Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

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austindonald1

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Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostSat Feb 09, 2019 8:56 pm

Does anyone know a reasonably priced lens to go with the Black magic 4k? (I'm guessing lens is sold separate?)
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Xtreemtec

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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostMon Feb 11, 2019 12:15 pm

Blackmagic 4K what? Studio camera? Ursa 4K? Ursa Broadcast 4K? BMPCC 4K?

No BMD camera is sold with a lens. But it is unclear from your question which camera you mean. ;)
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostMon Feb 11, 2019 3:21 pm

Xtreemtec wrote:Blackmagic 4K what? Studio camera? Ursa 4K? Ursa Broadcast 4K? BMPCC 4K?

No BMD camera is sold with a lens. But it is unclear from your question which camera you mean. ;)


the new bmpcc 4k for $1,295.00
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostMon Feb 11, 2019 3:45 pm

MFT Lens Mount
Compatible with your current lenses!

The Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera 4K uses the same MFT (micro four thirds) lens mount as the original Pocket Cinema Camera so you can use the lenses you already have! The MFT lens mount was designed specifically for smaller camera bodies with shorter flange focal distance. This means you can get high quality professional lenses that are much smaller than ever before! The MFT mount is extremely flexible and allows for different lens adapters. You can get adapters for PL, C, EF and more, so you can use lenses from manufacturers such as Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Leica and even Panavision!


So any MFT lens will do. But remember that the faster the lens. (F2.0 to F4.0) is much more expensive then a kitlens going from F5 to F8.
If you need a fast lens all depends on what the purpose is of your shootings. If you want to do low light shots you need to invest heavily on expensive glass. If you want to do studio work only with controlled light. You can work with lenses that are less expensive.

Also what type of lens you buy all depends on what you need for your shoot. Long lenses for tele shots, or wideangle for closeup / portrait work.
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Uli Plank

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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostTue Feb 12, 2019 7:22 am

A decent starter lens is the Panasonic 12-35mm f2.8.

But as already told, you need to be more specific.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostTue Feb 12, 2019 8:23 am

I just picked up a Zonlai 22mm 1.8 lens for about $100 in MFT mount. I'm doing some tests at the moment and I'll be happy to post some results when I have some time. So far, for $100 it seems like a rather pleasant lens with a roughly 45mm full frame equivalent FOV. It's also small and very light which makes it a good companion with my Ronin-S stabilizer.

More info from this guy:

>>Kays Alatrakchi
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostTue Feb 12, 2019 10:12 am

Why don't you give this thread a read.
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=79973

Lot's of discussion about lenses for the BMPCC4K.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostTue Feb 12, 2019 3:33 pm

You will have to define "reasonably priced." I think that Zeiss Milvus and Sigma APSC Art lenses are reasonably priced because they can fit on other mounts and are great values, whereas others think that these lenses are unreasonably priced and a 50 dollar plastic m43 lens is reasonable. You have to be more specific I think for us to be helpful. What do you want to shoot, how much are you willing to spend, etc.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostTue Feb 12, 2019 4:39 pm

Dune00z wrote:You will have to define "reasonably priced." I think that Zeiss Milvus and Sigma APSC Art lenses are reasonably priced because they can fit on other mounts and are great values, whereas others think that these lenses are unreasonably priced and a 50 dollar plastic m43 lens is reasonable. You have to be more specific I think for us to be helpful. What do you want to shoot, how much are you willing to spend, etc.


My goal is to create cinematic looking indoor headshots to submit for acting jobs and also for fun, to create cinematic looking short films and/or individual scenes.

so i guess ill need a wide angle lens for headshots, as i previously read concerning portraits?
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostTue Feb 12, 2019 4:43 pm

I read about a lens called cine D ( i dont remember the full name), and does that make a difference if the lens is labeled as a Cinema lens? :shock:
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostTue Feb 12, 2019 4:48 pm

Xtreemtec wrote:
MFT Lens Mount
Compatible with your current lenses!

The Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera 4K uses the same MFT (micro four thirds) lens mount as the original Pocket Cinema Camera so you can use the lenses you already have! The MFT lens mount was designed specifically for smaller camera bodies with shorter flange focal distance. This means you can get high quality professional lenses that are much smaller than ever before! The MFT mount is extremely flexible and allows for different lens adapters. You can get adapters for PL, C, EF and more, so you can use lenses from manufacturers such as Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Leica and even Panavision!


So any MFT lens will do. But remember that the faster the lens. (F2.0 to F4.0) is much more expensive then a kitlens going from F5 to F8.
If you need a fast lens all depends on what the purpose is of your shootings. If you want to do low light shots you need to invest heavily on expensive glass. If you want to do studio work only with controlled light. You can work with lenses that are less expensive.

Also what type of lens you buy all depends on what you need for your shoot. Long lenses for tele shots, or wideangle for closeup / portrait work.


indoor cinematic looking headshots, short films and individual scenes during shot during the day is my goal. but i do have 3 soft boxes for night scenes if required.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostTue Feb 12, 2019 4:55 pm

While cinematic can be defined in very individual ways. For headshots (you mean close-ups, do you?) I'd rather get a longer lens, like a fast 40-50mm for the P4K, so that you get some separation from the background by limited depth of field.

Other than that, 'cinematic' is a lot is about lighting, not the lens.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostTue Feb 12, 2019 5:19 pm

As Uli mentioned, closeups of people should not use wide angle lenses unless it suits the purpose of the story. The principal reason is the possible perspective distortion when you get too close to a subject. For example, a too prominent nose and a receding forehead and chin.

A good ‘portrait’ lens on the BMPCC4K would be the 50mm focal length if you are recording the angle of view of the 4K/UHD sensor area. If you are recording from an HD Window, the 24/25mm lens may be fine. If you use a slightly longer length such as 85mm on 4K and 32/35mm on HD, you may still get a very good closeup, but any longer focal lengths and the face might appear too flat.

Another way to determine what makes a good closeup lens can be that you select the lens that gives your frame the size of head that you want while your camera is roughly 6-12’ (2-4m) away from the subject. You break those boundaries if you want the intimate effect it gives you in a scene such as shooting individual players around a small card table, but not for an actor’s video headshot or screen test where you or they want the image to be normal.

Try variations and see what you prefer.


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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostTue Feb 12, 2019 5:33 pm

"Cinematic" is not really helpful in my opinion just because it is so subjective and generally a lens doesn't make things look cinematic exactly to me, it generally has more to do with the composition and lighting. You can get a cinematic looking image with a kit lens if you light the scene right, although it does make it easier to make good looking shots with better lenses of course.

I am assuming you will be shooting in 4K non cropped...

It sounds like you are looking for a specific lens which would provide headshots with shallow depth of field. I would argue that almost any quality name brand fast 50mm lens from the 80s to now would be useful for this purpose. Even an old Canon or Nikon fast 50 for example could do the job you are talking about if you have the room to back up. These will behave with a 100mm FOV

On m43 mount, the Olympus 45 f1.8 I think provides a great looking image for headshots for not that much money, but the mechanics are not too great for manual focusing. I personally, for that price, would rather adapt a Zeiss ZF 50mm F1.4 or Contax Zeiss 50mm f1.4 over the Olympus simply because you could use that same lens on a Full Frame, Super 35, or m43 camera and it has great mechanics. Just stop down to f2/2.8. There is also the Rokinon 50mm f1.4 that is very popular and a good value and I would opt for a non-m43 mount option and adapt it just so the lens can be useful on other mounts.

Hope this helps.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 4:44 am

If you stick to the MFT mount, there are cheaper vintage options. I can recommend Minolta SR lenses, the 50mm f1.4 PG is a very sharp lens. Or the 55mm f1.8, which is a bit more vintage and flattering for faces.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 5:24 am

I think one of the best portrait focal length lenses for MFT is the 42.5mm Panasonic Leica lens, it has the Leica/Zeiss pop to its images, with excellent bokeah and a very film like image quality, you are not going to find in the other options listed here. AF is dead fast, and manual focus works a treat.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 5:49 am

I'd suggest that the Olympus 45mm f1.2 Pro lens would be up there with any lens you might name, the Olympus 25mm f1.2 Pro would be on an equal footing. The interesting thing about this set of lenses, including the 17mm f1.2 Pro and forthcoming 12mm F1.2 Pro is that they are all the same physical size and take the same sized filters.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 6:56 pm

Yes, the new Oly Pro primes are great, and would work well. Having them all match size wise is also excellent. If I didn’t already have the Panny Leica set, these would be my first choice for an overal set to use on the Pocket 4K or GH5S.

