H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

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Doug Marsh

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H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostTue Sep 12, 2017 11:46 pm

I am sure this has been asked before but I am not finding it.

I assume I am wrong so please correct me.

I am guessing that one can import H264 directly on Resolve somehow, but perhaps that is disabled on the (lite) free version and supported on the Studio (paid) version?

*OR* is H264 import simply missing from Resolve Studio 14 (and lite) on Linux or perhaps missing on all platforms?

Can somebody provide information as to which OS and Resolve (lite/Studio) supports importing what (H264 in this case).

--Doug (dx9s)
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Dwaine Maggart

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostWed Sep 13, 2017 1:17 am

Windows or Mac?

If Windows, you must use Windows 10 for proper MPEG and H.264 support.

If you are using Windows 10, and don't see your file(s) in the Media page Media Storage area, please post a link to sample file that we can examine.
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Martin Schitter

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostWed Sep 13, 2017 8:11 pm

Doug Marsh wrote:*OR* is H264 import simply missing from Resolve Studio 14 (and lite) on Linux or perhaps missing on all platforms?
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Charles Bennett

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostWed Sep 13, 2017 9:12 pm

My experience is that h264 and it's variant, MP4, are both working fine in DR14 Free release version, and have done in all the 14 betas.
Dell XPS 8700 Core i7-4790 @ 3.60GHz, 24GB RAM, Nvidia Geforce GTX 750Ti, Win 10 Home, DaVinci Resolve 14.1.1 free.
Dell Precision 490 dual 4 core Xeon Workstation, 16GB ECC RAM, Win 7 Ultimate, Pro Tools 12.8.2, Wavelab
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Dwaine Maggart

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostWed Sep 13, 2017 9:15 pm

Reading H.264 files on Resolve Linux (free or Studio) is supported on supported RHEL/CentOS platforms.

Edited on 10-19-2017 to correct what I said above. Even though I'm pretty sure I tested this before posting the above, it's been brought to my attention that H.264 files only show audio in the non-Studio Resolve 14 versions. In retesting, I have to agree with that. No video with H.264 files in non-Studio Resolve 14 for Linux. But Resolve Studio 14 for Linux plays H.264 files properly.

Writing H.264 files is NOT currently supported on Resolve Linux.

I can't say what might happen if you are not using RHEL/CentOS.
Last edited by Dwaine Maggart on Thu Oct 19, 2017 6:05 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostWed Sep 13, 2017 10:06 pm

Dwaine Maggart wrote:Reading H.264 files on Resolve Linux (free or Studio) is supported on supported RHEL/CentOS platforms.
Writing H.264 files is NOT currently supported on Resolve Linux.


thanks for this clarification!

a complete list of all this linux specific differences in comparison to both other operating systems would be very useful, but eliminating the gaps would be even more pleasant. ;)
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Doug Marsh

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostWed Sep 13, 2017 10:53 pm

Then it must be a runtime linking library issue between Ubuntu and RHEL.

I can import DHxHD/R and even ProRES with PCM audio and see the mixer moving (can't hear it yet -- close to purchasing Intensity Pro 4K I think it was as-well-as Studio)... But cannot import (without transcoding) H264 content (either MOV container or MP4)

I'll try some more, perhaps I am missing something. Did a ldd on the resolve binary and everything is good there. Perhaps somebody in the RHEL/CentOS world can dig and see what system library (and it's location/name) it being used there so I can create the necessary symlinks / binaries to get H264 content to import.

It might also be my content, lossless H264 might not import at all!?

--Doug (dx9s)
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Dwaine Maggart

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostWed Sep 13, 2017 10:54 pm

If you provide a link to a file, happy to see what it does here.
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Doug Marsh

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 12:09 am

Uploaded to a test website

http://test.dx9s.net/2017-09-13_16-49-58.mov

Code: Select all
mi 2017-09-13_16-49-58.mov
General
Complete name                            : 2017-09-13_16-49-58.mov
Format                                   : MPEG-4
Format profile                           : QuickTime
Codec ID                                 : qt   0000.02 (qt  )
File size                                : 42.8 MiB
Duration                                 : 1s 856ms
Overall bit rate mode                    : Constant
Overall bit rate                         : 193 Mbps
Encoded date                             : UTC 1904-01-01 00:00:00
Tagged date                              : UTC 1904-01-01 00:00:00
Writing application                      : Lavf56.40.101

