Blackmagic Forum

If they are being made in Asia, which I presume, and there is a mass workforce available XXXX then what on earth is holding up getting hundreds of these cameras manufactured and sent out each day or week? Is it a chain reaction of delays of prominent parts? Is it issues with getting a labourforce together?

It is pretty pathetic and amateur than they are being sent out in their 1's to certain retailers or VIP camera ops for reviews (something should have been done in April/May).

(my original comment was edited not by me btw)

Gan Eden wrote:It is pretty pathetic and amateur...

I take it you've designed and manufactured and camera before then??

What Blackmagic are doing not other manufacturer is doing. Why? Because it's not a simple process. If it was then we would have many options available to us.

Once the design is compete and tested it goes into mass production but that mass production process also needs to be tested and tweaked to make sure the end result it right. Once those tests have been done the process is slowly scaled up testing along the way. That is where they are at.

Even tho the BMPCC is popular it's not a mass market camera like a Canon DSLR. Film making is still a niche market. So the volumes of production are lower and the process is longer.

Huh??

Or maybe they are just covering their arse. Get enough cameras out to make sure there are no unexpected hardware issues (thanks to the reviews and tests), then ramp up production? I don't think it's a matter of they can't produce enough, but they're choosing not to for some reason then.

Clever production technique?

BMD should be straight forward with the shipping statements, but we are all getting used to how they operate... We are all learning to ignore BMD when they say, "cameras should be available ______" or "We plan to ship _______" or "Cameras should be on shelves _______" you can fill in the blank with any date you like, it's all the same

adamantiumSTEEL wrote:BMD should be straight forward with the shipping statements, but we are all getting used to how they operate... We are all learning to ignore BMD when they say, "cameras should be available ______" or "We plan to ship _______" or "Cameras should be on shelves _______" you can fill in the blank with any date you like, it's all the same

Yes, agreed mate.

Gan Eden wrote:If they are being made in Asia, which I presume, and there is a mass workforce available (and cheap exploitation) then what on earth is holding up getting hundreds of these cameras manufactured and sent out each day or week? Is it a chain reaction of delays of prominent parts? Is it issues with getting a labourforce together?

It is pretty pathetic and amateur than they are being sent out in their 1's to certain retailers or VIP camera ops for reviews (something should have been done in April/May).

They are being made in Australia by BMD, not Asia.

With the greatest of respect, in the very literal sense of the word - I believe you are being a bit ignorant here.

Unless you have ever tried to mass produce a complex bit of consumer electronics, I suggest you reassess whether you are qualified or informed enough to judge anyone "Pathetic" or "amateur".

Tom wrote:They are being made in Australia by BMD, not Asia.

I have heard several times that BMD cameras are manufactured in Singapore. Do you know that's not true?

I don't really understand BMDs marketing strategy on this because yes people will want the camera because they have cornered the market. However if they had competitors by now BMD would be getting very few orders So although this is good times for them If competitors do come along they will pay a price for that.

To say the camera will be shipping at a set date and then use that date to do guinea pig tests on its own customers is misleading people into thinking cameras will be available In the past firms might get away with this as people would think demand was high. But this is the internet. So we know they are not shipping with only 5 cameras to the UK it isn't shipping at all Bit like bringing a loaf of bread to Wembley stadium and saying food is available. What it is doing is giving distributers and bloggers a camera to test for problems before ramping up production for the proper shipping to start.

mhood wrote:

Tom wrote:They are being made in Australia by BMD, not Asia.

I have heard several times that BMD cameras are manufactured in Singapore. Do you know that's not true?

Someone suggested the other day that they're being manufactured in Singapore and Melbourne, but BMD haven't been forthcoming with confirmation so far.

mhood wrote:

Tom wrote:They are being made in Australia by BMD, not Asia.

I have heard several times that BMD cameras are manufactured in Singapore. Do you know that's not true?

I have read, and been told they are manufactured in Singapore also. I don't know what to believe, trying to find out the actual truth with BMD product and shipment reminds me of Consumer Recreation Services and we are all Nicholas Van Orton (Michael Douglas), every time we think we know whats going on, we find out we are way off.

adamantiumSTEEL wrote:

mhood wrote:

Tom wrote:They are being made in Australia by BMD, not Asia.

I have heard several times that BMD cameras are manufactured in Singapore. Do you know that's not true?

