Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

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Stefan Jungreithmaier

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Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostThu Oct 02, 2014 10:57 am

Hi!

I bought a new HP Dreamcolor Z27x and a Quadro K620.

All the Adobe software works well with 10-Bit color depth, but in Davinci Resolve Light 11.1 I see 8-bit zebra stripes in my 10-bit test chart.

Somebody want to have a look? And tell me, if I need to switch something on inside the program.

Thanks!
Stefan
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Stefan Jungreithmaier

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostMon Oct 06, 2014 5:28 pm

anyone please?
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Frank Glencairn

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostMon Oct 06, 2014 5:51 pm

What are 8bit Zebra stripes?
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Chris Kenny

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostMon Oct 06, 2014 9:15 pm

Are you doing 10-bit output of the GUI directly through the Quadro? As far as I know, the Resolve GUI doesn't display images in 10-bit. If you want 10-bit live output from Resolve, you need a monitor connected via a DeckLink or UltraStudio.

Of course Resolve renders in 32-bit float; this only applies to monitoring.
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Stefan Jungreithmaier

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostTue Oct 07, 2014 8:51 am

Hey Frank, hey Chris!

I was following that guide http://www.tedlansingphotography.com/blog/?p=287

And it works very well for Photoshop CS 6 and Premiere CC 2014.2, but I see those 8-bit stripes in the grey gradiant in Davinci Resolve 11.1 and After Effects CC 2014.1

Okay, I think I get the point of Resolve showing me 8-Bit, but processing 10-Bit. Sad thing is I wanted to use it for color grading, but it seems to require aditional hardware to show 10-Bit in the GUI :?

So I will go with Premiere instead... or is there some workaround? It would be great :roll:
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Frank Glencairn

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostTue Oct 07, 2014 6:00 pm

Stefan Jungreithmaier wrote:Sad thing is I wanted to use it for color grading, but it seems to require aditional hardware to show 10-Bit in the GUI :?


The GUI viewer is not suitable for grading with any hardware (it's not even color managed), cause Resolve is a professional CC software, that is made to be used with a closed loop video monitoring solution - the only way to guaranty color fidelity.
Get an BM I/O card or box, connect you Dreamcolor to it and call it a day.
For a GUI, any cheap monitor does the trick.

Maybe you can sell your old Quadro K620, since it is not the exactly the best card for Resolve/Premiere and get a much better and faster 780TI or 980 instead. Actually you can buy two used 780TI now for the price of a new 980 - that wold probably double your render speed in Premiere and Resolve.

What made you buy that odd K620 in the first place?
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostTue Oct 07, 2014 7:24 pm

Hi Frank!

I was up to use 10-Bit. So I went for the recommended Quadro Cards by nVidia. I use the K620 since a week and I could send it back, if I want to.

Okay, which Blackmagic device is the cheapest and would fit my needs?
It should show me 10-Bit Color Output in Resolve Light 11.1 and the Adobe CC 2014 Programs like Photoshop, Premiere and After Effects in 2560 x 1440 on my Windows 8.1 PC.

I also ordered a GTX 970 to use the K620 together for computing, which should work well, when it arrives.

Thanks for all your advices!
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Frank Glencairn

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostTue Oct 07, 2014 10:21 pm

Send the Quadro back as long as you can, it will slow down your performance. It's like a handbrake for your 970.

What you want is something like the Black Magic DeckLink Mini Monitor as I/O device.
The mini Monitor is for SD and HD. If you want 2k/4k you need a DeckLink Studio 4K
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 08, 2014 3:27 am

Frank Glencairn wrote:The GUI viewer is not suitable for grading with any hardware (it's not even color managed), cause Resolve is a professional CC software, that is made to be used with a closed loop video monitoring solution - the only way to guaranty color fidelity.

I agree 100% with Frank. The GUI monitor is too OS-dependent, and you never know when somebody will bump or otherwise change the OS's own internal management of displays, particularly for color temperature or brightness. You need a video card outside of the OS feeding a monitor calibrated separately for best results. This is covered in chapter 2 of Alexis Van Hurkman's Color Correction Handbook, and also in the first couple of sections of the Resolve manual.

Most cheap, uncalibrated computer monitors are so far off from reality, I think it's a folly to trust them for anything but giving you a vague approximation of what's in the picture. They're great for the GUI; not so great for image adjustment.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 08, 2014 3:49 am

Frank Glencairn wrote:Send the Quadro back as long as you can, it will slow down your performance. It's like a handbrake for your 970.

What you want is something like the Black Magic DeckLink Mini Monitor as I/O device.
The mini Monitor is for SD and HD. If you want 2k/4k you need a DeckLink Studio 4K


Frank, I agree with your last paragraph but the OP only needs an Out card, not an I/O card (eg: Decklink mini-monitor) to monitor in 10bit, so long as he has a 10bit monitor which will accept a 10bit signal through HDMI. However, but I disagree with your statement about the Quadro K620 not being powerful enough. I use a K600 with Resolve 11.1 on a z87 Haswell 4Ghz system and it is more than powerful enough for all my HD 4:2:2 finishing needs. The newer K620 has approximately twice the number of CUDA cores and RAM whilst still consuming only about 45 watts of power.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 08, 2014 6:43 am

The GUI is not colour accurate, as BM reps have stated numerous times on this very forum.

Dreamcolor monitors take 10bit RGB I believe, and I understand the newer 4K BM IO devices can do RGB over HDMI.

Confirm with BM which device has 10bit RGB over HDMI, buy one, plug it in, calibrate the Dreamcolor and enjoy. Ignore the obvious amateur.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 08, 2014 8:54 am

@Jon
Interessting thing about 8 bits and 14bits.cube. I don´t understand it entirely - do you have some describing links or could describe it to me?

@everyone
Assuming I would buy the DeckLink and use it just with the GTX 970:

On the GUI Display (GTX 970 connected) would be Davinci Resolve, Premiere, After Effects like I know it with buttons, timeline and everything.
On the Dreamcolor Display (DeckLink connected) would be only the current video from the timeline without any GUI, right?
I ask that because I don´t really understand that I/O cards/boxes. Do they behave like usual graphics cards like nVidias or do they only show input/video, when I start "supported" programs? Is the DeckLink screen black, when I only run Firefox for example?

