Simple 5.1 audio mapping

Get answers to your questions about color grading, editing and finishing with DaVinci Resolve.
  • Author
  • Message
Offline

Dillon Brown

  • Posts: 4
  • Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:07 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostWed Oct 11, 2017 7:12 pm

Glenn Venghaus, THANK YOU! I've been trying for days to render out a 5.1 ProRes file with ALL 6 tracks combined into ONE single 5.1 track in the file. Instead of 6 separate mono tracks in the file. So this helps a lot! Way way more convoluted than 12.5 though.

Man it would be nice if Blackmagic could allow users to bypass the Fairlight tab entirely when doing audio deliverables. So a timeline could be set up with 6 mono tracks and then routed in the Audio Mixer as mono tracks - 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, then on the Deliver page 6 tracks and boom! Done. Like what used to be possible...

If this is the easiest way to do it then it'll be a lot more work to set up each time.
Offline

Glenn Venghaus

  • Posts: 556
  • Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:56 pm
  • Location: Amsterdam , The Netherlands

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostWed Oct 11, 2017 7:26 pm

Eric Rosen wrote:How would you you do this setup in regards to 7.1 monitoring?


As of 14.0.1 exactly the same as descibed above for 5.1 just with a 7.1 track format, which is now available
AKAI APC-40 The Ultimate Davinci Resolve budget controller | davinci-controller.tachyon-consulting.com
HACK OSX10.12.4 | 4790K | 2xGTX980ti | 32GB | DRS 14.2
V: CUDA387.99 | 378.05.05.05f02 | DTV10.8.6 | MiniMon-SDI >HDlink > Eizo
A: 5.1RME-FireFace
Offline

Glenn Venghaus

  • Posts: 556
  • Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:56 pm
  • Location: Amsterdam , The Netherlands

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostWed Oct 11, 2017 7:30 pm

Dillon Brown wrote:Glenn Venghaus, THANK YOU! I've been trying for days to render out a 5.1 ProRes file with ALL 6 tracks combined into ONE single 5.1 track in the file. Instead of 6 separate mono tracks in the file. So this helps a lot! Way way more convoluted than 12.5 though.

Man it would be nice if Blackmagic could allow users to bypass the Fairlight tab entirely when doing audio deliverables. So a timeline could be set up with 6 mono tracks and then routed in the Audio Mixer as mono tracks - 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, then on the Deliver page 6 tracks and boom! Done. Like what used to be possible...

If this is the easiest way to do it then it'll be a lot more work to set up each time.


Yeah its a pitty. I love fairlight , but the one thing that was more flexible in 12.5 is that you had the option NOT to fit into some existing standard like 5.1 7.1 etc . You could just create a single track with 20 channels directly mapped to it very easy if you wanted to. Fairlight FORCES you into an existing standard for single track outputs. Originaly i though the new multitrack bus type would allow you to do that but its not. You can max adress up to 8 channels in a single track using the 7.1 format.
There should be a directly patchable free format.
AKAI APC-40 The Ultimate Davinci Resolve budget controller | davinci-controller.tachyon-consulting.com
HACK OSX10.12.4 | 4790K | 2xGTX980ti | 32GB | DRS 14.2
V: CUDA387.99 | 378.05.05.05f02 | DTV10.8.6 | MiniMon-SDI >HDlink > Eizo
A: 5.1RME-FireFace
Offline

Glenn Venghaus

  • Posts: 556
  • Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:56 pm
  • Location: Amsterdam , The Netherlands

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostWed Oct 11, 2017 7:39 pm

Actualy i stand corrected. The same method work for up to 24 channels if instead of a 7.1 you pick an adaptive track type with 24 channels . Then map output of every track to a consecutive sub input of this track.
Maybe a recent addition or i just missed it.
So all is possible now. Just a bit different then before but once you know it its just as fast after you have done it a few times. Specialy as you can do bulk mapping in the input/output mapping menu. (eg select 24 track on the left and 24 on the right in one sweep. In 12 you needed to do it for each and every track separately.)
Then you just add this timeline track to the render output and you have a single track with 24 channels.
AKAI APC-40 The Ultimate Davinci Resolve budget controller | davinci-controller.tachyon-consulting.com
HACK OSX10.12.4 | 4790K | 2xGTX980ti | 32GB | DRS 14.2
V: CUDA387.99 | 378.05.05.05f02 | DTV10.8.6 | MiniMon-SDI >HDlink > Eizo
A: 5.1RME-FireFace
Offline

Vit Reiter

  • Posts: 22
  • Joined: Mon Sep 04, 2017 5:36 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostWed Oct 11, 2017 8:50 pm

Do You find this? It is really more simple than read it.

