16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

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Bertrand

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16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostThu Jun 06, 2019 10:45 pm

Hello all,
By reading the release notes, it appeared that resolve can now export bwf for pro tools, including metadatas. I've just tested it, with sounds from a sounddevice, and all the metadatas are gone. Moreover, the audio clips are still renamed as the synched video clips.
I tried to assign a reel name to the source audio clips, but couldn't find a way to do it. It just works for video, not audio. So audio conform is still impossible...
What am I missing ? Does someone achieved to export a useable aaf for pro tools ? I mean that can be reconformed on the source audio clips ?
Thanks for your help !
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PieroLass

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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostFri Jun 07, 2019 7:31 pm

I just tested DaVinci 16 beta 4 and aaf export, with protools delivery preset or avid preset still not working with metadata, even if it is announced otherwise for davinci 16. I tried with files from sounddevices and cantar aaton, but i got the same result. And still if you are dealing with synchrionised clips you get names after the video files and tracks, no way to reference to the original audio files. And with xml, aaf data or edl the situation is the same so it's not easy to round trip with others editing software. If you need metadata from original audio files my sound editor assistant discoverd it's possibile if you open an aaf data in avid and with edl manager you create and edl of your edited sequence and you compare with an edl of all your original sounds using Conformalizer (wich is quite expensive), using timestamp metadata is able to relink to the original audio files. But it's not an easy job and you have to get crazy to finds all the shift problems. But if you need metadata, working in a professional field, we needed to use this crazy method. Hope the soon it will work an easy solution directly from DaVinci, or an application like x2pro that works with davinci will come out!
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Bertrand

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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostFri Jun 07, 2019 9:30 pm

Thanks for this smart idea. But in my opinion it's a way too heavy, expensive and approximative process to be seriously used in a professionnal environment. Blackmagic has to improve this feature. I think it's the main one that keeps editors away from editing in resolve. Many of them would like to "try" resolve in a real project, but they just can't because of that.
The other main features that maintain avid on top of the editing softwares, beside this AAF issues, are in my opinion :
- you can choose which tracks of an external polyphonic bwf sound you want to sync with your video clip (usually the mixes in channels 1 and 2), with the ability to call for all the tracks on demand if needed.
- you can always open a project in an older or newer version of the software without big issues.
- the flawless source/record timeline toggle, used 99% of the time by all the editors I know.
- the ease of backuping an entire project (but maybe resolve as a feature for that, I don't know, honestly).

It should be an inspiration for blackmagic, Resolve deserves it, as it's an amazing and versatile tool in many ways. Just a few (big) steps to perfection !
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etang77

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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostMon Jun 10, 2019 3:02 pm

PieroLass wrote:I just tested DaVinci 16 beta 4 and aaf export, with protools delivery preset or avid preset still not working with metadata, even if it is announced otherwise for davinci 16. I tried with files from sounddevices and cantar aaton, but i got the same result. And still if you are dealing with synchrionised clips you get names after the video files and tracks, no way to reference to the original audio files. And with xml, aaf data or edl the situation is the same so it's not easy to round trip with others editing software. If you need metadata from original audio files my sound editor assistant discoverd it's possibile if you open an aaf data in avid and with edl manager you create and edl of your edited sequence and you compare with an edl of all your original sounds using Conformalizer (wich is quite expensive), using timestamp metadata is able to relink to the original audio files. But it's not an easy job and you have to get crazy to finds all the shift problems. But if you need metadata, working in a professional field, we needed to use this crazy method. Hope the soon it will work an easy solution directly from DaVinci, or an application like x2pro that works with davinci will come out!


Wow! I've been following your progress on the OMF/metadate issue. Because it's still the single issue that's holding me back to get people to use it. It sounds so "complicated", I'm just not trying to understand it...
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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostTue Jun 11, 2019 7:55 am

I’m in same situation.
If really cannot output audio metadata,
I hope will be can break synced-audio&video files like conpound clips......
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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostTue Jun 11, 2019 11:19 am

I add my voice for Blackmagic to move this up the priority list for the next beta.
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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostTue Jun 18, 2019 4:08 am

I'm so keen on a working pathway to Pro Tools, I registered to make a plea....
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tamagen

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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostTue Jun 18, 2019 4:36 pm

Now I’m editing tv drama shows.
I synced wav&mxf files via timecode in media page.
I tried to make FCPXML and use X2Pro for make AAF.
90% clips failed,But few clips could export with source wav metadata.

I strongly hope to export AAF with source wav files metadata.
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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostWed Jun 26, 2019 12:46 pm

I add my voice! Please BM make it work!
It’s the only thing that keep my clients working on avid or premiere!
An easy way to send clean aaf to protools! The old fcp7 did it realy easy!
How can we convince people to move on resolve if they can’t semd the audio to edit and mic!
Seaborn studio
https://www.studioseaborn.com
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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostThu Jun 27, 2019 12:56 am

tamagen wrote:I’m in same situation.
If really cannot output audio metadata,
I hope will be can break synced-audio&video files like conpound clips......


