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gsean96

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Expose image

PostTue Nov 22, 2022 9:19 am

Hi, I’m new to the cinematography world and black magic cameras. I uploaded a picture to illustrate what I mean because I don’t know how it’s called , it’s looked like a sort of waves when the image has almost no noise . Can someone please tell me how it’s called, how to achieve it in every shot and what does it mean? Because In every clean image I see has those sort of lines or waves . I use the Bmpcc 6k pro with sigma art prime lenses.Image
I once did while exposing at 200 iso, 1.8 Iris and the image was a bit under exposed. I really appreciate any instruction. Thank you.


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GalinMcMahon

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Re: Expose image

PostWed Nov 23, 2022 4:13 pm

It's hard to tell on my office monitor but it appears to be banding. Are you maybe editing in 8 bit? I believe there is an effect called 'Debander' that should help with that. Or you could select the darker regions in color and lower the MD (midtone dynamics) or just add some subtle blur.
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Chris Cronin

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Re: Expose image

PostWed Nov 23, 2022 6:34 pm

Probably not related, but any reason why you exposed at 200 ISO?
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John Brawley

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Re: Expose image

PostWed Nov 23, 2022 7:41 pm

gsean96 wrote:Hi, I’m new to the cinematography world and black magic cameras. I uploaded a picture to illustrate what I mean because I don’t know how it’s called , it’s looked like a sort of waves when the image has almost no noise . Can someone please tell me how it’s called, how to achieve it in every shot and what does it mean? Because In every clean image I see has those sort of lines or waves . I use the Bmpcc 6k pro with sigma art prime lenses.Image
I once did while exposing at 200 iso, 1.8 Iris and the image was a bit under exposed. I really appreciate any instruction. Thank you.


I think you’re referring to banding. It’s hard to tell so I’m guessing at what you’re asking, but if you have banding on footage shot with a Blackmagic camera, it’s not the cameras fault.

I bet you are using Premiere? It seems to have an 8 bit default mode where it creates this banding during editing.

Try the same shots in Resolve and see if there’s a difference.

JB
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gsean96

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Re: Expose image

PostThu Nov 24, 2022 6:30 am

Chris Cronin wrote:Probably not related, but any reason why you exposed at 200 ISO?
Hi, I always try to have the least noise as I can since I’m learning to shoot for music video. So Indoor I always try to stick around 200-400. To avoid noise because I think 800 is too noisy for me. Any suggestion?


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gsean96

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Re: Expose image

PostThu Nov 24, 2022 2:19 pm

John Brawley wrote:
gsean96 wrote:Hi, I’m new to the cinematography world and black magic cameras. I uploaded a picture to illustrate what I mean because I don’t know how it’s called , it’s looked like a sort of waves when the image has almost no noise . Can someone please tell me how it’s called, how to achieve it in every shot and what does it mean? Because In every clean image I see has those sort of lines or waves . I use the Bmpcc 6k pro with sigma art prime lenses.Image
I once did while exposing at 200 iso, 1.8 Iris and the image was a bit under exposed. I really appreciate any instruction. Thank you.


I think you’re referring to banding. It’s hard to tell so I’m guessing at what you’re asking, but if you have banding on footage shot with a Blackmagic camera, it’s not the cameras fault.

I bet you are using Premiere? It seems to have an 8 bit default mode where it creates this banding during editing.

Try the same shots in Resolve and see if there’s a difference.

JB
Image
Here’s a better image. I have noticed most videos on YouTube have have those linear in the background . I’m wondering if it something done in production or how do achieve that?


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John Brawley

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Re: Expose image

PostMon Nov 28, 2022 7:47 pm

To be clear, you are trying to avoid banding in flat fields of colour?

You DO NOT WANT banding right?

What editing platform are you using ?

JB
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carlomacchiavello

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Re: Expose image

PostMon Nov 28, 2022 9:36 pm

gsean96 wrote:
Chris Cronin wrote:Probably not related, but any reason why you exposed at 200 ISO?
Hi, I always try to have the least noise as I can since I’m learning to shoot for music video. So Indoor I always try to stick around 200-400. To avoid noise because I think 800 is too noisy for me. Any suggestion?


