UMP 12k Footage

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Mark Wyatt

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UMP 12k Footage

PostTue Sep 15, 2020 7:21 pm

Here are a few UMP 12k clips. These were shot at 4k Q5, as I wanted to see how the lower resolution and higher compression settings would look. The colour, detail and dynamic range from this sensor is incredible. Vimeo seems to kill the quality though. Clips were graded quickly with Extended Video (with some minor tweaks) and I also included clips of what the Gen 5 Film looks like prior to grading. I have other more interesting clips in the works but wanted to share these now.

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Paul Jonathan

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostTue Sep 15, 2020 8:11 pm

Hey Mark,

thanks for the footage - super helpful to see some 4k Q5 footage even with the Vimeo compression. In your own impression how do you feel it compares to higher resolution and/or higher quality? Care to comment on low-light capabilities from your experience?

Really would like to see this camera pushed to some noisy underexposure and then see how much the new CFA and extra resolution helps to get that noise floor down when rendering to a 2k or 4k final deliverable.
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jallen0

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostTue Sep 15, 2020 8:19 pm

I said on FB that the details in the shadows with this clip was amazing...even with the Vimeo compression added.
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Derek Howard

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostTue Sep 15, 2020 8:53 pm

Looks great! Thanks for uploading. I really appreciate seeing both the graded and ungraded clips for comparison.
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Wayne Steven

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 2:13 am

Mark Wyatt wrote:Here are a few UMP 12k clips. These were shot at 4k Q5, as I wanted to see how the lower resolution and higher compression settings would look. The colour, detail and dynamic range from this sensor is incredible. Vimeo seems to kill the quality though. Clips were graded quickly with Extended Video (with some minor tweaks)


Not that great of dynamic range, where is the cloud detail in the sky, under the trees the outside world is pastel. Not a great sign.

If Vimeo is killing it, what about some stills of difficult scenes, like the cloudy sky, the one where the outside forest can be seen hazily and the front of guys fingers as he examines the water?

Extended video shouldn't look like this. It looks like Sony sensor footage fixed up, where they fail in colour density in the bright areas and clip. It's OK, better than what you normally get from cameras with Sony sensors, which is an objectivity good look. If only it was dual gain, those washed out parts could pop. The in range colour here looks more sparse, where in the Alexa it would look more dense. You could say that one is too sparse and the other too dense, but both are objectively suitable looks with people prefering one or the other depending.

Thanks for the footage.
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Note Suwanchote

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 4:47 am

Mark Wyatt wrote:Here are a few UMP 12k clips. These were shot at 4k Q5, as I wanted to see how the lower resolution and higher compression settings would look. The colour, detail and dynamic range from this sensor is incredible. Vimeo seems to kill the quality though. Clips were graded quickly with Extended Video (with some minor tweaks) and I also included clips of what the Gen 5 Film looks like prior to grading. I have other more interesting clips in the works but wanted to share these now.

Really great footage Mark. Love the natural colors and detail there, especially in 4K. And even moreso that they’re just quickly graded with extended video. Thanks for sharing.


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Oyvind Fiksdal

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 7:00 am

Thanks for sharing. The lighting in forest scenes like this can be brutal, high contrast scene. Did you use any kind of reflector on the subjects or was it a run N gun kind of shot?

Looking at the ungraded footage. Seem like you keep both shadows and highlights.
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Mark Wyatt

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 4:38 pm

Paul Jonathan wrote:Hey Mark,

thanks for the footage - super helpful to see some 4k Q5 footage even with the Vimeo compression. In your own impression how do you feel it compares to higher resolution and/or higher quality? Care to comment on low-light capabilities from your experience?

Really would like to see this camera pushed to some noisy underexposure and then see how much the new CFA and extra resolution helps to get that noise floor down when rendering to a 2k or 4k final deliverable.

- Thanks Paul. The 4k is some of the best looking 4k I have seen. Obviously, when you jump up to 8k and 12k there is a clear difference. It is just very nice to have all these options and to use the entire sensor at all three settings. Low light seems great. I think it performs better than the G2.

jallen0 wrote:I said on FB that the details in the shadows with this clip was amazing...even with the Vimeo compression added.

- Thanks. Yes, I agree the shadow detail is outstanding.

