URSA G2 - Crazy Idea

The place for questions about shooting with Blackmagic Cameras.
  • Author
  • Message
Offline
User avatar

timbutt2

  • Posts: 1439
  • Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 10:32 am

URSA G2 - Crazy Idea

PostMon Dec 30, 2019 5:38 am

Bear with me on this...

SENSOR AND PROCESSOR UPGRADABLE BIG URSA UNIT

This is the truly upgradeable camera. It's designed for true testers and pioneers. The Mini is always full upgrade, but URSA Owners get an "Upgrade" Fee because the URSA always updates the Processor Unit and the Sensor Unit separately and is truly a shell. Batteries are always handled separately, and buying new batteries should always be a line budget item. The URSA size makes sense for this. Then the URSA Mini line will eventually get the LF sensor that every person desires, but it starts with the Charlie test run of that sensor and processor on a bigger URSA camera. The idea is to always figure out a way to make that tech available in a smaller size, and that's when it makes it to the Mini.

I think the flaw of the original URSA was that the processor couldn't be upgraded. So imagine that you can always trade-in at a low cost the old processor for the next generation. A bigger processor that's faster and more powerful will always eventually shrink down in size.

A guaranteed 240 FPS max slow-motion as a speed that designates the rolling shutter, then for the most part you're fine because it is pretty close to where you want the global shutter concept to be designated at. However, shooting 24 with the current 4.6K G2 in that max frame rate is so close to "global" that taking that same 4.6K sensor and allowing 4.6K at 240 FPS will guarantee that the sensor's rolling shutter speed is adequate.

Thus when you want a Large Format Sensor it will be capable of 240 FPS Slow-Motion Speed at 6.6K for LF Size and eventually 240 FPS for IMAX Size in 12K down the road.

I did some math. I found that for the most part I have a whole other argument for going back to the original Academy Aspect Ratio for Theatrical Distribution. However, I may have to concede that argument to a later forum since the point needs to be driven home here.

The LF Sensor gets tested in a New URSA Unit designated the URSA G2, with the G3 URSA Mini eventually upgrading to the concept of the technology to get that URSA G2 smaller in size. URSA G3 eventually allows for the upgraded aspects for further software tech that requires chassis upgrades. The following table displays what 6.6K LF would be matching the ARRI LF size. Then I have IMAX size designated to 12K enough so that keeping pixel size the same you can reach higher resolution with larger format sizes that require bigger lenses. That's where the money should truly lay... lens cost. Larger Size lenses should always be worth more. Optics is a different ball game not to get into at the moment.

Screen Shot 2019-12-30 at 12.36.38 AM.png
Tables
Screen Shot 2019-12-30 at 12.36.38 AM.png (351.32 KiB) Viewed 631 times

*scroll or click on table image.

The only thing I will say about lens diameter of image circle is these numbers; LF: 37 mm. IMAX: 72 mm. Easily IMAX is 3.5X larger and more expensive. That goal is maybe a 10-year goal for digital. For now let's focus on 240 as a base slow-motion frame rate in a 6.6K LF format.

Ultimately this is an argument for sensor size being equivalent to the 4.6K sensor for dynamic range. Lower light capability shouldn't truly be applicable since a truly cinematic image is properly lit. However, that 15-stops is a truly amazing goal. Even more dynamic range is always more welcome, if not purely for that highlight roll off. Heck, at this point internal ND is such that you could make a fantastic base ISO of 1600 for max shadow and highlight detail that then you ND it down outdoors via the internal that goes from 2 to 6 to 10 stops.

Additional filters are still able to be applied via the matte box. However, indoors with good lighting you could drop to 800 if you wanted richer blacks. Even 400 could produce deeper blacks, and this ultimately means we work in the opposite spectrum as we used to that has faster response for highlights and slower response for shadows. It's the opposite of film, but it makes sensor for digital.

