Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

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Florent Piovesan

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Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostMon Jun 24, 2019 1:29 pm

I have just edited a video for the Musicbed Challenge and since it was a collection of travel moments of the past 5 years most of the footage was shot on the original Pocket. Missing the look/image of that little guy.



Hope you enjoy and that it allows you to escape for 5 minutes.

For this video I want to show you guys the most beautiful, unique and incredible places we got to visit, film and photograph over the past five years.

Shot between 2014 and 2019.
Filmed on the original Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera, BMPCC4K , Canon C100 and DJI Mavic 2 Pro

Cheers,
Flo
https://www.oftwolands.com
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Oyvind Fiksdal

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostMon Jun 24, 2019 2:32 pm

Nice, some beautiful imagery there. :shock:

Really get the sense of one big epic trip, even though it stretches over 5 years with hold ups. All the cameras intercut quite good IMO. Love the sound design.

You should really consider a cut down version with only the very best shots, and prevent any repeat of similar shots. IMO, that would make it even more captivating from start to finish. A candidate for staff pic on Vimeo if molded.

Did you shoot prores or CDNG with the original pocket? Its hard to tell when you used it ;)
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Florent Piovesan

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostMon Jun 24, 2019 3:32 pm

Oyvind Fiksdal wrote:Nice, some beautiful imagery there. :shock:

Really get the sense of one big epic trip, even though it stretches over 5 years with hold ups. All the cameras intercut quite good IMO. Love the sound design.

You should really consider a cut down version with only the very best shots, and prevent any repeat of similar shots. IMO, that would make it even more captivating from start to finish. A candidate for staff pic on Vimeo if molded.

Did you shoot prores or CDNG with the original pocket? Its hard to tell when you used it ;)


Thank you :) !! Glad you like it.

Will keep that in mind. Was already hard to cut it down to 5mins haha !!

I've always shot prores for everything :).

Cheers and thanks for watching,
Flo
https://www.oftwolands.com
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Oyvind Fiksdal

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostMon Jun 24, 2019 5:15 pm

Yes I can see the conundrum :). It’s hard to cut away the uncutable so to speak.

Maybe make a versions where you cut from a less personal perspective. More like pure professional production, you got the material to make it stellar. Some of the shots are breathtaking.

This is good advocacy for prores.
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Florent Piovesan

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostMon Jun 24, 2019 10:03 pm

Oyvind Fiksdal wrote:Yes I can see the conundrum :). It’s hard to cut away the uncutable so to speak.

Maybe make a versions where you cut from a less personal perspective. More like pure professional production, you got the material to make it stellar. Some of the shots are breathtaking.

This is good advocacy for prores.


I am actually cutting a few reels at the moment, so there will be a shorter version at some point :).
Thanks for the input !!
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Florent Piovesan

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostTue Jun 25, 2019 12:04 am

Naveed Nasir wrote:Some stunning images here - nice work.

I strongly maintain that the original BMPCC in the hands of a skilled creator annihilates the new Pocket 4K. Same dynamic range, better highlight roll off (in my book) and just a beautiful thick textured image in contrast to the Pocket 4k image which at least to my eyes looks very compressed and shuttery in terms of motion cadence.

Nice drone shots too - I've got a Mavic Pro 2 and for me the images (when I have filmed) are just way to compressed - I'd compare them to a GH5 especially the motion, but nonetheless you've graded it well in this footage.


Thanks for the nice feedback !!
The original Pocket sure does have a beautiful image. Kinda miss it sometimes but wasn't reliable enough on most occasions.
The Mavic 2 Pro is insane, most of the footage is actually from the Mavic 1, forgot to add it to the camera list.
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Brad Hurley

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostTue Jun 25, 2019 12:06 pm

I really enjoyed watching this.

Do you still use the C-100 at all? I have to admit I'm tempted by that camera (the mark ii) as it seems more practical for the documentary work I do -- built-in ND filters, decent low-light performance, long battery life, good ergonomics and push-button controls, and I've seen some very nice footage from it, even from the compressed codec (or you can do Prores on an external recorder). As people move to 4K the price for the C-100 keeps coming down and you can get good deals on used ones. But I'd have to invest in new lenses; upgrading to the BMPCC 4K makes more sense from a cost standpoint.
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Adam Langdon

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostTue Jun 25, 2019 1:37 pm

oh, this was great! makes me want to travel.
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Jean Capdouzey

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostTue Jun 25, 2019 1:41 pm

That's the issue I've been trying to say but I get put down! It's the organic Super 16mm look that is missing!
BMD compromised! They should have given us a 4K version of the REAL BMPCC we all waited 5 years for!
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Bunk Timmer

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostTue Jun 25, 2019 2:45 pm

Jean Capdouzey wrote:BMD compromised! They should have given us a 4K version of the REAL BMPCC we all waited 5 years for!
How does a slightly smaller than APS-C sized sensor, give you an organic s16 look? It's not going to be your lenses.
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Florent Piovesan

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostTue Jun 25, 2019 10:25 pm

Brad Hurley wrote:I really enjoyed watching this.