1. Import video file with embeded 6 mono track to Media Page.
2. Right click to this video file and choose New Timeline Using Selected Clips... (You have to not to set the timeline inside pop-up window)
3. In the timeline inside the Edit Page You'll see 6 audio tracks. Delete A2 - A6.
4. Right click on right-side one of track and Delete Empty Tracks.
5. Right click on audio track A1 and choose Clip Attributes.
6. Choose second tab Audio and change Format to 5.1. (You'll see audio surround mapping. You can modify it.)
7. Right click on right-side of audio track A1 and Change Track Type to 5.1.
8. Go to Fairlight tab on the top of DaVinci Menu and choose Bus Format.
9. Change Format to 5.1 and click OK. (now You can export one audio track with embeded 5.1 sound)
DaVinci Resolve Studio 14.3, Fusion Studio 9.0.2

Mac Pro 2013, macOS Sierra 10.12.6
Graphics AMD FirePro D700 6144 MB
RAM 64 GB

Film Editor, Colorist, VFX and Motion Graphic Designer, DIT, Encoding technician
linkedin.com/in/vít-reiter-film-editor
Offline

Glenn Venghaus

  • Posts: 556
  • Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:56 pm
  • Location: Amsterdam , The Netherlands

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostWed Oct 11, 2017 9:57 pm

Hi Vit,

Not sure what you are trying to achieve with this convoluted way of rendering a single 5.1 audio track. The discussion above is more about mapping for monitoring AND redering in different combination using stems etc ,which makes it slightly more complex as are 2 different things.
But if you have just a single video clip with 6 mono tracks of audio and want to render out as single track with 5.1 chan layout, the simplest way is to go into clip attributes, change the audio settings from 6xmono to 1x5.1. Then drop on a timeline with single 5.1 track and render out the timeline track directly (not the main bus, but the timeline track). Done (And of course you can add a 5.1 but to monitor as well if you want.)
I have no clue why you do it your way, with deleting and changing tracks etc. That sounds just crazy and error prone and not needed.
Once you understand fairlight more (it helps it you have good general DAW knowledge about tracks/busssed/aux/ etc ect) it all becomes very easy. Just takes a little to understand the workflow and mapping possibilities.
AKAI APC-40 The Ultimate Davinci Resolve budget controller | davinci-controller.tachyon-consulting.com
HACK OSX10.12.4 | 4790K | 2xGTX980ti | 32GB | DRS 14.2
V: CUDA387.99 | 378.05.05.05f02 | DTV10.8.6 | MiniMon-SDI >HDlink > Eizo
A: 5.1RME-FireFace
Offline

Andrew Kolakowski

  • Posts: 3079
  • Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:20 am

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostThu Oct 12, 2017 12:15 am

What if I don't want single 5.1 track (which is in most cases true). I just want 6x mono to be mapped on output as 6x mono- 1:1 mapping. Simple as this. Same in case if I have e.g. 12 channels. I want pure mapping. A1,A2, A3..... to go into MOV as is, so I end up with 12 audio mono tracks with same order as audio tracks.
This should simply work by default with e.g. adaptive tracks.
Offline

Glenn Venghaus

  • Posts: 556
  • Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:56 pm
  • Location: Amsterdam , The Netherlands

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostThu Oct 12, 2017 12:38 am

Yeez here we go again.Read this and all other similar threads .
Explained a million times by now and super simple.
Just render 6 timeline tracks directly. Has been an option since early betas. Cant get any simpler. Even simpler the DR12 in than end as no mapping needed. Juts render in the order you want them.
Or 100000 track if you like.
AKAI APC-40 The Ultimate Davinci Resolve budget controller | davinci-controller.tachyon-consulting.com
HACK OSX10.12.4 | 4790K | 2xGTX980ti | 32GB | DRS 14.2
V: CUDA387.99 | 378.05.05.05f02 | DTV10.8.6 | MiniMon-SDI >HDlink > Eizo
A: 5.1RME-FireFace
Offline

