BMPCC 4K Should I buy native 4/3 lenses or EF/speedbooster

Hey guys, I have a BMCC4K on order and have purchased the Rokinon DS10mm for my first lens. Most of my shooting will be indoors in a workshop filming DIY stuff for YouTube. Lots of close up work shooting from a distance of 3 feet or less (all using a tripod) so this will be my primary lens. I also have some Canon EF and EF-S lenses which means I will be buying the Metabones adaptor. I want to wait until they update it for the 4k, or maybe that's not really a big deal?

My question is for future lens purchases that would utilize auto-focus and electronic aperture. Would it be better to buy 4/3s lenses since they or native to the camera and won't require an adapter or would EF mount lenses be a better choice because there is a larger resell market available if I choose to sell a lens? Is there an advantage to either mount that I am not thinking about? It seems to me that there is a much larger selection of EF lenses and yes, I realize there could be some potential compatibility issues so that's why I need your help.

PS I realize there is a slight boost in performance using the speedbooster but that is not really a big deal to me since I have my shop properly lighted and have several led camera lights available as well.

Thanks, sorry that this is such a newb like question

Randy

The Aputure LensRegain is on sale right now for $149 (normally $399). I've heard good things about it, and it includes focus and aperture control on Canon lenses.

https://aputure.com/products/DEC-LensRegain

At least I hope it's good....

If you don’t have any existing lenses buy native MFT.

I would avoid Canon EF mount lenses and adapters, a lot of EF lenses are not currently supported on the new Pocket Camera 4K/Metsbones adapter setup. If you want auto lenses, get native MFT lenses, and the Oly Pro series or Panasonic Leica series, both are both very good.
Cheers

One of the selling points for the Pocket camera is compactness, which is also a feature of MFT lenses...

And be aware that autofocus does not work like you would assume from other cameras. It is not able to track a movement or stick to a face/object. It is just a slow push AF which can be thrown out of finishing its focus hunting when the object moves a bit.

If you don’t have any existing lenses buy native MFT.

I do have 3 Canon lenses, none are real high dollar "L" lenses but they are all decent lenses and brand new. I bought a Cannon 77D with the hopes of good photos and decent 1080p video but was thoroughly disappointed. Sold it about 6 weeks later but kept the lenses. The photos were great but the video, well, you know. I only bought the 77D as a fill in until the 4K arrives and hoping it would be a decent B cam for the 4K. I certainly do not see the value investing in a high dollar Canon to get 4k video now that the BMPCC4k is drip shipping. However, I would still like photos that were similar in quality to the 77D.

Does anyone know how well the BMPCC4K does with photos? I wish BM would give more information on their website about that. Would I be better off keeping my lenses and buying a cheap Canon (like a T6 or Rebel) for photos or should I sell the Canon lenses and hope for the best on the BMPCC4K? My primary use for the camera will be video but I would also like to take decent photos.

I am not a professional, obviously, so your help is much appreciated.

Spencer, I get decent photos from my old Canon Rebel XT and it is only a 8MB raw+jpg image. A recent smartphone has more pixels than that! When we get the BMPCC4K, we shall know if the BMPCC4K DCI Image is better, but I expect it will be. I would hold off selling the lenses and/or buying another Canon stills camera until you see what the BMPCC4K can do with raw still images.

At last week’s video shoot, they asked me to do their “cast and crew” shot. I just left my kit lens on the Canon EF Rebel, but afterwards I thought I should have mounted my SLR Magic 50mm APO PL on the Rebel. I have the EF-PL adapter. Next time.


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I'm not an expert at all, but I think the camera can take perfectly acceptable still images. Compared to a stills camera, however, I'm missing:

• Pressing the shutter button half way to auto-focus
• Auto exposure
• A mechanical shutter

Although the BMPCC4K can auto-focus with native lenses, it isn't as fast as my GH4. So not only do I have to tap the screen to get it to auto-focus, I also have to wait longer. Then I can press the auto-iris button to get auto exposure, and then the still photo button to take the photo. Or I can manually focus and manually set the exposure.