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Pockets had 400 native iso, if you shoot 200 iso not reduce noise, only change curve of contrast.
Do you shoot raw or prores?
film or video settings ?
What software do you use to develop shooting? What technique do you use to develop film clip?
There are a lots of questions to answer to try to help you.


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gsean96

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Re: Expose image

PostTue Nov 29, 2022 3:53 am

carlomacchiavello wrote:
gsean96 wrote:
Chris Cronin wrote:Probably not related, but any reason why you exposed at 200 ISO?
Hi, I always try to have the least noise as I can since I’m learning to shoot for music video. So Indoor I always try to stick around 200-400. To avoid noise because I think 800 is too noisy for me. Any suggestion?


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Pockets had 400 native iso, if you shoot 200 iso not reduce noise, only change curve of contrast.
Do you shoot raw or prores?
film or video settings ?
What software do you use to develop shooting? What technique do you use to develop film clip?
There are a lots of questions to answer to try to help you.


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Hi, I’m shooting Raw, Film and use Davenci studio 18. I will try to stick to 400 when shooting in studio where I have control of lights. Or is there a better Spot for ISO


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gsean96

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Re: Expose image

PostTue Nov 29, 2022 3:56 am

John Brawley wrote:To be clear, you are trying to avoid banding in flat fields of colour?

You DO NOT WANT banding right?

What editing platform are you using ?

JB
So basically I’m trying to understand how to have them and avoid them. I see them in Most videos on YouTube. I’d say 90% so I thought maybe it a good thing. And I use davenci resolve Studio 18


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Ellory Yu

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Re: Expose image

PostTue Nov 29, 2022 4:42 am

Banding happens when you either shoot or process in 8-bit or have highly compressed images. Usually you do not want to have banding. I think the reason you see a lot of videos in YouTube with such banding is because of the compression applied to the video, compression during upload, and/or the video is processed in 8-bit. This is not via the BM camera itself, however possible with cameras recording in 8-bit. If you want banding, then try rendering your video using a highly compressed codec.

This is not noise caused by ISO and if you are shooting BRAW, ISO has no effect other than for monitoring exposure.
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Chris Cronin

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Re: Expose image

PostTue Nov 29, 2022 10:43 pm

gsean96 wrote:Hi, I always try to have the least noise as I can since I’m learning to shoot for music video. So Indoor I always try to stick around 200-400. To avoid noise because I think 800 is too noisy for me. Any suggestion?


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Basically what @carlomacchiavello said.

You're better off just sticking to the native ISO at 400 as you're not really getting a cleaner image shooting lower, just a different contrast curve applied to the native ISO. Same when switching to the second native ISO of 3200.
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Uli Plank

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Re: Expose image

PostWed Nov 30, 2022 2:33 am

Second that.
And then, be aware that YouTube is always applying their own compression, so deliver the best possible quality to them as you can. It doesn't need to be H.264/265, they accept other codecs with larger files up to a certain limit. Some swear on sending UHD to YT, since they'll be using a better codec then.

If you want such an effect, better achieve it with a filter. Try those under Stylize or a third-party Cartoon look filter, since overcompression will introduce other, pretty nasty artefacts.
Don’t approach DR with your preconceptions from another NLE.
Many features are better, some worse, most are different.


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Sean van Berlo

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Re: Expose image

PostWed Nov 30, 2022 8:16 am

I am dying at the idea of a generation of new image producers having grown up with YouTube and thinking that banding is supposed to be part of the image now.
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gsean96

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Re: Expose image

PostWed Nov 30, 2022 8:18 am

Ellory Yu wrote:Banding happens when you either shoot or process in 8-bit or have highly compressed images. Usually you do not want to have banding. I think the reason you see a lot of videos in YouTube with such banding is because of the compression applied to the video, compression during upload, and/or the video is processed in 8-bit. This is not via the BM camera itself, however possible with cameras recording in 8-bit. If you want banding, then try rendering your video using a highly compressed codec.

This is not noise caused by ISO and if you are shooting BRAW, ISO has no effect other than for monitoring exposure.
Alright thanks, I think understand better the concept. I was really confused about. Thank you very much.


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