As auto focus and focus tracking improve, the need for manual focus gears will soon not be needed anymore (except for the big zooms and large cone Primes of course).
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 7:33 pm

Denny Smith wrote:As auto focus and focus tracking improve, the need for manual focus gears will soon not be needed anymore (except for the big zooms and large cone Primes of course).
Cheers


I don't know about that. If you want to smoothly shift focus from a close subject to one further away or vice versa, I don't think AF can do that (or will be able to do that well enough). AF is more about all or nothing - stay on target at all costs. Great for vloggers.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 8:41 pm

See what I mean about reasonably priced and the reasonableness being all over the place?

BH Prices New [Where possible]

Minolta 50mm f1.4 [USED ONLY] - 50-100 USD
Oly 45 f1.8 - 400 USD
Zeiss ZF 50mm f1.4 - 750 USD
Oly 45 f1.2 pro - 1100 USD
Leica 42.5 f1.2 - 1400 USD


This is a huge range of pricing options from sub 100 dollars to 1400, some needing adaptation and can be used on other formats (super35 or 135) and others only usable on m43 mount. It needs to be defined what "reasonably priced" means before anyone can really be helpful here.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 8:47 pm

Australian Image wrote:
Denny Smith wrote:As auto focus and focus tracking improve, the need for manual focus gears will soon not be needed anymore (except for the big zooms and large cone Primes of course).
Cheers


I don't know about that. If you want to smoothly shift focus from a close subject to one further away or vice versa, I don't think AF can do that (or will be able to do that well enough). AF is more about all or nothing - stay on target at all costs. Great for vloggers.


Well a pre-selected controlled focus pull for near to far or the other way round is quite possible with the Micro cameras using Phill’s One Little Remote ver 3/4. You can select the two focus points, and control the focus speed and ramp up/down rate as the focus get closer to the 2nd target. This is very useable in a shoot.

The new Nikon Z6 using its new S lenses, will track a preselected subject and maintain a smooth focus, with no hunting. You can also punch in a Focus pull from one subject to the next, and again select the focus change speed from slow and smooth to a fast transition. Video AF is getting better with each generation of camera. Likewise, the new PC4K can make a nice focus pull by selecting the focus points on its lcd screen, and seems to work well with the better MFT lenses like the Panny Leica or Oly Pro Primes, John B demonstrated this in one of his sample videos with the OlymPro lenses.

But, I agree, we are a ways off before all this will fully replace manual focus pulls, especially with the larger pro cine lenses. But for some indie and documentary shooting, it is here today.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 8:54 pm

Dune00z wrote:See what I mean about reasonably priced and the reasonableness being all over the place?

BH Prices New [Where possible]

Minolta 50mm f1.4 [USED ONLY] - 50-100 USD
Oly 45 f1.8 - 400 USD
Zeiss ZF 50mm f1.4 - 750 USD
Oly 45 f1.2 pro - 1100 USD
Leica 42.5 f1.2 - 1400 USD

This is a huge range of pricing options from sub 100 dollars to 1400, some needing adaptation and can be used on other formats (super35 or 135) and others only usable on m43 mount. It needs to be defined what "reasonably priced" means before anyone can really be helpful here.


Well the above prices go from very inexpensive (you left out a Contax C/Y 50mm lens, also a good option) to what I would call very reasonable, considering a 45-50mm Cine prime starts at $3500 and up (new Sigma Cine Primes look promising at $3500). Some of the S35 PL Cine lenses are $4-6K for a used copy!