Thanks for all your help! I really appreciate it!
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 08, 2014 9:14 am

Simplest way to view 10bit 4:2:2 video out of Resolve is to purchase and install the Decklink 'mini-monitor' ($175) available either as a PCIe card with SDI and HDMI outputs or a portable 'box' with Thunderbolt in and SDI/HDMI out. You could also add the 'HD Link' box later which takes the Decklink's SDI output and converts it to 10bit 4:4:4 for either Display Port or DVI connections to your monitor.

So long as your Dreamcolor accepts 10bit through HDMI, all you need is the mini-monitor card and you'll see a 10bit picture on your monitor when you play a clip on Resolve's timeline. Other than that, your screen is black. Resolve 'lite' may be free but getting it work for you certainly is not! Great BMD marketing that...

PS: Although your K620 is capable of 10bit from the Display Port, Resolve unfortunately does not port video to the Quadro's DP at 10bit. You may see 10bit from other software such as some Adobe products, written for Quadros.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 08, 2014 10:31 am

@Craig
Maybe Resolve 12 will support 10-bit Displayports ;)
The HP Z27x supports 10-Bit over HDMI. But it won´t draw the Resolve GUI Monitor into 10-Bit over HDMI, right?

Another question: Will the 1080p i/o cards output a 4k timeline in 1080p over HDMI? Or does it convert 1080@60p to 1080@30p?
The website of the Intensity Pro says HD Down Conversion - Software based down conversion during video playback.

Is that what I want or will the video be "out of range"?
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 08, 2014 7:32 pm

Yes, maybe Resolve 12 (and a lot of other software) will be updated to take advantage of 10bit Quadro Display Ports but in the interim, we must buy the BMD hardware to run the free software! Still, when I was active the the Broadcast Television television industry in the '90s, DaVinci Resolve was around $80K so a the cost of a few Decklink cards is a small price to pay.

You are correct, the Declink mini-monitor will only operate 24/25p or 50/60i resolution, not 50/60P and this could be a limitation for some projects. My monitor's native display is 1920 x 1200 and I have it set to 1:1 so when I view HD material, I get the black bars top & bottom. It is essential that your monitor does not 'compensate' for material outside the display range otherwise it may add processing artifacts which are not present in the video material. I'm not sure how other BMD hardware processes 4K material for non-4K monitors so I cannot answer your 'out of range' question.

As far as the 50/60i display limitation goes with the Decklink mini-monitor, I shoot quite a lot of 50P (as I'm in PAL land) but I always transcode it to ProRes 422 using a PTS conversion so I get really smooth 50% slow motion 25P. (I normally shoot 50i for better motion and transcode it to ProRes 422 'de-interlaced' 25P so I set up Resolve only for 25fps.) My workstation will run ProRes or DNxHD 422 or 444 (and even DPX sequences) on Resolve very smoothly at 25fps with a couple of nodes up on the Quadro K600 GPU.

I should add too that quality 'reference monitoring' is essential in any video setup. Along with a smaller dedicated display for Resolve's scopes, your Rec709 monitor is probably more important than even your camera or your NLE. Without being able to accurately 'see' what you've actually shot, you are really flying blind. Your GUI display has too many variables to be relied upon. With Resolve installed and the Decklink feeding your Rec709 monitor, there is a direct and unmolested path between your video files and your eyes! It was easier and cheaper for me to configure Resolve for accurate 10bit monitoring than to configure my NLE and since I installed the Decklink mini-monitor and purchased a 10bit colour managed IPS display with an accurate Rec709 preset six month ago, I finally see my HD pictures the way I though I'd shot them, for the first time in two years!
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 08, 2014 9:47 pm

Thanks for the great reply Craig!

But what´s a PTS conversion? :)
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 08, 2014 10:25 pm

PTS is short for Post Time Stamp and it's a way of integrating a speed change during a transcode. For example, the camera I use to shoot 50P, records 8bit LongGOP 4:2:0 50P at a reasonable 28Mbps but before editing, I transcode this to ProRes 4:2:2. (occasionally, DNxHD) I select: 'speed change - 25fps' plus the codec I want to transcode to and this results in a very smooth 50% intra-frame 25P.

Some NLE timelines may also provide this feature but as I'm transcoding all compressed LongGOP material prior to edit, I like to integrate PTS and/or de-interlacing (and even sometimes, import LUTs) during the transcode.

PS: The transcoder I use is ClipToolz new 'Convert' V2 which I've found is very fast, very accurate and comes with a great set of scopes too. see: http://www.cliptoolz.com/convert.html
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostThu Oct 09, 2014 4:31 am

Craig Marshall wrote:...However, but I disagree with your statement about the Quadro K620 not being powerful enough. I use a K600 with Resolve 11.1 on a z87 Haswell 4Ghz system and it is more than powerful enough for all my HD 4:2:2 finishing needs. The newer K620 has approximately twice the number of CUDA cores and RAM whilst still consuming only about 45 watts of power.


If you are happy with it, good for you.
Personally I think it's an utter waste of money, if you don't need it for an application that needs double precision, which is not the case in any video program.

Let's compare a K620 with a 780ti

384 cuda cores vs 2880 cuda cores
2GB of DDR3 memory vs 3GB of DDR5
128-bit memory bus vs 384-bit

That makes a huge difference, especially when you work with files that are larger than HD.
Putting the K620 together with the 780ti in one computer means, that Resolve can only access 2GB of the 3GB ram of the 780, and that probably at a slower speed, cause it has to wait for the slow DDR3 ram of the Quadro - don't know if the same goes for the cuda cores, but it probably does.

So running just a 780ti (or better two used ones, for the price of one new) makes the most sense.

@Stefan

The scaling is done by Resolve on the fly, so it's a no brainer.
Same goes for Premiere or AE - on top of it, your Dreamcolor also provides scaling.

