Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

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Staffordfuhs

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Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSat Jan 08, 2022 11:43 pm

Does anybody have any great movies that come to mind shot all in 1080p or 2K resolution? I heard game of thrones was filmed in 1080p prores ? I want to study some of these movies and look how it was shot outside of pretty resolution and detail. I am sure there are many movies filmed in Full HD but some of the information is lacking. Trying to overcome the more resolution is better vs quality of resolution lol !

thanks

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Uli Plank

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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 12:08 am

Anything that was shot on an original Alexa (check IMDb) was shot in 2K.
And then, see what Steve Yedlin has to say about resolution.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 12:54 am

Movies are shot in different k depending on the post-processing it needs. but it all ends up in 1080 or 2k for distribution

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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 1:11 am

Recent… old like 2009 ?
Fhd in beta cam sr (10 bit 4:2:2 h264)
But I think was decent like result, it’s named something like Avatar from a guy called James Cameron

Resolution is a matter only if story isn’t good.


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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 1:12 am

Uli Plank wrote:Anything that was shot on an original Alexa (check IMDb) was shot in 2K.
And then, see what Steve Yedlin has to say about resolution.


http://www.yedlin.net/ResDemo/index.html
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 1:13 am

Uli Plank wrote:Anything that was shot on an original Alexa (check IMDb) was shot in 2K.
And then, see what Steve Yedlin has to say about resolution.
Original Alexa shot in 2.7k or in open gate 3:2 aspect ratio at 3.5k if I remember correctly.


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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 1:17 am

Staffordfuhs wrote:I want to study some of these movies and look how it was shot outside of pretty resolution and detail.


Not sure what exactly you’re looking to glean by studying stuff shot in 2K or 1080p – many movies, including big-budget Hollywood ones, and TV shows are still mastered in 2K even if they were shot in a higher resolution.

Even the movies that are mastered in 4K are released in 2K DCPs for most cinemas; 4K releases are still restricted to home media and streaming.

If you put a Schneider Classic Soft 2 or a Pancro Mitchell Diffusion Filter “D” on a lens and pop it on a 4K, 6K, or an 8K camera, the resulting image might just look like something shot at 1080p, even after it’s mastered at 4K.

Maybe if you could elaborate on what precisely you wish to study then you’ll get more specific advice. For instance, are you looking to analyze the texture of the playback resolution or do want to assess how much resolution plays a role in preserving production design and makeup?
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 1:40 am

carlomacchiavello wrote:
Uli Plank wrote:Anything that was shot on an original Alexa (check IMDb) was shot in 2K.
And then, see what Steve Yedlin has to say about resolution.
Original Alexa shot in 2.7k or in open gate 3:2 aspect ratio at 3.5k if I remember correctly.


Correct, but if he wants to look at the movies, they’d be finished in 2K. And then, 2.7K sensels on a Bayer sensor will yield about 2K of true resolution.
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Uli Plank and All Thanks !

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 2:25 am

So i just got done watching Steve's resolution comparison. I have done some similar comparisons with my own photos and videos as well. My own observations are right in line with his. I kept thinking over the years with all these photographers and video guys AM I CRAZY ?? I just do not see the differences to the huge amounts of work that goes into some of these very nice images. 10mp vs 100mp images almost look identical in most photos. Taking up 10X the storage and see very little return on the efforts expanded.
So many other aspects such as gradations, coloring and the list goes on and on.

From my background the Canon R5 and 8K video are the most touted thing in the photographers world, but as other guys have pointed out take a canon C100,c200 in 1080p/2k and look at the image quality it produces, the skin tones all these other things not taken into consideration buy some of the camera sellers. I think most cinematographers on this site probably know this but the wider audience gets sucked into thinking ohh if it is an upgrade it must be better.

Thanks again to all, and especially Uli Plank for suggesting the video. Like most of you indicated pretty much every movie out there uses less than 4K resolution as a deliverable.

