Update on Camera Shipments

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bhook

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostThu Oct 11, 2012 10:28 pm

I get the impression that some folks feel I (and others who comment on the shipping subject) rejoice in these problems BMD is facing. Nothing could be farther from the truth. I badly want(ed) the BMC to be the epiphany that the 7D was for me. I still am very excited about the BMC. I deeply regret these problems and the less than stellar manner in which this first roll out has been handled thus far. If I do have to go with another camera and be forced to give up on the BMC for now, I will be hugely disappointed. But we all have to do what we all have to do...
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PaulDelVecchio

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostThu Oct 11, 2012 10:53 pm

mhood wrote:I get the impression that some folks feel I (and others who comment on the shipping subject) rejoice in these problems BMD is facing. Nothing could be farther from the truth. I badly want(ed) the BMC to be the epiphany that the 7D was for me. I still am very excited about the BMC. I deeply regret these problems and the less than stellar manner in which this first roll out has been handled thus far. If I do have to go with another camera and be forced to give up on the BMC for now, I will be hugely disappointed. But we all have to do what we all have to do...


I would think that's obvious. The reason why so many people are complaining is because we want to get our hands on such an amazing camera. Something like this is now affordable and we want to start shooting with it. I really doubt anyone is enjoying this situation, least of all Blackmagic. People on both sides are frustrated I'm sure.
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bhook

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostThu Oct 11, 2012 11:14 pm

Yes, it should be obvious but it's posts like this one that personalize the situation that motivated me to offer my explanation:

As for dealers receiving information...most of the large chains I know don't have "any" direct communication with many of the manufacturers of the products they sell. So I don't see what the big deal is.

Frankly, I think BMD has been quite forthcoming with their information in the face of these delays. We know what the problem is, we know they are fixing it and we know they will update us when they have an update. They've said so. Show me any other company that's done more.

Obviously, many people doing all the bitching aren't actually doing any actual work, cause they're on here everyday, all day...bitching.

Talk about first world problems.


They don't recognize a problem and they sure sound angry with people who do.
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Nick Bedford

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostThu Oct 11, 2012 11:27 pm

mhood wrote:I get the impression that some folks feel I (and others who comment on the shipping subject) rejoice in these problems BMD is facing. Nothing could be farther from the truth. I badly want(ed) the BMC to be the epiphany that the 7D was for me. I still am very excited about the BMC. I deeply regret these problems and the less than stellar manner in which this first roll out has been handled thus far. If I do have to go with another camera and be forced to give up on the BMC for now, I will be hugely disappointed. But we all have to do what we all have to do...


It sounds like you're as passionate to "move on" from DSLR footage as I am (even though I've barely filmed any volume of work with it), and with rational, motivated reason to do so. As much as I can make a pretty picture with video mode on my DLSR's they seriously don't hold a candle to the professional level of image quality this and other raw cinema cameras provide. I mean, why would people shoot music videos with RED cameras if there's no reason you should need to? People make us feel as though having standards is a bad thing. I'm in the stage of slowly working on a cinematography portfolio, and presentation is everything. Solid technique + presentation = gold.

The main problem is that this camera exists and we've ordered them, so its not like we're waiting for a camera that hasn't even been brought to the market yet.
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wcapps1

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostThu Oct 11, 2012 11:34 pm

Well, here is at least some info. We are in preproduction for an indy feature and we really wanted to shoot it on a BMCC. My DP has a friend at one of the big US resellers. His friend had about the same news we all have and they are at a loss at what is going on at BM. He gave my DP the number of his contact at BM. So, my DP called the guy and talked to him for a while. Basically, we were told that if the "second wave" of cameras don't go out in the next 2 weeks, we will probably not see the camera until after the new year.

I know it is not much but at least it is something! I am a PR Director by trade and I truly believe that that whoever is running their communications department will end up costing this company a lot of money. The community understands that things happen in developing a new product but the lack of communication is causing rumors, speculation and mistrust in the company. It is truly PR 101 stuff here!
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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostThu Oct 11, 2012 11:51 pm

Yeah I don't know how much, but they've lost sales due to the lack of communication, let alone the obvious lack of cameras. I think the communication is probably the bigger factor in people just getting over the unknown wait time and going somewhere else, much to their chagrin.
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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostThu Oct 11, 2012 11:54 pm

wcapps1 wrote:Basically, we were told that if the "second wave" of cameras don't go out in the next 2 weeks, we will probably not see the camera until after the new year.