Andrew Kolakowski

  • Posts: 3079
  • Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:20 am

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostThu Oct 12, 2017 9:57 am

It wasn't working at all in (not sure) b5.
If it's working now then good.
Offline

Dermot Shane

  • Posts: 1093
  • Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:48 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostThu Oct 12, 2017 5:59 pm

i have;
LtRt eng full
5.1 eng full
LtRt ME
5.1 ME
LtRt dial
LtRt SFX
LtRt mx

22 mono sources total, need to ship a Qt with all 22 tracks embedded

and do it absolutly zero error

too many places for the train to fall off the tracks in v14.01

i have hope for simple & reliable functionality soon
Offline

Robert Arnold

  • Posts: 183
  • Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2012 11:53 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostThu Oct 12, 2017 6:09 pm

Glenn's (convoluted and not intuitive) workaround works to get 5.1 out through my speakers, but I still can't get easyDCP to work with audio. No matter what I try, I get "easyDCP job could not be added - easyDCP requires even number of audio channels". Anybody have any ideas on this? I keep having to boot up my old system with 12.5 to author DCPs.
Offline

Vit Reiter

  • Posts: 22
  • Joined: Mon Sep 04, 2017 5:36 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostThu Oct 12, 2017 8:22 pm

Hi Glenn,

Yes, I can go into the attributes of the clip, change the sound settings from 6x mono to 1x5.1 and then drop into the timeline with a single 5.1 track. But I never change the source clip attributes! And returning back to Clip Attributes and returning the original clip values there is not a good way. I like better to delete any excess tracks from the timeline.

Render out the timeline track directly (not the main bus, but the timeline track) is the right way, off course.
DaVinci Resolve Studio 14.3, Fusion Studio 9.0.2

Mac Pro 2013, macOS Sierra 10.12.6
Graphics AMD FirePro D700 6144 MB
RAM 64 GB

Film Editor, Colorist, VFX and Motion Graphic Designer, DIT, Encoding technician
linkedin.com/in/vít-reiter-film-editor
Offline

Glenn Venghaus

  • Posts: 556
  • Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:56 pm
  • Location: Amsterdam , The Netherlands

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostThu Oct 12, 2017 8:25 pm

@Robert,
The trick is to change the way you think and admitted that takes some time.
You have to separate monitoring from rendering. Once you get that it becomes relatively straightforward.
If rendering needs 6 mono tracks (like for easydcp) you directly add the individual stems (= timeline tracks) to the render job.
If you want to hear it on your 5.1 system , you set up an extra 5.1 print tracks as above and pipe that into a standard 5.1 main bus or if you dont mind messing with panning to the right bus , directly pan it to the 5.1 bus.
More option make it more convoluted. But by separating monitoring from rendering you can do a lot of things with a single setup that otherwise would be very difficult or even impossible.
Now you can setup a mono, a stereo , a 5.1 and a 7.1 mix at the same time, switch between them with a single mouseclick , switch between different speaker setups, and than render it out independant from all this however you want.

But again all this flexibility goes with some punishments, which is similar to any daw. I almost daily use ableton/reaper/protools (less lately) and all have complex routing and bus structures which would make you weep if you just jump in and want to setup separate multichannel monitoring and rendering options.

And it also took me time to find this all out, dont get me wrong, but i see now and appreciate the possibilities it opens up.
Maybe some preset system for average joe the colorist would be nice to add for BM so if you dont want to invest time in learning this , you can skip and just select a preset.
I suggest if you care for that to put some request in with BM for that. With enough users it might happen.
And it was already in there in a few betas, but was removed , so there is a chance it will happen.
AKAI APC-40 The Ultimate Davinci Resolve budget controller | davinci-controller.tachyon-consulting.com
HACK OSX10.12.4 | 4790K | 2xGTX980ti | 32GB | DRS 14.2
V: CUDA387.99 | 378.05.05.05f02 | DTV10.8.6 | MiniMon-SDI >HDlink > Eizo
A: 5.1RME-FireFace
Offline

Robert Arnold

  • Posts: 183
  • Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2012 11:53 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostThu Oct 12, 2017 9:54 pm

@Glenn Thanks for all your input on this forum!