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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 3:09 am

People are easily impressed by big numbers when it's about technology. But movies are about artistic value. Much harder to put into figures ;-)

And the Canon R5 and R6 are bad design. They overheat, technology is not there yet for such resolution in a small enclosure.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 3:21 am

Higher MP allows for bigger blow up.
Try resize lower MP photos, they look like Tetris blocks.
Same thing goes for video I say.
Technology is always for tomorrow. So higher resolutions like the 12K Ursa are future proofing themselves.
Plus as it’s stated, it’s able the cleanest 8k or 4k image.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 3:08 pm

Before the numbers really got huge, Steven Soderbergh offered that beyond HD, he couldn't see the difference. Yedlin may have showed why.

These arguments for reduced noise, etc. may be technically accurate, but they're irrelevant, for cinema. Artifacts get normalized, in the course of viewing. And artifacts have come to have aesthetic value associated with them (grain/noise/gate weave). Even surface noise on a vinyl record has achieved aesthetic value.

The only actual "future proofing" is making something people will want to watch. 16mm is "future proofed" for as long as people still watch movies. So is HD and below. A typical 35mm print in a typical movie theater delivers around 700 lines. Nobody has complained, for 100+ years.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 3:22 pm

Amen, bro.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 6:32 pm

If I may throw in an additional consideration, whit all the concern over resolution one thing which seems to get less attention, if any, is the bit depth of the color/gradation. This might not be so much an issue with laser projectors as with displays. 10-bit just does not give enough. I would like to see a move towards 14-bit (I believe there are some x-ray monitors that provide monochrome 14-bit.) At the least, a push to get consumer 12-bit displays especially as HDR becomes more prevalent. But I believe the image quality for even SD would be improved.

I have not seen any research of the ability of film to discern gradation, but from my platinum/palladium printing days I found that a digital negative for platinum would require at least 14-bits to hold the subtle tonal variations whereas gelatin silver could get away with a 10-bit digital negative. Note that although gelatin silver can be whiter and blacker, pt/pd will give more discrete tones. And the more tones would present more "life" to the print.

So this point being instead of chasing more pixels make the pixels better.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSun Jan 09, 2022 6:48 pm

I mean, we mainly shot The Wild Man in HD/2K end of 2020. Was more documentary/found footage style. We started showing at Festivals last year, and in December we won Best Florida Feature Film at the Tampa Bay Underground Film Festival.

Resolution doesn't matter that much. I still shoot with the 4.6K UMPG2 and the footage looks great. Image quality looks better than what I shoot with the Pocket 6Ks that I have.

Now, am I going upgrade to the next generation 12K? Yeah, but not for the resolution. It will be for the image quality of color science and dynamic range. And, when the next generation has body improvements that's why I'll be upgrading. Maybe it will be a 16K VistaVision, or maybe it will still be 12K Super 35, but mainly it will have some more improvements to the physical URSA Mini Pro body design. That's my hope.

Remember, theatrical projection has not exceeded 4K yet. Although there are 8K TVs, the theatrical distribution resolution hasn't pushed into that really high number yet. And, people were still amazed by the epic scope of movies on the big 4K IMAX screen in theaters this last year. Example: Dune.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostMon Jan 10, 2022 12:20 am

IMHO the UMP 12K is all about subtle tonal variations.
But it can't beat a black and white sensor without Bayer pattern filter.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostMon Jan 10, 2022 3:24 am

Travis Hodgkinson wrote:Higher MP allows for bigger blow up.
Try resize lower MP photos, they look like Tetris blocks.
Same thing goes for video I say.
Technology is always for tomorrow. So higher resolutions like the 12K Ursa are future proofing themselves.
Plus as it’s stated, it’s able the cleanest 8k or 4k image.

I don’t mean to say this in a bad way but a cinematographer working with the director to plan the framing of their shot [in camera] to tell the story wouldn’t need to reframe or blow up the picture in post. This should be the premise of everyone who is learning about visual story telling, framing, and composition. You then won’t need the big K numbers. Roger Deakins in one of his seminars said that when he shoots with the Alexa digital, he already knows exactly what he wants in the frame because unless there is a problem with the shot, he never wants it to be reframed in post. Personally, I feel and subscribe to that philosophy so I don’t find any value shooting anything greater than 4K, maybe once in a while, in 6K for vivid color renditions when down-resing to 2K. I have yet to have a reason to deliver anything greater than 2K DCI for narrative filmmaking work and for DCP delivery.

