Pocket Cinema Camera "Blooming Sensor"

Are all you drama queens shooting for Scientific American?

Wow. First post, already offending. Or is it just Jimmy with a new account...?

Maybe you can't think of applications where this issue might ruin the shots, but that gives you no right to insult those who can.

That's a normal clip of highlights. They are irregular shaped, not perfectly round, and they have soft edges.

I think you are right, the soft edges are are atypical, it's probably not blooming this time. Yet i think the shape alone is no indicator: If the reason for what we discuss here really is some kind of sensor blooming, then point lights will produce circular blobs, while larger light sources will produce a spill puddle around their edges, roughly following the light sources' shape, enlarging the lit area.

In all seriousness I like the term "spill puddle" a lot. It describes the effect very well. Since most highlights derive from a circular object, the sun being the biggest one of them all we see these more often, but I am more concerned with the wrap around effects of the "spill puddles" which engulf stuff that should be in front of them.

Screen Shot 2013-08-29 at 9.24.16 AM.png

In this second image the white "spill puddle" actually distorts the hand rail. It just doesn't look right and isn't right, when the rest of the image is so beautifully exposed.

Screen Shot 2013-08-29 at 9.24.39 AM.png

Spill puddle?

Ok let's call lenses glassy globe refractors.

Ok let's call cameras magic light sucking boxes.

Ok let's call tripods Tri AT-AT walkers.


It's a sensor blooming issue, distinct from lens blooming which is non related.

We are eagerly waiting for the much easier fix.

I should get my Pocket in a few days, then I can look into it.
I guess you have to be patient till then.

We are used to the delays and issues related to blackmagic pocket cinema camera by now.
All i am interested in is this "Much easier fix"

Shusshh it's a secret...

Maybe he can help and maybe he can't...

But why exactly are you two ragging on the guy? What did he do?

Dear Blackmagic Design, what do you say?

The silence is deafning.

quick test.


pocket camera
film mode
lumix 14mm 2.5
kino flo bare bulb 3200k
800 asa
180 degrees angle

quick test.


pocket camera
film mode
lumix 14mm 2.5
kino flo bare bulb 3200k
800 asa
180 degrees angle

Great test, so its official Blooming sensor for all cameras.

quick test.


pocket camera
film mode
lumix 14mm 2.5
kino flo bare bulb 3200k
800 asa
180 degrees angle

Nice, can do same test with any not blooming camera?

DAMIT!!! Gonna have to totally shelve my indie short about a man with an obsession for looking at light bulbs and car headlights.

DAMIT!!! Gonna have to totally shelve my indie short about a man with an obsession for looking at light bulbs and car headlights.

No, pls, just replace bulbs with vegetable!

DAMIT!!! Gonna have to totally shelve my indie short about a man with an obsession for looking at light bulbs and car headlights.

A truly heartwarming concept.

My two cents...

I don't like the blooming, but it won't stop me from getting and using my first BMPCC and producing great images. I'll hold off on getting my second and third pocket cameras until I know more.

Blackmagic should acknowledge, analyze, and state the problem. It doesn't have to be today, but in the next week or two would be nice.

It's not a defect. Blackmagic doesn't need to recall the cameras or fix them for free. It's just the way this camera is. Cameras have flaws. It's a disappointing flaw, for sure, since the 2.4k BMCC with a supposedly very similar sensor doesn't have the problem, and neither do most cameras these days.

Blackmagic should get back to the sensor manufacturer and see if this problem can be fixed for future production of the camera, and tell us something definitive when they know. I'll purchase more when I know they'll be without the problem.

DAMIT!!! Gonna have to totally shelve my indie short about a man with an obsession for looking at light bulbs and car headlights.

I also reckon that when the raw becomes available this blooming won't feature which gives me hope on it being a software rather than a hardware issue. Total guess work by me though

i encourage anyone with this problem (and yes, it is a real problem) to open a support ticket. the only thing that will motivate BMD to fix this problem is for enough people to raise the issue with them.

