 2 uses Ch 1 Input: Off
Ch 2 Input: 76%
Headphone Volume: 100%

302
XLR Atten. Level: -40dB
Everything else is factory default.

When sending out "full scale" tone (i.e. clipping level) from the 302 I get the following...

UltraScope 1.6.3

ultrascope_76_mic_fullscale.png (611.02 KiB) Viewed 21706 times

Media Express 3.2

mediaexpress_76_mic_fullscale.png (604.77 KiB) Viewed 21706 times

Adobe Audition 5.0.2 - Captured from Media Express

audition_76_mic_fullscale.png (181.18 KiB) Viewed 21706 times

Hi Tom, I'm reluctant to upgrade the firmware even though I hate DC-offset and I will to do in the next time.
But one time you update then we lose the out progressive?
thx

Yes

From what I understand you don't lose progressive, you can switch to interlaced!
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7247

Cheers,
Milen

For anyone who's interested, I just did some tests comparing Mic Level and Line Level.

For the Line Level tests, I used 100% on the camera and 0dB on the 302.

For the Mic Level tests, I used 76% on the camera and -40dB on the 302.

In both cases, I ran Full Tone from the 302, then exited out of the Setup Menu, switching it automatically to Standard Tone, then turned off Tone all together (where all of the Gain/Volume Pots were fully turned to the Left).

The files below are straight off the camera when recording in RAW 2.5K mode. I disconnected our external battery, SDI cables and headphones when doing this test - just incase they made a difference at all.

You can download the Mic test here: http://www.filedropper.com/mic
You can download the Line test here: http://www.filedropper.com/line

As you can hear, there is still a fair bit of noise on both examples. However, without anything to really compare it to at the moment, I'm not sure if this is a good or bad result.

If anyone has access to a higher quality mixer/recorder - I'd love to hear some comparisons.

One thing I haven't mentioned is that I'm now using a multi-core loom from the 302 to the camera - it's 2 x XLR, and 1 x Male 3.5 mm Headphone Return on the 302 side, with a 7-pin XLR on the camera end, connected to a breakout cable which has a Male 3.5mm for the Headphone Jack, and 2 x Right-Angle 1/4inch TRS Jacks that fit perfectly into the camera. I've tested it all - and the cabling is all wired correctly.

Any questions, let me know!

Chris!

From what I understand you don't lose progressive, you can switch to interlaced!

SDI outputs interlaced video when frame rate is set to 1080p25 or 1080p29.97 and overlays are turned off.

If you turn overlays on - then the output is progressive again.

However, to be perfectly honest - I have a SmallHD AC7 hooked up to the camera, and I can't really notice any difference between SDI Overlays set to Off versus Status. The AC7 doesn't actually tell you what kind of signal it's getting - so I'm not sure if it's PsF or not. Next time I have a chance, I'll hook it up to a broadcast monitor and see what the SDI signal ACTUALLY is.

This may be of interest... http://www.sounddevices.com/notes/cameras/red-one/

Its a summary of a test done by the sound devices guys with the Red camera.

If anyone with a camera is close to them, maybe sound devices would test the BMCC as well.

Hi Tom, I'm reluctant to upgrade the firmware even though I hate DC-offset and I will to do in the next time.
But one time you update then we lose the out progressive?
thx

Yes

From what I understand you don't lose progressive, you can switch to interlaced!
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7247

Cheers,
Milen

If you selet clean out, only "i" V1.3

If anyone with a camera is close to them, maybe sound devices would test the BMCC as well.

I've been chatting with the Sound Devices team over the last week about trying to get the best performance out of the BMC - and I'm sure if someone nearby could loan them a camera for a day, they'd love to have a play!

From what I understand you don't lose progressive, you can switch to interlaced!
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7247

Cheers,
Milen

If you selet clean out, only "i" V1.3

No, only i if you select clean AND 25 or 29.97....if you're on 24 or 23.98, still progressive

Can anyone from Black Magic confirm that changes have been made to the audio handling of the camera system ? Surely, this would have been reported in the upgrade notes. All that is shown is:

What's New

• SDI outputs interlaced video when frame rate is set to 1080p25 or 1080p29.97 and overlays are turned off

I can tell you 100% that the changes have been made - just look at the test results!

Why they decided to keep it quiet, I have absolutely no idea.

It's very Apple-like - never admit your mistakes, and the DC offset was a bug that should have never been there in the first place.

Maybe now we will see VUs?

Yes, I'd say in the next firmware release there will definitely be meters.