BTW, watch Deakins films which many are shot with the older Alexa in 2.8K and the newer once’s however delivered in 2K DCI.

Future proofing is just a marketing feel good jargon.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostMon Jan 10, 2022 4:00 am

I hate to say it, but a lot of this is all meant to trick you into buying a new camera so that the company can make more money.

That said, I do believe Blackmagic is exempt from that statement with the 12K because they went with a radical new sensor design. In order to achieve the color fidelity and the dynamic range they had to go with a very high pixel count. Nonetheless, the 12K resolution isn't the selling point to me with regards to that camera.

I still subscribe to the notion of better pixels over more pixels.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostMon Jan 10, 2022 4:24 am

Ok, so I am getting really confused.

2K DCI is a different aspect ratio that my TV and Computer. Am I watching a cropped picture?

I have comcast X1 and they claim I am getting 4K transmissions. Am I being flamboozeled?

I have a Samsung 4K TV. Is this just marketing BS (don't get upset it stands for big stories)?

I think I can see a difference between 1080 and 2160 on YouTube. Is this just psychological and not real?

I've been filming and delivering in 2160. Am I wasting resources?

Sorry if this seems over simplistic but I need to bring it down to real world terms.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostMon Jan 10, 2022 5:49 am

wemrick1 wrote:Ok, so I am getting really confused.

2K DCI is a different aspect ratio that my TV and Computer. Am I watching a cropped picture?

I have comcast X1 and they claim I am getting 4K transmissions. Am I being flamboozeled?

I have a Samsung 4K TV. Is this just marketing BS (don't get upset it stands for big stories)?

I think I can see a difference between 1080 and 2160 on YouTube. Is this just psychological and not real?

I've been filming and delivering in 2160. Am I wasting resources?

Sorry if this seems over simplistic but I need to bring it down to real world terms.

2K/4K DCI is a cinema standard. It's meant for digital projection. However, it's super close to the 16x9 (1.78:1) image of your TV. Actually, your computer might be a different aspect ratio. My iMac is 1.78:1, but my MacBook Pro is 1.6:1. Either way, 1.89:1 is the 2K/4K DCI Aspect Ratio and when going to 1.78:1 the difference is small. Either there's a crop or there's letterboxing going on.

I think when it comes to 4K TVs the most important thing is if it is HDR capable. The resolution from HD to 4K is noticeable to a degree, but the difference between SDR and HDR is more noticeable.

Yes, UHD has more pixels, but on YouTube I think what difference you see is the compression differences. YouTube sucks overall. It has the worst compression. Something uploaded in UHD 4K is probably going to have better compression because the uploader went with less compression for the higher resolution than something uploaded in 1080 HD.

Last, there's no problem if your camera is capable of 2160 in recording in 2160. I've been shooting in 4.6K RAW since the original URSA Mini 4.6K camera. Mainly for the benefits of RAW. But I shot a lot of content in HD ProRes 444 and UHD ProRes 422 HQ. I couldn't see a major difference accept in the color grading phase. Yet RAW always was best.

Again, when it comes to these 8K or 12K or 16K resolutions that are now being moved towards the problem is distribution. 8K TVs exist, but the resolution doesn't matter. The HDR is what matters. Cinema is still stuck in 4K. Yet from 4K to 8K on the television side of things the noticeable difference comes in at the size of the TV. So once you surpass 80 inches that's when 8K might actually make a difference.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostMon Jan 10, 2022 8:16 am

Very few TVs will show DCI. Manufacturers like to make us think DCI and UHD is the same by just calling it all 4K.
But you’ll need a bit of cropping from the sides or small black bars above and below. Resolution wise it doesn’t matter. As our colleague wrote, true HDR capability will be more impressive.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostMon Jan 10, 2022 9:27 am