I have read, and been told they are manufactured in Singapore also. I don't know what to believe, trying to find out the actual truth with BMD product and shipment reminds me of Consumer Recreation Services and we are all Michael Douglas, every time we think we know whats going on, we find out we are way off.

Who actually originally said they were being made in Singapore?
I am 99% sure the last time this came up, someone from BMD actually said they were made in Australia.

Tom wrote:Who actually originally said they were being made in Singapore?

A person who lives in Singapore named "jaiyenjohn" was adamant about it on "another forum". He said he had been to the BM manufacturing facility there in Singapore and was certain that all of the BMD cameras were being manufactured there. I would provide a link but it's not allowed.

mhood wrote:

Tom wrote:Who actually originally said they were being made in Singapore?

A person who lives in Singapore named "jaiyenjohn" was adamant about it on "another forum". He said he had been to the BM manufacturing facility there in Singapore and was certain that all of the BMD cameras were being manufactured there. I would provide a link but it's not allowed.

pm?

It's simple. It's taking this long because "THIS IS A PRO VIDEO CAMERA"
(4:00min: ) All pro cameras take this long to make

I understand your frustrations but as a general way of business practice, we do not discuss manufacturing logistics.

We do however want to point out that we are shipping this product out worldwide to resellers. We know the demand for this is high and we assure you that we are shipping these out on a daily basis to meet as many of our customers needs as possible.

Tony Rivera wrote:I understand your frustrations but as a general way of business practice, we do not discuss manufacturing logistics.

It's just a simple question about where your manufacturing lines are located. Nobody's getting deep into manufacturing logistics. On the other hand, if BMD (a proud Aussie company) were running lines in Australia, I suspect you would be happy to point that out, huh?

Even my shirts have to have a tag that reveals the country of manufacture. It's no big deal...give the cloaking device a rest for a moment.

mhood wrote:

Tony Rivera wrote:I understand your frustrations but as a general way of business practice, we do not discuss manufacturing logistics.

It's just a simple question about where your manufacturing lines are located. Nobody's getting deep into manufacturing logistics. On the other hand, if BMD (a proud Aussie company) were running lines in Australia, I suspect you would be happy to point that out, huh?

Even my shirts have to have a tag that reveals the country of manufacture. It's no big deal...give the cloaking device a rest for a moment.

stop whinging

Star Trak wrote:stop whinging

Joined up just to say that did you Mr. Trak...or is Star a lady's name?

I understand, that I am not an expert in manufacturing, and I know I want to invest in Blackmagic, however some realistic explanations of expectations would go a long way with me. I am going to buy either way but really if they are not going to be ready in August just tell me. Say should be mas market available in September, October, etc... I cant even imagine what it is like for a small company to get a big product to market but at the same time I want to invest in Blackmagic products so tell me where I stand, what is the reality of when those of us who did not pre-order on day one are going to get our camera and when. I dont care about them saying how many pre-orders etc are coming but I have not seen anything from Blackmagic for over a month. That is my rant, but they are making a great product that I cant wait to get.

I think the biggest factor and the one that doesn't get brought up in these threads is the price point. Blackmagic is a small business that is making a good product for a very cheap price point.

When a company like canon or Sony or apple runs into a hiccup they can throw money at the situation. Wether it's changing suppliers, paying over time or even hiring more people! In the larges scale this could even mean building factories.

I doubt BM has that or want to risk it. Remember they don't have 50 years of back products and R&D to get them to this point. This is from scratch.

If they spent the money to keep from delays they would LOSE money on there products. Not gonna happen.

Their goal was to deliver for a certain price point from the beginning.

Tom wrote:
They are being made in Australia by BMD, not Asia.

With the greatest of respect, in the very literal sense of the word - I believe you are being a bit ignorant here.

Yet Australia seems to be the last country to get them distributed unless you're somebody important of course.

Tom wrote:Who actually originally said they were being made in Singapore?
I am 99% sure the last time this came up, someone from BMD actually said they were made in Australia.

Can you provide the link/quote please then to verify your statement Tom??

mhood wrote:

Star Trak wrote:stop whinging

Joined up just to say that did you Mr. Trak...or is Star a lady's name?

Just been given 3 warnings for my opening comments. WTF. Is this a socialist site where anyone who dares to question anything about WHY gets the boots whilst obnoxious and rude comments by others are ignored by the mods?

