Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

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Pete Tomkies

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Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostFri Mar 08, 2019 1:36 am

With the latest update to the Pocket 4K the approved USB-C SSD list has been updated and the Samsung T5 removed from the RAW (now BRAW) list. Does anyone know why? It is still listed for ProRes at similar data rates. Thanks! :-)
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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostFri Mar 08, 2019 2:17 am

The T5 works fine with the latest update.
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rick.lang

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Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostFri Mar 08, 2019 5:09 am

I noticed the Wise 128/256 cards are still listed and the Wise Portable SSD 512GB (but not the 1TB?) were added so I got lucky there.



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Kristian Lam

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostFri Mar 08, 2019 5:34 am

More media being tested so it’s just in the queue.
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rick.lang

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostFri Mar 08, 2019 2:58 pm

Thanks, Kristian. Then I may hold off on the Wise Portable SSD purchase to see if the 1TB passed.


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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostSun Mar 17, 2019 10:22 am

I would be surprised if the Wise 1TB SSD doesn't make it on that list. It is fast in my use between it and the Mac Pro copying a large folder to it and from it.
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rick.lang

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostSun Mar 17, 2019 3:46 pm

Encouraging feedback. Have you run the Blackmagic Speed Test and the AJA dusk speed test with the graph turned on that shows the performance over time? The AJA graph is very good to see if the performance might have issues or if it’s easily handling sustained workload.


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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostSun Mar 17, 2019 4:59 pm

I did test it and just tried again. Remember it is a USB-C cable whiich I have to add an Angelbird C-USB converter to fit my Mac Pro which is USB 3.0 only.

Unfortunately the software needs updating as the disk speed has no BRAW yet.

Also remember I still have no camera, so I cannot really call myself experienced. The stress option was set to 5GB. The Wise has 1.5 GB used in video files and still images in 61 files.
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rick.lang

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostMon Mar 18, 2019 4:09 am

Thanks for the chart. Good point about the utility that needs to be updated for BRAW!

It’s never been a well-thought out as it’s missing a lot. Fine when it was created in a simpler HD world and they added some 2K, but needs to be rethought to be driven by selections from a menu of choices instead of an inadequate fixed layout in my opinion.

I’m sure it will be rewritten when the dust settles (as if the dust ever settles at BMD).


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Chris Whitten

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostMon Mar 18, 2019 8:25 am

FWIW, I've had the Wise 512GB SSD from day one of my Pocket 4K ownership and I've been extremely impressed. I've never had a single glitch using it and it comes with an elegant mounting solution for the Pocket 4K.
It's small and light, and it always mounts on both the Pocket 4K and my MacBook Pro.
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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostMon Mar 18, 2019 8:59 am

Chris Whitten wrote:FWIW, I've had the Wise 512GB SSD from day one of my Pocket 4K ownership and I've been extremely impressed. I've never had a single glitch using it and it comes with an elegant mounting solution for the Pocket 4K.
It's small and light, and it always mounts on both the Pocket 4K and my MacBook Pro.


I’ll second that on my Mac Pro and Macbook 12” it is fast! Light and elegant mounting. Well thought out.
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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostWed Mar 20, 2019 11:09 am

I was out filming a documentary on migrating Birds yesterday and using BRAW Q0. For the first time ever I experienced dropped frames with my Samsung T5 2TB. It seemed to be fine until the birds moved from water into grass and I suspect the fine detail required for the grass pushed the datarate above what the T5 could cope with.
I was shooting 4K DCI at 50fps and moved to C3 without any further dropped frames.

This was disappointing. Unfortunately I didn't get to test my second BMPCC4K which has a 1TB T5 attached as it was out on hire.

I guess I should have tried it at 4K but was more intent on getting the footage I required then testing codecs.
For me this means I just can't trust the T5 at Q0.
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David Hutchinson

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostWed Mar 20, 2019 11:19 am

David Hutchinson wrote:I was out filming a documentary on migrating Birds yesterday and using BRAW Q0. For the first time ever I experienced dropped frames with my Samsung T5 2TB. It seemed to be fine until the birds moved from water into grass and I suspect the fine detail required for the grass pushed the datarate above what the T5 could cope with.
I was shooting 4K DCI at 50fps and moved to C3 without any further dropped frames.

This was disappointing. Unfortunately I didn't get to test my second BMPCC4K which has a 1TB T5 attached as it was out on hire.

I guess I should have tried it at 4K but was more intent on getting the footage I required then testing codecs.
For me this means I just can't trust the T5 at Q0.


Here is the disk speed data for the T5
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rick.lang

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostWed Mar 20, 2019 7:58 pm

You should have been fine with those speeds on Q0. Q0 tops out as if it was 2:1 compression. So the Blackmagic Disk Speed Test isn’t a guarantee. It may be that you test was run when the card was below half full. Your filming may have occurred when the card was more than half full. Or there could be other internal issues.