Man, I'd pay $10 cash to know what that was all about.
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Luke Armstrong

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 12:27 am

I'd love to hear what BMD has to say about that
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Nick Bedford

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 12:29 am

The little camera than could...

...n't...

...make it out the door.
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Luke Armstrong

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 12:47 am

I'm sure that someday someone will make the movie... the question is will it be with or without a BMCC!?
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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 1:07 am

I've heard that BnH has ordered a pretty good number of camera's, and after talking with them today, they are not expecting a shipment to show up anytime soon, because they have not been able to get any info from Blackmagic. From what I was told they have tried to get info, and if they cant get Blackmagic to shed a little light on shipment, who can? We have nine authorized dealers with in my state, and all of them assume spring time for EF and M4/3. Obviously the dealers sales people would love to sell a 3000.00 camera, but all of the sales people I talked to today didn't really seem interested to take the salesman approach for a Blackmagic cinema camera. Almost as if they didn't believe the sale would pay off.
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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 1:28 am

Luke Armstrong wrote:I'd love to hear what BMD has to say about that


I would love to hear what BMD has to say on anything! Pretty quiet on their front!
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Nick Bedford

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 1:40 am

It's a pity that it's a black box. Ask for updates and nothing happens. Want updates and nothing happens. So as far as we're concerned, nothing is happening.
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Luke Armstrong

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 1:43 am

wcapps1 wrote:I would love to hear what BMD has to say on anything! Pretty quiet on their front!


Would be nice! I'd like nothing more than this except maybe receiving an actual camera right now...
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Raulofs

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 2:04 am

http://www.rubbermonkey.com.au/Pro-Video/Cameras/Video-Cameras/Blackmagic-Cinema-Camera

Stock arriving 19th October??

probably generic expected time... i guess!
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PostFri Oct 12, 2012 2:09 am

........................
Last edited by emotiondesigner on Fri Oct 12, 2012 2:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 2:11 am

wcapps1 wrote:Well, here is at least some info. We are in preproduction for an indy feature and we really wanted to shoot it on a BMCC. My DP has a friend at one of the big US resellers. His friend had about the same news we all have and they are at a loss at what is going on at BM. He gave my DP the number of his contact at BM. So, my DP called the guy and talked to him for a while. Basically, we were told that if the "second wave" of cameras don't go out in the next 2 weeks, we will probably not see the camera until after the new year.

I know it is not much but at least it is something! I am a PR Director by trade and I truly believe that that whoever is running their communications department will end up costing this company a lot of money. The community understands that things happen in developing a new product but the lack of communication is causing rumors, speculation and mistrust in the company. It is truly PR 101 stuff here!


Well at least there is a sliver of possibility that the "second wave" could still go out in the next 2 weeks.

If he issue is just the sensor glass and not some other manufacturing problem, then I would guess they're either still waiting on glass or they got the glass and the cameras are still not passing the QC process. They've got some issue that they're trying to work out with their manufacturing process.

The first round of cameras went out and we haven't heard any reports of faulty cameras yet, so we know they can build them. But maybe there is a difference between the way they produced the prototype batch and how they are ramping up production for mass quantity and they're trying to work it out. There is a multitude of possibilities on the table, but if it's not for sure out of the question and they still hope to resolve the issue in the coming weeks then it sounds like something that they're trying to work out. They don't have a timeline because they don't have a solution to the problem. Maybe something broke on their manufacturing line and it's not an easy part to fix? Although, for legal reasons, they probably couldn't blame the chip manufacturer if it wasn't true. So either the glass company or the chip company is the issue or BM is having problems in the QC process and their running diagnostics all day long crossing their fingers that the next step of troubleshooting will work. Admitting that they're having trouble manufacturing cameras isn't really going to install confidence in consumers so they probably have to hope they can figure it out.

I was planning to shoot an Indy feature with the BMCC too, so I'm really disappointed. Renting a RED is fine for commercials or Music Vids but the cost of producing a feature goes up astronomically as opposed to owning a camera that can do the job.

And just like all the everyone else on this thread, it's frustrating more than anything to sit with no answers or information. The fear is that if I decide to go with purchasing a different camera, I'll get that update email that cameras are shipping. If we had an update with a realistic timeline or an explanation then all of us trying to make production decisions could just weigh the options and move on. That glimmer of wishful thinking will eventually run out but for now is frustrating.
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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 2:13 am

Raulofs wrote:http://www.rubbermonkey.com.au/Pro-Video/Cameras/Video-Cameras/Blackmagic-Cinema-Camera

Stock arriving 19th October??

probably generic expected time... i guess!