What you say makes sense, but I still can't seem to get easyDCP to export audio. Here's what I get when I try to do it with individual tracks:

Screen Shot 2017-10-12 at 2.49.48 PM.png
Screen Shot 2017-10-12 at 2.49.48 PM.png (346.35 KiB) Viewed 699 times
Offline

Glenn Venghaus

  • Posts: 556
  • Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:56 pm
  • Location: Amsterdam , The Netherlands

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostThu Oct 12, 2017 9:58 pm

Thats crap indeed. I do not have nor ever had EasyDCP so cant help you there.
Either it should take a single 5.1 formatted track / bus or as you just did 6 mono channels . There aint no more flavours for a 5.1 mix. So if both dont work, maybe it is unrelated to audio but some other issue ?
Or just a bug, which sounds likely as 6 = even (at least here in the Netherlands :mrgreen: )
AKAI APC-40 The Ultimate Davinci Resolve budget controller | davinci-controller.tachyon-consulting.com
HACK OSX10.12.4 | 4790K | 2xGTX980ti | 32GB | DRS 14.2
V: CUDA387.99 | 378.05.05.05f02 | DTV10.8.6 | MiniMon-SDI >HDlink > Eizo
A: 5.1RME-FireFace
Offline

Glenn Venghaus

  • Posts: 556
  • Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:56 pm
  • Location: Amsterdam , The Netherlands

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostThu Oct 12, 2017 10:08 pm

Just went ahead and tried EasyDCP in demo mode (renders fine but with an demo overlay/logo) an no error for either a single 5.1 bus or 6 mono timeline tracks. So i guess the error you get is a false error message caused by something else.
Create a system log on your desktop (help menu) and examine that (unzip and look in the log files). Maybe there is some hint in there
2017-10-13_00-12-51.jpg
2017-10-13_00-12-51.jpg (236.35 KiB) Viewed 687 times
AKAI APC-40 The Ultimate Davinci Resolve budget controller | davinci-controller.tachyon-consulting.com
HACK OSX10.12.4 | 4790K | 2xGTX980ti | 32GB | DRS 14.2
V: CUDA387.99 | 378.05.05.05f02 | DTV10.8.6 | MiniMon-SDI >HDlink > Eizo
A: 5.1RME-FireFace
Offline

Robert Arnold

  • Posts: 183
  • Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2012 11:53 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostFri Oct 13, 2017 4:44 am

Wow, thanks for trying that, Glenn!

I'll nose around and try to figure out where the problem is then, since it looks like tha error message is a red herring.
Offline

Glenn Venghaus

  • Posts: 556
  • Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:56 pm
  • Location: Amsterdam , The Netherlands

Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostFri Oct 13, 2017 5:15 am

Yeah looks indeed fishy.
Are you also on Mac ? As if you are on windows my test, altough indicative, has less value for your case other then saying on mac it can work.
AKAI APC-40 The Ultimate Davinci Resolve budget controller | davinci-controller.tachyon-consulting.com
HACK OSX10.12.4 | 4790K | 2xGTX980ti | 32GB | DRS 14.2
V: CUDA387.99 | 378.05.05.05f02 | DTV10.8.6 | MiniMon-SDI >HDlink > Eizo
A: 5.1RME-FireFace
Offline

Robert Arnold

  • Posts: 183
  • Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2012 11:53 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostThu Oct 26, 2017 9:25 pm

The problem is intermittent now. On some projects I get the error, on others not. Haven't been able to narrow it down or make it strictly reproducible yet...
Offline

franciscovaldez

  • Posts: 34
  • Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2012 4:52 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostMon Jan 29, 2018 8:29 pm

Does anyone no the difference between 5.1 and 5.1 film bus format?
Offline

Reynaud Venter

  • Posts: 347
  • Joined: Sun May 28, 2017 9:34 am

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostMon Jan 29, 2018 8:44 pm

franciscovaldez wrote:difference between 5.1 and 5.1 film bus format?
SMPTE/ITU 5.1 Channel order:
L, R, C, LFE, Ls, Rs