Isn't the 'shot in' question irrelevant as all modern cameras are capturing >HD/2k and subsampling in post to create the broadcast resolution. HD/2k is IMO just about right but also HD/2k displayed on an upsampling UHD/4k screen is better than display on a native res screen. I'm also concerned on how subsampling is done when dealing with higher than final broadcast capture resolutions and would suggest this is not optimal in any NLE.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostMon Jan 10, 2022 10:43 am

Do you really need more choices than in DR?
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostMon Jan 10, 2022 12:48 pm

Ah I keep forgetting about the custom options...... :oops:
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostWed Jan 12, 2022 4:24 pm

All great points on this thread. Very helpful. I lean more towards the side of "companies update and market for profit". And of course, as technology changes, they need to keep up with the times in order to survive.

As a guitarist though, I have a slightly different perspective. I could easily play and record all of my music with one guitar. If I switch guitars, I feel safe in saying that most people would not notice since the majority of tone and expression comes from a player's mind, heart, and fingers.

However, as I personally switch from one guitar to the next, I am inspired in different ways. The look, weight, feel, string action, and other factors, cause me to play differently, and can inspire fresh new ideas. So collectively, my guitars are tools for different tasks in my art. For the record, I prefer vintage instruments and gear.

An interesting well-known fact and story amongst guitar players is that guitarist Ted Nugent was in awe of Eddie Van Halen's tone (as were countless other guitarists). He felt for sure that Eddie had some secret components in his guitar, amps, or pedals, that gave him "THAT" magical sound which inspired players from the 80's up until today. Ted had an opportunity to meet Eddie and asked if he could play through his gear. To his great amazement and disappointment, Ted Nugent sounded like... well... Ted Nugent. Moral of the story? Art is as unique as the individual artist.

I imagine for pro cinematographers (I am a hobbyist), the same holds true. A pro could probably use any one camera and lens and create brilliant work. The general public would not notice if he/she switched cameras or lenses. In order to get his/her art fully expressed, cinematographers will use the gear that inspires them.

Maybe I am talking out of my backside, but by way of comparison, I use the same camera (UMP G2), and some of the same lenses (DZOFILM Pictor), as fellow forum member timbutt2. My work is nowhere near as brilliant and artistic as his. To me, it's about vision, expression mind and heart more so than the gear. Not that the gear isn't important! Anyway, thanks for listening.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostWed Jan 12, 2022 5:04 pm

There’s nothing more disheartening as a cinematographer to be asked what camera you shot something with.

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Ellory Yu

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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostWed Jan 12, 2022 8:08 pm

John Brawley wrote:There’s nothing more disheartening as a cinematographer to be asked what camera you shot something with.

JB

I agree. It is disheartening if the cinematographer does DP work but not so much if the cinematographer is a camera operator. Knowing the intricacies of the camera is part of a cam op job (IMO). :)

Cinematographer is an overused word, just like Filmmaker is.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostWed Jan 12, 2022 10:29 pm

JB[/quote]
Cinematographer is an overused word, just like Filmmaker is.[/quote]

Just to be clear, my comment was regarding the hands-on person behind the camera and how they use their gear.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostThu Jan 13, 2022 1:53 am

Derfla wrote:A pro could probably use any one camera and lens and create brilliant work.


IIRC, Henri Cartier-Bresson, one of the greatest photographers of the last century, used a 50mm lens on his Leica for his street photography all the time. Only occasionally, he'd use a wide angle for landscape.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostThu Jan 13, 2022 6:53 pm

True, but if he was shooting 135 film, then the 35mm lens on a Super35 sensor will give you an equivalent angle of view to the nifty fifty on a ‘full frame’ sensor.

I do agree though a single focal length can be relied upon to handle most situations as you begin to visualize everything through that lens. When I rely on the 32mm, it’s on the BMPCC4K (or the Super35 UM4.6K). It behaves like the 65mm lens on a full frame camera shooting UHD or roughy 46mm on a Super35 camera.

