120 fps USB C output ?

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Doug Lee Pictures

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120 fps USB C output ?

PostThu Oct 17, 2019 1:26 am

Hello,

I was hoping any of the staff could tell me if it is possible to use the USB C output, recording to the Samsung T5 SSD drive and record 120fps to that drive. I'd love 4k, but 2k is fine if the write speed makes that possible Thanks for any help. I have a shoot coming up soon where I will need to do this. I will also have a Cfast to 2.5 inch SSD drive using an esata cable into the drive.

Thanks for any help!

Doug
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Gary Stanford

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostThu Oct 17, 2019 4:14 am

You won't be able to record 4k at 120fps, however, I've filmed 1080p @ 120fps on a T5 1 TB drive in BRAW Q0 for about 2 minutes without dropped frames, although I understand that BM recommend the 2TB T5 for this application.
1 x BMPCC4k/2 x BMCCs/Davinci Resolve Studio/Decklink Mini Monitor/HD Link Pro /ASRock Z77 Extreme 4 DDR3 x SATA3/Intel i7 3.4GHz/GTX 980ti 6 GB/32BG RAM/3 SAMSUNG 500GB 850 EVO SSD/4 x 3 TB WD HDDs/Seagate 1 TB SATA 3 HDD/OCZ 850w PSU/Windows 7 64bit SP1
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Tim Schumann

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostThu Oct 17, 2019 5:48 am

Important question... What camera are you using?
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Doug Lee Pictures

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostFri Oct 25, 2019 2:29 am

I will be using the Ursa mini Pro G2. It arrives on the 28th so I will have a bit of testing to do. The director on this project will be ok with 2k at 120fps. Will I be able to do this in ProRes 422? It doesn't have to be Raw. Thanks for responding and for the help!
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Tim Schumann

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostFri Oct 25, 2019 2:39 am

You should be able to hit 120fps in 4.6K Blackmagic RAW at 8:1 onto a fast USB-C disk.

Q0 is a great format but is not ideal for high speed recording because the data rate can vary so much.
If you set to 8:1 you should be able to sustain that onto a decent USB-C disk.
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David Hutchinson

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostFri Oct 25, 2019 8:59 am

Tim Schumann wrote:You should be able to hit 120fps in 4.6K Blackmagic RAW at 8:1 onto a fast USB-C disk.

Q0 is a great format but is not ideal for high speed recording because the data rate can vary so much.
If you set to 8:1 you should be able to sustain that onto a decent USB-C disk.


Tim I notice the BMPCC4K now recognises NVME drives with update 6.6, will the USB C port go above SATA data rates when saving? And if I asked really nicely do you think we can have it enabled on the G2 ? :-)
C3@150fps would be wonderful for my wildlife shots.

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rick.lang

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120 fps USB C output ?

PostFri Oct 25, 2019 2:55 pm

If the cameras can support 10Gb/s, you might get to 1200MB/s on NVMe but that might be difficult as it’s close to the theoretical maximum.

Those who have external NVMe drives might be able to test and let us know.

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Cooper

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostFri Oct 25, 2019 3:02 pm

Unless by some miracle a hardware change happens indide the BMPCC4K camera it will be stuck at USB 3.0 5G ~300MB/s datarate. The CFast 2.0 slot on the camera has the far superior SATA 6G ~500MB/s.
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rick.lang

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostFri Oct 25, 2019 3:12 pm

I know they’ve always said the interface was USB-C Gen 1, but you never know unless you try. After all until firmware 6.6, it’s my understanding that folks were reporting there was no NVMe support.


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Doug Lee Pictures

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostFri Oct 25, 2019 6:45 pm

Thanks for the input guys. I will also be using a dummy Cfast card to esata connection into a 500gb SSD. Will this be faster and more reliable than recording with the G2's USB-C output to the Samsung T5 500gb SSD? Again, Just needing minimum 2k 120fps. 4k would be great but I can't imagine how much storage I will burn through.

Thanks for the boost of confidence Tim. I will try the 8:1 Raw, but it could be ProRes HQ also.

Now that I have invested in the higher end G2 camera instead of the Pocket Cinema version which seems to be all the rage, will the G2 be getting all the great firmware updates also regularly?