Blackmagic ALREADY commented that they are looking into that. That takes time. Let's not act hysterically over and over again.

I also reckon that when the raw becomes available this blooming won't feature which gives me hope on it being a software rather than a hardware issue. Total guess work by me though

If its a software issue they should fix it also for ProRes, shouldn't they? My gut feeling does not believe in a software issue. It could be a serious problem for BMD because it's a serious issue of the camera. I planned to use it as b-cam and I try to imagine that shot from the second angle have glowing highlights and main shots don't. I own the camera for a week now and I can confirm this issue

I also reckon that when the raw becomes available this blooming won't feature which gives me hope on it being a software rather than a hardware issue. Total guess work by me though

Even if it's a software/firmware issue... if the firmware update history of the BMCC is anything to go by you'll be stuck with this problem for a long time to come.

The BMCC has numerous issues that still aren't resolved and that camera has been retail-available for more than 8 months.

Blackmagic ALREADY commented that they are looking into that. That takes time. Let's not act hysterically over and over again.

I agree and if there is one thing we know about BM is that they don't say something until they know something, so we can safely say they are looking into it and until we get told something they don't have a conclusive answer for people.


My only real question for BM is how they are handling shipping at this crucial point of ramping up. Personally I want the camera as I see the flaw as negligible and don't want to wait 6 months so I can shoot bright lights at night, which incidentally is all around me living in Fluorescent loving Asia. I accept some wont want the camera, fair enough. But for BM a big question hangs over them whether to ship and then have to recall thousands of cameras later or what they would do...It's a tough one for them. I completely trust them as a company, unfortunately that might mean more delays.

blooming highlights aside, the camera produces some stunning images. i've been shooting with the EF BMCC for many months now and I was still a little blown away by my first shots with the pocket camera. i have missed using my canon fd glass. makes me want to pick up a m43 BMCC now....

I wonder if it is to do with the way that the dynamic range is being rolled off in the Prores file. It just looks like clipping to me. I'm sure Blackmagic will get to the bottom of it.

here's my sample. It's not an issue of night shots or car headlights.
It looks even worse when the objects is moving.

Even if it's a software/firmware issue... if the firmware update history of the BMCC is anything to go by you'll be stuck with this problem for a long time to come.

The BMCC has numerous issues that still aren't resolved and that camera has been retail-available for more than 8 months.

What issues are they on the bmcc?

I also reckon that when the raw becomes available this blooming won't feature which gives me hope on it being a software rather than a hardware issue. Total guess work by me though

If its a software issue they should fix it also for ProRes, shouldn't they? My gut feeling does not believe in a software issue. It could be a serious problem for BMD because it's a serious issue of the camera. I planned to use it as b-cam and I try to imagine that shot from the second angle have glowing highlights and main shots don't. I own the camera for a week now and I can confirm this issue

Thats what I mean once they have the raw sorted and if it doesn't do it on the raw then it's a software issue and not a sensor issue which means they may be able to sort it on the pro res as well.

Even if it's a software/firmware issue... if the firmware update history of the BMCC is anything to go by you'll be stuck with this problem for a long time to come.

The BMCC has numerous issues that still aren't resolved and that camera has been retail-available for more than 8 months.

What issues are they on the bmcc?

The only imaging artifacts I'm aware of (apart from CMOS-related overloading) are that red objects are rendered as orange objects when footage is shot in either ProRes of DNxHD modes and that compressed modes have aliasing. Reds come out correctly when footage is recorded in RAW and processed in Resolve using ACES (at least that's what I remember reading in other forum posts). The aliasing issue was referenced in BMD's latest price-drop announcement and the same announcement stated that an update would be issued in the near future.

I'm mostly referring to the lack of usable exposure metering (outside of RAW), the lack of audio metering and the presence of audio processing introduced in firmware 1.3. Other users have complained of the lack of formatting and deletion functions.

Those are the issues that come to mind, all of which are software fixable. My point is, based on the BMCCs update history, the BMPCC will likely have the blooming issue for some time to come - and that one shouldn't purchase the camera with the expectation that BMD will fix it any time soon.