It also really depends on what sort of material you want to work with.
Is HD enough, do you plan to use 2k/4k? From what camera?
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostThu Oct 09, 2014 6:33 am

@Craig
Thanks for the explanation! I´ll definitely have a look at the ClipToolz software!

@Frank
I work with a GH4 and the BMPCC. 4k is important to me, but aslong as I can view the 4k timeline in a scaled 1080p output monitor, I can use it to color grade and will be fine I guess.

I´m currently thinking about getting the Intensity Pro I/O Card instead of the DeckLink Mini Monitor, cause it´s just a view Bucks more and it would be cheaper than a DeckLink Mini Monitor + Recorder. Maybe I want to record footage from a gaming console in the future sometime or capture 10-bit 4:2:2 footage from my GH4, which should be possible with that capture cards, am I right?

Despite the connections, the cards are basicly the same, right? I can see only this "PS" suffix in resolution, e.g. 1080Ps within the Mini Monitor description, which differs from the Intensity Pro.

Thanks for your time :-)
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostThu Oct 09, 2014 7:25 am

Frank Glencairn wrote:Let's compare a K620 with a 780ti

384 cuda cores vs 2880 cuda cores
2GB of DDR3 memory vs 3GB of DDR5
128-bit memory bus vs 384-bit


Frank, I understand that you are trying to assist the OP with his choices, especially if he plans to work with 4K content but you'll note I stated that the Quadro K600 fully satisfied my HD editing needs and as I use it with other colour managed programmes, it's 10bit Display Port was a positive factor. There are also two very important issues you failed to mention in your comparison table above. One is cost: a new K620 is only around $300 here in AU but the 780Ti costs around $650. The other is power requirements: The smaller Kepler series GPUs require less than 50 watts but the 780Ti requires at least 250w. (just for the graphics card alone)

Now you may live a country which sells power to it's population at reasonable cost but unfortunately, here in Australia, we are prepared to export our coal overseas for peanuts whilst charging our population ever increasing electricity prices. Many of us choose to opt out of the 'grid' system completely and go solar voltaic so when you're running your business off an inverter and 12volt batteries, every watt used must be considered. For some, watts can be more important than the number of CUDA cores...
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostThu Oct 09, 2014 9:32 am

jon Joug wrote:Two really expensive monitors ( different manufacturers ) side by side will not look the same and connecting a professional monitor to a CPU always introduces a break in the color management workflow.

Well, it's a "break" in that it's another box and a signal path, but it's not a lot of trouble, provided the monitor is calibrated.

Most colorists complain that nothing looks the same outside of their expensive bays. They always say "trust my bay setup because it's expensive and only the great colorists can afford it". They say, "pay me big dough and there is nothing I can do to guaranty consistent results outside".

I think a good colorist would put this kindly and with some tact. But it's essentially true. A sound mixer in a big re-recording stage will tell you the same thing. What happens when you take a million dollar mix and listen to it on $10 earbuds? How does it sound on an iPhone? How will it sound on a $600 TV set? Each one will sound different, none as good as it did in post. And each one will look different... none looking as good as it did in the color-correction room. That's the nature of the beast.

I will argue that you can do great color correction with Resolve on a Macbook, iMac or PC laptop and get outstanding results without a panel and an expensive monitor.

I believe you are misinformed. I think you can do acceptable non-broadcast work for sRGB delivery provided the computer displays are calibrated as much as possible and you have very modest expectations. For broadcast or theatrical, no client would tolerate it.

It would be no different to try to mix a show with $50 Bose speakers. Color-correcting on a $50 flat panel would basically take you into the same territory.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostThu Oct 09, 2014 9:37 am

Craig Marshall wrote:
Now you may live a country which sells power to it's population at reasonable cost ..


Nah, I live in Germany where they charge an arm and a leg plus your first born son for electricity - it's even more expensive than downunder.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostThu Oct 09, 2014 10:13 am

Still cheaper than gas ;-)

BTW, internally even Resolve Lite is calculating in 32-bit float. It's definitely a question of the I/O path.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostThu Oct 09, 2014 8:43 pm

jon Joug wrote:
Two really expensive monitors ( different manufacturers ) side by side will not look the same and connecting a professional monitor to a CPU always introduces a break in the color management workflow.
Most colorists complain that nothing looks the same outside of their expensive bays. They always say "trust my bay setup because it's expensive and only the great colorists can afford it". They say, "pay me big dough and there is nothing I can do to guaranty consistent results outside".
I will argue that you can do great color correction with Resolve on a Macbook, iMac or PC laptop and get outstanding results without a panel and an expensive monitor.


Well, We can only do one thing: have the viewing environment as close as the specification as technologically possible and color for it. I do color to a spec, not to a brand/monitor.

And Yes, we are paid more because our output is coherent and consistent: if Marc or jPo or any other colorist get a master form me (and vice-versa) it will look very close in their environment.

If someone does at home with workarounds and without proper calibration... I can only say good luck.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostFri Oct 10, 2014 6:59 am

jon Joug wrote:No one can claim that a professional monitor will guarantee consistant results because usually it’s quite the opposite.

Tell me again how you know this to be true. It seems to fly in the face of all the available evidence.

What I can say is that even an experienced colorist would struggle if he or she was confronted without a monitor they could really believe in. I know of cases here in LA where a monitor setup issue really hurt a show (a fairly major national network drama), and there were at least a couple of episode affected by a setup problem. They eventually fixed it, but the shows had to be redone and the company's reputation was not helped by it.

I don't think a great monitor alone will ensure the success or failure of color correction in general, but I'd say you have to have both a good colorist and a great monitor to get the job done. I suspect you're trying to defend your own preference to use a non-broadcast monitor, which (again) goes against the major texts and references on the subject, including the Alexis Van Hurkman's daVinci Resolve manuals.

Can you tell us how you're calibrating your monitor? And can you describe the circumstances under which you believe a pro monitor didn't work? I'd be curious to know what specific broadcast monitor was involved.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostFri Oct 10, 2014 3:38 pm

jon Joug wrote:No one can claim that a professional monitor will guarantee consistant results because usually it’s quite the opposite.


