8K Pro - 1080p60 input automatic detection error (=1080p30)

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engineertony

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  • Real Name: Antony Burness

8K Pro - 1080p60 input automatic detection error (=1080p30)

PostThu Mar 18, 2021 6:47 pm

Hi everyone,

I'm using a Decklink 8K Pro on a windows 10 machine (details below). My input source is an SDI 3G 1080p60 (unknown pixel format) yet the Decklink keeps automatically detecting the input as 1080p30 and doesn't appear to capture on the PC.

The signal outputs/views fine on the BlackMagic SmartScope 4k and a Sony LMD325 monitor.

Using Desktop Video 12 and Media Express there is no video output except for a single half frame that flashes up approximately every 2 seconds.
vMix previews a frame that updates about once every 2-3 seconds and more often than not the frame is corrupted with noise over the majority of the frame.

I've tried what I think is "manually setting the input format" using one of the SDK programs CaptureStills.exe with a whole range of settings including:
Code: Select all
\capturestills -d 0 -m 11 -n 1 -i 1 C:\Temp\
which is meant to try capture 1 frame assuming an input of 1080p60. However the program errors out on a "Timeout waiting for frame".
I've tried in both the SDK 10.11.4 and SDK 12.
I've also tried the CapturePreview.exe that comes packed with the SDK examples with no luck.

Any thoughts or suggestions?

  • Card:
    > Decklink 8K Pro (PCIe)
  • OS:
    > Windows 10 64x
  • PC:
    > Dell T3600 workstation
    > Intel Xenon E5-1607 3GHz
    > 12GB Ram (1600MHz DDR3)
    > NVIDIA P1000 Graphics
    > 1TB SSD - for capture
    > 5TB HHD
Antony B
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Cameron Nichols

Blackmagic Design

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Re: 8K Pro - 1080p60 input automatic detection error (=1080p

PostTue Mar 23, 2021 2:44 am

Hi Antony,

Could you please run prebuilt SDK sample DeviceStatus (or DeviceStatusCSharp) in parallel with Media Express or CaptureStills? Hopefully the detected status flags will give some insight into why the format detection is wrong.

In particular I'm interested to know whether the signal is 422 or 444, single-link or dual-link, ..

Regards
Cameron
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engineertony

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Re: 8K Pro - 1080p60 input automatic detection error (=1080p

PostTue Mar 23, 2021 5:52 pm

Hi Cameron,

Thanks for the reply.
Attached are the screenshots at Full (SDI 1,2 in 3,4 out) and Half Duplex (SDI 1io, 2io, 3io, 4io).

At Half Duplex (I think that is the correct phrase). It looks like the Decklink is struggling to lock onto the signal. The Video Input Locked state toggles rapidly between True and False.
20210323 Device status with capture (1io, 2io, 3io ,4io).PNG
Device status during capture, SDI inputs set to 1io, 2io, 3io, 4io
20210323 Device status with capture (1io, 2io, 3io ,4io).PNG (41.23 KiB) Viewed 4252 times


Also tried setting to Full Duplex (I don't understand these settings very well sorry).
20210323 Device status with capture (1,2in, 3,4 out).PNG
Device status during capture, SDI inputs set to 1+2 in, 3+4 out
20210323 Device status with capture (1,2in, 3,4 out).PNG (46.67 KiB) Viewed 4252 times


=======================
Also UPDATE on other things tried.
  • Saw another thread about possible issues with PCIe 2 vs 3 slot. I've tried both, no change, currently in PCIe 3 slot.
  • Saw a thread on issues with the DesktopVideo12 and Windows 20H2 update. I've tried reverting to 10.11.4 and 11.0 with no change. Back to v12 now.
Antony B
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Cameron Nichols

Blackmagic Design

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Re: 8K Pro - 1080p60 input automatic detection error (=1080p

PostWed Mar 24, 2021 6:38 am

Hi Antony,

As a comparison, the following screenshot shows the expected DeviceStatus windows for when the input is locked to 1080p60. Note the Detected video input status fields - these aren't present in your capture, so I suspect that the DeckLink has not been able to determine the input signal or SDI payload. Are you able to share details of your source?

DeviceStatus-Detected1080p60.png
DeviceStatus-Detected1080p60.png (20.78 KiB) Viewed 4234 times


Regards
Cameron
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engineertony

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Re: 8K Pro - 1080p60 input automatic detection error (=1080p

PostThu Mar 25, 2021 4:28 pm

Hi Cameron,
Thanks for the quick response.
Hmm that does look a lot better in your capture.

Unfortunately the source for our system is a custom board that was made by a supplier. I have requested additional information from them in regards to the signal format and if there is something unusual in their encoding format (maybe HANC instead of VANC). It uses a custom FGPA to process a pair of stereographic CMOS sensors into a pair of SDI signals, and the only details I have about the signal is that it is 3G 1080p60.

I find it weird that the SmartScope and Sony Monitor manage to present the signal ok, maybe they have a more robust signal processor? Additionally I have a cheap and cheerful SDI->HDMI converter that when plugged into a similarly cheap and cheerful HDMI->USB capture device can capture the video fine (just does it at a lower quality with a slight colour shift).

Do you think I need to look into frame synchroniser (like a yellobrik PVD1800) or similar?