You can get used copies of the Oly 45 and PL 42.5 for less than the new prices quoted above. A PL 42.5 is on eBay for $720 (current bid) to a BIN for $995. Look around, bargains are out there.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 9:00 pm

I suspect that the 'goat remote' :D is probably a little too complex to set up in regular workflow when you can do the same instantly and repeatedly with a follow focus wheel. It's obviously a very handy tool for when the camera is on a tripod and you're filming something that allows you time to manage the settings, as long as you have a compatible lens.

The Nikon again seems to have the same issues when it comes to ease of use. Having to select focus points on an LCD screen, then the speed of focus change, then re-frame and select the move is kind of slow and cumbersome. With a follow focus wheel it's at hand all the time.

No doubt if you want to follow a subject, then the increasingly sophisticated AF is a boon to cinematographers.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 9:08 pm

The issue with buying old, used, lenses like the Minolta (I have a number of them), is that you are playing hit and miss with the quality of the lens. You really don't know how well they have been looked after until you get it and once received, may not be returnable.

Then you have a similar issue with quality adapters for these older lenses. Some adapters are absolutely woeful, either in build quality or precision, and you usually can't make any adjustments if the adapter is misaligned. And then if you want a quality adapter, such as a Metabones or one of their speedboosters, you're up for quite a bit of extra cost.

I'm not against these older lens, not by a long shot, but have your eyes wide open to the issues if you decide to take this path.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 10:44 pm

Denny, I realize that you personally find certain lenses reasonably priced, but you are not the OP. The OP needs to be more specific by providing a price range or maximum price. I think that 800-1500 is reasonable as long as the lens performs clearly better to the competition, and not reasonable at that price to get a lens only usable on m43 mount, simply because I shoot with various camera bodies with varying mounts. Our personal feelings about what is or isnt reasonable is likely not the same as the OP's.

I also am aware that used lenses are available, however the differences are still there. A Leica 42.5 Used will be far more expensive than an Oly 45 f1.8 which will be far more than an old SLR lens like the Minolta.

I agree with Australian Image regarding buying vintage lenses. It took me years to collect a set of old primes in good condition and I got rid of all of them after shooting with a Sigma 18-35 f1.8 and a Zeiss Milvus 50 f1.4 on the pocket 4k. It was a no contest, too obvious situation for my purposes.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 11:10 pm

Ditto, we do not know what the OP’s idea of reasonable is. I was replying to the previous thread about lens price ranges. I have some vintage Nikon mount lenses, had a nice set of Zeiss ZF lenses, that were Cine moded by Duclos. But, I have found that if you are using a MFT camera like the Pocket 4K, to take advantage of all it features, MFT lenses offer a good choice in the $500-1200 range. Adapted lenses have their own set of issues, and is a route I would not recommend to a new user.

After having used adapted lenses in the original Pocket and Micro Cinema camera, MFT lenses were much quicker to use, smaller and lighter, and fit the small character of the camera better. I also had a full set of Veydra Mini Primes, MFT Mount, and before the new Pocket was announced, sold them because I thought MFT for cine and Video was coming to the end, which no new cameras released in more than a year.

If you want future proof lenses, than larger vintage lenses that can be adapted and PL mount glass is the way to go. That said, the OP wanted a nice filmic looking lens for head and shoulder interviews. So for that application, in a simple to setup and use, no adapters or worn vintage lens issues, the PL 42.5 or Oly 45mm lenses would be my first choice, and recommendation. For a full manual lens, the Veydra 50mm Mini prime is excellent, but very hard to come by now. SLR Magic is releasing a new MicroPrime cine lens, in $500-600 price range, slightly larger than the Verydra, but of a similar design.

We all have our preferences, and this is just my opinion, based on my experience. ;)
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 11:41 pm

Australian Image wrote:I suspect that the 'goat remote' :D is probably a little too complex to set up in regular workflow when you can do the same instantly and repeatedly with a follow focus wheel. It's obviously a very handy tool for when the camera is on a tripod and you're filming something that allows you time to manage the settings, as long as you have a compatible lens.

The Nikon again seems to have the same issues when it comes to ease of use. Having to select focus points on an LCD screen, then the speed of focus change, then re-frame and select the move is kind of slow and cumbersome. With a follow focus wheel it's at hand all the time.