You know, you can race in F1 with a toyota Prius if you like.... Just do not wine if you're left in the dust...

We have multiple rooms and multiple devices in Fotokem and YES they look (withing their technological tolerance) identical...
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostTue Oct 14, 2014 6:42 pm

I see the experts talking here. But experts great in colour may not necessarily be updated with the latest technology that Resolve can offer. They probably still think they are working in Resolve 8. Here are the examples from experts:

Frank Glencairn wrote:The GUI viewer is not suitable for grading with any hardware (it's not even color managed), cause Resolve is a professional CC software, that is made to be used with a closed loop video monitoring solution - the only way to guaranty color fidelity.
Get an BM I/O card or box, connect you Dreamcolor to it and call it a day.
For a GUI, any cheap monitor does the trick.

David Williams wrote:The GUI is not colour accurate, as BM reps have stated numerous times on this very forum.

Dreamcolor monitors take 10bit RGB I believe, and I understand the newer 4K BM IO devices can do RGB over HDMI.

Confirm with BM which device has 10bit RGB over HDMI, buy one, plug it in, calibrate the Dreamcolor and enjoy. Ignore the obvious amateur.


Frank Glencairn wrote:
Stefan Jungreithmaier wrote:Sad thing is I wanted to use it for color grading, but it seems to require aditional hardware to show 10-Bit in the GUI :?


The GUI viewer is not suitable for grading with any hardware (it's not even color managed), cause Resolve is a professional CC software, that is made to be used with a closed loop video monitoring solution - the only way to guaranty color fidelity.
Get an BM I/O card or box, connect you Dreamcolor to it and call it a day.
For a GUI, any cheap monitor does the trick.

Maybe you can sell your old Quadro K620, since it is not the exactly the best card for Resolve/Premiere and get a much better and faster 780TI or 980 instead. Actually you can buy two used 780TI now for the price of a new 980 - that wold probably double your render speed in Premiere and Resolve.

What made you buy that odd K620 in the first place?


And here is what Resolve 11 manual has to say:

Chapter Name Color Page Basics
Page Number 456

"Grading with the viewer on a Computer Display

Since most computer displays do not operate at the color critical tolerances or specifications required for broadcast or theatrical delivery, you'll likely need an external broadcast display of some type. However, it's worth noting that the viewer displays each clip's image data as it is handled by the calibration that your operating system applies to your computer display, making it eminently suitable for monitoring projects destined for the sRGB standard of the web if you have a high-quality sRGB-calibrated computer monitor.

Additionally, you can apply a dedicated Viewer LUT using the 1D/3D Color Viewer Lookup Table pop-up menu, found in the Look Up Tables panel of the Settings window. This lets you calibrate a computer display in the same way you would calibrate an external display, using a probe and color management software and apply the resulting calibration LUT in Resolve."

Now, despite what the experts are saying here and in other threads, BMD has made its standpoint very clear in the manual. YES, YOU CAN COLOR GRADE ON YOUR COMPUTER MONITOR, provided your monitor can handle the colour space. BMD, has never urged you to buy their Decklink cards, only the experts here do. The experts probably have to protect themselves because they have already purchased a very costly display monitor.

So, people who have the HP Dreamcolor or any other monitor which can handle the colour space, go ahead and do your grading on your computer monitor. BMD is not stopping you. Calibrate your monitor in sRGB 2.4 gamma and D 65 (this is same as Rec 709) and go ahead with your colour grading.

Edit: The bold words from the Resolve manual were made by me just to emphasise BMD's point of view
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostTue Oct 14, 2014 11:17 pm

Subrata Senn wrote:>snip<

So, people who have the HP Dreamcolor or any other monitor which can handle the colour space, go ahead and do your grading on your computer monitor. BMD is not stopping you. Calibrate your monitor in sRGB 2.4 gamma and D 65 (this is same as Rec 709) and go ahead with your colour grading.



mmm...I will say, mostly I agree with you. let's start from there.

The issue I see is that calibrating a monitor is not trivial issue, even with a Dreamcolor ones. Just slap a color sauce is not Ideal. If you do not have the $$$ to buy the external monitor, chances are that you might not have the $$$ to proper calibrate the one you have in the first place...

I personally also dislike the refresh of the monitor, I find the GUI sticky in the refresh. (at least in the systems i have that are not optimized for that)

Third if you are color correcting only for Web... it actually might be a better option than an external monitor... might be...

I also see the <sarcasm> tag on in your post... excellent!
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 15, 2014 1:59 am

Subrata Senn wrote:Now, despite what the experts are saying here and in other threads, BMD has made its standpoint very clear in the manual. YES, YOU CAN COLOR GRADE ON YOUR COMPUTER MONITOR, provided your monitor can handle the colour space.

The problem is... 99.999% of most computer displays can't handle the color space. The bigger problem is that the panels are inconsistent and uneven, which is a big problem. There was a long, long discussion of the problems with the HP Dreamcolor displays over on LiftGammaGain:

http://liftgammagain.com/forum/index.ph ... post-29615

The upshot is that I think it's an excellent display for graphic artists, photographers, and others who can live with its limitations. The reality is that a Class 1 (hell, even Class 2) color grading monitor is not cheap or easy to build:

https://tech.ebu.ch/docs/tech/tech3263.pdf

If the stuff is only for the web, and you can get it in the ballpark of correct sRGB, then it might be OK for small projects. I'd be very, very reluctant to use one for broadcast or theatrical work.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 15, 2014 5:39 am

waltervolpatto wrote:
Subrata Senn wrote:>snip<

So, people who have the HP Dreamcolor or any other monitor which can handle the colour space, go ahead and do your grading on your computer monitor. BMD is not stopping you. Calibrate your monitor in sRGB 2.4 gamma and D 65 (this is same as Rec 709) and go ahead with your colour grading.



mmm...I will say, mostly I agree with you. let's start from there.

The issue I see is that calibrating a monitor is not trivial issue, even with a Dreamcolor ones. Just slap a color sauce is not Ideal. If you do not have the $$$ to buy the external monitor, chances are that you might not have the $$$ to proper calibrate the one you have in the first place...