However, personally I don't see it as a huge priority. To get good audio you NEED an external mixer/pre-amp, and given the camera comes with UltraScopes you can calibrate with that, and you're good to go!

Few people will be monitoring off the back of the screen anyway, so most people will be using a 3rd Party monitor or EVF - just get one with meters.

Now that the line input settings are logical, I'm pretty happy. The camera is finally truly useable.

I am wondering though if the noise level can be improved in firmware, or whether it's a hardware limitation.

Personally, my biggest firmware priorities are drive space indicator, auto focus, and timecode.

I can live without audio meters, better battery meters and drive formatting.

In fact, I do really like the fact that the BMC is so simple with so little menus. Keeps things simple and streamlined. If I need something with a billion menus and ultimate flexibility, I'd get a RED.

Personally, my biggest firmware priorities are drive space indicator, auto focus, and timecode.

I can live without audio meters, better battery meters and drive formatting.

In fact, I do really like the fact that the BMC is so simple with so little menus. Keeps things simple and streamlined. If I need something with a billion menus and ultimate flexibility, I'd get a RED.

I would agree that drive space indicator, auto focus, and time code are needed, Internal Battery meter, I could care a less since we all know you need a good external battery solution, but I disagree about audio meters, since this is a fairly simple firmware (GUI) upgrade, But I would trade audio meters for drive formatting / Clip Deletion any day since I would be recording professional Audio/Sound as anyone should for a paid gig, The cameras audio would just be needed for sync if that, nothing more.

Maybe now we will see VUs?

+1,000!

I can shoot high-quality audio & video in-camera and with confidence if there are VU or audio peaking indicators on the camera's built-in LCD screen.

I can shoot high-quality audio & video in-camera and with confidence without being able to format the SSD in-camera, without being able to delete files in-camera, and (sometimes) without knowing record time remaining, and without being able to do a lot of other things in-camera.

But I can't reliably record high-quality audio & video in-camera (if there aren't VU or audio peaking indicators on the LCD) -- unless I connect a crap-load of external hardware such as a mixer, or T-Bolt equipped laptop running UltraScope, or a external EVF/monitor w. on-screen VUs, etc.

It's one thing to require people to use external hardware if it's physically difficult or impossible to add some functionality in-camera via a firmware update, but I'm not convinced that's the case with VUs/audio peaking indicators on the BMCC's LCD. I believe adding VUs/audio peaking indicators is a relatively simple software feature to add to the BMCC, but I could be wrong.

Just because some users don't need VUs/audio peaking indicators on the LCD doesn't mean it isn't an important, basic function which should be standard in any video camera presented as a professional piece of gear. Maybe there's an exception, but I don't know of any other pro video camera that doesn't include this feature.

Hopefully it'll be added to BMD camera firmware soon. Very soon.

Cheers.

Maybe now we will see VUs?

+1,000!

but I don't know of any other pro video camera that doesn't include this feature.

You just found one the BMCC, I'm not an audio or sound guy, all my work they have hired them,
So yes I don't have much interest in sound or audio as a DP, It is just as important and I'm not denying that, It's just not something I worry about unless I'm doing a low budget run&gun one man band gig and the budget is does not allow for a professional sound guy, So to for that reason I want it also, But I would still trade it for " per clip deletion" since a 480GB SSD is not enough for re shoots etc, and Many EVF's and Monitors have VU meters built in, or third party mixers.

I can shoot high-quality audio & video in-camera and with confidence if there are VU or audio peaking indicators on the camera's built-in LCD screen.

I guess it all depends on how they implement it.

Personally, I think there's very little point having audio meters, if you need to enter the menu to adjust the volume using those HORRIBLE level controls (it's so hard to easily adjust the level by single increments).

I'd much rather attach an external mixer/pre-amp to the camera, than have to use the touch screen to adjust levels if I'm running solo.

Don't get me wrong... I think it would be AMAZING to have meters - and from what I've heard, this functionality is coming VERY soon - but from a practical point of view, for me at least, I use the meters (via UltraScope) initially to set the gain structure for an external device, and then leave the camera's audio menu alone.

If the camera had the ability to quickly and easily adjust levels on the fly - without any of the current "clicks" when you adjust the Mic Level gain - then I would feel completely different about the matter. But at the moment, you can't really adjust the audio "on the fly", and if you're operating solo, clicking the touch screen mid-shot is pretty impractical anyway.

So again, I think it would be extremely handy to have this functionality, and I'm positive it's coming soon - but if I had a choice, I'd rather they remove the "automatically switch from Mic to Line Level when signal is too hot" - and a bunch of other annoyances first. It's just a matter of priority I guess!

