Pocket 6K Pro

I would have hoped though that they finally provided a thumbstick for menu navigation, especially now that there is the option for EVF.

It still would be possible to map the buttons for menu navigation, there is many buttons that are not needed when in menu.

So please BMD, look into this, I just dislike touching the screen and does not work with gloves on. Much needed on days like these.

Agree, little joystick (similar to used in smallHD monitors) saves space and very easy to operate. Some photo cameras also start to use it instead of classic navigation wheel with buttons.

The Pocket 6K Pro looks pretty awesome camera for the price point, improved on many areas over the Pocket 6K

- Battery and battery grip
- Buildin ND
- Bright screen
- EFV

- Tilt screen (finally)

Completely false? You suggesting we might as well stick to shooting 720p or 480p. Supersampling is all the rage and you just turn the clock back

Hyperbole doesn't support your position, it undermines it. It's what people who are wrong and have nothing to back their claims with rely on.

Reframe also helps with stability in post. People reframe for a variety of reason, if on a budget or with a small crew even a one man band, which we are likely to see more of in the current climate. Uprez is a poor choice, are you sure it does not lose quality? UPrez is false detail mate.

Most people who reframe in post do so because they were sloppy in production when it comes to scripted narratives. When you're shooting documentaries I can see the extra resolution being a plus because you can't redo a take to get a closeup when you're filming an event, but that's a different task from scripted film, where most of the people who complain about resolution want to be.

And regardless of your opinion on upresing, reality is reality, and I will not accept your opinion when it contradicts observationally verifiable reality. Since Roger Deakins shot Blade Runner 2049 on sub-4K cameras the 4K masters were ALL uprezzed from 2K, so reality proves you wrong on that front, and the photographers making their living selling fine art prints using native resolution proves you wrong again.

Not that it will sway you, but it's not important; learning your craft is vastly more important than having more resolution to shoot with.

Having said that, I have nothing to gain by deemphasizing resolution, because I have a 6K camera and an 8K camera, but since my background is fine art, I frame my shots with care rather than relying on reframing in post to save them from mediocrity. I don't nee do reframe or downsample for quality, but the 8K frames are nice for pulling print-sized frames from, as long as motion blur isn't a problem.

Seems you didn't even care this little bit to read the Q&A link I provided from the L-mount alliance.
The answer is NO. They are not giving out a license to anyone outside the alliance which BMD cannot join.

And RED is the only one who got the RF mount license because of an intellectual property agreement with Canon. RF mount is NOT open for licensing.

If you think it is possible, provide evidence.

Geez Robert, chill out.

I'm just voicing my opinion and apparently I'm not the only one who is displeased by being locked out by the choice of the EF mount. All of Blackmagic's competitors like Z-Cam, RED, Kinefinity, Sigma, Panasonic, Sony have better mount options that allow for much more flexibility than EF. You're telling me that a company like Blackmagic can't figure this out?

Seems you didn't even care this little bit to read the Q&A link I provided from the L-mount alliance.
The answer is NO. They are not giving out a license to anyone outside the alliance which BMD cannot join.

And RED is the only one who got the RF mount license because of an intellectual property agreement with Canon. RF mount is NOT open for licensing.

If you think it is possible, provide evidence.

Geez Robert, chill out.

I'm just voicing my opinion and apparently I'm not the only one who is displeased by being locked out by the choice of the EF mount. All of Blackmagic's competitors like Z-Cam, RED, Kinefinity, Sigma, Panasonic, Sony have better mount options that allow for much more flexibility than EF. You're telling me that a company like Blackmagic can't figure this out?

I am just upfront with you. You claimed that "BMD was too cheap" to license the mounts and I showed you that they are not able to.

I do wish the same like you - a better choice, but this is the reality and it doesn't magically change by saying it isn't.

So Near, and yet...

When I saw the 6k pro I thought; 'maybe get one of those, when I get some post-apocalypse money in the bank...'

Movable screen: Very Good!
Better battery life: Very Very Good!!!
Internal NDs: Very Very Good!!!