Do you still use the C-100 at all? I have to admit I'm tempted by that camera (the mark ii) as it seems more practical for the documentary work I do -- built-in ND filters, decent low-light performance, long battery life, good ergonomics and push-button controls, and I've seen some very nice footage from it, even from the compressed codec (or you can do Prores on an external recorder). As people move to 4K the price for the C-100 keeps coming down and you can get good deals on used ones. But I'd have to invest in new lenses; upgrading to the BMPCC 4K makes more sense from a cost standpoint.


I use the C200 now, which is very similar. For doco definitely, I loved using the C100 ii. I would definitely recommend it for documentary work. The Pocket 4K is amazing but you would actually spend quite a bit to turn into a doco ready cam in my opinion.
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Florent Piovesan

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostTue Jun 25, 2019 10:26 pm

Adam Langdon wrote:oh, this was great! makes me want to travel.


Thanks so much, that was the goal :) !!
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Florent Piovesan

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostWed Jun 26, 2019 10:17 pm

Australian Image wrote:Oh, I thought you'd put the BMPCC onto a drone.


Haha !! Would be cool :)
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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostThu Jun 27, 2019 4:12 pm

Jean Capdouzey wrote:That's the issue I've been trying to say but I get put down! It's the organic Super 16mm look that is missing!
BMD compromised! They should have given us a 4K version of the REAL BMPCC we all waited 5 years for!


Jean, no one is trying to shoot you down Jean, the BMPCC was a S16 Camera, as was the Bolex D16, bit had wonderful looking I get when processed correctly. The new Pocket 4K is not a S16 Camera, and uses a larger sensor to get a good image quality 4K recording. I previously shot with both the original BMCC and a Pana AF100, one was S16, and the other MFT, but both had MFT mounts and shared lenses (the Veydra Hyper Primes). Both are gone now. Smaller sensor cameras is the domain of broadcasting cameras, not cine type cameras, unfortunately. Larger sensors is where the current market demand is heading.

BMD both could not source a S16/1-inch size, 4K sensor that gave them the image quality thy wa Ted that matched the original Pocket, after almost two years, BMD released the news on the development of the Pocket 4K, by then Sony had developed a MFT sensor that could match the IQ of the previous camera.

BMD restricted their search to UHD then full 4K sensors, no 2K S16, as the market had already grown past that and the demand was for UHD minimum and full 4K was the current market demand, in a prosumer camera market. The closer the camera is to “ready to shoot” increases sales in this market. Pana had success with their GH5S in this market, so BMD upgraded their Pocket camera 4K into this market, beating the GH5/S price wise and feature wise for video work. This market is now headed towards full frame mirrorless type cameras that shoot good video.

Time marches on... :roll:
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lee4ever

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostThu Jun 27, 2019 7:48 pm

Sorry to be telling the truth again. If you have already shot with BMPCC and have experience with the camera and think that BMPCC4K is a slightly better BMPCC in Ver. 2, you must honestly admit that the look is excluded from it. BMPCC is simply something (CINEMA) special.

BMPCC4K is a completely different camera and should not be considered as "BMPCC v2".
BMPCC4K is not special because there are other comparable cameras that have similar image quality. And therefore not special. It's just my opinion.

And now the new Pocket 4K doesn't even have Cinema DNG. It's gone, what made the camera all the more special. Good that some are happy with BRAW anyway.

It seems to me somehow that the little guy has become better known through Pocket 4K. Some even miss it. :)
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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostThu Jun 27, 2019 10:47 pm

This is quite plainly a hopeless dispute, and you'll have to take my word for it, but the color science of the BMPCC and BMPCC 4K are very close -- so much so, I doubt any could tell the difference on that basis alone. How do I know? I shot the same scenes with both, used RCM to normalize the shots, and looked at them.

And this color science is different from the GH5, despite claims that BMPCC 4k uses the same sensor.