If they do release meters in the next firmware, I just really hope you'll be able to view them via the SDI output overlays!

But I would still trade it for " per clip deletion" since a 480GB SSD is not enough for re shoots etc, and Many EVF's and Monitors have VU meters built in, or third party mixers.

Personally... I wouldn't. Almost everyone will probably disagree with me, but I actually really like the fact that you can't format or delete clips on the camera. It makes it idiot proof.

Auto-focus is might biggest wish. I wonder if we'll ever see it?

I can shoot high-quality audio & video in-camera and with confidence if there are VU or audio peaking indicators on the camera's built-in LCD screen.

I guess it all depends on how they implement it.

Personally, I think there's very little point having audio meters, if you need to enter the menu to adjust the volume using those HORRIBLE level controls (it's so hard to easily adjust the level by single increments).

I'd much rather attach an external mixer/pre-amp to the camera, than have to use the touch screen to adjust levels if I'm running solo.

Don't get me wrong... I think it would be AMAZING to have meters - and from what I've heard, this functionality is coming VERY soon - but from a practical point of view, for me at least, I use the meters (via UltraScope) initially to set the gain structure for an external device, and then leave the camera's audio menu alone.

If the camera had the ability to quickly and easily adjust levels on the fly - without any of the current "clicks" when you adjust the Mic Level gain - then I would feel completely different about the matter. But at the moment, you can't really adjust the audio "on the fly", and if you're operating solo, clicking the touch screen mid-shot is pretty impractical anyway.

So again, I think it would be extremely handy to have this functionality, and I'm positive it's coming soon - but if I had a choice, I'd rather they remove the "automatically switch from Mic to Line Level when signal is too hot" - and a bunch of other annoyances first. It's just a matter of priority I guess!

If they do release meters in the next firmware, I just really hope you'll be able to view them via the SDI output overlays!

But I would still trade it for " per clip deletion" since a 480GB SSD is not enough for re shoots etc, and Many EVF's and Monitors have VU meters built in, or third party mixers.

Personally... I wouldn't. Almost everyone will probably disagree with me, but I actually really like the fact that you can't format or delete clips on the camera. It makes it idiot proof.

Auto-focus is might biggest wish. I wonder if we'll ever see it?

But it does not make an actor idiot proof, having a per clip deletion is needed, Just not yet until it's being used more for shorts/docs/and feature films lol then you will want this feature.

Each to their own. We shot a short film with the BMC back in September last year, and it was never an issue. On a bigger scale shoot, personally, I'd rather the data wrangler or assistant editor make the call on what to delete, rather than the DOP.

I'd imagine adding this functionality will be really tricky as well - as it looks like the camera basically loads a whole set of different software when you change between DNxHD, ProRes and RAW (hence the reason why you can't play ProRes files when you're in DNxHD mode).

Who knows though... anything could happen, and BMD are obviously listening (even if they're not actually telling us what changes they're making!).

Each to their own. We shot a short film with the BMC back in September last year, and it was never an issue. On a bigger scale shoot, personally, I'd rather the data wrangler or assistant editor make the call on what to delete, rather than the DOP.

I'd imagine adding this functionality will be really tricky as well - as it looks like the camera basically loads a whole set of different software when you change between DNxHD, ProRes and RAW (hence the reason why you can't play ProRes files when you're in DNxHD mode).

Who knows though... anything could happen, and BMD are obviously listening (even if they're not actually telling us what changes they're making!).

Now that is a big issue, recording in one format then switching to another, Yes that will/would be an issue for per clip deletion.

... Auto-focus is might biggest wish. I wonder if we'll ever see it?

I doubt we'll see auto focus soon, if ever, on the current shipping/announced BMD cams.

I suspect it's for 2 reasons: It's not currently a high priority for BMD, and it's much more difficult to implement well than are most other features.

For example, DSLR and mirrorless still camera manufacturers fiercely compete in part based on the auto-focus capability of their cameras. They put huge efforts into developing technology to eke out ever more difficult to achieve improved AF performance. It's really really hard to do well.

But for a "cinema camera", although auto focus might be useful once in a while, it's nowhere near as important to job #1: Such as implementing lossless compressed RAW, or high-fidelity color science, and so forth.

My guess is we'll see VU meters in BMD cameras before auto focus ... but who knows, maybe they put auto focus in the Pocket Cinema Camera first.

My guess is we'll see VU meters in BMD cameras before auto focus ... but who knows, maybe they put auto focus in the Pocket Cinema Camera first.

