Grading .Cine files (Phantom)

Hello All,


Lately I have been working with Phantom Cine files a lot and I have been trying to figure some stuff out but I can't get any further, hence my question here.

When I load a .cine file into resolve it works great. My only problem is that what I see in Resolve is Rec709. Not RAW. So you actualy start grading over Rec709 if I understand it well. We always used to export 1 DNG for color reference. This exports directly out of the Phantom software and has no colorspace or anything, its a green image which has to be white balanced before you start.

This is what i'd actualy like to do in Resolve as well. To get a flat, raw image. Without Rec709.

This is what a raw exported .DNG image looks like

When I import a R3D file in Resolve there are a lot of options in the Camera Raw, Master Settings. These options are not there when I import a cine file.

R3D



Cine file

Only options is to change Gamma and there is Log1 and Log2 but thats not what i want.

I hope i made it clear. This is such a struggle in our workflow. For now i have to bootcamp windows, start the phantom software and from there export a DNG from a Cine file to get a raw dng without any color.

Thanks,
Vincent

I'd like a bit of advice here as well.

We're receiving a ton of cine files and by default they always come in as rec709 and the black and white points are always right on the edge of legal. The cameraman tells me that the phantom records RAW and not log and that this RAW has a far greater range of latitude than say a log file from an Alexa but that's not what I'm seeing in Resolve. There doesn't seem to be anywhere to go with it and it certainly isn't as good to grade with as a true log curve.

[Peter Chamberlain]

Assuming your on Resolve v12, we read the cine file and debayer the raw. We don't show you the raw but we are processing it correctly and we are not making 709.

The raw controls on the color page camera raw palette let you decode is using either Rec 709 or Log gamma. they are not limiting the range. Its just applying a gamma curve. All these camera raw adjustments are prior to the node graph where you can make normal grading adjustments.

Using Resolve color managed timelines you can set the timeline and output color space to a number of options, and in either case, Resolve does not clip the color space to limit it within the signal processing path.

So if you like being in rec 2020 set that for your timeline and output, assuming you have a 2020 monitor, and none of your original raw data is lost.

Finally, the term 'Log' simply means some transform is applied to the image and it does not mean any part is lost or gained. It can be decoded to another image format. A full black image can be in linear or log or rec 709 or 2020 and its still black.

Hello Peter. Last phantom cine job I had, it was possible to choose a log mode for cine files, but some data in the blacks would be crushed below zero, Not all the blacks, in this case it was in the blue channel. I had to export out to DPX, so I was nervous about exporting with info crushed in the blacks. So I used soft blue curve to bring back that data. However, at that point I'm adjusting the image, when I should be exporting raw, exactly as recorded. If I switched to rec709, instead of log 1 or 2, all info came back. Nothing was crushed in the blacks, however, now the image looked rec709, without much latitude for further color. Blacks were just above zero, and whites at 100. I have another cine job coming up. Can I send you a frame, and get your feedback as to how to export, raw, exactly as recorded in cam, with no clipping in the blacks?

Thanks

[Peter Chamberlain]

Just to clarify, there is no raw export.

The images are debayered which means they are now in 32 bit float RGB.

Im not sure about the issue you saw but you can PM the image to me.