SSD connection and mac

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John Bartman

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SSD connection and mac

PostSun Sep 09, 2012 8:55 pm

So,
How does one connect the SSD to a mac?
Which are the best readers (fast enough for editing) USB?

Thanx
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Eric Santiago

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostSun Sep 09, 2012 9:23 pm

There are a few options for USB.
Try StarTech or Google SSD Docks.
The one I want is for eSATA to use with an older 17" Uni.
The other one for Thunderbolt on the cheap is the Seagate GoFlex reader.
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Peter J. DeCrescenzo

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostMon Sep 10, 2012 12:27 am

bartman wrote:So,
How does one connect the SSD to a mac?
Which are the best readers (fast enough for editing) USB?
Thanx


USB-2 is way too slow for editing, even with compressed ProRes 422 HQ footage. Completely impossible with uncompressed CinemaDNG footage.

Even just copying a 240GB SSD full of files (ProRes 422 HQ or CinemaDNG) to your Mac via USB-2 will take a few hours.

Firewire 800 is fast enough for editing ProRes 422 HQ, but not CinemaDNG. Copying 240GB of data via FW800 will take about >90-120 min. on most Macs.

CinemaDNG requires a very fast connection for editing -- at least 185 megaBYTES/sec. sustained read speed. Even USB-3 is too slow to do that on most systems. It requires SATA-2 or eSATA-2 at a minimum, preferrably SATA-3 or eSATA-3, or better yet: Thunderbolt.
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John Bartman

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostMon Sep 10, 2012 5:50 pm

Peter J. DeCrescenzo wrote:
bartman wrote:
CinemaDNG requires a very fast connection for editing -- at least 185 megaBYTES/sec. sustained read speed. Even USB-3 is too slow to do that on most systems. It requires SATA-2 or eSATA-2 at a minimum, preferrably SATA-3 or eSATA-3, or better yet: Thunderbolt.



Thanks Peter,
Do i then understand you correctly, that i can connect the camera (with SSD inside) via the THUNDERBOLT connection to edit/transfer files?
Last edited by John Bartman on Mon Sep 10, 2012 8:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Eric Santiago

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostMon Sep 10, 2012 5:57 pm

bartman no you cant with SSD over any cable.
you will need to offload the drive and use any dock type connected to host computer.
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Peter J. Odio

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostTue Sep 11, 2012 3:59 am

It's interesting that there are no SSD docking stations with thunderbolt connections. Yes, I know about the GoFlex Thunderbolt Adapter, but this is not a docking station design for this job.

I'm sure that soon we will see a solid docking station.

Front loading, with FW800 and Thunderbolt connection/or a USB 3.0 and eSATA, made of solid aluminum, that can be used on a desktop or on location.

Similar to the RED STATION REDMAG from RED.
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olof

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostTue Sep 11, 2012 1:04 pm

This one works very well for me and is quite fast:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/7 ... rface.html
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Peter J. Odio

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostTue Sep 11, 2012 2:34 pm

olof wrote:This one works very well for me and is quite fast:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/7 ... rface.html


Agreed, it's the best option now, not great for field work or rugged like an aluminun build one. Needs Thunderbolt.
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WTWall

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostThu Sep 13, 2012 7:00 pm

To put some numbers around "not fast enough":
A typical SSD can do sequential reads of non-compressible data at around 450 to 500 MB/sec. That's 3.6 Gbits to 4 Gbits/sec.

USB 3.0 will transfer about 3.1 Gbits/sec actual data (the bus runs at 5 Gbps, but that's not the actual data throughput rate.)

To see if this is "fast enough", calculate frame rate, bit depth, and resolution. E.g., with no compression and 10-bit/color RGB, 1080p at 30 fps uses about 1.8Gbps. If that's encoded as 16 bits per color, it goes up to about 2.9 Gbps uncompressed.

So, USB 3.0 can't handle the full read data rate of an SSD, but it should be able to handle the data stream of 30 fps 1080p HD. (Of course, there might be problems with a given implementation of USB on a particular system, but those _should_ be minimal on recent implementations.)
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Bruce Schultz

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostFri Sep 14, 2012 12:36 am

PODIO wrote:It's interesting that there are no SSD docking stations with thunderbolt connections. Yes, I know about the GoFlex Thunderbolt Adapter, but this is not a docking station design for this job.