Thanks.
Kind regards,
Antony
Antony B
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Cameron Nichols

Blackmagic Design

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Re: 8K Pro - 1080p60 input automatic detection error (=1080p

PostFri Mar 26, 2021 10:19 am

Hi Antony,

Are you able to check whether you can capture the dual-link stereoscopic signal when you are in either 1 sub-device half-duplex or 1 sub-device full-duplex profiles? Both these profiles support dual-link capture - see the connector mapping in section 2.4.11 of the DeckLink SDK Manual.

Regards
Cameron
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engineertony

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Re: 8K Pro - 1080p60 input automatic detection error (=1080p

PostMon Mar 29, 2021 1:30 pm

Hi Cameron,

I hope you had a good weekend. Thanks again for your help on this.
I've tried the following connections and capture profiles, still no video shown in CapturePreview or MediaExpress.

Full Duplex with SDI feeds in SDI 1 and SDI 2
20210329 Full 1+2.png
Full duplex
20210329 Full 1+2.png (220.14 KiB) Viewed 4137 times


Half Duplex with SDI feeds in SDI 3 and SDI 4
20210329 Half 4+3 (2).png
Half duplex
20210329 Half 4+3 (2).png (99.69 KiB) Viewed 4133 times


Let me know if I connected the feeds/channels to the wrong SDI ports for each setup.
I did try other combinations of feeds into the other SDI ports but didn't get a "video input locked" TRUE flag with the others.

The signal appears to lock and convert fine on a the SDI->HDMI LiNKFOR (amazon) converter with 1 channel/eye at a time.

Thanks again.
Kind regards,
Antony
Last edited by engineertony on Mon Mar 29, 2021 2:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Antony B
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engineertony

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Re: 8K Pro - 1080p60 input automatic detection error (=1080p

PostMon Mar 29, 2021 2:17 pm

Hi Cameron,
I've also just tried a AJA Hi5-3D unit, not sure if it helps but thought getting a second data point might help.

It doesn't look like the unit is compatible with 1080p60 but I thought I would try as the manual notes "p60 functionality may be added at a future date".
The detected signal formats are listed on the left port.
Unfortunately the resulting input was just garbage, depending on the output mode, it was just a series of single pixel brightly coloured lines.

AJA Hi5-3D output.jpg
HDMI output (AJA Hi5-3D)
AJA Hi5-3D output.jpg (875.18 KiB) Viewed 4135 times

20210323 AJA capture formats.PNG
AJA Hi5-3D control window
20210323 AJA capture formats.PNG (63.04 KiB) Viewed 4135 times
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kdoremus9

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Re: 8K Pro - 1080p60 input automatic detection error (=1080p

PostTue Mar 28, 2023 3:15 am

Was there any movement on this by chance? This is exactly what I am seeing with my own hardware.

I am using a Decklink 8K Pro. I am attempting to receive 4 input video channels at 1080p60.
Upon attempting to receive video, Media Express is blank yet claiming the input resolution is 1080p30.

I have each of the channels set to "SDI 1 In or Out" (SDI X In or Out) so that all can be used as inputs.
If I switch to "SDI 1 and 2 In, SDI 3 and 4 Out", I get a one frame, mostly corrupted, once every 5 seconds or so.

I have confirmed using both an SDI-to-HDMI converter and an SDI monitor that the video is accepted by different monitor types, just not the capture card.
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kdoremus9

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Re: 8K Pro - 1080p60 input automatic detection error (=1080p

PostThu Mar 30, 2023 12:26 am

Answering myself here, but for closure the issue I was having (and maybe the other users in this thread were having) is that the video signal from the camera was not following SMPTE standards.

We solved this by putting a Decimator MD-HX between the camera and the capture card. The MD-HX recognized the input video as 1080p60 even though I guess it was not exact SMPTE standards, and then it spit out a 1080p60 signal that the capture card could read.
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Xtreemtec

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Re: 8K Pro - 1080p60 input automatic detection error (=1080p

PostTue Apr 04, 2023 12:16 pm

Based on that answer it looks like the wrong VPID (Video Payload IDentifier ) flag is set to identify the signal as a correct 3G SMPTE signal.

This is often where Chinese companies go bust as they use a SDI Serializer from Gennum that is for the security business side of SDI. which is cheaper but does not comply to SMPTE regulations.

The proper Video Payload IDentifier is very needed to identify the signal. And BMD also had some products in the past that did not do this properly resulting is big compatibility issues with other vendors hardware.

See this document green section about VPID.
https://www.telestream.net/pdfs/technic ... 74-2-2.pdf

It is pretty known that Decimator is able to recover the signal based on stream info and does not look at the VPI. This is why these units are live savers in the world of SDI.

It is also known that the Constellation 8K by default output the REC2020 flag while it is running in REC709. Which causes a lot of issues with other hardware.. ;) 3 years later and still not solved...
Daniel Wittenaar .:: Xtreemtec Media Productions ::. -= www.xtreemtec.nl =-
4K OBV Trailer, ATEM TVS HD, 4M/E Broadcast Studio 4K, Constelation 8K, Hyperdeck Studio 12G, Ursa Broadcast 4K, 4K fiber converters with Sony Control

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