In conclusion the URSA size gets new life with the idea that it's meant for truly serious gear heads willing to put the sensor tech to its limits before it gets put into a smaller body. Eventually the LF format reaches the Mini, but that leads to faster LF frames rates in the URSA while eventually paving way for a processor capable of fitting into an URSA to handle the resolution and size of IMAX level proportion.
"I'm well trained in the art of turning **** to gold." - Tim Buttner (timbutt2)

Cameras: URSA Mini Pro G2, URSA Mini 4.6K EF & Cinema Camera 2.5K EF
Computers: iMac 5K (Late 2015) & MacBook Pro Retina 15.4in (Mid 2018)
Offline

robert Hart

  • Posts: 289
  • Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2014 3:16 pm

Re: URSA G2 - Crazy Idea

PostTue Dec 31, 2019 4:48 am

The original "big" URSA presented other challenges. We never heard how many of how few sold. There remain original Ursa cams brand new for sale so there may have been more unloved than us big Ursa holdouts might like to admit. The big Ursa was technically upgradable but likely at an unsustainable cost.
Offline

Ellory Yu

  • Posts: 1037
  • Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2014 5:25 pm

Re: URSA G2 - Crazy Idea

PostTue Dec 31, 2019 8:03 am

I held on to the big URSA with hopes like this. One day I woke up and it was just a crazy idea. I don't bother hoping for it anymore. Just get a URSA Mini G2 if you want an URSA.
MSI Raider X99 MB / Intel i7 5280 6 core CPU / 2 x AMD R9 390X 8Gb GPU / 64Gb 3200 RAM / Decklink 4K Mini Monitor / 240Gb SSD OS Drive / 480Gb RAID 0 SSD Cache Drive / 12Tb 7200rpm HDD Data Drive / Win 10 Pro 64bit / Resolve 16.1.1.005
Offline

robert Hart

  • Posts: 289
  • Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2014 3:16 pm

Re: URSA G2 - Crazy Idea

PostTue Dec 31, 2019 8:30 am

The big Ursa was pigheaven for me with the large screen so I did not have to be swapping eyeglasses off and on. Onlookers could evesdrop at any one of the three displays without crowding on everybody. Best of all you just bunged it on a tripod and pressed the button without having to frig around with add-ons and sweat about leaving something behind. Contrary to the experience of others I found the big Ursa's on board mics fine so long as you went in close and had a muff on them outdoors. The camera looked a bit like father Christmas. However an honest truth out there is one must remain adaptable and cope with change. As I have said before boringly to many, if BM made a retrofit kit for big Ursa, comprising of entire electronics, even if this required relocating some hardware with the camera body I would be ahappy camper. It won't happen of course. The machined Ursa body itself likely would need further machining as it was laid out around original motherboard and hardware,all shaped differently now.
Offline
User avatar

timbutt2

  • Posts: 1439
  • Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 10:32 am

Re: URSA G2 - Crazy Idea

PostWed Jan 01, 2020 4:47 am

Let me say that this is based on the obsession with LF format and my trying to make it work. Let the URSA live as a testing platform so that LF can be tested out and then moved into the Mini platform. ARRI did it with the Alexa LF. So, if we have the URSA G2 LF then it will eventually lead to the URSA Mini LF. That's my thought.

I am trying to compromise with the LF obsession. Or even the 8K obsession. I could care less about 8K. I could care less about LF.

Although, from what I've seen from ARRI LF I love it. RED? Eh, I couldn't care. So it's ARRI that makes me care. Thus Blackmagic could achieve it since they manage to do the ARRI principle of dynamic range and color science first.

Either way, Happy New Year!
"I'm well trained in the art of turning **** to gold." - Tim Buttner (timbutt2)

Cameras: URSA Mini Pro G2, URSA Mini 4.6K EF & Cinema Camera 2.5K EF
Computers: iMac 5K (Late 2015) & MacBook Pro Retina 15.4in (Mid 2018)

Return to Cinematography

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Denny Smith, Google [Bot], Kim Janson and 26 guests