Wayne Steven wrote:
Mark Wyatt wrote:Here are a few UMP 12k clips. These were shot at 4k Q5, as I wanted to see how the lower resolution and higher compression settings would look. The colour, detail and dynamic range from this sensor is incredible. Vimeo seems to kill the quality though. Clips were graded quickly with Extended Video (with some minor tweaks)


Not that great of dynamic range, where is the cloud detail in the sky, under the trees the outside world is pastel. Not a great sign.

If Vimeo is killing it, what about some stills of difficult scenes, like the cloudy sky, the one where the outside forest can be seen hazily and the front of guys fingers as he examines the water?

Extended video shouldn't look like this. It looks like Sony sensor footage fixed up, where they fail in colour density in the bright areas and clip. It's OK, better than what you normally get from cameras with Sony sensors, which is an objectivity good look. If only it was dual gain, those washed out parts could pop. The in range colour here looks more sparse, where in the Alexa it would look more dense. You could say that one is too sparse and the other too dense, but both are objectively suitable looks with people prefering one or the other depending.

Thanks for the footage.

- I guess we are seeing different things, but that's ok. The weather was not bright clear sky (sort of a high thin haze), that is why the sky looks a bit off (not bright blue). Despite that, shooting in these types of conditions (in the forest, middle of summer at noon) is a great stress test for dynamic range, and this sensor performed incredibly.

- Thanks Note!

Oyvind Fiksdal wrote:Thanks for sharing. The lighting in forest scenes like this can be brutal, high contrast scene. Did you use any kind of reflector on the subjects or was it a run N gun kind of shot?

Looking at the ungraded footage. Seem like you keep both shadows and highlights.

- Thanks Oyvind. Yes, this type of scene is usually very hard to capture, but the camera did great and no details in any of these shots were clipped. This was all very quick (no bounce or reflectors).
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Adam Langdon

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 6:38 pm

DON'T SHOOT ME, but i grabbed some frames from some screen shots to show what a simple Fuji 3510 LUT can look like...

ORIGINAL SHOT
ImageWide - Original by Adam Langdon, on Flickr

FUJI LUT
ImageWide - Fuji LUT by Adam Langdon, on Flickr

ORIGINAL SHOT
ImagePlant - Original by Adam Langdon, on Flickr

FUJI LUT
ImagePlant - Fuji LUT by Adam Langdon, on Flickr

ORIGINAL SHOT
ImageStream - Original by Adam Langdon, on Flickr

FUJI LUT
ImageStream - Fuji LUT by Adam Langdon, on Flickr
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Wayne Steven

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 8:02 pm

Mark Wyatt wrote:- I guess we are seeing different things, but that's ok. The weather was not bright clear sky (sort of a high thin haze), that is why the sky looks a bit off (not bright blue). Despite that, shooting in these types of conditions (in the forest, middle of summer at noon) is a great stress test for dynamic range, and this sensor performed incredibly.

- Thanks Note!


Thank you for your kind reply Mark.

I assumed that the white sky was clouded over. The Vimeo doesn't help, but I should see more detail.

Shooting under the trees the often washes the rest of the outside world, which is what it looks like. But with great dynamic range and light pickup that's not the case. It looks relatively good, but not great.

The real issue, is if we have a 4k or 6k version, we loose a lot of 4k downscaling benefits, and are back at the native dynamic range. If it isn't ideal with the downscaling it will be less ideal without it.
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Wayne Steven

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 8:10 pm

Adam, yeah, the Fuji lut doesn't look that great.

The guy's fingers still have a burn out.
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Adam Langdon

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 8:13 pm

Wayne Steven wrote:Adam, yeah, the Fuji lut doesn't look that great.

The guy's fingers still have a burn out.


That area is out of focus. AND is a screen capture grab.

Are you viewing on a calibrated monitor?
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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 9:44 pm

Adam Langdon wrote:
Wayne Steven wrote:Adam, yeah, the Fuji lut doesn't look that great.

The guy's fingers still have a burn out.


That area is out of focus. AND is a screen capture grab.

Are you viewing on a calibrated monitor?


Footage looks good for a screengrab. Dunno what he sees there. And I'm looking at it on a tablet.

I've always been attracted to Fuji emulation more than Kodak. Dunno why.
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Wayne Steven

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 10:07 pm

Adam Langdon wrote:
Wayne Steven wrote:Adam, yeah, the Fuji lut doesn't look that great.