OLED EVF: Very Good! ...but hold on- it only works on the Pro, not on the (probably by now) 10s of thousands on 4K/6K pocket cameras already owned: own-goal/dropped the catch/whatever
I get it - how do you power it from the old cameras, with the already wobbly battery life, and no power output.
Here's a free idea for you BM: advertise 'coming soon! EVF / Battery Grip for all Pocket Cameras' (ok, maybe not the original HD one)
Take a leaf out of DJI's playbook and release a battery grip full of LiPO cells (not a huge thing to fit sony batterys into), built in /non removable so the punters have to buy it from you, give it a useful DC out socket (DTAP or something robust), and...
Make a sled the EVF fits onto, giving it DC and HDMI in, bingo!
$650 Us the pair, and loads & loads of happy existing customers!

Same recording media: own-goal/dropped the catch/whatever - where's the NVME SSD slot so we finally get large, fast, inexpensive media?!?!? And maybe some higher frame-rates (assuming it wouldn't melt the ASIC or whatever)...

Just saying like... Anyone agree with any of the above?!?

good deal for sure but...

i don't like it.
to me feels like the 12k is a flop and it needed a new cam to come and bmd didn't have the time to develop a new one realising the 12k flop 3-4 monthes release.
so what to do ? upgrade an existing cam... why not.

the evf seems a good id but it won't be usable on a shoulder rig, why not getting a cable to move it on the side ? also you'll need a lot of screen cleaners to erase the nose grease on the screen

i also never liked the shape of the pockets, i prefer cube shapes as it is easier to rig and access to ports on the back is more efficient and safer for connections.
also a pain to balance on a gimbal.

internal is great, i just would have prefered 1/3 stop increments, ok that's a cheap cam but still

ef mount, gosh, cool but with ef ff lenses no speedbooster so... thanks no.

once again i am disapointed, i was disapointed with the ursa 12k and same here. doesn't fit my needs.

still waiting on a cube with ff 4k sensor for great low light, a bigger micro camera

On another note, it’s still incredibly puzzling as to why there’s still no sign of OLPF adoption in the new camera.

The development of Blackmagic RAW has been a masterstroke, and I’m pleased that other pro features such as active fan-based cooling and in-built ND filters, now even with the new Pocket 6K Pro, have been adopted well in recent years. But Blackmagic’s selection of what may be considered necessary pro features can be a bit bewildering.

From what I’ve gathered, an OLPF with a UV-IR–cut coating permitting transmittance between 410 and 640 nm is a necessity in any video camera. I’d also add to that a sensor pixel-pitch between 5 and 8 µm and a dedicated timecode input. Conversely, sensor size and resolution are not as important in my opinion.

I hope someone from the Blackmagic Team provides a clue, if not a clarification, as to the underlying reason for their implicit policy to disregard the use of OLPFs in all camera lines, which I suspect has something to do with engineering practicality.

I hope the update that brings Gen 5 colour science to the original P6K will also bring 4K DCI BRAW. Is there anyone here from BM who can comment?

good deal for sure but...

i don't like it.
to me feels like the 12k is a flop and it needed a new cam to come and bmd didn't have the time to develop a new one realising the 12k flop 3-4 monthes release.
so what to do ? upgrade an existing cam... why not.

I'm pretty sure they didn't start working on this after the 12k was announced. It would take much longer than that to do the redesigns, tests and get it into production. You can't just pull a camera with new hardware off a magic shelf.

once again i am disapointed, i was disapointed with the ursa 12k and same here. doesn't fit my needs.

Let's hope they come and ask what your exact needs are before they release anything else.

I also don't need this camera, but I'm happy it's available for people who might. Definitely a step in the right direction.

This is an old argument thate been refuted many times and people still bring it up. Framing, sampling, reduce noise, better DR. enough said.

Sure, super-sampling is super useful – but that's not a factor if the 6K Pro had used a 6K version of BMD's sensor.

My point (perhaps poorly worded) was that the new sensor tech itself – BMD's RGBW sensor vs Sony's bayer pattern sensor – wouldn't yield a meaningfully different PQ.

The new features BMD *did* include are much more impactful.

Robert Niessner wrote: The answer is NO. They are not giving out a license to anyone outside the alliance which BMD cannot join.