I personally also dislike the refresh of the monitor, I find the GUI sticky in the refresh. (at least in the systems i have that are not optimized for that)

Third if you are color correcting only for Web... it actually might be a better option than an external monitor... might be...

I also see the <sarcasm> tag on in your post... excellent!


Walter, it was not sarcasm, it was <exasperation>. :D
Just because a broadcast monitor was a must in Resolve 8 and 9 doesn't mean it would be needed even now.

Yes, I agree that calibrating the computer monitor is not a trivial issue. You not only need to have a proper wide-gamut monitor, you need to calibrate it properly with probes and all. Resolve manual clearly says so. But see, calibration is needed for broadcast monitors also.

I have nothing against broadcast monitors through Decklink cards. I personally use one. But to say that only broadcast monitors can do a job properly is not exactly correct. That was my point.

Even if computer monitors are sufficient, big sized broadcast monitors (I use a Panasonic Plasma) helps me otherwise. A bigger display points out some other flaws (grains for example -- I get a lot of DSLR footage) not easily noticeable on a 27 inch GUI monitor. That's one big advantage I cannot ignore.

But for people who may not be having broadcast monitors, a properly calibrated GUI monitor should work. Not only for web, but also for broadcast as well as theatrical releases. The Resolve manual basically gives you an indication of the work process.

Here is how that can be done:

1. Get one high end computer monitor which can be calibrated to 100% sRGB.
2. Calibrate the monitor to sRGB with 2.4 gamma and D65 through a proper probe and software.
3. Locate the .icc/.icm profile in your computer.
4. Convert the .icc/.icm profile into a sRGB to Rec 709 3D LUT using free DispcalGUI software or Briz LuT Converter software (http://www.brizsoft.com/lut-converter/). The second option is available only for Windows.
5. Copy the created LUT in the LUT folder of Resolve.
6. Apply the LUT in Resolve for your viewer.

And now, the viewer will work in Rec 709 color space, just like a broadcast monitor.

Walter, since you go by mathematics quite often, tell me if I've gone wrong mathematically.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 15, 2014 6:31 am

Subrata Senn wrote:But for people who may not be having broadcast monitors, a properly calibrated GUI monitor should work. Not only for web, but also for broadcast as well as theatrical releases.

I think your flaw is believing that the LUT alone can compensate for a bad panel. There are manufacturing issues that even a 3D LUT can't overcome. If it were possible for a $1500 monitor to look every bit as good as (say) a $35,000 Dolby HD monitor, why would anybody buy the latter? Sex appeal?

No, when you pay serious money for a serious Class 1 broadcast monitor, you get uniform brightness, perfect corner-to-corner luminance, perfectly even grayscale response, accurate color, long term stability, and all the other qualities that define what a broadcast monitor is. Read the EBU document above and see why making a true grading monitor is really difficult.

There are affordable grading monitors out there that actually work; the 10-bit FSI monitors are among them. Me, I use a Panasonic Broadcast BT-300 plasma and I'm OK with it. They're still using them at a dozen different facilities around LA for American network comedies and dramas, and I have no problem with them when they're properly calibrated (even with the known ABL issues). But they're actually designed to be a picture monitor, not a computer monitor shoehorned into graphics and video.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 15, 2014 7:29 am

Marc Wielage wrote:
Subrata Senn wrote:But for people who may not be having broadcast monitors, a properly calibrated GUI monitor should work. Not only for web, but also for broadcast as well as theatrical releases.

I think your flaw is believing that the LUT alone can compensate for a bad panel. There are manufacturing issues that even a 3D LUT can't overcome. If it were possible for a $1500 monitor to look every bit as good as (say) a $35,000 Dolby HD monitor, why would anybody buy the latter? Sex appeal?


I am not believing anything Marc. I am just reiterating what DaVinci Resolve 11 manual has to say.

DaVinci Manual says most computer monitors are not suitable. Which means some are. In other words, most computer monitors have bad panels. But some have good panels. That's obviously the pre-requisite.

Now, for the LUT thing, I am quoting again from the manual, in case you have missed it:

"Additionally, you can apply a dedicated Viewer LUT using the 1D/3D Color Viewer Lookup Table pop-up menu, found in the Look Up Tables panel of the Settings window. This lets you calibrate a computer display in the same way you would calibrate an external display, using a probe and color management software and apply the resulting calibration LUT in Resolve."

Now, should I not believe DaVinci Resolve manual also?
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 15, 2014 4:26 pm

Subrata Senn wrote:
waltervolpatto wrote:
Subrata Senn wrote:>snip<

So, people who have the HP Dreamcolor or any other monitor which can handle the colour space, go ahead and do your grading on your computer monitor. BMD is not stopping you. Calibrate your monitor in sRGB 2.4 gamma and D 65 (this is same as Rec 709) and go ahead with your colour grading.



mmm...I will say, mostly I agree with you. let's start from there.

The issue I see is that calibrating a monitor is not trivial issue, even with a Dreamcolor ones. Just slap a color sauce is not Ideal. If you do not have the $$$ to buy the external monitor, chances are that you might not have the $$$ to proper calibrate the one you have in the first place...

I personally also dislike the refresh of the monitor, I find the GUI sticky in the refresh. (at least in the systems i have that are not optimized for that)

Third if you are color correcting only for Web... it actually might be a better option than an external monitor... might be...

I also see the <sarcasm> tag on in your post... excellent!


Walter, it was not sarcasm, it was <exasperation>. :D
Just because a broadcast monitor was a must in Resolve 8 and 9 doesn't mean it would be needed even now.

Yes, I agree that calibrating the computer monitor is not a trivial issue. You not only need to have a proper wide-gamut monitor, you need to calibrate it properly with probes and all. Resolve manual clearly says so. But see, calibration is needed for broadcast monitors also.

I have nothing against broadcast monitors through Decklink cards. I personally use one. But to say that only broadcast monitors can do a job properly is not exactly correct. That was my point.