In short, it's fine if you have the time to set up your shot, but I certainly wouldn't use it for sports photography.

Agree many sports might be too challenging. But in general, shooting stills you may have the option to shoot with a very small shutter angle so your exposure, subject to lighting and aperture, can be very fast and adequate for many sports where you can nail the focus well before you need to press the shutter: a race at the finish line, pole vaulting, baseball on the hitter or the pitcher, etc.

There are more reasons than that to consider buying lenses for larger sensors and using an adapter.

For example, you can use the lenses with a "SpeedBooster" adapter to get a brighter image and a wider angle, or use them with one of the various tilt/shift adapters available (for some types of mounts, such as m42) to work with focal planes that are not parallel to the sensor while obtaining their native focal length.

With the different adapters that are available, each individual lens effectively becomes several different lenses for the smaller format.

I would suggest getting native lenses for autofocus applications and larger-format lenses for manual focus applications.

Maybe my memory is off but I thought that I heard or saw that the photo MP would only be around 8MP. That's why I am somewhat concerned. I found it strange that a 4K sensor would take such low res photos. I have a 15? year old E-volt 300 that is 8MP, and as Rick said, my phone can do that.

No, probably not any sports shooting, just family holidays, vacations, you know, average Joe kinda stuff.

I would suggest getting native lenses for autofocus applications and larger-format lenses for manual focus applications.

That's exactly what I was thinking except I already purchased one Rokinon Cine DS lens in MFT mount so I guess I'll keep using that mount on the Rokinon's just in case I get a follow focus down the road.

Another reason I am thinking of an EF adapter is that you can get just about any lens you want with an EF mount but sometimes not mft.

I own a bunch of EF mount lenses so for my the choice is to get an adapter, however I'm also planning on investing in at least a couple of wide-angle m4/3 lenses so that I can cover all the bases. If I didn't own any lenses, it'd be a bit of a tough call honestly since glass is something that you want to be able to reuse in the future, and m4/3 limits you to this particular sensor size, so if you want to move to a s35 sensor or even a full size you'd be SOL.

Spencer, the resolution of a 4K Video is 8MP, and bothmthe Pocket 4K and GH5/S are a about a 10MP native resolution sensor, which is why they work so well for low light video. Higher resolution cameras like the GH5, etc. need to “bin” the extra pixel buts or line skip to reduce their resolution to 4K. The BM camera shoots its stills from the UHD 16:9 sensor crop window, so the resolution is around 8MP.

If you need a camera for primary still shooting, get a Rebel, or something similar. If you only need occasional still images for publication or web release, 8MP is more than enough for that.
Cheers

the resolution of a 4K Video is 8MP

Wow! Really? Is that per frame of video? So 60fps x 8MP = 480MBps data rate? Soooo, MP in video is overrated? I guess the processing power of the camera and the codecs it uses would be more important than MP?

If you need a camera for primary still shooting, get a Rebel, or something similar. If you only need occasional still images for publication or web release, 8MP is more than enough for that.

Maybe I will get a G7 or G85 to stay in the MFT mount. GH5 would be great but it would be severe overkill for my photo needs and a second BMPCC 4K would be better for video.

glass is something that you want to be able to reuse in the future, and m4/3 limits you to this particular sensor size

That's exactly what prompted this post in the first place!! MFT only works on MFT so I was planning on getting all EF lenses so they could be adapted to the "next" mount of the future. I guess it was my thought on how to future proof my lens collection.

So 60fps x 8MP = 480MBps data rate?

Since the max data rate of the BMPCC 4K is 272 MBs does that mean it is actually recording in an interlaced format?

So 60fps x 8MP = 480MBps data rate?

Since the max data rate of the BMPCC 4K is 272 MBs does that mean it is actually recording in an interlaced format?