If I have said something bad then I apologise but 3 warning just recieved for the same 1 "infringment". No wonder forums are dying.

just for asking questions about camera delivery

ARTnVIDEO wrote:just for asking questions about camera delivery

Yes and thats all. Shooting themselves in the foot by enough bad press.

Even on my worst day of posting here I have never sounded as idiotic as what I have been reading here lately, I would like you all to go and...Well you get my point! yeah go fudge the truth about your complaints, STOP! it will only bring you misery, Best thing you can do is be supportive of BMD,
And help them grow as a successful camera manufacture. Why would you want to impede the possibility of this being the best and most affordable cinema camera available?, Would you rather they fail?
I would think not, Now grow up, man up, and be a part of history.

Darryl Gregory wrote:Even on my worst day of posting here I have never sounded as idiotic as what I have been reading here lately, I would like you all to go and...Well you get my point! yeah go fudge the truth about your complaints, STOP! it will only bring you misery, Best thing you can do is be supportive of BMD,
And help them grow as a successful camera manufacture. Why would you want to impede the possibility of this being the best and most affordable cinema camera available?, Would you rather they fail?
I would think not, Now grow up, man up, and be a part of history.

That is not the issue Darryl. I want BMD to do well. Seems you are whitewashing over the many issues going on. Complaining for complaining sake is bad I agree, but as I said elsewhere some of us have made a financial outlay and were told it would be END OF JULY when we would recieve the cameras. People accept mediocrity and accept others to follow suit.

Remember, It is not only BMD who need to upscale production in a controlled manner and release initially small quantitees under constant quality check and testing and adjusting, but sensor manufacture also have to do this.

This means that sensors are not yet coming to BMD in massive numbers, but, perhaps like 50 or 100 at the time.

Gan Eden wrote:

Darryl Gregory wrote:Even on my worst day of posting here I have never sounded as idiotic as what I have been reading here lately, I would like you all to go and...Well you get my point! yeah go fudge the truth about your complaints, STOP! it will only bring you misery, Best thing you can do is be supportive of BMD,
And help them grow as a successful camera manufacture. Why would you want to impede the possibility of this being the best and most affordable cinema camera available?, Would you rather they fail?
I would think not, Now grow up, man up, and be a part of history.

That is not the issue Darryl. I want BMD to do well. Seems you are whitewashing over the many issues going on. Complaining for complaining sake is bad I agree, but as I said elsewhere some of us have made a financial outlay and were told it would be END OF JULY when we would recieve the cameras. People accept mediocrity and accept others to follow suit.

Gan Eden you are standing on your last leg, with...
Posts: 61
Warnings: 3
and a date Joined: Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:49 am
You need to slow down, they do not retract warnings here, in fact they hand them out like candy
to disadvantaged unwilling child.

Your ongoing efforts will get you "nowhere here", I know that sounds like an idiom, but the only
idiom will come from a BMD Forum MOD who ends up banning you.

Darryl Gregory wrote:

Gan Eden wrote:

Darryl Gregory wrote:Even on my worst day of posting here I have never sounded as idiotic as what I have been reading here lately, I would like you all to go and...Well you get my point! yeah go fudge the truth about your complaints, STOP! it will only bring you misery, Best thing you can do is be supportive of BMD,
And help them grow as a successful camera manufacture. Why would you want to impede the possibility of this being the best and most affordable cinema camera available?, Would you rather they fail?
I would think not, Now grow up, man up, and be a part of history.

That is not the issue Darryl. I want BMD to do well. Seems you are whitewashing over the many issues going on. Complaining for complaining sake is bad I agree, but as I said elsewhere some of us have made a financial outlay and were told it would be END OF JULY when we would recieve the cameras. People accept mediocrity and accept others to follow suit.

Gan Eden you are standing on your last leg, with...
Posts: 61
Warnings: 3
and a date Joined: Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:49 am
You need to slow down, they do not retract warnings here, in fact they hand them out like candy
to disadvantaged unwilling child.

Your ongoing efforts will get you "nowhere here", I know that sounds like an idiom, but the only
idiom will come from a BMD Forum MOD who ends up banning you.

What has that got to do with you? Butt out of people business and stop trolling you muppet. I was given 3 warnings for asking why there is a delay with making the cameras. Is that a sin??

I couldn't give a poop if they ban me or not. No loss to me. It will only sum up what kind people are runnign this site if they give warnings and bans for very trivial things. I think people like you need to grow up and get a life mate.