When I was trying to figure it out, back in 15. There was a way to break sync and even show the original name, but still it wasn't able to get the original data, when I export the timeline as XMLs.
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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostTue Jul 02, 2019 6:04 pm

This is a super-frustrating bug. I tried 16b4 on a commercial and LOVED almost everything until it came time to export for ProTools. Had the same issues with metadata from source audio metadata referencing my original R3Ds that only had scratch tracks. Tried Avid AFF, tried ProTools export. Tried taking an XML to premiere and still had files missing the synced audio tracks. Eventually, I had to export each audio track as a wave individually and send that to my sound engineer.

Also noticed a weird bug when I was manually conforming my timeline to try to fix the above issue. When I would drag my source audio on top of the old no meta-data audio, the clip didn't really replace the old clip. It just laid over the top of it. I figured this out after replacing all my synced audio clips with the recorded source. Took an XML to premiere and it was still looking for the R3D scratch.I found that if you dragged the new clip down one track, the old track was still there. Had to manually delete every old non-metadata track and then add in the new source audio.
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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostWed Jul 10, 2019 8:12 am

+1
Better export of audio is the only thing Resolve really needs to use it as a NLE.
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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostWed Jul 10, 2019 10:32 am

+1(!)

please elimante that issue before going out of beta. BM is advertising the AAF funtion, so let it be true.

As long as this bug is existing, Resolve can't be considered as a serious production tool.
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etang77

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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostFri Jul 12, 2019 11:06 pm

Can anyone try it on 16b6:

"• Improved naming behavior for synced audio clips when round-tripping to Pro Tools"
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Steinar Stalsberg

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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostSat Jul 13, 2019 2:06 pm

In 16b6 the synced audio-filename is exported when creating AAF with the Pro Tools option in Delivery Page.
But it is exported in the form of: A1-0001_OriginalFilename_A01.wav

Still no audio metadata or iXML metadata is exported.

It is also discussed in this post:
https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=94617
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Peter Chamberlain

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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostTue Jul 16, 2019 4:30 am

Steinar Stalsberg wrote:In 16b6 the synced audio-filename is exported when creating AAF with the Pro Tools option in Delivery Page.
But it is exported in the form of: A1-0001_OriginalFilename_A01.wav

Still no audio metadata or iXML metadata is exported.

It is also discussed in this post:
https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=94617


Can you PM a sample to me of the iXML metadata that you want to export from Resolve into other DAWs?
DaVinci Resolve Product Manager
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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostWed Nov 13, 2019 6:44 am

Has this issue been addressed? I've also tried this feature on 16.1.1 and I'm only getting it to work on raw wav files that haven't been synced exporting separate wav files. On the synced clips with the same audio it doesn't come out. No scene, take, tape or track label metadata on the synced clips (not appended) which use the same file.
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etang77

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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostWed Nov 13, 2019 7:37 am

In case you haven't read my other two post, I'm too lazy to type, so here were what I wrote:

I've finally got my hands on some shooting materials and managed to test exporting AAF. I only did this test with one synced shot and placing after it on the timeline the original polyphonic WAV file.

While DaVinci Resolve does recognise the metadata name of each track assigned by the audio recordist on set, regardless if it is synced or the original file. However, once exported as ProTools AAF and imported into ProTools what I found is this.

The only "metadata" left of the synced part is the original track name plus the extension added by DaVinci Resolve. The timecode has followed that of the video (MOV), and there is no information that was inputted by the sound recordist such as scene numbers, shot numbers, takes, track name (character or mic name).

While the original audio file part has managed to preserve all the metadata mentioned above minus the track names. It is there, but every track has the track name of the first channel of the polyphonic waves, and that is regardless if that first channel is in the timeline or not.

Lastly, I feel there is a lack of options for audio output, I think namely, I can't choose to export the whole audio file or what's in the edit but with handles. I think I can live without the OMF option, and I don't think anyone really cares if it's OMF or AAF as long as the audio export actually works properly.

So I guess there are two parts to the feature request:
1. Full metadata on export of aaf to the files.
2. More options on export of AAF.
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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostThu Nov 14, 2019 4:03 am

Thanks Eric, yeah this exactly what I've found as well. I've had issues finding a good workflow for this in Resolve and Premiere. Premiere has gotten the closest and actually and puts the xml data in the files but slightly incorrectly. To get the iXML data to work I have to modify the interleave index in the xml tags to be 1 instead of it's original track allocation because it is now a mono file. This gets it working in Protools.

Resolve doesn't seem to have any iXML data or xml tags in the written out mono files. It just has the original description metadata (only on non sync wave export) and does not have the actual iXML xml tag information from the file.
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PieroLass

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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostThu Nov 14, 2019 12:59 pm

1. Full metadata on export of aaf to the files.
2. More options on export of AAF.

this is the only feature I need since the fist moment I used davinci as an editing tool in a professional environment. As edinting software is perfect for me but the problem with metadata(expecially with synched clips) and aaf for pro tools make the decision to work on this software always a huge problem at the end of a work. I think professional editors need this badly.
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Michal Sulima

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Re: 16b4 - AAF pro tools export and audio metadatas

PostMon Dec 16, 2019 1:42 pm

Same here, mess coming out the other end of AFF, it seems.

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