5.1 Film Channel order:
L, C, R, Ls, Rs, LFE
Resolve Studio 14.3 | Merging VAD 2.0.33517 | Merging HAPI
[*]MacPro 2x Quad 2.26GHz Xeon | 14GB RAM | OS X.11.6 (15G19009)
NVIDIA Quadro K620 (346.03.15f12/CUDA 8.0.83) | IntensityPro 4K (10.9.7)
[*]MBP Quad 2.3GHz | 16GB RAM | OS X.12.6 (16G1212)
Offline
User avatar

waltervolpatto

  • Posts: 5626
  • Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2013 5:07 pm
  • Location: Burbank, CA

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostMon Jan 29, 2018 9:12 pm

Reynaud Venter wrote:
franciscovaldez wrote:difference between 5.1 and 5.1 film bus format?
SMPTE/ITU 5.1 Channel order:
L, R, C, LFE, Ls, Rs

5.1 Film Channel order:
L, C, R, Ls, Rs, LFE



Film
L R C LFE Ls Rs
Walter Volpatto - C.S.I.
Digital Intermediate Colorist
Fotokem, Burbank. USA
www.fotokem.com
www.coloristsociety.com

Inb4YouCanJustColorComments: yes you can, good luck with that.
Offline

Glenn Venghaus

  • Posts: 556
  • Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:56 pm
  • Location: Amsterdam , The Netherlands

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostMon Jan 29, 2018 9:16 pm

AKAI APC-40 The Ultimate Davinci Resolve budget controller | davinci-controller.tachyon-consulting.com
HACK OSX10.12.4 | 4790K | 2xGTX980ti | 32GB | DRS 14.2
V: CUDA387.99 | 378.05.05.05f02 | DTV10.8.6 | MiniMon-SDI >HDlink > Eizo
A: 5.1RME-FireFace
Offline

franciscovaldez

  • Posts: 34
  • Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2012 4:52 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostMon Jan 29, 2018 10:22 pm

Thanks :)
Offline

Reynaud Venter

  • Posts: 347
  • Joined: Sun May 28, 2017 9:34 am

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostTue Jan 30, 2018 5:52 am

waltervolpatto wrote:Film
L R C LFE Ls Rs
Glenn Venghaus wrote:https://wiki.multimedia.cx/index.php/Channel_order
Yet, that is incorrect and not according to spec.

That is also not how Resolve has implemented the 5.1 Film Buss.

There is a pretty straightforward method to test:

Image

Are the two of you using the same software I am?
Resolve Studio 14.3 | Merging VAD 2.0.33517 | Merging HAPI
[*]MacPro 2x Quad 2.26GHz Xeon | 14GB RAM | OS X.11.6 (15G19009)
NVIDIA Quadro K620 (346.03.15f12/CUDA 8.0.83) | IntensityPro 4K (10.9.7)
[*]MBP Quad 2.3GHz | 16GB RAM | OS X.12.6 (16G1212)
Offline

Dermot Shane

  • Posts: 1093
  • Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:48 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostTue Jan 30, 2018 7:49 am

yes unfortuantly we are hobbled with the same disfunctional audio tools that you are

and L R C Lfe Ls Rs is correct layout for DCP and 99% of studio / distb / network deliverables contracts
Offline

Reynaud Venter

  • Posts: 347
  • Joined: Sun May 28, 2017 9:34 am

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostTue Jan 30, 2018 8:11 am

Dermot Shane wrote:yes unfortuantly we are hobbled with the same disfunctional audio tools that you are
Resolve's 5.1 Film Buss channel order matches the implementation within ProTools (where the Film ordering scheme is still the default), and that of several other audio workstations.

Some workstations designate it as 5.1 Film Alternative to differentiate it from the SMPTE/ITU 5.1 specification.

Notice the other Buss types Resolve provides (which matches that of other audio workstations),
and notice the channel ordering:
LCR
LCRS
LCRSS

So, Resolve's implementation is not unusual in the slightest, nor is it dysfunctional, neither is it hobbled. It is within spec.

It may seem incorrect to non-audio people, but any trained audio engineer would be instantly at home with Resolve's implementation.

and L R C Lfe Ls Rs is correct layout for DCP and 99% of studio / distb / network deliverables contracts
Yes, broadcast uses the SMPTE/ITU ordering scheme, which is the only official standard adopted by all standards bodies.

The reason for the SMPTE channel ordering scheme is because of channel pairing (L/R, C/LFE, Ls/Rs), in order to match the L/R channel pairing of stereo, to avoid channels being played back incorrectly and to prevent channels from potentially being out of phase.