Would be pretty sick. Either way, I'm still in my half patient/half impatient mood until more info is unearthed ;)
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Bill Rich

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 2:17 am

I heard the Panasonic GH3 is hitting the shelves November 30th.
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Nick Bedford

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 2:17 am

Raulofs wrote:http://www.rubbermonkey.com.au/Pro-Video/Cameras/Video-Cameras/Blackmagic-Cinema-Camera

Stock arriving 19th October??

probably generic expected time... i guess!


Curious!

I'm also curious about the slight rip off :p I got mine for a hair over $3,000.
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J. Richardson

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 2:22 am

What I wonder about the "first round" of camera's is? How many went out? If you say the second wave of cameras and only send out 10 camera's then, what's the 3rd wave going to consist of? BnH said there is only two BMCC in the states at the moment... how they know this I'm not sure, but if you look at footage on vimeo or youtube, the only people posting footage is original tester's, and the two lucky guys that got camera's from BnH. If they continue the 1st, 2nd, 3rd wave kinda thing it will be 2016 before camera's are flowing like they should. This is a world cam, its gonna take much more than 10 cameras here, 5 cameras there.
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PetePolyakov

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 2:36 am

over two weeks and no any official updates, and people here as donkeys should guessing "what's going on". because all of us remember "The supplier is due to get more glass later this week..." and "We should know more details about shipping times once the new glass arrives at our supplier."

tired of this unprofessional way of the communication.
until the moment when all the audience getting angry nobody cares there.
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Theodore Prentice

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 2:55 am

this thread is actually funnier than comedy central to me.

people say they are giving up (but dont)
crazy speculation and emotion over a camera

venom towards other forum members, DEMANDS on blackmagic...

I find it absolutely hilarious some of the responses on this forum :lol:

the cameras will probably be rolling out soon, then there will be more crying and bellyaching about something else, anything else :roll:
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Bill Rich

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 3:03 am

Had I simply 'pre-ordered" the camera I would have far more patience.. but I've paid in full many months ago for the camera and accessories.. so yes.. I'm growing very impatient having paid a lot of money.. but have no camera.. or even an idea when I might get the camera..
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Nick Bedford

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 4:41 am

Theodore Prentice wrote:this thread is actually funnier than comedy central to me.

people say they are giving up (but dont)
crazy speculation and emotion over a camera

venom towards other forum members, DEMANDS on blackmagic...

I find it absolutely hilarious some of the responses on this forum :lol:

the cameras will probably be rolling out soon, then there will be more crying and bellyaching about something else, anything else :roll:


Ahh. The old high horse.
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J. Richardson

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 5:00 am

Nick Bedford wrote:
Theodore Prentice wrote:this thread is actually funnier than comedy central to me.

people say they are giving up (but dont)
crazy speculation and emotion over a camera

venom towards other forum members, DEMANDS on blackmagic...

I find it absolutely hilarious some of the responses on this forum :lol:

the cameras will probably be rolling out soon, then there will be more crying and bellyaching about something else, anything else :roll:


Ahh. The old high horse.


Yeah, not sure why people act as if they have no understanding why some paid buyers have become a little anxious, and concerned about the lack of updates on shipping from Blackmagic. ( I'm sure BMD understands the frustration ) it's just how they handle dealing with the frustration.

I was trying to place my order today for the camera, and every dealer that I contacted seemed annoyed with the Blackmagic camera situation. Every one of them were Authorized Dealers, and they all seemed very unsure of the future, had no enthusiasm for a Blackmagic camera sale. One dealer told me that "You should use pause, as there is little, to no communication from them" So with that I see it's not only buyers that are having concern, it's the sellers as well, as I was not able to place an order today, because all my state dealers are hesitant, but so was B&H. I understand, and would be thinking about my 3,000 investment.
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Nick Bedford

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 5:12 am

J. Richardson wrote:Yeah, not sure why people act as if they have no understanding why some paid buyers have become a little anxious, and concerned about the lack of updates on shipping from Blackmagic. ( I'm sure BMD understands the frustration ) it's just how they handle dealing with the frustration.

...