"The L-Mount Alliance is not a completely open alliance. It came about by the granting of licences by Leica Camera AG to Panasonic and SIGMA. Nevertheless, other partners could be taken onboard if certain conditions are met." https://l-mount.com/en/Q-and-A

So now when there is a port for EVF I guess BM could come out with a Lidar module and motor. It could easily be mounted instead of the EVF. What do you think?

Robert Niessner wrote: The answer is NO. They are not giving out a license to anyone outside the alliance which BMD cannot join.

"The L-Mount Alliance is not a completely open alliance. It came about by the granting of licences by Leica Camera AG to Panasonic and SIGMA. Nevertheless, other partners could be taken onboard if certain conditions are met." https://l-mount.com/en/Q-and-A

Yeah. Do you think that BMD will meet those "conditions"?

Robert Niessner wrote: The answer is NO. They are not giving out a license to anyone outside the alliance which BMD cannot join.

"The L-Mount Alliance is not a completely open alliance. It came about by the granting of licences by Leica Camera AG to Panasonic and SIGMA. Nevertheless, other partners could be taken onboard if certain conditions are met." https://l-mount.com/en/Q-and-A

Yeah. Do you think that BMD will meet those "conditions"?

We can only guess. We do know from history that BMD is pretty insular and has a spotty record of playing nice with others.

The EF mount will still work for a great many people. It's still a safe business decision for another generation of cameras...but the writing is on the wall. BMD will have to find a modern, "mirrorless" mount, whichever it is.

Unfortunate to see this thread already being derailed into name-calling and emotional responses, rather than having an evidence-based discussion here..

Anyway, as I am fairly excited about this camera as it fills a specific need for me, I wanted to pick up on the PL-Mount Adapter discussion. As many here, I feel EF-mount is unflexible and outdated, but Robert showed that there really aren't too many options on the table for Blackmagic.

As I am using mostly PL-glass these days, I was wondering about the adapter posted earlier in the thread - does this provided a true locking mechanism to the camera? I don't see any support foot and as such the adapter would then just be held by the EF-Mount spring mechanism, right? Also I have read that most PL-EF adapters have fairly limited compatibility, as many PL-lenses protrude too far back to fit into these kind of mounts.

Rick can you comment on your experience on using this particular mount - in particular with a follow focus? Does it avoid the dreaded image shift when changing focus direction?

Also would be interesting to see whether the Wooden PL-Mount conversion still works on this camera? Although again PL-compatibility is fairly limited and the conversion is fairly work-intensive and not intended to be reversed frequently.

Hyperbole doesn't support your position, it undermines it. It's what people who are wrong and have nothing to back their claims with rely on.

You are being ridiculous. Claims are backed up everywhere, ie using ones eyes. Stop wearing rose tinted lens Maybe lockdown is having an effect on your eyesight mate. See an optician.

Have you seen Steve Yedlin's resolution tests? My guess is not... But that test closed the case.

Sent from my H1T1000 using Tapatalk

Unfortunate to see this thread already being derailed into name-calling and emotional responses, rather than having an evidence-based discussion here..

+1, and see viewtopic.php?f=18&t=134741

I’ll probably buy it. But I really want a PL version so I can use some amazing PL glass.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We can use this Tim

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/ ... gKCwPD_BwE

Curious if anyone here has ever found a way to make PL glass work on the Pocket 6K other than a modification? After reading down to the bottom of the thread and seeing Ricks post I'm editing here. Rick does that work for all your PL glass. I've often heard that modifiers work for some but not all lenses. Look forward to hearing your thoughts.

It's definitely similar to an Apple "S" or Samsung "FE" version camera. Nothing wrong with that. A solid offering.

The cameras a great option for those that either want to finally move to 6K from 4K or for new BMD customers. Nothing was better than the P6K (except maybe the P4k, debatable) for under 5k now it's even better with the cost of the add-ons off-setting the cost of the accessories you would have to buy.

If you want a box, get the Micro, wait to see the next camera update or jump to the Komodo, Kinefinity or ZCam. There are tons of options out. Same with the mounts.

Only thing I'm disappointed in, is the sensor. I wish they put their new tech into their newest camera but whatever. The mount sucks for me since all my glass is PL except for a native M43 Meike set but it makes sense. We use PL w/metabones for the P4Ks. Might be interested in selling an P4K kit and getting a 6Kpro w/that SLR adapter someone posted here if I can get some word of mouth usage info on it.