I don't know why you say this, I use both of the Seagate GoFlex Thunderbolt docking stations (single and dual T-Bolt) with my Atomos Samurai recorded SSD drives all the time without problems.
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Peter J. DeCrescenzo

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostFri Sep 14, 2012 11:47 am

bartman wrote:
Peter J. DeCrescenzo wrote:
bartman wrote:
CinemaDNG requires a very fast connection for editing -- at least 185 megaBYTES/sec. sustained read speed. Even USB-3 is too slow to do that on most systems. It requires SATA-2 or eSATA-2 at a minimum, preferrably SATA-3 or eSATA-3, or better yet: Thunderbolt.



Thanks Peter,
Do i then understand you correctly, that i can connect the camera (with SSD inside) via the THUNDERBOLT connection to edit/transfer files?


No, the BMCC can't currently act as a SSD reader for a computer. In other words, footage that has been recorded onto a SSD is not transferrable from inside the BMCC to a computer. Instead, to transfer footage from a SSD, put the SSD in an appropriate drive dock/caddie device connected to a computer. The faster the dock/caddie's interface (Thunderbolt is fastest, USB-2 is slowest), the faster the files will transfer to the computer.

The BMCC does feature the ability to output live (not pre-recorded) full-quality video for capture via Thunderbolt using the included Media Express software, as described in the BMCC user manual PDF:
http://www.blackmagicdesign.com/media/4 ... Manual.pdf

Another method, is to play footage from a SDD in the BMCC and capture it to a computer using the camera's 1080p HD-SDI output. This requires a computer with appropriate HD-SDI capture hardware & software or an external recorder (such as BMD offers). Since the BMCC HD-SDI output is 1080p, both 2.5K CinemaDNG and 1080p ProeRes/DNxHD footage is output @ 1080p resolution.

Because the BMCC HD-SDI output is always "live", it can also be used to capture to a computer or external recorder @ 1080p regardless of what format the BMCC is recording to the SSD. So, for example, the BMCC could be recording CinemaDNG 2.5K to the SSD, while at the same time an external recorder attached to the cam's live HD-SDI output records the 1080p signal. The HD-SDI output can be set to either "Film/log" or "Video/Rec.709" gamma.
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Eric Santiago

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostFri Sep 14, 2012 12:43 pm

Peter will you testing this theory with your Hyperdeck?
Im thinking of renting one for a 2 hour locked cam shoot.
Will be using something else that has HD-SDI output obviously :(
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Joshua Helling

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostFri Sep 14, 2012 8:16 pm

Herr S wrote:
I don't know why you say this, I use both of the Seagate GoFlex Thunderbolt docking stations (single and dual T-Bolt) with my Atomos Samurai recorded SSD drives all the time without problems.


That's probably because the goFlex is designed to have the HDD enclosed in a box that mounts to the GoFlex base unit. So mounting a naked SSD feels odd..I put a shim on mine to level the drive and prevent stress. The Samuria/Ninja's have an enclosure for the drives that mounts cleanly to the base unit.
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Nick Shaw

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostFri Sep 14, 2012 9:43 pm

PODIO wrote:Front loading, with FW800 and Thunderbolt connection/or a USB 3.0 and eSATA, made of solid aluminum, that can be used on a desktop or on location.

Similar to the RED STATION REDMAG from RED.


Not Thunderbolt, and only USB-2 not USB-3 but the REDMAG 2.5 [http://www.red.com/store/products/red-station-redmag-25] would do the job quite nicely.
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Bruce Schultz

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostTue Sep 18, 2012 4:03 pm

Joshua Helling wrote:
Herr S wrote:
I don't know why you say this, I use both of the Seagate GoFlex Thunderbolt docking stations (single and dual T-Bolt) with my Atomos Samurai recorded SSD drives all the time without problems.


That's probably because the goFlex is designed to have the HDD enclosed in a box that mounts to the GoFlex base unit.


I've never put a HDD in an enclosed box onto the GoFlex T-Bolt unit. Bare drive on the contacts, 3.5 and 2.5 no problems. The Atomos caddy also works perfectly on the GoFlex T-Bolt - this is the one that does require external power to run both T-Bolt ports.
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Peter J. DeCrescenzo

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Re: SSD connection and mac

PostTue Sep 18, 2012 4:12 pm

Eric Santiago wrote:Peter will you testing this theory with your Hyperdeck?
Im thinking of renting one for a 2 hour locked cam shoot.
Will be using something else that has HD-SDI output obviously :(


Sure, but first I have to receive my BMCC EF. ;-)

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