Exactly... I think auto-focus makes a HUGE amount of sense for the Pocket Cinema Camera (especially considering it has an active mount) - and given that the firmware is uniform across all three cameras, I don't think auto-focus is that out of the question.

Given BMD has a huge inventory of patents in the telecine space - I'm sure they've got some focus algorithms up their sleeve.

On the current Blackmagic Cinema Camera (EF) unless you're using cine glass, or have a follow focus on your stills glass - focus is a pain if you're a solo operator. It would be great if you could just press the FOCUS button for a quick and dirty auto-focus, so that it can at least give you a starting point.

Time will tell I guess!

Either way, I think we'll definitely see audio meters first... Hopefully sometime within the next month or so!

Auto focus is never gonna be like you are used to in traditional video cams. Witness the long struggle the maic lantern developers have had try to get there with the eos dslrs. It been reached to a degree, but in my experience dslr lens can't be programmed to act like traditional auto focusing.
.
Audio meters for the camera are needed to assure in camera audio is not clipping . My initial audio testing indicates the camera will be capable of recording usable dialogue and if nothing else will be a decent backup in a dual recording set up.

Auto focus is never gonna be like you are used to in traditional video cams. Witness the long struggle the maic lantern developers have had try to get there with the eos dslrs. It been reached to a degree, but in my experience dslr lens can't be programmed to act like traditional auto focusing.

I agree - but I just want to be able to press the FOCUS button and for the camera to do it's best attempt (like my iPhone can). Doesn't have to be brilliant, just a handy starting point. If it can be done in a smart phone - I'm positive we'll see it in the camera soon enough.

Audio meters for the camera are needed to assure in camera audio is not clipping . My initial audio testing indicates the camera will be capable of recording usable dialogue and if nothing else will be a decent backup in a dual recording set up.

I agree - but my argument is that to get useable audio, you need an external mixer/preamp. In this case you can set up your gain structure using UltraScopes, and you're good to go. It's set and forget.

I think meters on the camera only work if you can adjust levels on the camera with ease. If they add meters, and the ability to "tap" on the meters, and adjust the gain by simply sliding your finger, then problem solved!

You guys realize the camera probably doesn't have any sort of depth perception right? And would only be available on active mounts with active lenses. But if you don't have hardware to judge distance to the camera you kinda can't auto focus. You know how DSLRs have like 6, 18 or 61 focusing points? Those are used to judge focus, this camera looks at sharpness all over to tell you where it thinks its focusing.

If you take the camera and point it at a TV it will say its focused onto whatever is in focus in the shot on the TV, and not the TV itself.

I just want it to act exactly like my iPhone - I tap the screen and it "finds" focus.

Yes, obviously this will only work with active mounts and active lenses - but given the BMC EF is the only camera currently out there in the wild (with the exception of a few beta cameras), this isn't really an issue. If they could make auto-focus work with the current BMC EF and Canon Lenses, I'd be happy.

Definitely not a show stopper - and for jobs where you have a follow focus and cine lenses, this feature would be redundant - but for everyday run and gun stuff, it would be really handy to have.

If the camera had the ability to quickly and easily adjust levels on the fly - without any of the current "clicks" when you adjust the Mic Level gain

The "clicks" are gone since the new firmware.

The "clicks" are gone since the new firmware.

Interesting! I was sure I could still hear them with Mic Level when I did some tests - but maybe not.

I'll have to have another play on Monday.

One thing I haven't mentioned is that I'm now using a multi-core loom from the 302 to the camera - it's 2 x XLR, and 1 x Male 3.5 mm Headphone Return on the 302 side, with a 7-pin XLR on the camera end, connected to a breakout cable which has a Male 3.5mm for the Headphone Jack, and 2 x Right-Angle 1/4inch TRS Jacks that fit perfectly into the camera. I've tested it all - and the cabling is all wired correctly.

This interests me, Chris. Can you post an image of the custom cable you're using?

One thing I haven't mentioned is that I'm now using a multi-core loom from the 302 to the camera - it's 2 x XLR, and 1 x Male 3.5 mm Headphone Return on the 302 side, with a 7-pin XLR on the camera end, connected to a breakout cable which has a Male 3.5mm for the Headphone Jack, and 2 x Right-Angle 1/4inch TRS Jacks that fit perfectly into the camera. I've tested it all - and the cabling is all wired correctly.

This interests me, Chris. Can you post an image of the custom cable you're using?

I have a similar custom loom:
http://instagram.com/p/X_76pkNhUC/