Nobody can judge a camera by graded footage posted on youtube or vimeo. To get anywhere at all, you need to see the original raw or log files. Presentation online, subject to somebody else's grading, too often says little or nothing about what the camera can actually do.
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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostThu Jun 27, 2019 11:45 pm

That the BMPCC and BMPCC4K are very close to each other is not true. There is no need to argue about that, because everyone who has experience with BMPCC knows that. The new Pocket 4K has a completely different look, different highlights, contrasts. My opinion is that the highlights and contrast of the Pocket 4K, do not allow to adapt similar look to that of BMPCC.

It is completely different camera, different sensor. It is not unreasonable to say that BMPCC4K has nothing in common with BMPCC. BMPCC4K may have something in common with GH5S. You could say it is a cheaper GH5S.

There are countless Vimeo and Youtube videos. Some good others are horrible. Is not different with BMPCC4K, there are nice recordings but also terrible ones. Nevertheless this can serve as a comparison source. But you know better if you have the BMPCC and work with it in davinci resolve.

I hold the BMPCC direction sun and light looks like light, a nice lens flare (depending on lens), good dynamic range, doesn't look like videolook or too digital, it's clean and beautiful. :)

So far I have always filmed according to the ETTR principle and have often thought "this won't be good" but as soon as I have packed the Cinema-DNG (or ProRes) files into davinci timeline and performed color correction, the result is beautiful. There are several possibilities, you can make it blue-green and it looks nice, you can make the faces orange and it looks nice. You can use Film-Convert and it just looks beautiful. I recently saw a BMPCC video on Vimeo, the creator has mentioned in comments what he did in davinci, namely luts from impulz applied and also with it, it looks nice.



I was looking for new videos and found this one now



It's like watching a movie. :)

Blackmagic Design has done a great job creating a camera worthy of the name "Cinema". It's just my opinion.
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lee4ever

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 1:02 am

The same opinions always accumulate. So there must be something true about it. There are also more often opinions of people who own the BMPCC4K, or bought it, tested it and sold it again or returned it (like me).

But my conviction is really only mine and it is not based on the testimony of others. It's not meant to stop others from buying the BMPCC4K.

I just write that BMPCC4K is a completely different camera, different sensor, different image quality, highlights, etc. It simply has different "quality" and therefore nothing in common with the orig BMPCC, except the product names.
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lee4ever

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 1:25 am

it has nothing to do with belief, but with personal opinion about the camera. The fact that the same opinion accumulates is not a bad thing. The BMPCC4K owners like you don't have to understand that as "attack" or competition. It wouldn't change anything about personal opinions, or stop the convinced ones, or even get the convinced ones to find Pocket4K look, or the whole BMPCC4K, or whatever, better.

When someone writes that he misses look of the little guy, it's nice. This shows that Blackmagic Design did a very good job 5 years ago. It's something positive.

Think positive, do such nice convincing shots and hopefully your BMPCC4K shots, after 5 years, will still be felt beautiful. It would be great.
Last edited by lee4ever on Fri Jun 28, 2019 1:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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lee4ever

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 1:58 am

Australian Image wrote:Then those citing opinions shouldn't insist that the opinion is a fact. It's an opinion - 'a view or judgement formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.'


Not the others are guilty of anything, I think you should rather accept opinions that others like bananas, others like yellow flowers ... OR the iq/look of BMPCC more beautiful than BMPCC4K. Does that make a big difference whether anyone on earth finds yellow flowers more beautiful than red OR the image quality of the BMPCC more beautiful than BMPCC4K?

The fact is that they are completely different cameras, it has a different sensor, different iq/look and not everyone has to find the Pocket4K iq/look better.
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John Brawley

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 7:37 am

The cameras are the same in that they share the same people making them, making subjective choices about how the curves and colours look to their own internal metrics.

They are also wildly different in that the sensors are inherently different. One has a lot more resolution, a dual ISO architecture that means you can shoot in scenarios where you couldn’t with the other. The other has a dual gain sensor that still delivers a higher dynamic range.

Therefore, one gives you higher dynamic range with a more compressed curve to fit that DR across 12 bits and with much less resolution in less flexible ISO iterations, whereas the other gives you a larger sensor size, greater resolution across a far more meaningful ISO range with a different curve to spread less dr across the same 12 bits.

That means they’re the same and also totally different. It’s too hard to compare then because they have so little common ground.

I love the OG pocket cinema camera. Even today it’s a marvel. For such a tiny tiny camera, that shoots RAW and ProRes when even in 2019 most cameras don’t give much more than compressed 8 or maybe 10 bit 254/265.