I have the Tilta screen mod for both my P4Ks and it's been great.(Got it specifically for the "internal" recording that wasn't cfast so the screen was a bonus, which would have been a great idea to partner with them for doing it to the 6k as well) I can downsize when/if needed. Still sucks outdoors but changing the angle helps in sunlight. I rarely use the P4Ks other than a music video or as a C cam to my 2 G2s so direct sunlight is never really an issue as it can be moved to avoid. It will definitely be a welcome addition to a P6K user.

It's definitely a great addition and the EVF is nice, but @ 1500nits, unless you're in direct sunlight it might not be needed and just cause an issue with the top handle.

Battery grip is fine, puts it around the same size as a C70 probably 2-3 inches wider though at half the price. Not sure about the battery life but I would assume a legit 45mins each maybeeeee an hour without anything else running through it.

Yeah. Do you think that BMD will meet those "conditions"?

All license agreements have conditions, including those for the EF mount.

BMD does not make lenses. Sigma and Leica are primarily lens manufacturers. It is in their interest to have more L-mount cameras.

I would be surprised if BMD could not make an L-mount deal if they chose to.

BMD does not make lenses. Sigma and Leica are primarily lens manufacturers. It is in their interest to have more L-mount cameras.

I would be surprised if BMD could not make an L-mount deal if they chose to.

As an owner of a Leica M3, an M6 and an M (Typ 240), I am under the impression that Leica is pretty well-known for making cameras. Indeed, Leica apparently does it well enough that New York's Museum of Modern Art has one in its collection

More seriously, I think that Panasonic, which also makes cameras, including the S1H, and which as I understand it is a partner in the development of current Leica cameras, would have a view on who can, and who can't, adopt the Leica mount. Not being in the business of manufacturing cameras, I'm not qualified to express a view on what that position would be.

As an owner of a Leica M3, an M6 and an M (Typ 240), I am under the impression that Leica makes cameras.

Leica makes cameras primarily to sell lenses. Their main income stream has always been from glass.

I have 25 Nikon lenses. Lucky for me, they all work on F-mount, L-mount, E-mount, and FZ. I'd buy several Pocket cameras in a heartbeat if they had an adaptable mount.

Leica own L mount. It’s up to them if they let others play and if they do you can bet they will also pay. Which means we pay. This is the only likely modern option for BMD.

E mount and RF are off limits. It’s not a matter of money. It’s a strategic choice they make. Sony have never allowed anyone to make an E mount camera. RED, likely because of an IP swap for RAW did a deal for RF but I bet the conditions of that IP swap would say only RED.

All the ones that seem to offer E mount or RF do it through third party adaptors or are dumb mounts with no electronics.

An RGBW sensor WOULD look great in the 6K. Most get distracted by the 12k number BUT the real leap forward with this sensor is the colour response. I just shot again the other day with the 12k and the thing that slaps you in the face when you go back to it is it’s beautiful colour response. Not the resolution.

The P6k pro has been in planning for a long time. It was likely sketched out to be released before the 12k but the Covid affected supply chains likely resulted in a delay.

Making your own sensor from scratch is hard. And costly.

The reason they started with the 12k is the higher unit cost of the sensor in lower initial volumes is better matched to the likely demand. For every 12k sensor they sell in a 12k camera, they likely sell 6 pockets. They would make less per camera and have to make a lot more of them. It doesn’t make manufacturing sense to create a product you can’t manufacture fast enough for enough money.

A brand new sensor line where the pricing from the fab is high means a pocket 6k would be a LOT more expensive and they couldn’t keep up with demand. They can barely keep up with demand as it is when it’s a sensor that’s already been bought in high volume for some time.

They will no doubt make more RGBW cameras but the timeline would be more likely in the next cycle.

JB

Most people who reframe in post do so because they were sloppy in production when it comes to scripted narratives. When you're shooting documentaries I can see the extra resolution being a plus because you can't redo a take to get a closeup when you're filming an event, but that's a different task from scripted film, where most of the people who complain about resolution want to be.
...
learning your craft is vastly more important than having more resolution to shoot with.