No.

First, each pixel (in raw format) is 12 bits, or 1.5 bytes, so the actual uncompressed data rate is approximately 60 * 8 * 1.5 = 720MB/s.

Second, the camera doesn't actually record anything uncompressed. Instead it uses "lossless" compression, which means that it compresses the data in such a way that when uncompressed every bit of the data is identical to the original. (Well, that's what "lossless" means, anyway. I don't know whether that is actually what BM's lossless raw codec does, but so far as I know nobody has proved otherwise.)

Third, the data rate for 4K DCI raw at 60fps is implied by the table on page 16 of the manual. You get 7 minutes of recording time on a 256GB card, so (256 * 1024) / (7 * 60) = 624 MB/s (approximately). Unless I messed up the arithmetic, in which case I'm sure someone will correct me.

glass is something that you want to be able to reuse in the future, and m4/3 limits you to this particular sensor size

That's exactly what prompted this post in the first place!! MFT only works on MFT so I was planning on getting all EF lenses so they could be adapted to the "next" mount of the future. I guess it was my thought on how to future proof my lens collection.

Spencer, the EF mount is dying. In the future, Canon will be replacing it everywhere with their R mount. EF lenses can still be used with the R mount. R mount lenses have arrived. Anyone know the FFD of the R mount?


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Anyone know the FFD of the R mount?

20mm.

Jack, thanks. That’s an interesting choice. Not Sony’s E mount, 18mm, but close enough you wouldn’t be able to use R mount lenses on an E mount camera even though the optical design has similarities.


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Jack, thanks. That’s an interesting choice. Not Sony’s E mount, 18mm, but close enough you wouldn’t be able to use R mount lenses on an E mount camera even though the optical design has similarities.

Coincidence? You decide...

Has anyone tried the Viltrox? A fairly inexpensive x.71 Canon EF to MFT speed booster. I think they are under $150.

Has anyone tried the Viltrox?

This guy on youtube (https://www.youtube.com/user/arberbaqaj ... _polymer=1)has been using one on his P4K. Seems to give great results. I plan on picking that one up to use until Metabones updates their line. If the Viltrox works as good as it seems to, I probably won't bother with the Metabones.

It is clearly visable at the 2:32 mark of this video

It is clearly visable at the 2:32 mark of this video

Just noticed that in that vid he was not using the P4K but one can only assume that he has been using it on both cameras

glass is something that you want to be able to reuse in the future, and m4/3 limits you to this particular sensor size

That's exactly what prompted this post in the first place!! MFT only works on MFT so I was planning on getting all EF lenses so they could be adapted to the "next" mount of the future. I guess it was my thought on how to future proof my lens collection.

Spencer, the EF mount is dying. In the future, Canon will be replacing it everywhere with their R mount. EF lenses can still be used with the R mount. R mount lenses have arrived. Anyone know the FFD of the R mount?
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I agree with Rick, times are a changing, as the big three, Canon, Sony, and Nikon are all going to shorter FFD mirrorless lens mounts for full frame cameras, like the Canon R and Nikon Z mount, all of which are not interchangeable due to their close FFDs.

If you have Canon EF lenses, then get a Speed Booster and use them. If not, and cine shooting is your goal, then get PL mount Cine lenses, like the new Tokina 11-20mm Cine Zoom, prices are coming down, and thenPL most can be adapted to all of these camera new lens mount systems. MTF Services already has a PL mount availformthe recently released Nikon Z6/7 Cameras.

If you need to keep the cost down for right now, then just get a couple of MFT lenses that will meet your current needs and sell them off (or just keep them) when you upgrade to better Cine lenses. So far, I have used my MFT lenses on three different cameras, and the new Pocket 4K will make Four cameras.

