BlackMagic Pocket Cinema Camera 1080p

I currently have the BMPCC 1080p. Which I'm assuming is an older model due to there only be 4k ones on the website..
I'm perfectly happy with my BMPCC1080 I do not feel it necessary to upgrade to the 4k. However, I am in the need of a wall mount for this specific camera. Due to everything on the website being about the 4k, I'm having trouble finding a mount for the 1080p. Can someone shed some light on my situation?

I'm perfectly happy with my BMPCC1080 I do not feel it necessary to upgrade to the 4k.

And you're not the only one. The camera is still very popular.

What should the wall mount look like? There are many universal wall mounts, from cheap to very expensive (with control systems).

Just a basic wall mount.. or maybe a controlled one would be pretty cool.. I don't know, I just need to know if the BMPCC4K accessories are compatible with the 1080p

No, the Pocket 4K power supply is a different plug. You need to get an original wall power supply with the small DC connector, or get an adapter to use the larger standard DC barrel connector used in the other BMD products. Power requirement is 12VDC at around 2000 MA (2 amps). Try contacting contacting your regional BMD Support office to see if they can help your sort an original power wall unit.
Cheers

Pocket 4K power supply is a different plug. You need to get an original wall power supply with the small DC connector, or get an adapter to use the larger standard DC barrel connector used in the other BMD products. Power requirement is 12VDC at around 2000 MA (2 amps). Try contacting contacting your regional BMD Support office to see if they can help your sort an original power wall unit.
Cheers

Thats not what I mean't. I'm referring to the things for the tripods. Are they the same? Like the connector piece.

OK, you want to mount th camera to a wall. The bottom connector is a 1/4x20 standard photo screw socket. That said, it is not that strong, but enough to hold the camera. You might want to consider getting a 1/2 cage for it, like the Smallrig Pocket Cage, or,the Wooden Camera Pocket Cage, both of which mount to the top and bottom screw points, and yiu get both a 1/4x20 and a 3/8-inch tripod mounting point.
Cheers

I guess the original BMPCC would be far superior resolution to the 1080 windowed mode of the P4K due to the larger S16 sensor?

Yes Jean, the BMPCC HD would look cleaner than the winnowed HD clip from the new Pocket. However, the down sampled HD image from the new Pocket 4K using the UHD window, is going to be better than the original Pocket Camera.
Cheers

Yes Jean, the BMPCC HD would look c,earner than the winnowed HD clip from the new Pocket. However, the down sampled HD image from the new Pocket 4K using the UHD window, is going to be better than the original Pocket Camera.
Cheers

Hmmmm not sure you are correct at all really Denny.

Can you tell us what you are trying to achieve.

Yes Jean, the BMPCC HD would look c,earner than the winnowed HD clip from the new Pocket. However, the down sampled HD image from the new Pocket 4K using the UHD window, is going to be better than the original Pocket Camera.
Cheers

Hmmmm not sure you are correct at all really Denny.

Why wouldn’t he be? How can a smaller sensor, noisier, with lesser resolution and less dynamic range be better?

Well, could be, depending on what you are looking for in the image. The Pocket 4K is technically better, but Jean May prefer the aesthetic, classical look of the original Pocket/Micro Camera.
Cheers

You can get the "classic" look of the BMPCC from the 4K camera pretty easily. Color bias towards yellow/amber/brown, plus mist or some of the newer OFX soften/sharpen filters to take the edge off the high frequency detail of the BMPCC 4K. My $1.99 says it would be impossible to tell the difference between the BMPCC and degraded BMPCC 4K full-sensor HD, if anyone wanted to fool you.

That aside, there's a significant difference between the HD image of the BMPCC and full sensor HD from 4K, when they're side by side. If a cleaner and more detailed image is deemed to be better, the BMPCC 4K HD is easily superior.

And we haven't even started on the ergonomics....

You can get the "classic" look of the BMPCC from the 4K camera pretty easily.

but surely sorry, but you have to show it as 1 to 1 comparison. There are already several attempts, unfortunately unsuccessfully.