I was cynical about liking the 4K pocket. I’ve don’t care much for resolution but I do care for dynamic range. And the Pocket 4K has less.

In my work i often used the OG pocket (and micro) and the micro alongside Alexa and Ursa or UMP. That’s when you should really notice the difference in DR.

But then a funny thing happened.

The 4K pocket is actually really great and the DR difference just doens’t matter because of the way I use the camera. And the more I use the camera, the more I like it. I mean I really like the pictures from it now. My colourist on the last show agreed.

I’ve actually not turned on my poor little pockets for about 2 years now. I can’t bring myself to shelve them, but I just don’t use them ever. I hardly ever even use the micro either.

The pocket is different. But it’s not really fair I don’t think to say that it’s any less than the OG pocket. It’s just different. And for a lot of people it’s more functionally useful (frame rates, ISO, screen etc)

The OG pocket is a legendary camera. It’s earned its cult status well and truly.

But champions retire.

It’s also funny how die hard the OG pocket fans are but no one mentioned the micro, which is essentially the same camera or even the BMCC, which is also the same linage.

JB

*EDIT - When I first met the P4K I originally thought of it as more of a spiritual successor to the BMCC, more than the Pocket.
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Chris Whitten

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 8:15 am

I've owned and used both.
The funny (peculiar) thing to me is that when the BMPCC was being sold there were endless threads on this forum about it's short comings. Now it has been superseded by the BMPCC4K there are endless threads about the 4K version's short comings and the OG Pocket is suddenly a saint.

I'm sure there are thousands of OG Pocket cameras around, so there is no need to cry about the Pocket 4K, just buy yourself the original.
Personally, 1) what is 'cinematic' - it is truly subjective.
2) There are many, many things that impact the quality of the footage - the skill of the film maker, the lighting, the lens choice, the edit, the grade etc, etc.....
The new Pocket 4K is easier to use IMO. I can influence the look by using my vintage lenses. I can influence the look by choices I make in editing and grading.
The OG Pocket was a true marvel for it's time, but the 4k version has eliminated some of the downsides and difficulties of using the OG Pocket.
So you prefer the OG pocket? - buy one, they are now cheap. I don't see any need to post multiple threads about how one is better than the other. 'Better' is too subjective.
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Brad Hurley

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 10:29 am

John Brawley wrote:It’s also funny how die hard the OG pocket fans are but no one mentioned the micro, which is essentially the same camera or even the BMCC, which is also the same linage.


I love my Micro and the footage I get from it seems subtly deeper and richer that of my original Pocket; I read somewhere that it uses a newer version of that Fairchild sensor. But probably the real reason the footage looks better to me is that the Micro requires me to use an external monitor so I'm dialing in exposure and focus more accurately. On the Pocket I use a monitor when I'm outdoors, but inside or on cloudy days I use the built-in LCD. I tend to take more time and care when I'm using the Micro.

As a musician (and I think Chris would understand this analogy), I find this debate has echoes of debates in the music world about microphones, preamps, or even particular instruments. For example, some people like a microphone or preamp that asserts its own character whereas others prefer a transparent microphone or a preamp that's "like wire with gain," adding no coloration at all. I play the wooden flute, and there are similar debates in that world as well: some flutes have a strong inherent character and color and the player has to meet the flute half-way, whereas other flutes are more like a tabula rasa that give the player complete control over tone color on individual notes.

I think the cult status of the original Pocket and its relatives may boil down to something similar: it has an inherent character out of the box that's different from what we're used to seeing in current cinema, on television, or online. As others have argued, it's just "different," not "better," but the appeal is precisely because it doesn't look like footage we're used to seeing from a Canon DSLR, a GH5, or an Alexa.
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lee4ever

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 12:13 pm

It's not about "what's better" but much more about the fact that BMPCC4K did not reach some people as BMPCC successor, because the most important thing is missing, the image quality/look of BMPCC, only in 4K. So there are people who expected something different than "successors" and not only "bigger housings, bigger screens or better internal microphones" but the same BMPCC look, only in 4K.

Both cameras aren't expensive. And that's good, you can own both and use both for different shots.

I love my Micro and the footage I get from it seems subtly deeper and richer that of my original Pocket; I read somewhere that it uses a newer version of that Fairchild sensor.