This I can completely agree. Why people keep harking on resolution (particularly for scripted film) to reframe sloppy shots in post is sometimes beyond me.

Did BM add an OLPF to the pro?

Did BM add an OLPF to the pro?

I think they worded this a bit misleading. It is meant that the ND filters are filtering the visible (optical) and infrared part of the entering light equally.

Did BM add an OLPF to the pro?

I’m sure if the did they would have spelled it out so....no

JB

The need for an OLPF on the 6k is not that great as moire is minimal unlike the P4. Will the P4 and P6 get the 'intermediate' compression Q codecs in a FW upgrade?

I assume these NDs have an IR cut as well?

I assume these NDs have an IR cut as well?

"the IR filters have been designed to filter both optical and IR wavelengths evenly, eliminating IR contamination of the images."

I am just upfront with you. You claimed that "BMD was too cheap" to license the mounts and I showed you that they are not able to.

Please do me a favor and don't put words in my mouth, I never said such a thing.

What I did imply is that where there is a will, there is a way.

EF is an outdated mount which has its own issues as well as being unadaptable for many lenses due to its overlong flange distance.

If L-mount or RF are really not options, personally I would prefer for a Blackmagic "BM-mount" with a short flange that can then be easily converted with adapters to whatever the end user needs, or alternatively a user-swappable bayonet (although the body design of the Pocket might make that not feasible).

With neither of these options being offered I am left once again at having to pass on this camera, that is all that needs to be said in regards to this matter and your insistence on me being wrong is not going to make me purchase this camera.

Leica own L mount. It’s up to them if they let others play and if they do you can bet they will also pay. Which means we pay. This is the only likely modern option for BMD.

And you can't really have it both ways; BMD's cameras are bargains partly because BMD avoids choosing licenses that it would have to pay for as much as it can.

E mount and RF are off limits. It’s not a matter of money. It’s a strategic choice they make. Sony have never allowed anyone to make an E mount camera. RED, likely because of an IP swap for RAW did a deal for RF but I bet the conditions of that IP swap would say only RED.

Yeah, it would be very surprising if that was not the case.

An RGBW sensor WOULD look great in the 6K. Most get distracted by the 12k number BUT the real leap forward with this sensor is the colour response. I just shot again the other day with the 12k and the thing that slaps you in the face when you go back to it is it’s beautiful colour response. Not the resolution.

I think the high frame rate by scaling without cropping is also a big step forward, but yeah. And since the SDK support for the 12K is still in beta while the Pocket 6K Pro is releasing says a lot about why that sensor isn't in other products yet. BMD has been doing some great engineering, and that takes time. I suspect that the 12K sales have been quite tepid thanks to the fact that most of the film industry was still largely shuttered when it launched, so it's going to take longer than usual for BMD to recoup its costs and get more products built using that new sensor.

The reason they started with the 12k is the higher unit cost of the sensor in lower initial volumes is better matched to the likely demand. For every 12k sensor they sell in a 12k camera, they likely sell 6 pockets. They would make less per camera and have to make a lot more of them. It doesn’t make manufacturing sense to create a product you can’t manufacture fast enough for enough money.

There are basically two ways that the companies using custom sensors have been covering their R&D costs. One is to develop high end, high margin cameras and then trickle them down to lower priced products (unless you're Phase One, in which case you skip the trickle down part), and the other is to ship tiny versions in huge volumes to cell phone, action cam, drone, etc manufacturers, and that basically means Sony since no one else in the sensor biz right now can make that many sensors.

A brand new sensor line where the pricing from the fab is high means a pocket 6k would be a LOT more expensive and they couldn’t keep up with demand. They can barely keep up with demand as it is when it’s a sensor that’s already been bought in high volume for some time.

They will no doubt make more RGBW cameras but the timeline would be more likely in the next cycle.

JB

Or they launch a really expensive Pocket 6K and everyone complains about the price. Sometimes it seems like BMD just can't win.

Fortunately, BMD is focused on making cameras based on what professionals are using and asking for, rather than based on marketing fads. If the 12K sensor was 135 rather than Super35, let alone medium format, the price of the 12K camera would probably be closer to that of a Phase One than what we got. For which frankly $10K is still kind of ridiculously low for what that camera offers.