Video
ID                                       : 1
Format                                   : AVC
Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                           : High 4:4:4 Predictive Intra@L4.2
Format settings, CABAC                   : Yes
Format settings, GOP                     : N=1
Codec ID                                 : avc1
Codec ID/Info                            : Advanced Video Coding
Duration                                 : 1s 652ms
Bit rate mode                            : Constant
Bit rate                                 : 216 Mbps
Width                                    : 1 920 pixels
Height                                   : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
Frame rate mode                          : Constant
Frame rate                               : 59.940 (60000/1001) fps
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:4:4
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 1.734
Stream size                              : 42.4 MiB (99%)
Writing library                          : x264 core 148 r2643 5c65704
Encoding settings                        : cabac=1 / ref=1 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x1:0x111 / me=hex / subme=2 / psy=0 / mixed_ref=0 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=0 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / fast_pskip=0 / chroma_qp_offset=0 / threads=12 / lookahead_threads=4 / sliced_threads=0 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / interlaced=0 / bluray_compat=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=0 / weightp=0 / keyint=1 / keyint_min=1 / scenecut=40 / intra_refresh=0 / rc=cqp / mbtree=0 / qp=0
Language                                 : English
Encoded date                             : UTC 1904-01-01 00:00:00
Tagged date                              : UTC 1904-01-01 00:00:00
Color range                              : Full
Matrix coefficients                      : BT.709

Audio
ID                                       : 2
Format                                   : PCM
Format settings, Endianness              : Little
Format settings, Sign                    : Signed
Codec ID                                 : sowt
Duration                                 : 1s 856ms
Bit rate mode                            : Constant
Bit rate                                 : 1 536 Kbps
Channel(s)                               : 2 channels
Channel positions                        : Front: L R
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 KHz
Bit depth                                : 16 bits
Stream size                              : 348 KiB (1%)
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : Yes
Alternate group                          : 1
Encoded date                             : UTC 1904-01-01 00:00:00
Tagged date                              : UTC 1904-01-01 00:00:00


If you want it in an MP4 container:
http://test.dx9s.net/2017-09-13_16-49-58.mp4 (audio is AAC instead of PCM, not allowed for MP4: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compariso ... _supported )

Code: Select all
mi 2017-09-13_16-49-58.mp4
General
Complete name                            : 2017-09-13_16-49-58.mp4
Format                                   : MPEG-4
Format profile                           : Base Media
Codec ID                                 : isom (isom/iso2/avc1/mp41)
File size                                : 42.5 MiB
Duration                                 : 1s 890ms
Overall bit rate mode                    : Constant
Overall bit rate                         : 188 Mbps
Encoded date                             : UTC 1904-01-01 00:00:00
Tagged date                              : UTC 1904-01-01 00:00:00
Writing application                      : Lavf56.40.101

Video
ID                                       : 1
Format                                   : AVC
Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                           : High 4:4:4 Predictive Intra@L4.2
Format settings, CABAC                   : Yes
Format settings, GOP                     : N=1
Codec ID                                 : avc1
Codec ID/Info                            : Advanced Video Coding
Duration                                 : 1s 652ms
Bit rate mode                            : Constant
Bit rate                                 : 216 Mbps
Width                                    : 1 920 pixels
Height                                   : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
Frame rate mode                          : Constant
Frame rate                               : 59.940 (60000/1001) fps
Color space                              : YUV
Chroma subsampling                       : 4:4:4
Bit depth                                : 8 bits
Scan type                                : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 1.734
Stream size                              : 42.4 MiB (100%)
Writing library                          : x264 core 148 r2643 5c65704
Encoding settings                        : cabac=1 / ref=1 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x1:0x111 / me=hex / subme=2 / psy=0 / mixed_ref=0 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=0 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / fast_pskip=0 / chroma_qp_offset=0 / threads=12 / lookahead_threads=4 / sliced_threads=0 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / interlaced=0 / bluray_compat=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=0 / weightp=0 / keyint=1 / keyint_min=1 / scenecut=40 / intra_refresh=0 / rc=cqp / mbtree=0 / qp=0
Language                                 : English
Encoded date                             : UTC 1904-01-01 00:00:00
Tagged date                              : UTC 1904-01-01 00:00:00
Color range                              : Full
Matrix coefficients                      : BT.709