I had the BM Micro for two weeks and can confirm that I didn't see a better difference (It's the same sensor) Except that the BM Micro fan made a lot of noise? Maybe the fan was defective. It also had more noise (Fixed Pattern Noise), much more visible.
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John Brawley

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 1:01 pm

lee4ever wrote:
I had the BM Micro for two weeks and can confirm that I didn't see a better difference (It's the same sensor) Except that the BM Micro fan made a lot of noise? Maybe the fan was defective. It also had more noise (Fixed Pattern Noise), much more visible.


There's no fan on the micro.

It's not the same sensor, but shares the same sensor family.

It has a shorter integration time compared to the pocket and of course higher frame rates.

Blackmagic rarely do a model that supersedes another. If you look at their camera line ups, each model has a unique feature set. The only time they have ever done a MKII iteration of a camera is the Ursa Mini Pro G2.

JB
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lee4ever

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 1:07 pm

Sure Micro doesn't have a fan? Where did the noise come from?

It's the same sensor (CIS1910F) and there's only one version.
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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 1:16 pm

The most similar debate is analog vs digital. As in analog synths and studio gear vs digital music software and digital synths.
The reality is, just about ALL the successful artists (that's success in terms of artistic values and/or financial) use a mix of both, without prejudice. A hardcore who are most vocal on the web, say you can never top analog and that analog is 'better' in every way.
People are obsessed with the cinematic look. It's just a film biz way of saying 'analog'.

The first year the BMPCC was available there were endless threads about the 'black sun', the moire, the banding, the noise. How hard it was to use with fast depleting batteries and an unviewable screen outdoors.
Now it's apparently the beezneez.
Last edited by Chris Whitten on Fri Jun 28, 2019 1:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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John Paines

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 1:17 pm

I think the main objection to this nostalgia is that, however the two cameras may differ, the response is not based in anything actual, it's an internet-only reality. The BMPCC is being admired for heavily compressed, oddly graded youtubes -- and memories of heavily compressed oddly graded youtubes. And "oddly" is a euphemism.

What follows then is aggrieved complaints: why can't the new camera look like that youtube I remember seeing in 2014?

This is not a great way to compare cameras.
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Brad Hurley

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 1:21 pm

John Brawley wrote:There's no fan on the micro.


I wonder if the fan was added after you bought the ones you own? Mine most certainly has a fan, I can not only hear it when the Micro powers on but I can feel it pushing air through the vents! It's loud enough to be a problem during interviews in rooms with reflective surfaces.
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John Brawley

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 1:28 pm

Brad Hurley wrote:
John Brawley wrote:There's no fan on the micro.


I wonder if the fan was added after you bought the ones you own? Mine most certainly has a fan, I can not only hear it when the Micro powers on but I can feel it pushing air through the vents! It's loud enough to be a problem during interviews in rooms with reflective surfaces.


Maybe im wrong.

The P4K sure has one.

I don’t have them right in front of me but my memory was it was passive cooling with heat sinks.

JB
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lee4ever

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 2:02 pm

Chris Whitten wrote:The first year the BMPCC was available there were endless threads about the 'black sun', the moire, the banding, the noise. How hard it was to use with fast depleting batteries and an unviewable screen outdoors.
Now it's apparently the beezneez.


Blackmagic Design has developed in years thereafter, certainly an improved BMPCC? Probably also another Micro, with fan? Nobody knows what Blackmagic Design changes afterwards.

I have e.g. better audio recording with internal microphones when I use Firmware 1.7. But Blackmagic Design says that the internal microphones work better with FW 1.8 and higher. Therefore, I suspected that the first BMPCC in 2013/14/15, had problems with internal microphones and these were improved by Firmware update.

See also viewtopic.php?uid=16&f=2&t=42701&start=0#p280968

I've seen a broken BMPCC from 2013 or 2014 and that doesn't have the copper. I bought mine new in 2018 and it has copper.
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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 3:22 pm



from 5:20 he also shows some pictures
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John Paines

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostFri Jun 28, 2019 3:45 pm

He does show "some pictures", so tell me: if you think that footage is "cinematic", what movies or cinematographers do you have in mind as references?

You also must be aware he made some strange grading choices -- or he may not understand that log is usually normalized before grading.

All that aside, if you admire this footage, as exhibited on youtube, it's beyond me how you'd be able to distinguish it from youtubes of any number of other cameras similarly graded. Unless you're clairvoyant.
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Dmytro Shijan

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostSat Jun 29, 2019 7:29 am

Yep, Pocket/Micro footage looks great even in 2019. Wider color gamut with less color clipping and wider sensor gamma curve with smoother highlights. But it needs OLPF/IR filter.