Even if computer monitors are sufficient, big sized broadcast monitors (I use a Panasonic Plasma) helps me otherwise. A bigger display points out some other flaws (grains for example -- I get a lot of DSLR footage) not easily noticeable on a 27 inch GUI monitor. That's one big advantage I cannot ignore.

But for people who may not be having broadcast monitors, a properly calibrated GUI monitor should work. Not only for web, but also for broadcast as well as theatrical releases. The Resolve manual basically gives you an indication of the work process.

Here is how that can be done:

1. Get one high end computer monitor which can be calibrated to 100% sRGB.
2. Calibrate the monitor to sRGB with 2.4 gamma and D65 through a proper probe and software.
3. Locate the .icc/.icm profile in your computer.
4. Convert the .icc/.icm profile into a sRGB to Rec 709 3D LUT using free DispcalGUI software or Briz LuT Converter software (http://www.brizsoft.com/lut-converter/). The second option is available only for Windows.
5. Copy the created LUT in the LUT folder of Resolve.
6. Apply the LUT in Resolve for your viewer.

And now, the viewer will work in Rec 709 color space, just like a broadcast monitor.

Walter, since you go by mathematics quite often, tell me if I've gone wrong mathematically.


One of the limitation is the density of the icc profile. My knowledge is a bit update in the matter, but last time I looked into it the ICC was limited to a 5x5x5 cube and the bare minimum to have color accuracy is either 9x9x9 logarithmic distributed or 17x17x17 linear distributed on a tethraedrical interpolation... Although you get away with a lower density due to the [1d]+[cube]+[1d] structure of the Icc profile, that is great to match a linear color space, not really if you have non uniformity (like flaring/coloring in the black.

I do not believe that those requirements are met, but somebody with more up to date knowledge can chime in.

I do not think that the monitors hit the color space correctly like Marc explained as well.


so, to sum up my thoughs...

a - "can" you color on a monitor? Yes, within the tolerance of your color pipeline/calibration
b - is that tolerance acceptable? IMHO no.
c - is the final product acceptable? --- it might be.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Oct 15, 2014 11:27 pm

Marc Wielage wrote:I believe you are misinformed. I think you can do acceptable non-broadcast work for sRGB delivery provided the computer displays are calibrated as much as possible and you have very modest expectations. For broadcast or theatrical, no client would tolerate it.

It would be no different to try to mix a show with $50 Bose speakers. Color-correcting on a $50 flat panel would basically take you into the same territory.


Which is why I mostly think in terms of producing anything for 'public viewing' in monochrome (B&W), and mono audio...

Who needs color and 5.1 sound, anyway...
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostMon Nov 17, 2014 3:51 am

Hi guys.
I've purchased the new LG 31MU97 and am waiting for delivery.
I have some sense of the importance of quality monitors for post and colour grading as I once worked at a post production house though not in a professional role.

However, I have buckleys of ever buying a high end broadcast monitor, nor do I need one.
But it would be nice to have something that was ball park professional and I recently became aware of the new LG 4K cinema panel that does 4096 x 2160 at 60Hz and with true 10 bit colour and 99.5% of Adobe RGB, so they claim.
A Quadro card of at least K5200 specs and $2.5K is needed to get those 10 bits in 4K at 60Hz.

I'm wondering if this changes the discussion here.
To my knowledge this is the first panel of it's kind and is within reach of an individual like myself who could never afford a small Sony HD oled monitor, let alone a large 10 bit 4K one.

http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=29708
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostMon Nov 17, 2014 4:10 am

Paul, do you need 4K @ 10bit? I use a very cost effective 24" IPS 10bit solution for HD.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostMon Nov 17, 2014 5:57 am

Craig Marshall wrote:Paul, do you need 4K @ 10bit? I use a very cost effective 24" IPS 10bit solution for HD.


Good point.
No I don't really need 4K at this point but I have been giving this a lot of thought for a long time.
I was looking at the PA279Q 27" which is 10 bit via dithering, and the PQ321Q which is 4K 10 bit but only 65% of Adobe RGB gamut.
The 31MU97 is true 10 bit, almost full A RGB and will accommodate 4k which I might dabble in with 5D timelapse or possibly 4k acquisition in future.
But for any 10 bit LCD I would need a Quadro card which is the greater expense and makes it more worthwhile spending on a large, future resistant panel.
The LG is far better and cheaper than the PQ321 and somewhat better than the PA27".
I'm thinking if I make the investment in a good panel I would like it to last for a while before being obsolete.
Anyway, I made the decision when I saw this LG for $700 below RRP on ebay.

As you can see I'm starting to OD on spec jargon.
Time to relax and think of other things.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostMon Nov 17, 2014 10:16 am

Paul Kapp wrote:
Craig Marshall wrote:Paul, do you need 4K @ 10bit? I use a very cost effective 24" IPS 10bit solution for HD.


But for any 10 bit LCD I would need a Quadro card which is the greater expense and makes it more worthwhile spending on a large, future resistant panel.


Paul, I think you may have been mislead here. I have a Quadro Kepler card installed too and although it is capable of 10it out via Display Port, it is really only appropriate with some graphics programmes so it's use in video colour correction software like Resolve is limited to it's CUDA cores and it's GPU capability.

To see your video files at 10bit resolution out of Resolve, you'll need to fit additional hardware such as a Thunderbolt or PCIe Decklink 'mini-monitor' device which offers SDI and/or HDMI out at 10bit. I use the BMD PCIe Decklink SDI 4K card but as my 24" IPS display does not accept 10bit via HDMI, I use a BMD HDLink Pro box to convert SDI to DVI @ 10bit.

PS: I use BenQ's new 16:10 PG2401PT for colour accurate HD video monitoring at 10bit. They are 100% gamut, are individually set up to Rec709 prior to shipment but more importantly, can also be manually software/hardware calibrated with 14bit LUTs. The PG2401PT costs around AUD$1100. http://www.benq.com/product/LCD/PG2401PT
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostMon Nov 17, 2014 11:20 pm

Craig Marshall wrote:
Paul Kapp wrote:
Craig Marshall wrote:Paul, do you need 4K @ 10bit? I use a very cost effective 24" IPS 10bit solution for HD.