The 5.1 Film channel ordering (L, C, R, Ls, Rs, LFE) never was standard in the way that the current SMPTE/ITU standard is, but was used by Dolby so it was widely adopted. But, the 5.1 Film channel ordering scheme is part of the ITU 775 spec (it’s just not a SMPTE standard), as is the 7.1 Film ordering scheme. So even the ITU considers the 5.1 Film and 7.1 Film channel ordering schemes a standard.

Of course, Dolby now regards 5.1 as legacy, and now uses the SMPTE/ITU channel ordering for Atmos and the RMU's MADI inputs.

But, several sound libraries (e.g. Boom Library) still use the 5.0 Film channel ordering scheme as standardised by the ITU.

In implementation the Film channel ordering also makes more sense, much like the ITU spec for NHK 22.2 in implementation isn’t necessarily workflow friendly (hence some 22.2 workflows use a custom channel ordering that differs from the deliverable channel ordering scheme).
Resolve Studio 14.3 | Merging VAD 2.0.33517 | Merging HAPI
[*]MacPro 2x Quad 2.26GHz Xeon | 14GB RAM | OS X.11.6 (15G19009)
NVIDIA Quadro K620 (346.03.15f12/CUDA 8.0.83) | IntensityPro 4K (10.9.7)
[*]MBP Quad 2.3GHz | 16GB RAM | OS X.12.6 (16G1212)
Offline

franciscovaldez

  • Posts: 34
  • Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2012 4:52 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostTue Jan 30, 2018 3:08 pm

I did some tests exporting a DCP and a quicktime clip with both settings.

1. When I export 5.1 film and reimport into Resolve and my DCP software the channel mapping appears to be L, R, C, LFE, Ls, Rs.

2. When I export the regular 5.1 and reimport the mapping appears to be L, C, R, LFE, Ls, Rs.

It wasn't a thorough test (I wouldn't know how to perform one). I just focused my attention to a beep on the waveform that originally was on C (3rd) channel on my 6 track timeline. When exported and imported back using regular 5.1, it moves to the 2nd channel.

For some reason when I open in quicktime and click info it shows both being the same as 5.1 (L R C LFE Ls Rs)
Offline

Andrew Kolakowski

  • Posts: 3079
  • Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:20 am

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostTue Jan 30, 2018 3:32 pm

There is a mess with those standards (some of them are not standards?) and this is why you should rather use some container like MOV which allows you to tag each channel (or have channel config written as comment), always double check your workflow and manually assign channels. You can also use mono tracks for each channel which is quite "safe" way.
I would say: L, R, C, LFE, Ls ,Rs is the most common.
Offline

Andrew Kolakowski

  • Posts: 3079
  • Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:20 am

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostTue Jan 30, 2018 3:36 pm

franciscovaldez wrote:I did some tests exporting a DCP and a quicktime clip with both settings.

1. When I export 5.1 film and reimport into Resolve and my DCP software the channel mapping appears to be L, R, C, LFE, Ls, Rs.

2. When I export the regular 5.1 and reimport the mapping appears to be L, C, R, LFE, Ls, Rs.

It wasn't a thorough test (I wouldn't know how to perform one). I just focused my attention to a beep on the waveform that originally was on C (3rd) channel on my 6 track timeline. When exported and imported back using regular 5.1, it moves to the 2nd channel.

For some reason when I open in quicktime and click info it shows both being the same as 5.1 (L R C LFE Ls Rs)


QT won't know which channel is which- it reads flagging which previous software set and shows you this. A software can use some "actual data" layout, but write wrong info into headers and this is enough for file to be later misinterpreted by other apps. There are so many bugs in current apps that you shouldn't trust them at all. Always check by eye/ear :)
Offline

franciscovaldez

  • Posts: 34
  • Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2012 4:52 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostTue Jan 30, 2018 4:13 pm

Andrew Kolakowski wrote:
QT won't know which channel is which- it reads flagging which previous software set and shows you this. A software can use some "actual data" layout, but write wrong info into headers and this is enough for file to be later misinterpreted by other apps. There are so many bugs in current apps that you shouldn't trust them at all. Always check by eye/ear :)


Annoying that I have to check and recheck something that is out of my level of expertise (audio)... It's kind of scary that people invest a lot of time and money to mix and deliver proper audio, to have someone in my position screwing things up for a delivery because the finishing software workflow is open to interpretation or not straightforward enough.

