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Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 5:55 pm
by ricardo marty
Looks like atomos has become apples bit%#c*^h

Could this make BMD make ad braw capable video assist? I hope so, especially through sdi.

https://www.cinema5d.com/why-atomos-pro ... -industry/

The Nikon Z 6 and Z 7 will be able to output a RAW video stream to the Atomos Ninja V which will record that stream as high-quality ProRes RAW.


Ricardo Marty

Re: Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 6:11 pm
by Denny Smith
BRaw and ProRes Raw are two entirely different types of codec. ProRes Raw takes a true Raw signal from of the camera and converts it to record as ProResRaw in the recorder, and was designed for use in external recorders like the Ninja (for Z6/7) and Shogun (For Pana EVA1). BRaw is designed as an internal recording codec, where part of the de-Bayer process is done in the camera before recording the BRaw codec, according to BMD. Then the remaining de+0-Bayer process is done in Resolve or other NLE supporting BRaw.

BRaw does not work like CDnG or ProResRaw. So you can not have it in an external recorder as such, because you would still need part of the program to still be in the camera. BRaw is a very much camera specific codec, taylored for each camera sensor type. This is why we are still waiting for BRaw on the new Pocket and UM 4.6.
Cheers

Re: Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 6:54 pm
by ricardo marty
Im sure they can find a way. Apples push is very evident. First atomos then adobe cc windows. They want to make evrything else as irrelevant as posible. Ir bmd wants to star relevan they must push back..

Ricardo Marty

Re: Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:31 pm
by Robert Niessner
ricardo marty wrote:Im sure they can find a way.


What's not to understand with:
BRaw is designed as an internal recording codec, where part of the de-Bayer process is done in the camera before recording the BRaw codec, according to BMD.

Re: Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:38 pm
by Australian Image
Why are people worried about this?

Re: Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 10:28 pm
by ricardo marty
Robert Niessner wrote:
ricardo marty wrote:Im sure they can find a way.


What's not to understand with:
BRaw is designed as an internal recording codec, where part of the de-Bayer process is done in the camera before recording the BRaw codec, according to BMD.


What part do you not understand that I said? I'm not referring to the same braw. Braw could maybe be made to be de-bayerd on a computer or on a V.A. maybe even with a utility program.

Ricardo Marty

Re: Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 10:42 pm
by ricardo marty
Australian Image wrote:Why are people worried about this?


I'm not worried at all. Just thinking the possible consequences of these steps by apple. Having a degree in marketing and an MBA I see this move as a "check" If I where a company like BMB I would think of a possible scenario where this could affect my company.


1- if prores raw would be available to anyone but only editable in fcpx and adobe cc what would happen
to bmd camers and other hardware sales?

2-Or maybe Prores will only be available for Nikon. Where does this leave other camera owners?

Its just a thought

Ricardo Marty

P.S. have been told that prores raw is nothing to write home about but apple is apple.

Re: Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 11:06 pm
by Australian Image
ricardo marty wrote:
Australian Image wrote:Why are people worried about this?


I'm not worried at all. Just thinking the possible consequences of these steps by apple. Having a degree in marketing and an MBA I see this move as a "check" If I where a company like BMB I would think of a possible scenario where this could affect my company.


I suspect that Blackmagic is well aware and considered the consequences; after all, they have been going from strength to strength over the years. Note that Blackmagic also appears to have a close relationship with Apple, given their eGPU work and that they have produced a BMPCC4K app for iOS.

Re: Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 11:11 pm
by Denny Smith
I also do not think BM is worried about Apple and its ProResRaw. BMD is more concerned with developing a superior product with ease of use. Nikon is not the only camera company Atomos is working with for ProResRaw, which started out as a joint Atomos and Appple project. The first camera thus project worked with was the Pana EVA1. Then Atomos approached Nikon to add ProResRaw support for Nikon’s new mirrorless Z6/7 Cameras, with the Z6 as the primary focus. The Z6 is basically a full frame version of the Pana GH5S, and is more competition for it, than the VM Pocke 4K, which is in a class of its own, but marketing wise it obviously is in competition with both cameras.

Apple is currently restricting its ProResRaw to FCPX only, but is supposed to release it to other NLEs, and Atomos has an exclusive for the same period, to oddest its cost in helping this joint effort. BMD does not need to have an external recorder to record Raw on its Cinema camera line up, they are one of the few that has this available without an external recorder, unlike Sony, Panasonic, and now Nikon. So BMD can develop a better product, that costs less — why would BMD want to give this “edge” away to its competition by making a BRaw enabled VA?

But, since BMD did release the VA in obvious competition to the Atomos Ninja/Shogun, who is to say, BMD doesn’t develop another flavor of its Raw codec, that can read the Nikon HDMI stream, and also record Panasonic’s raw feed from the EVA1. But this would not be the BRaw as it is currently being done in Camera. This will maintain BRaw’s better technical edge, while making the VA compatible with these new cameras.
Cheers

Re: Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 11:12 pm
by ricardo marty
[quote="Note that Blackmagic also appears to have a close relationship with Apple, given their eGPU work and that they have produced a BMPCC4K app for iOS.[/quote]

Yes but there is no Prores raw in neither bmp cameras nor software.

Ricardo Marty

Re: Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2019 11:16 pm
by Australian Image
Yes but there is no Prores raw in neither bmp cameras nor software.


And this is a concern?

Re: Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2019 1:26 am
by Robert Niessner
ricardo marty wrote:
Robert Niessner wrote:
ricardo marty wrote:Im sure they can find a way.


What's not to understand with:
BRaw is designed as an internal recording codec, where part of the de-Bayer process is done in the camera before recording the BRaw codec, according to BMD.


What part do you not understand that I said? I'm not referring to the same braw. Braw could maybe be made to be de-bayerd on a computer or on a V.A. maybe even with a utility program.

Ricardo Marty


You do realize that then it wouldn't be BRAW anymore, because the whole thing is about saving space through noise-pre-processing and lossy compression and saving CPU power through partial de-bayering in camera?

Re: Atomos will facilitate prores raw recording to nikon.

PostPosted: Tue Jan 15, 2019 1:47 am
by MishaEngel
This competition is good for higher quality, pricing, etc... as long as they don't compete each other to death because then we will have less competition.

I hope someday China, India and Nigeria will drop the Cineform(RAW) bom as a true opensource heavily supported free (RAW)codec. It has all the benefits the other (RAW)codecs have combined.