The classic look of BMPCC is beautiful cinematic, what no one has ever done with BMPCC4K before. Many others recognized this and I was a bit surprised because I thought I was the only one who saw it that way.
It also has nothing to do with higher resolution 4K. http://www.bmcuser.com/showthread.php?2 ... -Cinematic

The other way around is possible. I found this on Youtube today.

"This is a super quick test with some RAW footage I shot years ago on the original BMPCC. A lot of people asked me if the Natural Rec709 LUT was working on the original Pocket camera and I always said no. Till I found out that if you shoot CDNG you can actually switch from color science v1 to v4 in DaVinci Resolve and that basically makes your original Pocket pretty much identical to the Pocket 4K in terms of colors. Still, the original Pocket, even with the color science v4, looks more cinematic than the Pocket 4K and the texture in the footage is just so unique. I rented an original Pocket for the weekend and I'm gonna shoot some footage and do a proper side by side with the Pocket 4K, but I wanted to put this out there since I'm totally in love with the result I achieved using the Natural Rec709 LUT. I'm now thinking to get the original Pocket as a second camera for my 4K. What an incredible piece of gear!"

As has been noted many times before, the use of the unqualified term "cinematic" is meaningless. This youtuber, who's selling LUTs btw, needs to specify exactly what he's talking about if the discussion is going to go beyond the usual ravings, where people are reacting far more to grading and production value than raw image quality.

And you can't readily compare two cameras, by exhibiting footage from only one.

As for unsuccessful attempts to make the BMPCC 4K look like the BMPCC, I don't know where you're looking (more youtube?), but you might want to reserve judgment until you've gone into the matter more deeply.

As has been noted many times before, the use of the unqualified term "cinematic" is meaningless.

So the people who like the classic look of BMMCC and BMPCC cinematically are unqualified? Sorry, but even in this case you are talking nonsense.

There is evidence that vice versa is possible. The Youtube user is not the only one who claims that the classic look of BMPCC4K is also possible with BMPCC or BMMCC.

As I said before, you should substantiate your statement with a 1 to 1 comparison. That would finally make you one who has proven to many others that it is possible.

We're either talking about quantifiable differences, or we're talking nonsense.

The "people" you're referring to are amateurs and hobbyists. Many draw their conclusions not from experience, but from youtube, where 99% of what you see is production value, grading and compression quality.

I could easily post stills here, where you'd be unable to distinguish the BMPCC from the BMPCC 4K. But, apart from the work it would require, I'm not persuaded you're persuadable.

In any event, it sounds like you don't use either camera, and have no intention of using either camera. So what's the point?

Don't make any more nonsense but prove to others that you are qualified enough to make the BMPCC classic look possible with BMPCC4K. You probably own both cameras, so you have the option.

To be honest most of the BMPCC and Micro and P4k and Kinefinity, Z-Cam RED and other samples are shoot like DSLR with clipped highlights so it actually makes very small difference. Some looks sharper/softer on 4k screen , some have more/less rolling shutter, more bokeh/less bokeh, but usually they all have the same fake filmic youtuber/corporate style look. People keep overexpose, doing too open shadows and clip highlights even when they use wide dynamic range cameras. Just for reference - grab some stills from some 35mm film movies transferred to BlueRay, put them to Resolve and take a look at RGB parade levels. You will be surprised their actual low brightness level on the scopes. Older B&W movies are even more darker because B&W film stock have wider dynamic range.
If you want something "cinematic" just learn to see and shoot something cinematic, next you need to expose it in cinematic way. New camera can't help do things more cinematic if you keep shoot and grade things in non cinematic way.

There is other little thing in 1080 Pocket/Micro camera that you probably can't fully mimic with 4K sensor. It is some sort of micro texture look. The theory comes from Film scans for photography. I noticed that if you scan full frame 35mm film on 8K scanner with hard direct light source, you can fully capture source grain structure. This shapes image micro texture look even if you downscale it to HD and do some soften. Same time if you scan film with soft diffused light on 4K sensor grain structure, dust and scratches magically disappears and image looks completely different. It became smoothed in some very unique way. The same smoother creamy effect i see in BMMCC 1080 sensor combined with OLPF filter. The starting point of sharpness and details level are exact at the level of "film looking image" and don't produce "stills photography effect" similar to other higher resolution cameras.