I am just upfront with you. You claimed that "BMD was too cheap" to license the mounts and I showed you that they are not able to.

Please do me a favor and don't put words in my mouth, I never said such a thing.

What I did imply is that where there is a will, there is a way.

EF is an outdated mount which has its own issues as well as being unadaptable for many lenses due to its overlong flange distance.

If L-mount or RF are really not options, personally I would prefer for a Blackmagic "B-mount" with a short flange that can then be easily converted with adapters to whatever the end user needs, or alternatively a user-swappable bayonet (although the body design of the Pocket might make that not feasible).

With neither of these options being offered I am left once again at having to pass on this camera, that is all that needs to be said in regards to this matter and your insistence on me being wrong is not going to make me purchase this camera.

EF is not outdated as there are a vast amount of lenses with it and will be for a long time to come. EF actually has a very short flange to focal plane distance for a DSLR system hence why EF cameras are popular as they can be used with a lot of very good legacy SLR lenses in a 'cinema' system, Leica R, Contax/Yashica, Nikon, Olympus, Pentax etc. Sure a 'B' mount would be ideal but at what cost? Once you add adapters you have to add on a lot more engineering and production precision to make it work. Also with a 'B' mount you will loose the space to put in the internal ND system. I think BM got the P6P just right - right features and right price.

ProAv on the Pocket 6K Pro. £1879 in the UK, ex-VAT (~US$2620):

I am just upfront with you. You claimed that "BMD was too cheap" to license the mounts and I showed you that they are not able to.

Please do me a favor and don't put words in my mouth, I never said such a thing.

I put that in " " for a reason.
But I'd like to quote you once again and you tell me how one should interpret this not like I did?
Maybe language/cultural barrier and I misunderstood what you wanted to say between the lines.

PL? The truth is that EF is one of the most restrictive mounts out there. Ultimately L-Mount or RF are accessible for a license fee, same with ProRes on Resolve for Windows. They choose not to deal with the license but overall it's a lose lose situation for many users like me. I'd rather Blackmagic charge me extra for an L or RF mount option than not have one at all and be looking elsewhere.

What I did imply is that where there is a will, there is a way.

EF is an outdated mount which has its own issues as well as being unadaptable for many lenses due to its overlong flange distance.

I already stated that I do share you sentiment about the available mount.
But we also have to stay realistic - the largest target group of this camera will probably still have EF-mount lenses more than any other mount system.

With neither of these options being offered I am left once again at having to pass on this camera, that is all that needs to be said in regards to this matter and your insistence on me being wrong is not going to make me purchase this camera.

TBH - I do not care if you buy the camera and none of my feelings will get hurt if you won't.
If this camera does not tick all the boxes for you then make a good business decision and give another company your money. It's not a religion but a tool.

Leica own L mount. It’s up to them if they let others play and if they do you can bet they will also pay. Which means we pay. This is the only likely modern option for BMD.

No doubt, but how much for a camera mount and how much for a lens mount? Sigma and Panasonic would need to license both.

For the first time in decades, I'm ready to spend a silly amount of money on Leica glass for my Sigma fp.

Perhaps Leica should be paying Sigma for using L-mount? That's the argument I would use if I were BMD.

For the first time in decades, I'm ready to spend a silly amount of money on Leica glass for my Sigma fp.

How are you liking the camera?

Leica own L mount. It’s up to them if they let others play and if they do you can bet they will also pay. Which means we pay. This is the only likely modern option for BMD.

No doubt, but how much for a camera mount and how much for a lens mount? Sigma and Panasonic would need to license both.

For the first time in decades, I'm ready to spend a silly amount of money on Leica glass for my Sigma fp.

Perhaps Leica should be paying Sigma for using L-mount? That's the argument I would use if I were BMD.

Panasonic and Leica have long had a close branding relationship. So it’s not new. It’s very likely sigma make their leica branded and designed lenses. The L mount club was already participating behind the scenes anyway.

JB

How are you liking the camera?

Currently, my favorite camera. I shoot only 12 bit DNG, and it reminds me of a film camera - only what's needed, no frills, great images, and my old lenses look great.