The guy's fingers still have a burn out.


That area is out of focus. AND is a screen capture grab.

Are you viewing on a calibrated monitor?


If it's a screen capture grab off Vimeo, a calibrated screen is not going make enough of a difference. My phone will do. I see a nice defined oblong blob with some colour, like suggested to do clipping, but a bit more curved on individual fingers. Focus doesn't matter there, I'm looking at where the sensor tops out. But, if Mark says it's just Vimeo and there is little top out there, that's fine.
Last edited by Wayne Steven on Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Wayne Steven

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostWed Sep 16, 2020 10:14 pm

IvanovS wrote:
Adam Langdon wrote:
Wayne Steven wrote:Adam, yeah, the Fuji lut doesn't look that great.

The guy's fingers still have a burn out.


That area is out of focus. AND is a screen capture grab.

Are you viewing on a calibrated monitor?


Footage looks good for a screengrab. Dunno what he sees there. And I'm looking at it on a tablet.

I've always been attracted to Fuji emulation more than Kodak. Dunno why.


Some of its fine, some colours have a sickly look. I put the colour on my QLed up borderline insane, but it Looks better. You should see the first season of the new lost in space on it, or ST Discovery, really redefines what you think about contrast and colour. So, I'm not adverse to a bit of colour.
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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostThu Sep 17, 2020 12:43 pm

Wayne Steven wrote:Adam, yeah, the Fuji lut doesn't look that great.

The guy's fingers still have a burn out.
Ah well, Wayne, please do share the footage you’ve shot + color graded here on the forum so we can all see how it should be done.
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Wayne Steven

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostThu Sep 17, 2020 3:20 pm

Jamie LeJeune wrote:
Wayne Steven wrote:Adam, yeah, the Fuji lut doesn't look that great.

The guy's fingers still have a burn out.
Ah well, Wayne, please do share the footage you’ve shot + color graded here on the forum so we can all see how it should be done.


Wow, we are talking about a lut here, not really individual choice. But you knew that. Trying to deflect and make excuses. I don't like the look of that lut, nor do I worship this camera. If objectivity offends..
Last edited by Wayne Steven on Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Adam Langdon

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostThu Sep 17, 2020 3:23 pm

Wayne Steven wrote:
Jamie LeJeune wrote:
Wayne Steven wrote:Adam, yeah, the Fuji lut doesn't look that great.

The guy's fingers still have a burn out.
Ah well, Wayne, please do share the footage you’ve shot + color graded here on the forum so we can all see how it should be done.


Wow, we are talking about a lut here, not really individual choice. But you knew that.


Wayne i would still love to see some of your work! i see you post a lot on here but i don't think i've seen an example of what you do. just curious...
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Wayne Steven

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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostThu Sep 17, 2020 3:31 pm

Been retired for years. I can't even get stuff off 3/4 inch tape, If it's still there. I'm not young like John.

Don't worry, I'm sure more will come when they can sell me a camera I want.

Since Ivermectin treatment, it seems to cleared out some pathogen out of the ATP cycle in my brain cells.

The best stuff, is the stuff you don't have to grade. Unfortunately, nobody makes a low end camera like that - legend of the ghost camera.

I might have to buy an original pocket on the side, just to post samples here, if I can't get what I want and have to buy another brand.

Panasonic is wasting it's time. If they had a raw GH with an organic 8k sensor this year, that would beat almost any cinema camera sensor. But, looks like another Sony sensor, which is one reason I didn't but the new pockets.

What's with all the dodging selling me a camera guys?

Anyway, back to 12k footage (who would believe I would be saying that a few years ago). I'm still open to it being really excellent. My comments (apart from the lut and neutral.on the normal look) has just been pointing out it needed a few more stops lattutude and low light to really kick the high end competition, and flawlessly handle those scenes. I wish it was dual gain 16-18 stop. If only they had the Samsung sensor they had prepared for the next stills that never got released, that might have had a Alexa kicking image. Samsung is trying to compete with Sony. Options out there could get interesting.
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Re: UMP 12k Footage

PostThu Sep 24, 2020 4:22 pm

Remember the Q5 footage was quickly graded with the Extended Video so we could see more footage. It would seem to me a final complete grade is going to produce even better results. Thanks for the footage, Mark.
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