Audio
ID                                       : 2
Format                                   : AAC
Format/Info                              : Advanced Audio Codec
Format profile                           : LC
Codec ID                                 : 40
Duration                                 : 1s 890ms
Duration_LastFrame                       : -9ms
Bit rate mode                            : Constant
Bit rate                                 : 129 Kbps
Channel(s)                               : 2 channels
Channel positions                        : Front: L R
Sampling rate                            : 48.0 KHz
Frame rate                               : 46.875 fps (1024 spf)
Compression mode                         : Lossy
Stream size                              : 29.7 KiB (0%)
Language                                 : English
Default                                  : Yes
Alternate group                          : 1
Encoded date                             : UTC 1904-01-01 00:00:00
Tagged date                              : UTC 1904-01-01 00:00:00


EDIT: BTW I guessed the "latest" download link based on previous URLs and found this: http://downloads.blackmagicdesign.com/D ... OS_7.3.iso ... I'm gonna download that and install on a new machine I am building for video production and try it out. WISH ME LUCK!
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Dwaine Maggart

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 3:09 am

No need to guess. That link is in the Resolve 14 Linux download Linux_Installation_Instructions pdf.
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Dwaine Maggart

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 4:51 am

Those files don't open in any Resolve version on any platform.

So apparently an unsupported format. It's not something specific to your Linux setup.
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Doug Marsh

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 5:45 am

Dwaine Maggart wrote:Those files don't open in any Resolve version on any platform.

So apparently an unsupported format. It's not something specific to your Linux setup.


It is a lossless mode for H264 (a somewhat unusual, i-frame only and no quantizing, keep all the data, in a 4:4:4 8-bit mode, so a loss in RGB -> YUV, but lossless in YUV) format.

A function of the highly used in many places x264 encoder/decoder https://licensing.x264.org/en/ describes it briefly.

FFMPEG uses x264 codec and can be used here: https://trac.ffmpeg.org/wiki/Encode/H.264#LosslessH.264 .. (ffmpeg is cross platform), many other 'wrappers' around x264 (frameworks, implementations, etc.) that make use of x264 codec (like libav as well) all support lossless. VLC seems to play it fine (MOV and MP4). The lossless format I believe is standard, just not typical.

I tried importing an MP4 from a Hero 5 and that didn't work either on my Ubuntu machine here (which IS a more typical MPEG file).

ON a side note. tried installing the centos DVD and it crashed once on installer boot, 2nd time installed and a few reboots later wouldn't boot (the chipset on this motherboard are quite new, X299 with 7820X and 1080 Ti).. So downloaded the ISO from CentoOS and tried same thing.. got futher but I *REALLY* hate yum.. and the command line from CentOS out of the box (things like control-left/right for skipping blocks of text NOT enabled, sorry I am spoiled with debians/ubuntu's command line )

Tried to upgrade to some "elrpo" 4.13 kernel and just NOT having any fun there.. so stuck with 3.10 and installed NVIDIA's latest drivers there. but getting some missing library when trying to run Resolv on CentOS... SO MUCH HARDER installing it on CentOS

From what I got via PM from another user is that h264 import is only available in the studio version. I just wanted to test importing under CentOS for worked/failed with "lite" version and not having any luck. CentOS just doesn't support the hardware well out of box and fighting with it is a pain... gonna go to bed and fight tomorrow

--Doug (dx9s)
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Ed Nixon

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 12:25 pm

Supplementary question:

The Panasonic Lumix GH5 firmware will be updated within the next few weeks to incorporate a set of All-intra encoding options. Is this issue related at all to that update?

In general: will the (Lumix) all-intra encoding(s) be supported in Resolve 14?