But for any 10 bit LCD I would need a Quadro card which is the greater expense and makes it more worthwhile spending on a large, future resistant panel.


Paul, I think you may have been mislead here. I have a Quadro Kepler card installed too and although it is capable of 10it out via Display Port, it is really only appropriate with some graphics programmes so it's use in video colour correction software like Resolve is limited to it's CUDA cores and it's GPU capability.

To see your video files at 10bit resolution out of Resolve, you'll need to fit additional hardware such as a Thunderbolt or PCIe Decklink 'mini-monitor' device which offers SDI and/or HDMI out at 10bit. I use the BMD PCIe Decklink SDI 4K card but as my 24" IPS display does not accept 10bit via HDMI, I use a BMD HDLink Pro box to convert SDI to DVI @ 10bit.

PS: I use BenQ's new 16:10 PG2401PT for colour accurate HD video monitoring at 10bit. They are 100% gamut, are individually set up to Rec709 prior to shipment but more importantly, can also be manually software/hardware calibrated with 14bit LUTs. The PG2401PT costs around AUD$1100. http://www.benq.com/product/LCD/PG2401PT


Thanks Craig.
I'm aware that Resolve doesn't display 10 bit without BM hardware and external monitor.
But I also use Premiere, AFX, ACR, Speedgrade and Photoshop for raw workflows. This gives me lens correction for my Canons as well as many other raw benefits. I will want to monitor in Resolve sometime so thanks for the info.

p.s. On reflection, I guess my discovery of this new monitor doesn't change the conversation started by the OP.
For many other reasons It's a game changer though.
True 10 bit without dithering, factory calibrated A-RGB accurate wide gamut and 4K.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostMon Dec 15, 2014 6:38 am

Subrata Senn wrote:
waltervolpatto wrote:
Subrata Senn wrote:
Here is how that can be done:

1. Get one high end computer monitor which can be calibrated to 100% sRGB.
2. Calibrate the monitor to sRGB with 2.4 gamma and D65 through a proper probe and software.
3. Locate the .icc/.icm profile in your computer.
4. Convert the .icc/.icm profile into a sRGB to Rec 709 3D LUT using free DispcalGUI software or Briz LuT Converter software (http://www.brizsoft.com/lut-converter/). The second option is available only for Windows.
5. Copy the created LUT in the LUT folder of Resolve.
6. Apply the LUT in Resolve for your viewer.

And now, the viewer will work in Rec 709 color space, just like a broadcast monitor.

Walter, since you go by mathematics quite often, tell me if I've gone wrong mathematically.


late to this thread but thought I chime in... ;)

Subrata, first of all thank you for stating that Resolve has an option to "calibrate" the viewer. Lots of peeps have complained about that, and as you demonstrate there is an approach.

But - as others have stated - that won't make the viewer remotely as good as an external reference grading panel.

If you are on a shoestring budget and that's the best you can do, so be it.

But as Marc has pointed out, the hardware of low end panels is crap. You will run into many issues (gamut, LCD backlight contamination, light leakage, viewing angle, non-proper i/o, not true 10-bit etc etc) that your eyes cannot see but that will be there and it will affect your grading decisions... screen uniformity is one of your biggest problems... see here, why OLED is absolutely recommended for professional grading:

http://displaycalibrationtools.com/disp ... omparison/

look at the Qnix QX2710 results (very popular cheapo display, great GUI screen for the price).... devastating compared to the FSI LCD, which in turn is destroyed by the FSI OLED... u can only imagine how many bad grading decisions u will make because of bad uniformity...

Plasmas will have the ABL issues, IR issues and bad uniformity... I have three 65VT60s here (all 65^3 calibrated)... u can use them as a client "real world" reference display, but not for direct grading... and now that Plasma is obsolete, not so much "real world" anymore... :cry:

I sincerely doubt the broadcast Plasma perform better... maybe

one can use a larger cheaper computer display for editing and to spot non-color related errors...

but spotting critical color errors on a display with horrible uniformity (which introduces color AND luminance errors) is impossible b/c one will never know what a real "problem" is until u check the footage on real reference screens... ;-)

As Walter has already mentioned, the ICC profile won't be as good as a real 3D LUT created from the original profiling data... and the conversion just makes it worse... but to back up ur point, simply do NOT create an ICC profile, go directly to creating a 3D LUT from the original display profile...

which brings up the next problem: Resolve had problems in the past with LUTs... not saying it has now, but how would YOU know your (viewing) LUT is 100% correctly applied ?

that is why the Pro approach is always to use 3D LUT memory inside of the ref screens or external LUT boxes when it comes to the actual display calibration...

besides that, you are not getting true 10-bit out of any of these low-end displays...

my tip for the budget approach: spend some of the money u're saving on quality calibration probes...

btw, the suitable "computer panels" that you mentioned may exist because Resolve manual says that "most panels" are not suitable, will be (if any) the Eizo (models w/ 3D LUT memory)...

I may do quick comparison of viewer calibrated vs. ref panel calibrated... i got all of that setup and I still have the original display profile (10,000+ points) of the GUI screen - I actually created the ICC from the LS 3D LUT via Spaceman... I'll update here... :)

- M
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Jan 21, 2015 3:46 am

Stefan Jungreithmaier wrote:I´m currently thinking about getting the Intensity Pro I/O Card instead of the DeckLink Mini Monitor, cause it´s just a view Bucks more and it would be cheaper than a DeckLink Mini Monitor + Recorder. Maybe I want to record footage from a gaming console in the future sometime or capture 10-bit 4:2:2 footage from my GH4, which should be possible with that capture cards, am I right?

