Vimeo & YouTube HDR

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timbutt2

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Vimeo & YouTube HDR

PostTue Dec 05, 2017 12:16 am

I'm looking to get some information about the Vimeo HDR guidelines and DaVinci Resolve.

https://help.vimeo.com/hc/en-us/article ... HDR-videos

During the upload process, we will detect that your video is HDR based on metadata in your source file.


There's an aspect that is a bit unclear, and what is exactly what is generating the metadata that tells Vimeo the video is HDR. I look under the current Vimeo Export Presets in DaVinci Resolve and see nothing that clearly tells you that that metadata will be exported.

This may come down to Blackmagic Design updating Resolve to include these new settings for exporting a file for Vimeo 4K HDR. The new preset would thus then export in a H.265 video file that has the HDR metadata included so that Vimeo knows.

Otherwise, I'm curious if anyone here has had experience exporting and uploading HDR video to Vimeo? What were the settings that you used?

EDIT: Presets for both Vimeo and YouTube need to be in app. Beyond that, Netflix. The Deliver Page needs to acknowledge all the deliverable formats appropriately,
"Movies are not watched. They are an encounter with a life's experience not your own." - Tim Buttner (timbutt2)

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timbutt2

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Re: Vimeo & YouTube HDR

PostWed Dec 06, 2017 5:56 am

BUMP: Due to the recent edit.

I'm asking for presets for Netflix, Vimeo, and YouTube to be in the software.
"Movies are not watched. They are an encounter with a life's experience not your own." - Tim Buttner (timbutt2)

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Geert Geerits

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Re: Vimeo & YouTube HDR

PostWed Dec 06, 2017 8:17 am

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Piotr Wozniacki

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Re: Vimeo & YouTube HDR

PostWed Dec 06, 2017 9:32 am


While we're at the article again, does anyone here who grades for HDR know a good answer to the Author's doubts on usefulness of working with "HDR mode" enabled in node(s)? I for one still do not - and simply never use it, but perhaps some good soul from BMD could address this? After all, this option has been put there for a purpose (I hope?)... Just what the purpose is, please?

Piotr
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Andrew Kolakowski

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Re: Vimeo & YouTube HDR

PostWed Dec 06, 2017 10:24 am

If you have project set to e.g. Rec.2100 ST048 then MP4 made with Vimeo preset will be flagged as in project setting, but only on container level (not in h264 headers). File is also 8bit which is not what you want for HDR. I would never use Vimeo presets anyway. Resolve compressed formats output are crap.

Latest Resolve does flagging (at least for some containers/formats) based on project settings. If you have color space set to Rec.2100 ST048 (or HLG) it will be properly reflected in exported eg. ProRes, DNxHR, Cineform, Uncompressed etc MOV file.
This should be enough (as minimum) for Youtube or Vimeo to detect file as HDR. This still won't have all detailed information, like mastering display info. For this you still need correctly encoded h265 or use (at least for youtube) use their tool to inject metadata into MKV container.

Based on Viemeo article they do want properly flagged 10bit files, with display mastering info, so in this case I would advice to export some 10bit intermediate file (ProRes, DNxHR, Cineform, v210 etc) and use x265 at high bitrate. Hybrid is 1 option if not you have info on BM forum how to do it with ffmpeg.
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waltervolpatto

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Re: Vimeo & YouTube HDR

PostWed Dec 06, 2017 3:11 pm

Andrew Kolakowski wrote:If you have project set to e.g. Rec.2100 ST048 then MP4 made with Vimeo preset will be flagged as in project setting, but only on container level (not in h264 headers). File is also 8bit which is not what you want for HDR. I would never use Vimeo presets anyway. Resolve compressed formats output are crap.

Latest Resolve does flagging (at least for some containers/formats) based on project settings. If you have color space set to Rec.2100 ST048 (or HLG) it will be properly reflected in exported eg. ProRes, DNxHR, Cineform, Uncompressed etc MOV file.
This should be enough (as minimum) for Youtube or Vimeo to detect file as HDR. This still won't have all detailed information, like mastering display info. For this you still need correctly encoded h265 or use (at least for youtube) use their tool to inject metadata into MKV container.

Based on Viemeo article they do want properly flagged 10bit files, with display mastering info, so in this case I would advice to export some 10bit intermediate file (ProRes, DNxHR, Cineform, v210 etc) and use x265 at high bitrate. Hybrid is 1 option if not you have info on BM forum how to do it with ffmpeg.


The problem is that the timeline color might be another color space like Alexa and still generating a HDR: how do you flag it then?

Beyer have a checkbox in the delivery page
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Andrew Kolakowski

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Re: Vimeo & YouTube HDR

PostWed Dec 06, 2017 5:07 pm

You can only flag formats which are properly recognised by some spec and also "other" software. MOV on contains level (same as h264/h265 on elementary stream level) has fixed number of possible flagging and only widely accepted formats are there. This currently includes HDR10 (ST048) and HLG. It's not about flagging any possible format out there, but those which are used as final delivery and are widely recognised.
This is also why this "simple" flagging (primaries, transfer function and matrix) is not enough and the best what you can do is to go over h265 which does also allow you to use mastering display info, which is more detailed.
Youtube "own" way of flagging MKV files is a "hack" and response to the missing widely accepted (outside h265) way of detailed flagging HDR files.
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Cary Knoop

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Re: Vimeo & YouTube HDR

PostWed Dec 06, 2017 6:09 pm

Andrew Kolakowski wrote:Based on Viemeo article they do want properly flagged 10bit files, with display mastering info, so in this case I would advice to export some 10bit intermediate file (ProRes, DNxHR, Cineform, v210 etc) and use x265 at high bitrate.

I agree, that is the most practical approach right now.

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