Even if it's a software/firmware issue... if the firmware update history of the BMCC is anything to go by you'll be stuck with this problem for a long time to come.

The BMCC has numerous issues that still aren't resolved and that camera has been retail-available for more than 8 months.

What issues are they on the bmcc?

The only imaging artifacts I'm aware of (apart from CMOS-related overloading) are that red objects are rendered as orange objects when footage is shot in either ProRes of DNxHD modes and that compressed modes have aliasing. Reds come out correctly when footage is recorded in RAW and processed in Resolve using ACES (at least that's what I remember reading in other forum posts).

Are you not just referring to the "video" REC709 LUT? Shooting in film mode in non-raw results in an almost identical image as when viewing the flat Raw footage.

The only imaging artifacts I'm aware of (apart from CMOS-related overloading) are that red objects are rendered as orange objects when footage is shot in either ProRes of DNxHD modes and that compressed modes have aliasing.

I think you're referring to the VIDEO mode, which is BMD's version of a REC709 LUT. While I'll agree that it's not something I think of as accurate, VIDEO mode is meant to be a quick and dirty way of shooting for an edit without grading.

It's certainly not a problem to shoot ProRes RAW or DNxHD in FILM mode.

All modes will have some aliasing in certain situations. The camera doesn't have an OLPF.

jb

I'll test quickly...

Wow, I'm sorry, I made a mistake, reds come out beautifully when film profile is used. I almost always shoot raw, but I was asked to film an interview a few days back with someone else's BMCC and they wanted it shot in ProRes video mode. There was a lot of red in the frame and it all came out orange. It's still an issue, but I think I'll be able to convince them in future to, at minimum, shoot ProRes film mode.

Thanks for the correction.

Even if it's a software/firmware issue... if the firmware update history of the BMCC is anything to go by you'll be stuck with this problem for a long time to come.

The BMCC has numerous issues that still aren't resolved and that camera has been retail-available for more than 8 months.

What issues are they on the bmcc?

The only imaging artifacts I'm aware of (apart from CMOS-related overloading) are that red objects are rendered as orange objects when footage is shot in either ProRes of DNxHD modes and that compressed modes have aliasing. Reds come out correctly when footage is recorded in RAW and processed in Resolve using ACES (at least that's what I remember reading in other forum posts). The aliasing issue was referenced in BMD's latest price-drop announcement and the same announcement stated that an update would be issued in the near future.

I'm mostly referring to the lack of usable exposure metering (outside of RAW), the lack of audio metering and the presence of audio processing introduced in firmware 1.3. Other users have complained of the lack of formatting and deletion functions.

Those are the issues that come to mind, all of which are software fixable. My point is, based on the BMCCs update history, the BMPCC will likely have the blooming issue for some time to come - and that one shouldn't purchase the camera with the expectation that BMD will fix it any time soon.

Didn't notice the red issue in pro res when we last used one, then again we were in a controlled environment and ultra flat it was colour corrected afterwards. Whats the aliasing issue in pro res/dnxhd, is it just Moire? I always use a external device for audio. Deleting footage in camera is something I would never do. I do admit though not being able to format in camera is a pain but thats about it.
They're not really issues more a case of inconveniences. This blooming may actually be an issue but until the full abilities of the camera is released then we'll have to wait and see.

Some more examples:

Some more examples:

could i ask if this issue was viewable on the pocket cams display (live veiw) or only present in the actual recording?

Total exaggeration of a non-issue!

I wouldn´t buy this camera for 50 € with this malfuntion.

It's not a defect. Blackmagic doesn't need to recall the cameras or fix them for free. It's just the way this camera is. Cameras have flaws. It's a disappointing flaw, for sure, since the 2.4k BMCC with a supposedly very similar sensor doesn't have the problem, and neither do most cameras these days.

Are you kiddind us!?!

Thanks to slashcam.de for the footage!