Despite the connections, the cards are basicly the same, right? I can see only this "PS" suffix in resolution, e.g. 1080Ps within the Mini Monitor description, which differs from the Intensity Pro.
I've got a very similar question. Is there any non-obvious gotcha about using the Intensity Pro PCI-E I/O card for 10-bit HDMI output from Resolve? I'm interested in this card rather than Mini Monitor/Recorder because I've also got some analog video capture to deal with.
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Jan 21, 2015 6:59 am

mike_n wrote:But as Marc has pointed out, the hardware of low end panels is crap. You will run into many issues (gamut, LCD backlight contamination, light leakage, viewing angle, non-proper i/o, not true 10-bit etc etc) that your eyes cannot see but that will be there and it will affect your grading decisions... screen uniformity is one of your biggest problems... see here, why OLED is absolutely recommended for professional grading... but spotting critical color errors on a display with horrible uniformity (which introduces color AND luminance errors) is impossible b/c one will never know what a real "problem" is until u check the footage on real reference screens... ;-)

I'm going to cut and paste Mike Nagel's quote for future use. But... I don't think plasmas are that bad if they're calibrated as far as you can go. Not ideal, but certainly better than a $299 Costco computer monitor (or a $1200 HP display).
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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Jan 21, 2015 7:20 am

Craig Marshall wrote:
Paul, I think you may have been mislead here. I have a Quadro Kepler card installed too and although it is capable of 10it out via Display Port, it is really only appropriate with some graphics programmes so it's use in video colour correction software like Resolve is limited to it's CUDA cores and it's GPU capability


Craig;

you have mentioned this several times, i thought i would mention that Nucoda Film master uses the 10bit output from a Q/K card's Displayport to send video to your mon all day long.... as does Avid DS, and i think many others like Baselight and Scratch....

it's more like Resolve is the odd man out here, many (or most) other top class gradeing software is using the 10 bit out of the Q/K cards

You may not be aware of other systems, but perhaps check on the alternitives before making a blanket statment like "10it out via Display Port, it is really only appropriate with some graphics programmes so it's use in video colour correction software like Resolve is limited"

d
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Craig Marshall

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Jan 21, 2015 11:24 am

Dermot Shane wrote:...it's more like Resolve is the odd man out here, many (or most) other top class gradeing software is using the 10 bit out of the Q/K cards...


Great! But everyone uses Resolve, right? ;)
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Stu Friedberg

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Feb 11, 2015 9:41 pm

Stu Friedberg wrote:
Stefan Jungreithmaier wrote:I´m currently thinking about getting the Intensity Pro I/O Card instead of the DeckLink Mini Monitor, cause it´s just a view Bucks more and it would be cheaper than a DeckLink Mini Monitor + Recorder. Maybe I want to record footage from a gaming console in the future sometime or capture 10-bit 4:2:2 footage from my GH4, which should be possible with that capture cards, am I right?

Despite the connections, the cards are basicly the same, right? I can see only this "PS" suffix in resolution, e.g. 1080Ps within the Mini Monitor description, which differs from the Intensity Pro.
I've got a very similar question. Is there any non-obvious gotcha about using the Intensity Pro PCI-E I/O card for 10-bit HDMI output from Resolve? I'm interested in this card rather than Mini Monitor/Recorder because I've also got some analog video capture to deal with.

I've been pursuing this question in another thread, but just got the following from a BMD technical support representative today.
The Intensity Pro processes internally at 10 bit but will only output 8bit video. You technically can use it to grade in Resolve but it will not have the the color precision that our 10 bit Decklink cards have.
So, consider it highly misleading that the "tech specs" page for the Intensity Pro simply says 10-bit HDMI.
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Peter_r

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostTue Feb 24, 2015 1:14 am

Do all of the decklink cards work correctly with 10bit output for resolve?
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Adam Simmons

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostTue Feb 24, 2015 8:06 am

Stu Friedberg wrote:
Stu Friedberg wrote:
Stefan Jungreithmaier wrote:I´m currently thinking about getting the Intensity Pro I/O Card instead of the DeckLink Mini Monitor, cause it´s just a view Bucks more and it would be cheaper than a DeckLink Mini Monitor + Recorder. Maybe I want to record footage from a gaming console in the future sometime or capture 10-bit 4:2:2 footage from my GH4, which should be possible with that capture cards, am I right?

Despite the connections, the cards are basicly the same, right? I can see only this "PS" suffix in resolution, e.g. 1080Ps within the Mini Monitor description, which differs from the Intensity Pro.
I've got a very similar question. Is there any non-obvious gotcha about using the Intensity Pro PCI-E I/O card for 10-bit HDMI output from Resolve? I'm interested in this card rather than Mini Monitor/Recorder because I've also got some analog video capture to deal with.

I've been pursuing this question in another thread, but just got the following from a BMD technical support representative today.
The Intensity Pro processes internally at 10 bit but will only output 8bit video. You technically can use it to grade in Resolve but it will not have the the color precision that our 10 bit Decklink cards have.
So, consider it highly misleading that the "tech specs" page for the Intensity Pro simply says 10-bit HDMI.
It's Black Magic, never take what is said on the advertising as gospel. We're still waiting for the UHD 50/60p that's advertised on the Ultrastudio 4K V2 and that's been out for over a year
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Building Bespoke Video Editing systems for over 16 years
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Peter_r

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Feb 25, 2015 1:34 am

What about the new Intensity Pro 4K card, does it output 10bit correctly?
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Stu Friedberg

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostWed Feb 25, 2015 11:33 pm

Peter_r wrote:What about the new Intensity Pro 4K card, does it output 10bit correctly?
That's one of the prominently listed features of the new card. However, on the New Intensity Pro 4K thread, someone reported a day or two ago that DeepColor support won't be in the initial release of the card. Without clarification from Blackmagic Design, it's possible to interpret lack of DeepColor support rather broadly...
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Adam Simmons

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Re: Davinci Resolve Light 10-Bit capable?

PostThu Feb 26, 2015 6:51 am

The quote I posted in that thread was from the BM Product manager in Australia
DVC Built Clevo P775DM3-G Laptop with UHD screen, 7700K CPU@4.9Ghz, Geforce GTX 1060 6GB GPU, G-Sync UHD screen, 500GB M.2 Primary, 1x 480GB SSD, 1x1TB M.2, 1x 2TB Video drives.
Building Bespoke Video Editing systems for over 16 years
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