Thanks so much!
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David Hutchinson

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostFri Oct 25, 2019 7:04 pm

Cooper wrote:Unless by some miracle a hardware change happens indide the BMPCC4K camera it will be stuck at USB 3.0 5G ~300MB/s datarate. The CFast 2.0 slot on the camera has the far superior SATA 6G ~500MB/s.


How do you calculate 300MB/s for gen 1? 5Gb divided by 8 is 625MB but 2 bits per byte for data overhead brings it back down to 500MB/s.

I did mention in a previous post that I was getting 1200MB/s with the NVME drive but I now realise/remember that that was on the PCIE bus. I retested today in the external adapter and reached circa 900MB/s.

I also tested the drive on the P4K and it worked with everything I threw at it, unlike the Samsung T5 which occasionally drops frames in Q0.

So I guess it depends if the USB PORT is gen1 or gen2.... I've not seen any definitive statement by BMD. Can anyone point me to such a statement?
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rick.lang

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostFri Oct 25, 2019 8:08 pm

It’s been mentioned it’s Gen 1, but...


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Doug Lee Pictures

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostTue Oct 29, 2019 8:01 pm

Rick,

Are you using a NVMe drive to record from the Pocket Cinema 4k camera? Tim. Is it possible to record using an NVMe drive with the G2?
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Peter J. DeCrescenzo

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostTue Oct 29, 2019 8:10 pm

David Hutchinson wrote:... So I guess it depends if the USB PORT is gen1 or gen2.... I've not seen any definitive statement by BMD. Can anyone point me to such a statement?


On the product tech specs page it says, "... USB-C 3.1 Gen 1 expansion port for external media for Blackmagic RAW and ProRes Recording ..."
https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/produc ... s/W-CIN-15
http://www.peterdv.com
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rick.lang

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostTue Oct 29, 2019 8:29 pm

Doug Lee Pictures wrote:Rick,

Are you using a NVMe drive to record from the Pocket Cinema 4k camera? Tim. Is it possible to record using an NVMe drive with the G2?


Doug, I’m using that long thin Wise Portable 1TB drive. It interfaces vía SATA and supports up to USB3.1 Gen 2.


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Doug Lee Pictures

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostTue Oct 29, 2019 9:12 pm

Thanks Rick. With the Ursa Mini Pro G2? What kind of enclosure do you have for the NVMe drive?
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rick.lang

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120 fps USB C output ?

PostTue Oct 29, 2019 9:20 pm

Sorry I use this on the BMPCC4K slipped into that tray secured by a cold shoe mount, but it should work on the latest Mini Pro Gen 2.

Image



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Rick Lang
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David Hutchinson

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostWed Oct 30, 2019 9:23 pm

Doug Lee Pictures wrote:Rick,

Are you using a NVMe drive to record from the Pocket Cinema 4k camera? Tim. Is it possible to record using an NVMe drive with the G2?

Doug the G2 does not recognise NVME drives at the moment. The drive I use for my p4ks is a samsung evo ...I think an 860...with an enclosure I bought from amazon.
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Doug Lee Pictures

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostSat Nov 09, 2019 2:46 am

David Hutchinson wrote:
Doug Lee Pictures wrote:Rick,

Are you using a NVMe drive to record from the Pocket Cinema 4k camera? Tim. Is it possible to record using an NVMe drive with the G2?

Doug the G2 does not recognise NVME drives at the moment. The drive I use for my p4ks is a samsung evo ...I think an 860...with an enclosure I bought from amazon.




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Doug Lee Pictures

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostSat Nov 09, 2019 2:51 am

Thanks! I was finally able to test the Samsung T5 and a Samsung blue SSD. They did very well with high speed. There will be no problem recording ProRes 444 at 120 frames per second in 2K. I would shoot higher res except for burning through so much footage. I stopped the camera after over a minute recording.


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Doug Lee Pictures

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Re: 120 fps USB C output ?

PostMon Nov 25, 2019 1:17 am

In case anyone else needs to shoot 120fps, I was able to record over a minute, although I didn't need it, to Samsung T5 and Sandisk Extreme Pro Cfast cards in ProRes 444, 2k. Our project didn't require 4k, so it wasn't a problem stretching the system. Everything went well. Thanks for the posts.

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