Not sure if it all helps to find a proper wall mount (whatever it could be) to topic starter

Guys, Steve Yedlin has dealt with these questions far more definitively than anyone here, and with well-controlled demonstrations. He's not somebody comparing a 2014 youtube to a 2019 youtube and then claiming that one camera is obviously cinematic, while the other obviously is "video".

If you don't believe him -- namely, that there's no such things a "cinematic camera" in the realm of equipment which delivers a reasonably faithful image -- then good luck to you. There are plenty of forums which love to talk about "motion cadence" and other mystical notions, and they would be obvious choices for this discussion.

Me and certainly others, are still waiting for the 1 to 1 comparison with the same classic look from the BMPCC or BMMCC. The one who has claimed this should be able to prove it.

Well, I took the trouble to do some side by side comparisons, under well-lit outdoor conditions (full range, but nothing clipped, nothing crushed). And two things became instantly apparent:

1) the color science of the two cameras is all but identical, at least to the naked eye. No typical viewer will be able to tell them apart on that basis after rudimentary adjustment, to bring them into conformity with each other.

2) comparing full sensor HD clips on the BMPCC 4K to BMPCC HD clips, the one big difference is the level of detail, which is exactly as expected: down-sampling from UHD will always produce more data than a native HD sensor.

Viewed as still images, a simple mist effect applied to the BMPCC 4K footage eliminates that difference, and the BMPCC 4K will be all but indistinguishable from the BMPCC. For actual playback, you might want to add some grain to the BMPCC 4K footage, if the idea is to make the shots look identical.

Remaining differences are so indistinct and trivial, they fall into the realm of the Emperor's New Clothes, or imaginary behaviors like "motion cadence", of interest only on internet forums.

Me and certainly others, are still waiting for the 1 to 1 comparison with the same classic look from the BMPCC or BMMCC. The one who has claimed this should be able to prove it.

Seems like this is the answer to many questions here...

First of all, he used the same custom LUT on both, which introduces an unknown variable. If there *were* a significant difference between clips, they'd react differently to the same LUT.

And the rest can be dismissed as grading differences, easily corrected differences in saturation and contrast, lighting changes, etc., even assuming, incorrectly, that youtube is an adequate venue for these comparisons.

The only thing which is different for sure is level of detail, and that's easily eliminated, if the goal is to make them look the same.

First you have to define what a cinematic look is.

If you want Eastman 5247 look, at 100t, you first try to shoot 35mm analog film. If that’s out of the question you try to emulate the look with another camera. Is there cameras emulating some styles better than others? I for one believe so. And that’s the reason many of us love the straight out of camera original pocket look. It’s easy to get that look. But as John points out. Skilled people like Steve Yedlin have the ability to emulate the same look from a variety of cameras. Making the rest of look like smocks. At least the ones believing only one modern cinema camera is able to emulate a cinematic look. It’s mostly about skill, several skills, and a camera.

Well, could be, depending on what you are looking for in the image. The Pocket 4K is technically better, but Jean May prefer the aesthetic, classical look of the original Pocket/Micro Camera.
Cheers

I actiually like the design of the P4K

Well, that’s a start Jean...
Perhaps the new Upcoming 2.8 and S16 crop window will “fit the bill” for you.
Thanks for keeping us from getting too serious about ourselves.
Cheers

Well, could be, depending on what you are looking for in the image. The Pocket 4K is technically better, but Jean May prefer the aesthetic, classical look of the original Pocket/Micro Camera.
Cheers

Oui!

Well, that’s a start Jean...
Perhaps the new Upcoming Ming 2.8 and S16 crop window will “fit the bill” for you.
Thanks for keeping us from getting too serious about ourselves.
Cheers

Thanks for your sense of humour Den.

In order to see the difference between both cameras it's better to upscale P4K BRAW to (let say) 8K. And look what happened next.) BMPCC with CDNG is not bad from this point of view.

post scriptum And what I understand from this video is that a bigger form factor P4K body (even for this Woodstock style model) looks more funny than small and serious original BMPCC. That is the matter of fact.))