EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

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zareone

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EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostTue Sep 26, 2023 3:36 pm

Maybe some company is already on it...

Would it be feasible to have something like the Z-Cam eND filter in a EF or PL to L-Mount adapter?

I mean a mount adapter like the Sigma MC-21 (or MC-31), but with the possibility to slide a eND tray between the mount and the sensor, as Z-Cam do: https://www.cined.com/z-cam-electronic- ... available/

Pros? Cons? Insights?
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Jamie LeJeune

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Re: EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostTue Sep 26, 2023 3:43 pm

www.cinedocs.com
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm4601572/
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zareone

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Re: EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostTue Sep 26, 2023 3:49 pm



Thanks for the read Jamie!

Some people complained about color shift in 6KPro NDs too. So I guess, as John says there, it's a matter of purity vs convenience, and my bet is a lot of people would be good to go with a solution like that. Would the color shift be "fixed" or variable depending on the ND strenght?
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Jamie LeJeune

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Re: EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostWed Sep 27, 2023 2:53 am

The 6K Pro has full spectrum glass ND filters in it (the kind that are marketed these days as "IRND" filters). They aren't perfectly consistent, so there's a little bit of temp/tint shift, but that is easy to correct out in post.
What the forum link explained is that eND causes some totally different kind of color shifts that are far more difficult to correct out (perhaps impossible to manually correct out) because the way that light is being attenuated is different than a full spectrum glass ND filter. And as John Brawley also notes in that thread, high end productions continue to use quality full spectrum glass ND filters, rather than any of the eND options because of those limitations.
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Uli Plank

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Re: EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostWed Sep 27, 2023 5:59 am

The main issue with eNDs (and Red's Motion Mount) that they are also polarisers with their specific side effects, like changing the look of skin, of reflections, the sky and causing weird colors on tempered glass.

Variable NDs are simply polarisers crossing over.
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Sean van Berlo

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Re: EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostWed Sep 27, 2023 8:51 am

Jamie LeJeune wrote:The 6K Pro has full spectrum glass ND filters in it (the kind that are marketed these days as "IRND" filters). They aren't perfectly consistent, so there's a little bit of temp/tint shift, but that is easy to correct out in post.
What the forum link explained is that eND causes some totally different kind of color shifts that are far more difficult to correct out (perhaps impossible to manually correct out) because the way that light is being attenuated is different than a full spectrum glass ND filter. And as John Brawley also notes in that thread, high end productions continue to use quality full spectrum glass ND filters, rather than any of the eND options because of those limitations.


I don't know if you've ever shot with the 6K Pro but while the internal NDs are really convenient, they're definitely not full spectrum. Definitely IR pollution with those NDs.
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Jamie LeJeune

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Re: EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostWed Sep 27, 2023 9:20 am

I’ve owned the 6K Pro since it first released.

The 6K Pro sensor cover glass does not cut IR very aggressively. If there’s a lot of IR in the scene, it will show up in your image regardless of whether the internal ND is engaged or not.

The marketing term “IRND” is misleading. The better quality filters marketed that way are not cutting out IR specifically, they are attenuating all wavelengths evenly across the spectrum:
https://www.tokinacinema.com/tokina-pro-irnd

BMD’s internal ND filters are the same type — full spectrum ND filters. Since the cover glass IR cut is not very aggressive, you’ll see some IR pollution, but that isn’t the result of the internal NDs. BMD’s two latest model cameras have OLPFs with a more aggressive IR cut for that reason. For the 6K Pro you can purchase a third party solution:
https://rawlite.com/olpf-for-blackmagic-pocket-cinema-camera-6k-pro/
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rick.lang

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Re: EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostWed Sep 27, 2023 11:49 am

Jamie LeJeune wrote:… The marketing term “IRND” is misleading. The better quality filters marketed that way are not cutting out IR specifically, they are attenuating all wavelengths evenly across the spectrum:
https://www.tokinacinema.com/tokina-pro-irnd

BMD’s internal ND filters are the same type — full spectrum ND filters…


Correct.

In many situations the IRND may be sufficient especially with the new sensor cover glass on the BMCC6K becoming the new standard for BMD cameras. But there are times when the scene has more intense infrared radiation and an IR Cut should be added—for example man-made oil-based materials like nylon bags and rayon clothing.
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zareone

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Re: EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostWed Sep 27, 2023 12:32 pm

Thanks Jamie, Uli and Rick for the educative responses.

As always in engineering... compromises. You have to choose your pain.
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John Brawley

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Re: EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostWed Sep 27, 2023 2:00 pm

I used the MOFAGE adaptor which as a built in VND. It was sued on the downloadable car shot.

https://www.mofage.store/

I liked it a lot. VND also has its problems but it was very convenient to use. What I like about MOGAGE is that they tell me that they are soon to offer regular ND that you can swap in and out. They already offer some diffusion options as well.

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Krishna Pada

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Re: EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostThu Sep 28, 2023 11:22 am

John Brawley wrote:I used the MOFAGE adaptor which as a built in VND. It was sued on the downloadable car shot.

https://www.mofage.store/

I liked it a lot. VND also has its problems but it was very convenient to use. What I like about MOGAGE is that they tell me that they are soon to offer regular ND that you can swap in and out. They already offer some diffusion options as well.

JB

Would have been great if they had adapter for EF lenses as well.
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zareone

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Re: EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostFri Sep 29, 2023 7:08 am

John Brawley wrote:I used the MOFAGE adaptor which as a built in VND. It was sued on the downloadable car shot.

https://www.mofage.store/

I liked it a lot. VND also has its problems but it was very convenient to use. What I like about MOGAGE is that they tell me that they are soon to offer regular ND that you can swap in and out. They already offer some diffusion options as well.

JB


Looks awesome! L Mount (as many other mirrorless mounts) opens a ton of possibilities...
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rick.lang

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EF / PL to L-Mount Adapter with eND

PostFri Sep 29, 2023 4:00 pm

L-Mount and Micro Four-Thirds share a similar short flange focal distance, but L-Mount is a superior design including the strength of the mount compared to mFT that never feels solid when adding lens adapters that needed to have feet or matte boxes to keep adapted lenses steady when rotating their gears.
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