Try the AJA Speed Test with the history view turned on and see if the performance is a smooth straight line or a very jagged line full of ups and downs which means you aren’t always getting the bitrate you need.


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David Hutchinson

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostWed Mar 20, 2019 11:22 pm

I downloaded the AJA speed test and it gave almost identical results with pretty much straight line graphs.
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rick.lang

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostThu Mar 21, 2019 2:39 am

Thanks, David. I had expected peaks and valleys but a plain line should be good. I suppose it only takes a moment for a bitrate to run higher or the internal data controller in the card to have a slowdown. Glad 3:1 worked well for you.


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Andrew Kolakowski

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostThu Mar 21, 2019 10:43 am

Good camera should have some bit of RAM and cache data to RAM first. No ida how BM cameras are designed.
The best example of this are ingest systems. Poor ones (like MediaExpress) seems to dump data straight to disks and any smallest hiccup in the system= dropped frames. Good ones, like Edius (or Tools on Air) are well designed and use RAM as cache. In this case you have 99.9% reliability. I've ingested 1000s of tapes with Edius 5 over 5 years and never had a single dropped frame! ( in some cases I was at the same time encoding for Blu-ray with CPU killed at 90%). It was that stable. Same system, but using Premiere was a nightmare. Same applies to camera, but it's all down to design and costs.
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rick.lang

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostThu Mar 21, 2019 1:14 pm

Andrew, the BMD cameras may have a small buffer but they write data in real-time in a way that can’t wait for a card that can’t keep up with the bitrate. Cards also may vary with the size of their internal buffer, but those are also limited with the camera pushing data without pausing. This was briefly described years ago, but I’m assuming something so fundamental has essentially followed the same method with newer cameras. One of the reasons that BMD tests the cards so frequently.

We know there are some buffers as even cards that cannot possibly keep up may continuously record a second or two.


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Andrew Kolakowski

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostThu Mar 21, 2019 2:55 pm

Well, if card is simply too slow then even big buffer won't help. It's more for some random hiccups. Bigger buffer always helps, but it comes at cost.
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Jim Giberti

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostThu Mar 21, 2019 5:59 pm

FWIW, I'm seeing consistnent 425ish W&R speeds on the T5s using a USB-C to USB-3 interface.

From an editing standpoint, we have 1TB T5s as edit drives and they play 4k Braw with 2 -3 nodes of LUT, Balance and CC perfectly even on a MBP.
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Andrew Kolakowski

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostThu Mar 21, 2019 7:37 pm

USB3 is most likely limiting you a bit in this case.
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Jim Giberti

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostThu Mar 21, 2019 7:59 pm

Oh, it definitely is - that's why I specified the step down from C to 3.
The important point is that it's still performing at a great level for 4k editing - a negligible difference compared to straight USB-C.
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Andrew Kolakowski

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostThu Mar 21, 2019 8:49 pm

Yes as it looks like a decent drive.
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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostFri May 10, 2019 4:24 pm

Has anyone shot BRAW 3:1 using samsung T5 1TB without any problem? I just bought the pocket BMPCC and I am searching for media solution (2TB version is a little bit expensive for me right now)
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JordanWright

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostFri May 10, 2019 6:43 pm

I shoot BRAW 3:1 using the Samsung T5 500GB. the 1TB should work too.
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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostFri May 10, 2019 8:49 pm

fotiadischris wrote:Has anyone shot BRAW 3:1 using samsung T5 1TB without any problem? I just bought the pocket BMPCC and I am searching for media solution (2TB version is a little bit expensive for me right now)


No problem with that. Usually the higher capacity drives tend to perform better than the lower ones, so you'll be fine.
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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostFri May 10, 2019 10:22 pm

I can confirm 80 minutes of continuous 3:1 4K shooting with the T5 1TB, no problem whatsoever...
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Kim Janson

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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostSat May 11, 2019 1:50 am

The problem is that SSD reduces performance over time. They have limited write cycles. When it eventually starts failing, there is error correction, but that will slow it down. The in computer installed SSD usually have trim functionality, that keeps it running better. Not sure how it is on the external SSD. I do not have much knowledge on this, but it is also my experience that eventually they will slow down.

Bad cable or connection could also cause problems. Just fixed TB2 RAID disk problems by changing the cable that had been working good for years. The disk started disconnecting couple of times in a week and computer crashing occasionally. Changing the cable completely fixed it.

It would be good if the BMD disk test would provide graph or variance in addition to speed. The gauge pretty much just gives the average speeds that is not very interesting regarding dropping frames, unless the camera has huge buffer.
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Re: Samsung T5 removed from approved list?

PostSat May 11, 2019 2:22 am

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