Thanks

...edN
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Martin Schitter

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 12:43 pm

Ed Nixon wrote:The Panasonic Lumix GH5 firmware will be updated within the next few weeks to incorporate a set of All-intra encoding options. Is this issue related at all to that update?


no -- i don't think, it should be seen as related to this particular issue.

lossless h.264 encoding is hardly supported by any non ffmpeg based software. it's a really obscure feature, which is not used much often in real world. although it's perfectly standard compliant, it isn't readable by most h.264 codecs. scalable video coding (SVC) would be a similar feature specified in the standard, which will not work in most applications.

the gh5 files look much more common in this respect. but they utilize 10bit resolution per color channel, which also will raise issues in many common h.264 implementations. h.265 or vp9 would be better options to handle advanced bitdepth in a more compatible manner.
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Ed Nixon

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 1:12 pm

Thanks. It certainly seemed like the 10-bit colour channel feature was the big issue on the Mac platform. In general; none of the in-built utilities would do more than display an information screen.

In fact, I think Resolve was the only application on my installation that would run those files as is. Not super fast/smooth (on a MacBook Pro) but they would run.

I'm still feeling that either transcoding or proxy media are the main options for my H.264 sourced material on my setup.

I'm very curious to see how Resolve reacts to the Lumix upgrade's encodings.

Thanks again for your help.
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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 1:31 pm

I tried that file in Kyno, which is opening and transcoding most H.264 I'd throw at it on my Mac, but it doesn't recognize it either. But VLC does open and play it.

Hope this helps.
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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 2:45 pm

I'll look at Kyno.

Yes, I forgot to mention VLC. There's an app called EditReady which has been updated to do 10-bit processing. It has a nice feature around meta-data addition and editing. Two unfortunate issues:

* there's a bug in the output customization option that is supposed to permit filename tagging with output resolution; 0x0 is what you get no matter what, and

* the metadata is EXIF which, unless I'm mistaken, is not a capability available in Resolve -- which, to editorialize -- seems like a no brainer for a major tool that is trying to go down-market into the broader 'hybrid' production segment.

Thanks again.
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Doug Marsh

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Re: H264 import on Resolve 14 ?

PostThu Sep 14, 2017 2:46 pm

Martin Schitter wrote:
Ed Nixon wrote:lossless h.264 encoding is hardly supported by any non ffmpeg based software. it's a really obscure feature, which is not used much often in real world. although it's perfectly standard compliant, it isn't readable by most h.264 codecs. scalable video coding (SVC) would be a similar feature specified in the standard, which will not work in most applications.


Lossless h264 is in the standard, just highly unused and so various implementations lack support, that is true! x264 implements that standard and ffmpeg (which is a swiss army knife, a collection of a bunch of codecs in a "semi" standardized interface from a programming interface) as well as a few other "interfaces" (wrappers) around x264 (like libav) also support Lossless as they all use x264.

The licensing on x264 is weird, it is free as long as your have a product that is free (which the free version of Resolve technically is). *IF* a paid version of Resolve doesn't "add" x264 support (directly or indirectly via say ffmpeg) and the free version includes same integration (support) of same x264 library (again, directly or indirectly) then resolve should be fine with using it. But I am not a lawyer.

Instead it appears resolve (on Linux and on Windows) uses the nvidia libraries to decode h264 and pass any licensing (if that exists) on to them. It appears to be "included" in OSX in the "free" version.

On a side note, I reinstalled (added some boot options) the Resolve CentOS7 1708 ISO from BM and got it installed last night before going to bed and then installed the latest nVidia drivers. the 1080 ti has issues with older drivers (both nouveau and nVidia) and got it running.

I can confirm, the free version of Resolve on Linux does NOT import H264 (as also confirmed in a PM from another user here). The Studio version (paid) will import H264 on Linux with nVidia graphics card as it uses the nVidia hardware to perform that.

The moderator also confirms that nVidia's drivers do NOT support the Predictive Lossless (rare and most people don't implement) mode of H264. I would like to post a "near" lossless file and have somebody test it -- will get around to asking later.

BUT in any case, my installation on the same hardware with Ubuntu 16.04 (updated to MUCH newer kernel 4.x series) and CentOS 7.3 (build 1708) from BM with tweaking and the free version behave the same.

Gonna place an order for Intensity Pro 4K (like the analog capture, but probably will almost never use) over the various DeckLink cards and Studio and call that good -- unless somebody knows of issues with that hardware under Linux?!

--Doug (dx9s)

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