... As I am using mostly PL-glass these days, I was wondering about the adapter posted earlier in the thread - does this provided a true locking mechanism to the camera? I don't see any support foot and as such the adapter would then just be held by the EF-Mount spring mechanism, right? Also I have read that most PL-EF adapters have fairly limited compatibility, as many PL-lenses protrude too far back to fit into these kind of mounts.

Rick can you comment on your experience on using this particular mount - in particular with a follow focus? Does it avoid the dreaded image shift when changing focus direction?
...

Paul, I’m not able to access my SLR Magic PL->EF mount at the moment so I’ll update this if my statement is incorrect, but I don’t believe the more expensive adapter I have included any mechanism to lock the EF portion to a non-locking EF mount. The PL portion does lock any PL lens of course. So there’s a possibility of the mount shifting as can occur with any non-locking EF mount.

To minimize any movement, I use two approaches that should be successful for my purposes but they may not suit everyone understandably, especially given the marketing of the BMPCC6K Pro as a handheld camera. If handheld means shoulder-mounted, my approach may be valid, but not if you’re turning gears by one hand as you really hold the camera in your other hand given the smooth resistance that is a feature of gearing on PL mount lenses.

One: I lock my PL lens in position by using a matte box (and proper ring such as the 114mm to 95mm spacer) that is secured to rails; I can tighten my Bright Tangerine Misfit Atom enough to prevent rotation of the lens and the matte box is locked down to a proper alignment with a BT rail support. And when feasible (such as with the SLR Magic 1.33x-65 Anamorphot) I also use the SLR Magic Universal Lens Support to align and secure the lens preventing rotation of the barrel.

Two: I use the motorized PD Movie to control and manage any gear movement especially for focus because the motors are much less likely to disturb the lens than my hand suddenly grabbing a gear or cranking a manual follow focus. The motorized thumb controller takes a subtle movement that isn’t going to be as likely to disturb the framing.

Can’t guarantee success but so far I’d say more than 99% successful. Before I took this approach and would use my hands, I had problems frequently until I decided my personal style suits locked-down shooting. Probably because these things can get heavy at my age and unsteady in a hurry and my shots are usually more than a few seconds.

There is a place for using a mess of movement to reflect excitement or panic and other emotions in a scene, but I seldom want my camera or lenses to be the story. I prefer the camera be an observer, not another character. Regardless of other planned movement, no one wants to see their image shift at the start of a focus change.

Great price on a capable small viewfinder; it’s a great idea for the BMPCC6K Pro even though that camera already has a 1500 nit tilting screen that lessens the need for a separate viewfinder.

“Surely goodness and mercy” will prevail and they’ll make another version with a non-proprietary connector such as HDMI. Otherwise I share your disappointment. We want to be able to mount a viewfinder off the camera, not stuck on one camera exclusively.

I think that the attraction of the viewfinder is size and weight. Apart from that, it appears to be inferior in every way to the Portkeys L-EYE, which is 20% cheaper.

As you suggest, it's also unclear what the EVF adds to the 1500 nits tilting screen.

Not sure why this viewfinder is being compared to external EVF's, especially the LEYE. I own the portkeys. It is an LCD display, the BM is Micro Oled. Totally different level of accuracy, especially with regard to contrast. Potentially with regard to color as well, but we'll see.

The Portkeys has a ton of features as all external EVF's should. This BM viewfinder has none built in, it will simply show you the features that the camera has.

The Portkeys is small and lightweight compared to some other external EVF's, but it is huge compared to this BM.

I see this BM viewfinder like all built in viewfinders, except BM has turned it into an add-on option rather than making it an obligatory part of the build.

If you're gonna compare it, it should be compared with the EVF in the C200 vs no EVF in the C200B. That's more akin to what they've done here.

Most people who reframe in post do so because they were sloppy in production when it comes to scripted narratives. When you're shooting documentaries I can see the extra resolution being a plus because you can't redo a take to get a closeup when you're filming an event, but that's a different task from scripted film, where most of the people who complain about resolution want to be.

