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Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 4:53 am
by Krishna Pada
A Fairlight question.

How does one render out L, R, C, LFE, LS, RS wave files separately from a 5.1 interleaved audio file?

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 6:05 am
by Reynaud Venter
Have a look at page 2451 of the Manual.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 9:30 am
by Vit Reiter
Reynaud Venter wrote:Have a look at page 2451 of the Manual.

In my manual it is page 2522.

Simply, check the checkbox Render one track per channel checkbox on Deliver page/Render Settings/Audio.

If you’re exporting a single track, this checkbox lets you specify whether you want to export each channel as an individual track in the structure of the exported file.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 11:36 am
by Krishna Pada
Vit Reiter wrote:
Reynaud Venter wrote:Have a look at page 2451 of the Manual.

In my manual it is page 2522.

Simply, check the checkbox Render one track per channel checkbox on Deliver page/Render Settings/Audio.

If you’re exporting a single track, this checkbox lets you specify whether you want to export each channel as an individual track in the structure of the exported file.


How do I know which audio is which channel?

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 11:55 am
by Andrew Kolakowski
Does it have _1, _2 etc naming after export? This most likely matches your track order in the project.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:55 pm
by Reynaud Venter
Vit Reiter wrote:In my manual it is page 2522.
That's describing different functionality.

Page 2451 of the Manual, describes rendering discrete broadcast wave files from the Fairlight Timeline, no need to use the Render page.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 3:24 pm
by Vit Reiter
Reynaud Venter wrote:
Vit Reiter wrote:In my manual it is page 2522.
That's describing different functionality.

Page 2451 of the Manual, describes rendering discrete broadcast wave files from the Fairlight Timeline, no need to use the Render page.

Can I export audio channels from Fairlight without Deliver page?
Page 2451 talks about Pan control or not?

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 3:29 pm
by Reynaud Venter
Vit Reiter wrote:Can I export audio channels from Fairlight without Deliver page?
Yes.

Page 2451 talks about Pan control or not?
Panner is not discussed.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 3:40 pm
by Vit Reiter
Reynaud Venter wrote:
Vit Reiter wrote:Can I export audio channels from Fairlight without Deliver page?
Yes.

Really? Can do you tell us how?
I can not see it on page 2451.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 3:58 pm
by Reynaud Venter
Vit Reiter wrote:I can not see it on page 2451.
Appears the source of the confusion is that the August 2018 Manual on my iPad (the one I actually reference) differs to the August 2018 Manual version in the Applications folder on my Mac.

One version includes a description of the “Commands For Bouncing Audio“ on page 2451, and the other includes it on page 2455.

My error for not clearly indicating the relevant section title I was referring to, which would have avoided this tangent.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:59 am
by Krishna Pada
Andrew Kolakowski wrote:Does it have _1, _2 etc naming after export? This most likely matches your track order in the project.


Unfortunately., going by the manual and clicking the "separate channel" option does not yield anything. Even after render, the folder remains blank.

Unclicking the "separate channel" option yields an interleaved file, the name is same as the project.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 6:01 am
by Krishna Pada
Reynaud Venter wrote:
Vit Reiter wrote:Can I export audio channels from Fairlight without Deliver page?
Yes.



How? Can't find anywhere in the manual.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 10:09 am
by Andrew Kolakowski
Krishna Pada wrote:
Andrew Kolakowski wrote:Does it have _1, _2 etc naming after export? This most likely matches your track order in the project.


Unfortunately., going by the manual and clicking the "separate channel" option does not yield anything. Even after render, the folder remains blank.

Unclicking the "separate channel" option yields an interleaved file, the name is same as the project.


Probably this won't work with wav export.
It's most likely for MOV or MXF containers and forces rendering many channels as separate tracks.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 10:50 am
by Jean Claude
Hello,

You can test:

You have a Main 5.1 format.

Farlight TAB => Timeline menu => Bounce Mix to Track and select in new popup => Destination: New Track

You get a mix from ALL your audio tracks in 5.1 (like the bus format) => 6 audios, 1 per channel in a new track

Next go back to Media TAB:
You have a new audio clip like "FL_MAIN etc ... etc ..." which has 6 channels format .Wav, FPS = Fps project, etc ...