So my advice is buy the best lens you can afford that will meet your current needs.
Cheers

Having the debate right now on what I should get. I own a kit of Rokinon EF lenses, so a speed booster seems like the one I should go for. But CAN wise, we're talking over $900 with tax and all. That's the price of a MFT Telephoto Lens. The VILTROX is way cheaper, but I heard some mixed results with it.

Having the debate right now on what I should get. I own a kit of Rokinon EF lenses, so a speed booster seems like the one I should go for. But CAN wise, we're talking over $900 with tax and all. That's the price of a MFT Telephoto Lens. The VILTROX is way cheaper, but I heard some mixed results with it.

I’m having this debate too. But think I’m going to stick with speedbooster as I have so much nice canon glass. The Viltrox is great with all my L lenses as they’re all f4 (16-35, 24-105, 70-200, all stabilised). I’m not sure how it will do with lower f stops, apparently it can get a bit strange.

Answering my own question in this thread, the new Canon RF Mount and the Leica L Mount have a FFD of 20mm. The new Nikon Z mount is 16mm. In between is the ‘old’ Sony E mount at 18mm.


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Having the debate right now on what I should get. I own a kit of Rokinon EF lenses, so a speed booster seems like the one I should go for. But CAN wise, we're talking over $900 with tax and all. That's the price of a MFT Telephoto Lens. The VILTROX is way cheaper, but I heard some mixed results with it.

No, more like the cost of a good MFT Oly Pro or Pana Leica f/2.8 Zoom!
Cheers

Having the debate right now on what I should get. I own a kit of Rokinon EF lenses, so a speed booster seems like the one I should go for. But CAN wise, we're talking over $900 with tax and all. That's the price of a MFT Telephoto Lens. The VILTROX is way cheaper, but I heard some mixed results with it.

No, more like the cost of a good MFT Oly Pro or Pana Leica f/2.8 Zoom!
Cheers

Definitely eying the Oly Pro 12-40mm. Though the Lumix 12-35mm is around that price used. Same with the Sigma 18-35mm, but I'd need a speed booster for that one.

Having the debate right now on what I should get. I own a kit of Rokinon EF lenses, so a speed booster seems like the one I should go for. But CAN wise, we're talking over $900 with tax and all. That's the price of a MFT Telephoto Lens. The VILTROX is way cheaper, but I heard some mixed results with it.

No, more like the cost of a good MFT Oly Pro or Pana Leica f/2.8 Zoom!
Cheers

Definitely eying the Oly Pro 12-40mm. Though the Lumix 12-35mm is around that price used. Same with the Sigma 18-35mm, but I'd need a speed booster for that one.

I sold my beloved Sigma 18-35mm f1.8 ART zoom and bought a used Olympus 12-40mm f2.8 PRO zoom in excellent condition from KEH.com. Obviously not as "fast" as the Sigma & an adapter, but the Oly is a fraction of the size, weight & cost.
https://www.keh.com/shop/olympus-m-zuik ... hirds.html

Over the years I've bought & sold many lenses & cameras via KEH.com. I highly recommend them!
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I've got a pair of P4ks and one is in a kit with the "big" lenses like the Sigma 18-35 and full frame Nikon glass all on a MB SB. Only use the Sigma with a dumb adapter because 35-70mm is really great range and I could film all day with just that.

The kit that I like to shoot has all native MFT glass. It gets used for a lot of outdoor, fast moving and doc stuff that we do all the time. The Oly 12-40mm is a perfect match for the P4k in day to day shooting. Shoot it wide open and it looks great and has some mojo, but it's always got great IQ, color and contrast. And it's a wonderfully built lens and great to handle.

Other than that, the kit has the Oly 40-150, also auto focus. And then I have and love the small MFT primes. I have SLR Magic Hyper Primes - use the 25mm .95 a lot, and a set of small Rokinon primes.

Long answer - the camera is great with the big glass and adapters and the Sigma is great but if I were building just one kit it would be all native with the two Oly zooms for the benefit of AF and range and a set of SLR Magic Hyper Primes.