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The other advantage for an event is that a fixed full framing can be converted into something that looks like a multicam. This is what I do now with GH5 and GH5S ( with slightly different framing, crop/pan /zoom ) so for this approach I would like 8K. For a theatre performance a single camera could look like many in the edit. I edit in a 1920x1080 timeline so have no real interest in 4k or 8K output. An 8 version of this 6K Pro would fit my needs great as at the moment I carry two cameras and two Ninja V with all the batteries and cables that could be replaced by one camera and no cables.

Rick, appreciate the detailed reply. Looking into the Wooden PL Mount modification now, which obviously is more expensive than your option. I have reached out to them whether they think it will be compatible with the 6k pro, although I do not see any reason it shouldn't, barring the internal NDs perhaps.

... Rick does that work for all your PL glass. I've often heard that modifiers work for some but not all lenses. Look forward to hearing your thoughts.

Marshall, my PL-EF adapter is the expensive one on the B&H Photo site that I posted. I bought it years ago but haven’t used it as my cameras are PL mount of MFT mount. My still camera is an old Canon Rebel XT that uses EF-S lenses. Later I’ll see if I can mount my PL lenses. I believe all my PL lenses do not extend more than 13mm so they’ll be fine on an EF mirrorless camera like the BMPCC6K.

I don’t have the BMPCC6K Pro to know the position of the integrated neutral density filters and if that becomes a challenge but perhaps BMD can comment on the free movement available for a PL lens. I don’t know if there are differences with the space available on the URSA Mini Pro family that support EF mounts. At this point I think BMD may be able to give assurances that lenses that conform to the Zeiss CP.2/CP.3 design allowing 13mm of rear element travel are good-to-go on the BMPCC6K Pro with integrated ND filters.

I’m reading the updated manual today but not at the moment. That may already have an answer. I wouldn’t assume PL is good until BMD provides more information. There are many (usually older) PL primes and zooms that exceed the CP.2 design limits. Metabones has also been a source for guidance in the past, but they won’t know about the new cameras with integrated ND.

... I just shot again the other day with the 12k and the thing that slaps you in the face when you go back to it is it’s beautiful colour response. Not the resolution...

They will no doubt make more RGBW cameras but the timeline would be more likely in the next cycle.

JB

I agree completely with the footage that UMPro12K shooters have made available to download. It’s clear the colour from the RGBWWW has reached another level of fidelity. That’s why I was gunning for an 8K version with mFT, but I can wait, especially given the pandemic that shut me down. Fingers crossed for 2022 if that’s what it takes. It’s amazing how all those tiny photosites work together to make the most beautiful images I’ve graded.

I was a bit bummed that Blackmagic did not use their new sensor in the P6KPro. I do not know what the yield is when they are producing the new sensors...but I thought they could save $ on the ones that didnt make the cut, and put it in a lower model. Maybe sensor fabrication don't work like this? I dunno.

Thanks Rick! You may have just sold me on getting the Pocket 6K Pro and the SLR Magic PL Adapter.

I finally got home and am going to finally watch the live stream. I'm also going to look completely into what is in the Pocket 6K Pro fully. See if it's what I need. Probably. Should I sell the Pocket 6K or keep it will be the next question.

Hey Tim, After reading Ricks posts regarding this adapter he's thinking that 13mm of rear element travel (assuming that means from the end of the mount to the physical end of the lens) is the limit. Just measured the Pictor zooms which came in around 22mm. Does not seem like this adapter will be a solution. Wondering if Blackmagic could weigh in on this one. Or perhaps JB who so often sheds light on shadows.

I was a bit bummed that Blackmagic did not use their new sensor in the P6KPro. I do not know what the yield is when they are producing the new sensors...but I thought they could save $ on the ones that didnt make the cut, and put it in a lower model. Maybe sensor fabrication don't work like this? I dunno.

A sensor kinda works or it doesn't. But what exactly were you hoping to get out of a different sensor?

Maybe count your blessings. Nikon is nearly dead, we know what happened to Olympus, and there's talk that even Panasonic may exit this market. Smart phones....

At least they listened -- the Pro has the articulated screen and the EVF option, which will probably figure in future Pocket models. And it's consumers which have doomed m43 -- it's a whole lot bigger than S16mm, but evidently not big enough for making imaginary movies -- not technical shortcomings at this end of the market.