Right click on it, select "Open File Location":
In the directory of the HDD (the first HDD, the same as for the cache and gallery) you will have a directory 'CAPTURE' and inside you will have 6 files WAV 24 bits 48Khz => 1 per track
:)

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 1:10 pm
by Krishna Pada
Jean Claude wrote:Hello,

You can test:

You have a Main 5.1 format.

Farlight TAB => Timeline menu => Bounce Mix to Track and select in new popup => Destination: New Track

You get a mix from ALL your audio tracks in 5.1 (like the bus format) => 6 audios, 1 per channel in a new track

Next go back to Media TAB:
You have a new audio clip like "FL_MAIN etc ... etc ..." which has 6 channels format .Wav, FPS = Fps project, etc ...

Right click on it, select "Open File Location":
In the directory of the HDD (the first HDD, the same as for the cache and gallery) you will have a directory 'CAPTURE' and inside you will have 6 files WAV 24 bits 48Khz => 1 per track
:)


Looks like this is the way. But when I do this:
Farlight TAB => Timeline menu => Bounce Mix to Track and select in new popup => No popup appears :(

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 2:59 pm
by Vit Reiter
Krishna Pada wrote:
Vit Reiter wrote:
Reynaud Venter wrote:Have a look at page 2451 of the Manual.

In my manual it is page 2522.

Simply, check the checkbox Render one track per channel checkbox on Deliver page/Render Settings/Audio.

If you’re exporting a single track, this checkbox lets you specify whether you want to export each channel as an individual track in the structure of the exported file.


How do I know which audio is which channel?

Channel layout is the same as the channel layout in the timeline.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:38 pm
by Dermot Shane
as i have to get shows through QC, my answer has been to use another software, i cannot afford the massive amount of fail points in the so called "workflow" discribed

this is really nuttzzzz when all that is needed is v12.5's track router put back, that worked reliably everytime with next to zero fail points

and you know for sure what is going where every time....

very glad i have options, the only two time we tried useing Resolve they were the only two QC fails for Audio mapping in the last few deacdes.... and i didn't do the deliverables, my clients did after reading the manual and reading posts here... glad to say it was against my advice to even try, very glad i did not advise them to use any version of Resolve after 12.5 for deliverables

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 6:11 pm
by Nathan Morgan
One thing that I don't know if it has been mentioned is that if you are using Timeline Tracks to render out your audio deiscrete it might be easiest to spilt up that audio file by going to clip attributes and changing it from a 5.1 mix to 6 separate mono tracks.

The bounce track method would work. As would setting up individual track outputs from the Audio Only preset on the delivery page. Then if you are looking for individual wav files you will need to setup separate renders for each wav or if you just need a single wav with discrete channels as mentioned above you can use the "Render on track per channel option".

I have delivered 100s of hours of content out of DaVinci and have no problems passing QC. For anyone having trouble understanding how audio works in DaVinci 15 I highly recommend the Intro to resolve book that blackmagic published. It goes over Clip Attributes, Audio Routing and the Delivery Page in a clear and concise manner that even the most inexperienced user will understand!

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 4:40 am
by Krishna Pada
Nathan Morgan wrote:One thing that I don't know if it has been mentioned is that if you are using Timeline Tracks to render out your audio deiscrete it might be easiest to spilt up that audio file by going to clip attributes and changing it from a 5.1 mix to 6 separate mono tracks.



This "easiest" thing is not permitted in Resolve Fairlight. Interleaved Stereo tracks can be split into 2 separate channels, but alas, 5.1 interleaved cannot be split in 6 channels to facilitate separate channel outs. Strange, but true.
Bouncing doesn't really work also.

If someone can give me a clear workflow, I'll be indebted.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 5:43 am
by Reynaud Venter
Krishna Pada wrote:Bouncing doesn't really work also.
Bouncing works fine. In use daily.

Primary IMF deliverables produced via the Deliver page, ancillary Broadcast Wave Print Masters produced via the “Bounce Mix to Track” command.

