Canon C500 raw 4116x2178

Shooting 4K Canon Raw recorded to the Odyssey 7Q (and 7Q+) is producing files that show up 4116x2178 in Davinci Resolve. This seems odd, is it correct? Is one expected to crop or scale them to 4096x2160? Is the viewfinder showing the 4116x2178 or 4096x2160? Anyone working with Canon 4K Raw? Thanks, Stephen

Clip data in Resolve

C500_4116x2178.jpg (107.17 KiB) Viewed 1904 times

I would get a chart with the desired delivery aspect ratio size and use that as a reference. If you need to deliver 16x9, then you want 4096x2304, or 1920x1080. And there are clients who prefer UHD, 3940x2160. The key is to know that if you're shooting in a non-standard aspect ratio, then compromises will have to be made for delivery, either in terms of a blow-up or pan/scan or both.

4096x2160 is the 4K standard - 17/9 aspect ratio - DCP 4K cinema delivery. 3840x2160 is the UHD -16/9 aspect ratio UHD television delivery. 4K clips, which according to the camera specs should be 4096x2160, are coming up as 4116x2178 in Davinci Resolve when recorded by the Odyssey 7Q. I'd be curious to know if this is happening with clips record to Codex recorders. Likewise UHD clips which according to the camera specs should be 3840x2160 are coming up as 3860x2178 in Davinci Resolve when recorded by the Odyssey 7Q. In each case there are 20 more pixels horizontally and 18 more vertically than specified.

According the Canon, clips come up correctly as 4096x2160 in their Canon Cinema RAW Development software but I don't know if those clips were recored with a Convergent Design or Codex device.

It would be interesting to hear back from someone at BlackMagic or someone with C500 experience. Below are Canon and Convergent Design responses to my questions regarding this issue.

Canon: "I checked our Canon Cinema RAW Development software reports the footage as 4096 x2160. Also, once I exported the footage to Pro Res using the RAW Development tool, and then imported into Final Cut, FCP also reports it as 4096x2160.

I do not have an answer at to why Resolve reports it differently Although I have seen at least one screen grab online of Resolve showing some C500 footage with the same res of 4116x2178 pixels. The visible pixels should be 4096 x2160. Whether the software requires one to crop or scale is unclear and you would need to speak to DaVinci about that part. I've never heard of anyone needing to do this. My question to you is what happens when you take footage that has been color corrected via Resolve and bring that into your Final Cut Pro? What does FCP detect the footage as? Also does this affect your workflow? If so, how?

With regards to the viewfinder. The coverage is 100% therefore what you see is what you get. Whether that means that the entire 4206 x 2340 photosites are visible within it or only 4096x2160 is information that is not available. Also the viewfinder is also only about 1 cm large and 1.5 Megapixels therefore it would be very difficult if not impossible distinguish the 20 additional pixels either way."

Convergent Design: The actual number of Raw photosites is larger than 4096 x 2160. A few extra photosites are required to do a proper deBayer. The extra photosites are used for other purposes by Canon. We deBayer for the viewfinder as 4096 x 2160, then we scale to the size of our monitor.

The last statement suggest that their is something wrong with DaVinci's De-Bayer.

Thanks,

Stephen

I will shoot with a mask and crop pixel to pixel 3840x2160 so you don't have to subsampling, this also allow some room for reposition/reframing/stabilize
think in this way, if you scale from 4096 to 4097, the central pixel of the image is a merge of two adjacent pixels, reducing the spacial resolution by (at worst) half

If I were shooting for UHD delivery I think I would probably shoot 3840x2160 which shows up as 3860x2178 in Resolve and crop it 3840x2160 for delivery to avoid downscaling. The reason I'm posting this is because I believe there is a glitch in the process: the Canon C500 in theory is set-up to output 4096 x 2160 or 3840x2160 depending on whether one selects 4K or UHD. The Odyssey 7Q is theoretically recording either 4096 x 2160 or 3840x2160 as well. And finally, one would expect Resolve to De-Bayer the clips to the standard resolutions.

S

Is this not common to have RAW files at "strange" resolutions- like I whole sensor dump. You rather want to crop/pan in the frame than try to fit all info in case when difference (compared to 4K) is so small. When you record already debayered footage than this is happening behind the scenes, so you don't notice/"care".

hi
here i have my own c500 camera with odissey..we shot lot of films in c500..it records in 4116x2178.
no issues...set ur project..to final output what u need..select the image scaling options in resolve for center crop with no resize...no need to pan..the up and down pixels are crop a littile bit..no problem...
i think its not an issue to discuss...

hi
here i have my own c500 camera with odissey..we shot lot of films in c500..it records in 4116x2178.
no issues...set ur project..to final output what u need..select the image scaling options in resolve for center crop with no resize...no need to pan..the up and down pixels are crop a littile bit..no problem...
i think its not an issue to discuss...

that will be my approach as well, however i find some editors being really pissy because I'm cropping few pixels. ...

that will be my approach as well, however i find some editors being really pissy because I'm cropping few pixels. ...

There's a whole generation of young filmmakers who don't seem to grasp that you need to shoot with a definitive aspect ratio in mind. I've had a dozen projects over the last year come in where the producers were completely ignorant of delivery specs to the point where they shot in an aspect ratio nobody could actually see, and never bothered to monitor in a consistent aspect ratio on the set, nor did they shoot a sizing chart. Idiots.