BMMCC/BMMSC Rigs Collection https://bmmccrigs.tumblr.com
My custom made accessories for BMMCC/BMMSC https://lavky.com/radioproektor/
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Dmytro Shijan

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostSat Jun 29, 2019 9:59 am

Australian Image wrote:How do they compare? Orange and teal with muddy skin tones. Very cinematic.


Sure, there is nothing compare in this world to your P4K samples :mrgreen:

BMMCC/BMMSC Rigs Collection https://bmmccrigs.tumblr.com
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Chris Whitten

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostSat Jun 29, 2019 10:40 am

I don't really understand what the problem is, if one prefers the original pocket - just buy one, there are several on Ebay UK right now (haven't looked in USA or Europe).
There are also many good examples of Pocket 4K footage on Youtube.
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Dmytro Shijan

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostSat Jun 29, 2019 10:57 am

Australian Image wrote:
Dmitry Shijan wrote:
Australian Image wrote:How do they compare? Orange and teal with muddy skin tones. Very cinematic.

Given that I only started doing video very recently and slowly coming to grips with not just the BMPCC4K, but the entire video process, my early attempts are indeed quite poor. But I'm not embarrassed by that no matter how much fun people try and poke at those early attempts, it's a learning curve.

That said, I would expect much better from seasoned film makers than the usual orange and teal with shadowy figures and muddy skin tones. The thing is, I'm learning all the time and I know I'll get better. Will those seasoned professionals get better or have they peaked?


Just to stop your teal and orange paranoia here are some of my early attempts to get the most neutral starting point. BMMCC RAW with OLPF/IR filter installed. Also all of my product still photos that have 16x9 ratio are made with BMMCC. Those are graded in same way but with additional film emulation LUTs and sometimes with film grain added.

Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
BMMCC/BMMSC Rigs Collection https://bmmccrigs.tumblr.com
My custom made accessories for BMMCC/BMMSC https://lavky.com/radioproektor/
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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostSat Jun 29, 2019 12:00 pm

Dmitry Shijan wrote:
Australian Image wrote:How do they compare? Orange and teal with muddy skin tones. Very cinematic.


Sure, there is nothing compare in this world to your P4K samples :mrgreen:



how a BMPPC4K owner told me: like shots from a smartphone. Okay, that also has a Sony sensor.

@AI, and I thought you were one of those who make movies with BMPCC4K, but apparently you are just a rocker, with BMPCC4K on your head as an action camera :mrgreen:

Is John Paines also a member of your Australian-Blackmagic-Rocker-Club (ABMRC) ? :D

A little fun is important for life. ;)


Dmitry Shijan, beautiful shots. Looks natural.
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John Paines

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostSat Jun 29, 2019 2:57 pm

lee4ever wrote:Is John Paines also a member of your Australian-Blackmagic-Rocker-Club (ABMRC) ?


I'm afraid not, different country. But apparently anyone who questions the ridiculous claims made here is an idiot. Briefly. among the absurdities being regularly promoted:

1) posting stills of one camera to prove its superiority, while neglecting to provide the same material from the other camera which is supposedly inferior -- a comparison without any comparison. In this case, the footage is from a camera which isn't even a party to the dispute, but at least that much was disclosed; in past instances, it wasn't.

2) citing uncontrolled youtube comparisons where the publisher (and his fans), would appear to have no grasp of the post-production that footage from these cameras requires or what a controlled experiment is,

3) citing unrelated youtubes, sometimes separated by years and continents, to make comparisons in favor of whatever camera the poster prefers, or claims to prefer.

4) using the term "cinematic" to mean, "I like it" or, "It says 'BMPCC', so I like it".

So much for the Worldwide Church of Youtube?
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lee4ever

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostSat Jun 29, 2019 5:49 pm

But apparently anyone who questions the ridiculous claims made here is an idiot.


That's what you wrote, not me. You don't have to feel like an idiot if others don't like your camera or BMPCC4K or are still more satisfied with BMMCC, BMCC or BMPCC.
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Chris Whitten

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostSun Jun 30, 2019 9:47 am

It's a real shame the thread has devolved to damning someone's work that they've posted.
It really has nothing to do with whether either camera (Pocket or Pocket 4K) are capable of stellar results.
It actually reinforces the fact that they are all just tools, and the outcome is more determined by the way the tools are used (skill and experience) than by the tools itself.
Chris Whitten
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Chris Whitten

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Re: Ode to the original BMPCC - Video

PostSun Jun 30, 2019 10:42 am

Likewise.
I think I use the Pocket 4K OK, but then editing and grading effectively is a whole other can of worms.
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