Zero issues producing deliverables with Resolve.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:28 am
by Nathan Morgan
In order to change the clip config you need to go into the clip attributes and change it from a 5.1 file to 6 mono tracks.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:38 am
by Reynaud Venter
Nathan Morgan wrote:In order to change the clip config you need to go into the clip attributes and change it from a 5.1 file to 6 mono tracks.
Specifying the Audio Track Type as Mono in the New Timeline Settings, will automatically create 6 Mono Tracks on the Timeline from a 5.1 Interleaved Audio file, dragged on to the Timeline from the Media Pool.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:43 am
by Krishna Pada
Reynaud Venter wrote:
Nathan Morgan wrote:In order to change the clip config you need to go into the clip attributes and change it from a 5.1 file to 6 mono tracks.
Specifying the Audio Track Type as Mono in the New Timeline Settings, will automatically create 6 Mono Tracks on the Timeline from a 5.1 Interleaved Audio file, dragged on to the Timeline from the Media Pool.


It doesn't. Suppose you create 6 mono tracks in a new timeline and import 5.1 interleaved into this timeline, 6 blank mono tracks are pushed downwards and a new 5.1 interleaved track is automatically created above!

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 7:00 am
by Reynaud Venter
Krishna Pada wrote:It doesn't
Operation is functional on my systems, as described in my previous post -
here with an 8 channel interleaved source.

Clips.gif
Clips.gif (89.74 KiB) Viewed 1039 times

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 3:43 pm
by Nathan Morgan
Reynaud,

It looks like you source is not interleaved, you can tell the this because your audio channels read 8. This leads me to suspect you have a file with discrete audio.

Krishna,

If you file is truly interleaved you will need to right click on it in the media pool and select clip attributes. There is an audio tab along the top of that window. Under the audio tab you can change the channel from being 5.1 to 6 mono channels.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 4:01 pm
by Reynaud Venter
Nathan Morgan wrote:It looks like you source is not interleaved
Source contains a single stream (i.e. interleaved or “polyphonic” file), and not 8 streams.

Confirmed via MediaInfo, WaveAgent, BWF MetaEdit, and Baton.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 4:04 pm
by Nathan Morgan
Reynaud Venter wrote:Source contains a single stream (i.e. interleaved or “polyphonic” file), and not 8 streams.

Confirmed via MediaInfo, WaveAgent, BWF MetaEdit, and Baton.


In that case it might just be that DaVinci is interpreting it as mono tracks. Can you post a screenshot of you clip attributes? That might help us solve this mystery!

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 4:12 pm
by Reynaud Venter
62338C0C-40F3-42F1-93D1-F129FFC20D98.png
62338C0C-40F3-42F1-93D1-F129FFC20D98.png (147.38 KiB) Viewed 1000 times

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 4:35 pm
by Nathan Morgan
Reynaud,

Very strange I am unable to recreate this behavior on my system. Perhaps there is a setting that I am not aware of that allows this? I am seeing exactly what Krishna described where when you drop a 5.1 or 7.1 track onto the timeline it creates a new 5.1 or 7.1 audio track. The manual also seems to lead me to believe that this is the default behavior.

If there is a way to enable the behavior you have demonstrated please enlighten us!

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:10 pm
by Krishna Pada
Reynaud Venter wrote:
62338C0C-40F3-42F1-93D1-F129FFC20D98.png


Unfortunately this doesn't work. Are you sure your source file is Interleaved 7.2? Probably they are 7.2 discrete channels in one folder.

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:17 pm
by Reynaud Venter
Krishna Pada wrote:Are you sure your source file is Interleaved 7.2? Probably they are 7.2 discrete channels in one folder.
Single interleaved Broadcast Wave file.

Specifying the correct channel configuration in the Clip Attributes in the Media Pool, and then dragging the source to the Timeline will definitely place each embedded channel on a dedicated Timeline Track.

Is that procedure functional on your system?

Re: Discrete audio for each channel from interleaved 5.1?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:36 pm
by Nathan Morgan
For the life of me I cannot recreate the behavior you are describing when using a clip that has a 7.1 audio channel. A 7.1 or 5.1 channel seems to always drop into a 7.1 or 5.1 audio track. The only way I am able to recreate your behavior is to change my channel config to like this:

Audio Tracks.PNG
Audio Tracks.PNG (56.97 KiB) Viewed 965 times


Also, Krishna, when I am talking about setting clip attributes this is what I am referring to.

If there is a way to force a 7.1 channel clip to mono channels without setting the clip attributes I would love to know how it is done.