10 years from now it'll be a fad and people will hunt down vintage BMPCCs

Regarding video mode: it also affects skin tone, it looks ugly in "Video" mode. If you shoot "Film" and grade it in DaVinci Resolve you can get skin tones that justify the affectionate "Baby Alexa" nick.

This is one of the most awful camera flaws I've seen

Its preMasking, silly! You have lees work in postproduction.

wow..look at the bloom on the cars in the first few seconds!!

It's not a defect. Blackmagic doesn't need to recall the cameras or fix them for free. It's just the way this camera is. Cameras have flaws. It's a disappointing flaw, for sure, since the 2.4k BMCC with a supposedly very similar sensor doesn't have the problem, and neither do most cameras these days.

Are you kiddind us!?!

Thanks to slashcam.de for the footage!

Reminds me of Doraemon

Look how bad this one is.......ok can we stop posting examples now.

Look how bad this one is.......ok can we stop posting examples now.

This is a thread to discuss the issue, so the examples will pop... no way.

My camera has been shipped and I decided to keep it in the last minute, although I'm waiting for a BMD explanation... There is a problem here, and this is clear. Probably the reflections are the worst scenario.

Look how bad this one is.......ok can we stop posting examples now.

This is a thread to discuss the issue, so the examples will pop... no way.

My camera has been shipped and I decided to keep it in the last minute, although I'm waiting for a BMD explanation... There is a problem here, and this is clear. Probably the reflections are the worst scenario.

I'm sorry but I'm not sure what you mean, but I'm sure it's very good. Well done.

I'm sorry I don't speak Monkey.

grow up... f****** idiot

Look how bad this one is.......ok can we stop posting examples now.

Agree, whatever your example is FAKE! (Or they will lock this topic for "TooMuchExamples" reason.)

Phase 2

What scenarios will follow?

It seems jimmykorea only speaks monkey, here and everywhere... he was already banned from personalview.com...

The examples are important, other way how could we understand and deal with the issue? Sorry but until BMD say something I think people will keep posting them, no matter how it affects that guy.

It seems jimmykorea only speaks monkey, here and everywhere... he was already banned from personalview.com...

The examples are important, other way how could we understand and deal with the issue? Sorry but until BMD say something I think people will keep posting them, no matter how it affects that guy.

That guy was on PV today actually, potty mouth.

Look how bad this one is.......ok can we stop posting examples now.

This is a thread to discuss the issue, so the examples will pop... no way.

My camera has been shipped and I decided to keep it in the last minute, although I'm waiting for a BMD explanation... There is a problem here, and this is clear. Probably the reflections are the worst scenario.

I'm sorry I don't speak Monkey.

Wow, you are the prime example of a Troll, either that or just a straight up @ss.

A few days ago I couldn't understand why so many people talked about you, and your history of being banned from forums... It's become very clear. I cant understand why you haven't been banned from here yet, maybe it's because, while you are acting like the forum version of Michael Oliver, better known as Junior, you are campaigning for people to ignore the sensor blooming so you can get your annoying @ss one to complain about after you receive it. You complain about complaining, STFU!

The Hysteria is wild. I don't think there was this much hysteria over the CCD smear issue, which lasted several generations on several cameras. Maybe there was, but it was a lot more civil because the camera cost more...

If you don't need a camera, then is there a reason to be upset that you won't be spending your hard earned dollars on something you don't need?

If you do need a camera, there are others in the same price range (yes, without the same specs but they do offer some things that this one doesn't).

And, if you want this camera, or a really great image despite the two headline "problems" you should take your order. Cheezweezl, Blazer... they both have it right in my opinion: I've been shooting for a good year on 2.5K cameras and have only had a scarce amount of time with a store unit, but the image definitely surprised me. I imagine that if you cancelled your order over said premature hysteria, you may regret having to get back in line in a week or two when a few more people get their hands on it and post some material. xD

There is no need for BM to fix it! You can fix it in post!!



Just uploaded ...

There is no need for BM to fix it! You can fix it in post!!



Just uploaded ...