No doubt if you want to follow a subject, then the increasingly sophisticated AF is a boon to cinematographers.


True, if you are using manual focus lenses, than a Follow Focus is the way to go. Yes, the Goat Remote is more for tripod work if using the focus pull feature. It takes several steps to set up.

The Nikon Z6 is quick, you preset the focus change speed, then touch the screen for the first focus point, and when ready to go to the next point, just press that subject while filming, and it pulls the focus change, no reframing required.

For subject tracking with the Z6, you frame the subject of shooting handheld, press the set button, and tracking is set (or touch the screen if in a tripod), and the camera will track and keep that person in focus. This would be great for shooting a medium/long shot of a speaker who walks around the stage during their presentation, an issue I have dealt with frequently.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostWed Feb 13, 2019 11:59 pm

What I would see more beneficial with these electronic lenses is a way to simply assign a button/dial/toggle (with the ability to preset speed) to change the focus backwards or forwards. Mind you, this is not going to be easy if you're using a shoulder rig, Easyrig or gimbal, or even on a tripod if you're following a subject.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 1:53 am

Yes, it would be nice Ray. And that is how the One Little Remote works, you have a button assigned to toggle the focus back and forth, with a dial to control the speed.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 2:26 am

I had a further look and the goat remote isn't for the BMPCC4K. The focus control is also a dial, which I don't think is ideal. The concept is pretty good, but it's very much camera specific.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 2:31 am

Well, the OP is quite silent, he might have been overwhelmed by the amount of information. But that's the problem without a detailed question: you get too many answers!

I have to admit that buying into vintage glass needs a lot of experience and knowledge. BTW, forgot to mention the Zeiss Contax C/Y 50mm f1.7. You can still find it for a reasonable price and it's excellent. The higher you aim (like going Zeiss), the better your chance that the equipment has been treated well.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 4:18 am

Thanks for the replies, I am occasionally studying them, waiting for my brain to remember the downloaded information :shock: :geek:
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 4:25 am

Dune00z wrote:"Cinematic" is not really helpful in my opinion just because it is so subjective and generally a lens doesn't make things look cinematic exactly to me, it generally has more to do with the composition and lighting. You can get a cinematic looking image with a kit lens if you light the scene right, although it does make it easier to make good looking shots with better lenses of course.

I am assuming you will be shooting in 4K non cropped...

It sounds like you are looking for a specific lens which would provide headshots with shallow depth of field. I would argue that almost any quality name brand fast 50mm lens from the 80s to now would be useful for this purpose. Even an old Canon or Nikon fast 50 for example could do the job you are talking about if you have the room to back up. These will behave with a 100mm FOV

On m43 mount, the Olympus 45 f1.8 I think provides a great looking image for headshots for not that much money, but the mechanics are not too great for manual focusing. I personally, for that price, would rather adapt a Zeiss ZF 50mm F1.4 or Contax Zeiss 50mm f1.4 over the Olympus simply because you could use that same lens on a Full Frame, Super 35, or m43 camera and it has great mechanics. Just stop down to f2/2.8. There is also the Rokinon 50mm f1.4 that is very popular and a good value and I would opt for a non-m43 mount option and adapt it just so the lens can be useful on other mounts.

Hope this helps.

What is a non m43 mount? Also with a speed booster?
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 4:42 am

Somewhere around 500.00 for a lens, also would like to get a speed booster to increase image quality?
Main use will be for indoor/outdoor head shots (to like something that came out of a movie when you hit pause) and creating scenes (for auditions) and I would like to learn how to create really nice cinematic short films.

* I would like to capture a movie like or cinematic looking headshot taken out of individual scenes or a short film where I can capture a real expression, not like a pose in front of a camera.

if necessary, I will spend more than 500.00 on a lens to help me achieve this goal.

This is a life long learning process, and as I am learning, I may not be wording my questions the way I should be, thanks for everyone's patience.
Last edited by austindonald1 on Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 4:47 am

A Speedbooster won't increase quality. If the lens is crap, the Speedbooster will increase the crap.