PS, pretty IRONIC that you youself have TWO warnings. Would have expected less....



Darryl Gregory

Posts: 657
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2012 10:49 am
Location: Los Angeles
Warnings: 2

There's no problem.

It's a choice.

As I mentioned to you in another thread.

jb

Gan Eden wrote:
What has that got to do with you? Butt out of people business and stop trolling you muppet. I was given 3 warnings for asking why there is a delay with making the cameras. Is that a sin??

I couldn't give a poop if they ban me or not. No loss to me. It will only sum up what kind people are runnign this site if they give warnings and bans for very trivial things. I think people like you need to grow up and get a life mate.

PS, pretty IRONIC that you youself have TWO warnings. Would have expected less....

You are "Self" destructive by nature, I suggest you seek help.

Gan Eden wrote:

Tom wrote:
They are being made in Australia by BMD, not Asia.

With the greatest of respect, in the very literal sense of the word - I believe you are being a bit ignorant here.

Yet Australia seems to be the last country to get them distributed unless you're somebody important of course.

What? I've spoken to my reseller and they've had a few come through already (I pre-ordered in May/June so I'm pretty low on the list and wont get mine in a hurry). There also others here from Australia who have theirs.

Darryl Gregory wrote:

Gan Eden wrote:
What has that got to do with you? Butt out of people business and stop trolling you muppet. I was given 3 warnings for asking why there is a delay with making the cameras. Is that a sin??

I couldn't give a poop if they ban me or not. No loss to me. It will only sum up what kind people are runnign this site if they give warnings and bans for very trivial things. I think people like you need to grow up and get a life mate.

PS, pretty IRONIC that you youself have TWO warnings. Would have expected less....

You are "Self" destructive by nature, I suggest you seek help.

I suggest you grow up little boy. ALL humans have the capacity to be destructive, you included.

PS:

PMThu Aug 22, 2013 9:13 pm
From: Terry Frechette
To: Gan Eden
That should have only been one warning.

Jace Ross wrote:

Gan Eden wrote:

Tom wrote:
They are being made in Australia by BMD, not Asia.

With the greatest of respect, in the very literal sense of the word - I believe you are being a bit ignorant here.

Yet Australia seems to be the last country to get them distributed unless you're somebody important of course.

What? I've spoken to my reseller and they've had a few come through already (I pre-ordered in May/June so I'm pretty low on the list and wont get mine in a hurry). There also others here from Australia who have theirs.

Who did you order from Jace?

This thread is quickly getting out of hand. Please be respectful of your fellow forum members or we will lock it.

Thanks

Gan Eden wrote:PMThu Aug 22, 2013 9:13 pm
From: Terry Frechette
To: Gan Eden
That should have only been one warning.

A global mod can't correct it under your avatar?

I am unable to find any evidence to support my claim that they are manufactured in Australia. Perhaps there is some truth in the claims to the contrary.

Either way, considering the official company policy - it is unlikely we will ever know for sure.

Tom wrote:Either way, considering the official company policy - it is unlikely we will ever know for sure.

everyone can agree on that.

There are three possible explanations:

1) a COMMERCIAL TRICK (STRATEGY)
At this time it is announced a few comparable News - BMD knew it could not meet in July = but took customers away from competitors' products. (If I'm right than saying F*** off and cancelling my order.)

2) a HUMAN MISTAKE
Someone from the marketing department should find a new job. (Even Apple does not do it. Remember last event with LOGIC X, they were pretty silent and than BOOM - functional new version is out if they are sure they will manage it. Or does that Canon Or Sony as any rule?)

3) a SUBCONTRACTORS (MISSING COMPONENTS or CAPACITY)
Well, is time have a look for better business partners ... or next time keep your mouth shut if is not 1st delivery ready.

(Sorry for expressive, but in my country we speak like that. I bet BMD does their best.)

mhood wrote:
A global mod can't correct it under your avatar?

Unfortunately we cannot. It's actually a limitation in the PHPbb3 software. There is a mod we can potentially install to allow us to edit this. We'll look into it.

However, we will keep in mind that 2 warnings were excessively issued.

At this point I've got one final word then I'm going to close this thread as it's really not being helpful and is basically just speculation.

BMPC's are arriving and being shipped out every day. We're working hard to get all of you your cameras as soon as possible. Production is still ramping up well, we know you guys are excited about getting your cameras and we look forward to getting them to you soon!