Thanks :)
Offline

Dermot Shane

  • Posts: 1093
  • Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:48 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostTue Jan 30, 2018 4:49 pm

franciscovaldez wrote:
Andrew Kolakowski wrote:t's kind of scary that people invest a lot of time and money to mix and deliver proper audio, to have someone in my position screwing things up for a delivery because the finishing software workflow is open to interpretation or not straightforward enough.

my thoughts as well,

Despite what ProToolz says or does, ALL my deliverables are L R C Lfe Ls Rs,
the distb and the QC houses obviously do not care what ProToolz says or does either....
that Resolve cannot manage to make this simple task happen flawlessly is, well, lets be polite.... some what suboptimal....
Offline

Andrew Kolakowski

  • Posts: 3079
  • Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:20 am

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostTue Jan 30, 2018 5:23 pm

Don't use 1x 5.1 track.
6x mono with tagging for each track is way more robust. Export from Resolve 6x mono in your preferred order and if it doesn't tag tracks just do it manually in QT PRO or Switch, so you know this is correct and checked.

I not only tag my tracks, but also put channels order as comment metadata inside MOV, so there are automated and human ways to verify this info. As I mentioned already many times- metadata is so under-used and under-valued. Correct metadata is such great thing in many cases.
Offline

EvanAnthony

  • Posts: 97
  • Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2015 6:19 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostFri Feb 02, 2018 5:44 pm

waltervolpatto wrote:Something i did for 15 years with ease now seems an engineer endeavor.

1) import 6 mono track give to me by the mix
2) put file "left" on track 1, "right" on track 2, then C,Lfe,Ls,Rs.
3) pipe track 1 to output 1, track 2 to output 2 and so on.

Play.

It was that simple, has been that simple for 15 years (quantel, nucoda, baselight, lustre, mistika, all have a very simple mapping).

I do not need to do mixing, i get the track already mixed: how in the good earth (hell) do i acheve this in resolve 14?

Did this ever get figured out? I'm with you and want it simple for us not mixing at all.
Offline

Glenn Sakatch

  • Posts: 200
  • Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 5:36 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostSun Feb 04, 2018 6:38 pm

The issue I've been having...(aside from the convoluted workflows in 14)...are that if I do the timeline channels in delivery..ch 1 mono ch 2 mono...etc with the first 12 being 5.1 mix and M&E tracks, and the track 13 a stereo mix and track 14 a m&e mix and track 15 a described video mix (tracks 13,14,15 all set to stereo) . I spen what seems like forever setting this up in the delivery page, but half the time the audio tab makes everything after track 8 mono track 8 duplicates. It won't allow me to call up track 9 as a mono and track 13 as a stereo output. It just keeps everything at track 8mono. If I relaunch resolve...sometimes it corrects itself, sometimes not. If I I get it to look properl in my output setting
Gs, and render out the movie..20 percent of the time it renders incorrectly. If I go call up the delivery page, and recall the output, more times than not all that setup work I did is gone, and back to ch's 1-6 or 1-7, are set to mono and everything else is set to ch 8 mono again.

Put on top of this a set of outputs with some wanting 5.1 and stereo, some only 5.1, some 5.1mix and 5.1 m&e....and it becomes a total nightmare, with no idea what is actually going to be output.
Offline

Dermot Shane

  • Posts: 1093
  • Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2014 6:48 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostMon Feb 05, 2018 2:36 am

Glen.. still have your DS licence around?

i've been linking to DPX output from Resolve, adding audio tracks and exporting from DS

would love to see v12's edit timeline router back sooner rather than later, in the meanwhile i've had to stop using Resolve for mastering
Offline

Glenn Sakatch

  • Posts: 200
  • Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 5:36 pm

Re: Simple 5.1 audio mapping

PostMon Feb 05, 2018 10:22 pm

Hey Dermot, i do still have DS running. Whats the rule for dpx realtime agian? 444 sequence?
My issue is so many people want ProRes outputs as well, so sooner or later i have to move it over to a Mac box.
Every now and then i get called if using my Mirizon codec.
Previous

Return to DaVinci Resolve

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Piotr Wozniacki, Roen Davis and 18 guests