Rather than worrying about lenses, I think you should consider doing some study or courses in cinema, in order to learn what it's really all about. Methinks you are starting at the wrong end.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 4:50 am

Australian Image wrote:A Speedbooster won't increase quality. If the lens is crap, the Speedbooster will increase the crap.

Rather than worrying about lenses, I think you should consider doing some study or courses in cinema, in order to learn what it's really all about. Methinks you are starting at the wrong end.


I looked for courses at the colleges around my area, I hadn't had much luck finding cinema photography
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 4:53 am

Kays Alatrakchi wrote:I just picked up a Zonlai 22mm 1.8 lens for about $100 in MFT mount. I'm doing some tests at the moment and I'll be happy to post some results when I have some time. So far, for $100 it seems like a rather pleasant lens with a roughly 45mm full frame equivalent FOV. It's also small and very light which makes it a good companion with my Ronin-S stabilizer.

More info from this guy:



A nice lens for only 100 would be like a dream come true, lol
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 5:02 am

austindonald1 wrote:
Australian Image wrote:A Speedbooster won't increase quality. If the lens is crap, the Speedbooster will increase the crap.

Rather than worrying about lenses, I think you should consider doing some study or courses in cinema, in order to learn what it's really all about. Methinks you are starting at the wrong end.


I looked for courses at the colleges around my area, I hadn't had much luck finding cinema photography


Go to YouTube and you'll find lots of useful (and sometimes not so useful) videos on film making and related issues. Names to look for are:

D4Darious
YCI Imaging
Tom Antos
Curtis Judd (more for audio)
Brandon Li
Cinecom.net (actually quite good if you take the time)
COMV (interesting stuff about a project they are doing)

Just watching these and others and you'll start to learn and understand what's involved in the entire film making process.
https://australianimage.com.au/
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 6:17 am

Australian Image wrote:I had a further look and the goat remote isn't for the BMPCC4K. The focus control is also a dial, which I don't think is ideal. The concept is pretty good, but it's very much camera specific.


Ray, I did say the One Little Remote Goat was for,
with the Micro cameras using Phill’s One Little Remote ver 3/4...
as in Micro Cinema or Micro Studio Cameras...
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 6:21 am

A Speed Booster is useful for increasing the angle of view on S35/Full Frame lenses, like Nikon, Canon, Contax, Leica, etc. when these lenses are used on a smaller sensor camera like GH5/S and BM’s Pocket Camera 4K, or the original Pocket Camera and the Micro Cameras. You can not use a Speed Booster on a MFT lens. As previously mentioned, it does not improve the lens quality, or add any special look to the image, other than the expanded field of view, lost on small sensor cameras.
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Last edited by Denny Smith on Thu Feb 14, 2019 8:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 6:24 am

I realise that, but I thought there may have been other versions, since this thread was about the BMPCC4K and you mentioned the product.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 7:48 am

In an effort to cut through......
Video making is a side gig to my main gig, so I work to a budget. I had the original pocket for years and am now using the Pocket 4K.
To be fair, the bigger, high end, more professional lenses are beyond my budget at $1500 to $3000.
The Panny/Leica lenses are at the top end of what I would pay. To me they feel more like Panasonic lenses (rightly or wrongly). The best Panasonic footage I've seen (subjective opinion) has been from the 12-35mm, which seems like a fantastic all-rounder, starter lens.
The affordable lenses I'm personally liking are from Voigtlander and SLR magic, both in m4/3rds format.

On used lenses, I have bought a few. They sit on the shelves of many small, local camera stores. So you can grill the store owner before buying, or probably return the lens if it is mis-described or dodgy.
Two of my favourite lenses I bought (blind) off Ebay - a Kodak Cine Ektar 25mm, pretty sharp, beautiful colour rendition and hasn't vignetted on my Pocket 4K - and an Alpa Kern Switar 50mm 1.8, a somewhat iconic lens, incredible macro performance.
If I was going to buy a 'soft' forgiving portrait lens, it would be one of those 1970's Nikon or Canon 50mm. They are often quite affordable.
I wouldn't bother with a Speedbooster. Most off the time it's not needed and just adds another cost. I sold my BMPCC version and am just using dumb adapters for now.
I don't think the lens adapter game is that complex or full of pitfalls. Just buy quality. Mine are either Metabones or Voigtlander. I haven't had a problem with either brand.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 8:09 am

If you buy quality adapters, then you have less to worry about, but people often don't want to spend hundreds on a piece of metal with a hole in it, when they can get one for $10. What could go wrong?