When this is the only high end camera you'll own (yes, own, not rent) for a while and you also wish to produce portfolio work on it, then yes, it's very frustrating!
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Costa Louvieris

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 6:40 am

Theodore Prentice wrote:this thread is actually funnier than comedy central to me.

people say they are giving up (but dont)
crazy speculation and emotion over a camera

venom towards other forum members, DEMANDS on blackmagic...

I find it absolutely hilarious some of the responses on this forum :lol:

the cameras will probably be rolling out soon, then there will be more crying and bellyaching about something else, anything else :roll:


Obviously some who hasn't invested substantial time and money on the BMC already.
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To Grant Petty and BMD

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 6:53 am

Dear Grant Petty,
Lets be honest, man to man, this is a FARCE :(
If you were a customer who ordered and still waiting for a BMC camera you would know exactly how each and everyone of us feel about your company.
You say the problem lies elsewhere, however you are in it as well. Do your company BMD have a duty to customer satisfaction? Would BMD offer some kind of goodwill gesture to compensate for this debacle that your company are in? How about a discount or send a copy of Resolve 9 to everyone who pre-ordered a BMC free of charge regardless if they chose to cancel their pre-orders they can keep the software as consollation. I think something from BMD to offer its customer as compensation will not go amiss and help restore confidents in your company.
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Michael Sandiford

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 6:55 am

Can we have 2 threads on this. One called 'Camera shipments Discussion' so every one can talk, and another one called 'Camera Shipping Updates' that only contains official updates. When I come on and see the thread has grown another 2-5 pages only to find that there's no actual updates are on is getting a bit tedious now.
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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 8:25 am

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Luke Armstrong

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 8:25 am

Michael Sandiford wrote:Can we have 2 threads on this. One called 'Camera shipments Discussion' so every one can talk, and another one called 'Camera Shipping Updates' that only contains official updates. When I come on and see the thread has grown another 2-5 pages only to find that there's no actual updates are on is getting a bit tedious now.


I hear you, but if BMD does post an update they'll make a new thread as they did with this one.
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Dr.Rajah

Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 10:03 am

We hope BMD comes out with a surprise and make us all happy..
Last edited by Dr.Rajah on Fri Oct 12, 2012 2:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 11:16 am

Dr.Rajah wrote:I have been going through all the comments from different parts of the world...about your camera BMCC . I became a fool before my students and film friends.. talking big about your camera & your company, many of them have ordered and they now blame me for their orders and spending money, which they are not sure of getting it back..I feel so sorry that the CEO of the company could not come out and tell his customers the real problem or say that this camera is not going to be released in near future....I too wanted to shoot a very important project with BMCC but was disappointed and had to look for other cameras for the projects...I request the management of BMD to come out with the real facts & decide to ship their camera or not. I am sorry for being frank.


Frank, I mean Dr.Rajah (sorry some british humor) we have seen a lot of similar stories here regarding the BMCC. To be honest, and I'll play Frank too, your students blaming you is a bit silly. Did you tell them to go buy it or did you simply mention the camera's existence to them?

If you TOLD them to buy it, then it seems like it may have been your fault telling students to buy something that wasn't released yet. However, I get where you are coming from. You put faith in a company and they let you down. They have let us all down.
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Raulofs

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 11:21 am

Blackmagic Cinema Camera Firmware 1.1 Now available!!!

good news? or simply upgrade without the camera!

What is this?
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Luke Armstrong

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 11:24 am

Its a software update for the camera that no one has yet.
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Raulofs

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

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Luke Armstrong

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 11:38 am

Not sure what your point is here.
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Nick Bedford

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 11:41 am

I suspect that the units we get will have generally the latest firmware.
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Luca Salvatori

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 1:41 pm

Luke Armstrong wrote:Its a software update for the camera that no one has yet.


+1
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Dr.Rajah

Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 2:59 pm

Costa wrote:
Dr.Rajah wrote:I have been going through all the comments from different parts of the world...about your camera BMCC . I became a fool before my students and film friends.. talking big about your camera & your company, many of them have ordered and they now blame me for their orders and spending money, which they are not sure of getting it back..I feel so sorry that the CEO of the company could not come out and tell his customers the real problem or say that this camera is not going to be released in near future....I too wanted to shoot a very important project with BMCC but was disappointed and had to look for other cameras for the projects...I request the management of BMD to come out with the real facts & decide to ship their camera or not. I am sorry for being frank.