It's like those that buy expensive cameras and then look for the cheapest batteries instead of OEM and then wonder why they don't last, get stuck or catch fire.

On another note, some very good lenses to consider are the older Olympus OM lenses, just about every one of these was a gem. The few I have are outstanding, though I'm loathe to do much lens swapping in our dusty conditions.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 11:44 am

Another good learning resource would be http://www.filmmakeriq.com and to some degree https://wolfcrow.com/cinematography-for-beginners/
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 3:31 pm

Australian Image wrote:
austindonald1 wrote:
Australian Image wrote:A Speedbooster won't increase quality. If the lens is crap, the Speedbooster will increase the crap.

Rather than worrying about lenses, I think you should consider doing some study or courses in cinema, in order to learn what it's really all about. Methinks you are starting at the wrong end.


I looked for courses at the colleges around my area, I hadn't had much luck finding cinema photography


Go to YouTube and you'll find lots of useful (and sometimes not so useful) videos on film making and related issues. Names to look for are:

D4Darious
YCI Imaging
Tom Antos
Curtis Judd (more for audio)
Brandon Li
Cinecom.net (actually quite good if you take the time)
COMV (interesting stuff about a project they are doing)

Just watching these and others and you'll start to learn and understand what's involved in the entire film making process.

Thanks, i'm relying on you tube channels and black magic forum for learning the cine-magic .
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 4:54 pm

Does the sensor draw the light to a single focal point after the light travels through the len's glass?

I'm trying to understand why light enters the lens glass in a straight line, but doesn't exit the glass in straight line.

or if it exits the glass to a focal point, not because of the sensor drawing it (like electricity drawn to a light bulb when turned on) but because of how the lens glass is shaped? :shock:
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 5:51 pm

I've been using a Blackmagic Pocket for ten years and I don't know that.
I think people meant - research about your day to day needs filmmaking, watch reviews of the Pocket 4K, what other people are using and how they are using their lenses, cages, lights etc....
I learnt by reading many threads here, also looking for people on Youtube and Vimeo that are making great footage with the camera. They often also have tutorials, or videos about their equipment.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 7:05 pm

Chris Whitten wrote:I've been using a Blackmagic Pocket for ten years and I don't know that.
I think people meant - research about your day to day needs filmmaking, watch reviews of the Pocket 4K, what other people are using and how they are using their lenses, cages, lights etc....
I learnt by reading many threads here, also looking for people on Youtube and Vimeo that are making great footage with the camera. They often also have tutorials, or videos about their equipment.


Sometimes when I have trouble holding information, as if it goes in one ear and out the other without stopping in the middle, I shift my attention to the fine details and "fine tune' my understanding of how it works, i have an easier time remembering....
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 8:21 pm

No, a sensor does not “draw” the light in, no more than film would. A lens is an optical device that gathers in the light and it converges to a point in the lens, then expands back out to create an image circle, that is projected on the film/sensor plane. Take a piece of paper draw a triangle/cone wide base at the top to a point down, then join it to the point of another triangle point up base down, the point they meet is the focal point or entrance/exit pupil, now draw a horizontal elliptical circle around that point, which is your lens. This is how your Eye works also, the lens takes in a wide area, then projects the image to a smaller area.
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Re: Black magic 4k lens recommendation?

PostThu Feb 14, 2019 8:22 pm

Australian Image wrote:I realise that, but I thought there may have been other versions, since this thread was about the BMPCC4K and you mentioned the product.


It would be nice, if Phil or someone else, could come up with a similar remote for the new Pocket camera. Give it Time Ray, and one will probably pop up.
Cheers
Denny Smith
SHA Productions
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