Frank, I mean Dr.Rajah (sorry some british humor) we have seen a lot of similar stories here regarding the BMCC. To be honest, and I'll play Frank too, your students blaming you is a bit silly. Did you tell them to go buy it or did you simply mention the camera's existence to them?

If you TOLD them to buy it, then it seems like it may have been your fault telling students to buy something that wasn't released yet. However, I get where you are coming from. You put faith in a company and they let you down. They have let us all down.


Hi Costa, after seeing all those videos and the cost. I felt it would be a good buy but...anyway it's my fault and hope good things will happen.
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Margus Voll

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 3:02 pm

seems like people do not remember red took 3 years to ship.

few months is nothing!
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bhook

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 3:12 pm

Margus Voll wrote:seems like people do not remember red took 3 years to ship.

few months is nothing!


Two wrongs do not make a right...but three lefts do.
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Margus Voll

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 3:23 pm

it is hard for me to see why people get so emotional

maybe i do not have much feelings :D
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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 3:26 pm

Talked to someone at BMDESIGN today and was told that if I had not preordered then there a chance I wouldn't see the camera till after the new year and if I did preorder prior to the sensor incident then theres a slight chance but not 100% chance, I'd receive it before.. its based on you're location and how the company sends out orders,I'm guessing some resellers have priority over others !

As far as for people complain its kinda ridiculous... they noticed a problem w the product and halted to correct the problem... That's a good thing ...imaging receiving the highly praised BMCC only to noticed it was defective then as a customer having to ship it back and wait even longer for camera to be FIXED ...NOW that would've been a mess! So instead of complaining on here like little kids,be thankful!

BMDESIGN came out gave us an update on the problem and method for solution already,do u really think someone is gonna address an update everyday? NOOOO let them spend that time on correcting the problem ,when its done then and only then should someone readdress us as to actual shipping schedule...

Just my 2cents
Last edited by Cuboirs on Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Bill Rich

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 3:27 pm

RED wasn't pre-selling the Scarlet three years prior to shipping.. they didn't actually sell it until it's release date.. So people didn't pay for a camera then had to wait 3 years for it to finally ship.

I was just on the phone with B&H to change my SSD order (since my order originally had OCZ which is no longer on the BMCC preferred list) and asked about shipping info the the BMCC.. they said they will call for an update on my behalf and email me the response.
Bill Rich
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Margus Voll

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 3:34 pm

i meant red one not scarlet
Margus Voll, CSI

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Bill Rich

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 3:42 pm

That's fine.. did they pre-sell the RED ONE then make folks wait for 3 years?
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Peter J. DeCrescenzo

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 3:53 pm

Raulofs wrote:Blackmagic Cinema Camera Firmware 1.1 Now available!!! good news? or simply upgrade without the camera! What is this?


Yes, it's good news, but it's slightly old news. The v.1.1 firmware has been available since 10/5/12. And, as others have pointed out, it's also somewhat annoying news, too, because almost no one has a BMCC with which to use the new firmware. So, good news & bad news, both. Cheers.

For more info see:
http://herefortheweather.wordpress.com/ ... -features/

---
Last edited by Peter J. DeCrescenzo on Fri Oct 12, 2012 7:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Peter J. DeCrescenzo

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Re: Update on Camera Shipments

PostFri Oct 12, 2012 4:03 pm

Cuboirs wrote:Talked to someone at BMDESIGN today and was told that if I had not preordered then there a chance I wouldn't see the camera till after the new year and if I did preorder prior to the sensor incident then theres a slight chance but not 100% chance, I'd receive it before.. its based on you're location and how the company sends out orders,I'm guessing some resellers have priority over others !

As far as for people complain its kinda ridiculous... they noticed a problem w the product and halted to correct the problem... That's a good thing ...imaging receiving the highly praised BMCC only to noticed it was defective then as a customer having to ship it back and wait even longer for camera to be FIXED ...NOW that would've been a mess! So instead of complaining on here like little kids,be thankful!

BMDESIGN came out gave us an update on the problem and method for solution already,do u really think someone is gonna address an update everyday? NOOOO let them spend that time on correcting the problem ,when its done then and only then should someone readdress us as to actual shipping schedule...

Just my 2cents


Your 2 cents is appreciated, but with respect I think you're defense of BMD's behavior, and criticism of those of us who are angry with them, is a mistake.

I wrote the following to explain why I'm disappointed and angry with BMD. Let me know what you think about what I wrote:
http://herefortheweather.wordpress.com/ ... ts-up-bmd/

Cheers.
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