Depending upon your subjects and framing 50mm can work well on Super35 camera too but might be long on the BMPCC4K.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostThu Jan 13, 2022 7:39 pm

A recent short that I directed and had several nominations and won multiple awards including Best Short Drama at the Culver Film Festival was entirely shot with just 1 lens - the same Xeen 35mm EF using several cameras (Blackmagic URSA UMP G2, Canon C200, and FujiFilm XT-3), each giving it a different FOV of the respective cameras. We took advantage of it on various story parts of the picture. We shot it in 4K and delivered it in 2K DCI for theatrical DCP release.

The choice for the Xeen was also due to its soft quality (like the Rokinons) to help with softening the skins of the actors, who were in their golden years.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostThu Jan 13, 2022 8:02 pm

The 50mm, as sole lens, was pretty common in classic art cinema. It definitely has telephoto characteristics. Here at 1.37:

50mm.jpg
50mm.jpg (151.97 KiB) Viewed 7779 times


50mm3.png
50mm3.png (537.99 KiB) Viewed 7776 times



and again at 1.66:

50mm2.jpg
50mm2.jpg (169.5 KiB) Viewed 7779 times
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostFri Jan 14, 2022 1:30 am

rick.lang wrote:True, but if he was shooting 135 film, then the 35mm lens on a Super35 sensor will give you an equivalent angle of view to the nifty fifty on a ‘full frame’ sensor.


I was assuming that most folks around here would know that much ;-)
Just referring to using a single focal length. Many classic heroes of our profession also used very few lenses.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostFri Jan 14, 2022 5:31 pm

John Brawley wrote:There’s nothing more disheartening as a cinematographer to be asked what camera you shot something with.


Eh...I think you're reading too much into it. It's like asking a tennis player what racket they prefer, or a carpenter what table saw they use. It's not a loaded question, just a professional asking another professional for their opinion on the tools they use.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostFri Jan 14, 2022 6:33 pm

To use your analogy, it's unlikely a top-ranked tennis player would ever inquire what racket another top-ranked tennis player uses, since everyone at that level knows what (and what not) to expect from a racket. A beginner, OTOH, who's convinced that the "right" equipment will make him rich and famous, or look cool, might well ask....
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostFri Jan 14, 2022 7:20 pm

John Paines wrote:To use your analogy, it's unlikely a top-ranked tennis player would ever inquire what racket another top-ranked tennis player uses, since everyone at that level knows what (and what not) to expect from a racket. A beginner, OTOH, who's convinced that the "right" equipment will make him rich and famous, or look cool, might well ask....


Exactly.

What's annoying is that these kinds of assumptions come often from PRODUCERS or DIRECTORS who should know better.

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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostFri Jan 14, 2022 9:25 pm

John Brawley wrote:
John Paines wrote:To use your analogy, it's unlikely a top-ranked tennis player would ever inquire what racket another top-ranked tennis player uses, since everyone at that level knows what (and what not) to expect from a racket. A beginner, OTOH, who's convinced that the "right" equipment will make him rich and famous, or look cool, might well ask....


Exactly.

What's annoying is that these kinds of assumptions come often from PRODUCERS or DIRECTORS who should know better.

JB
Top athletes, like in professional golf in addition to tennis, are usually paid to use the latest equipment and it often puts amateurs in a position of trying to “keep up” rather than establish their own criteria. With sports equipment in the hundreds of dollars it can make sense as an amateur to just buy into the latest technology, which might only show minor improvements to pros, but mostly not qualify as a huge financial gamble.


Thinking about “great recent 1080p” the trend that comes to mind to me are the YouTubers or small production crew that have gone out and purchased a used Alexa for $4,000 - $6,000 or the continued support for upscaling the pocket or micro cam to 4K instead of upgrading. Or even the many Red Komodo’s for sale on Facebook because the investment was too high to pay off short term.

Should the independent or low budget filmmaker live behind the curve? In HD?
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostFri Jan 14, 2022 10:06 pm

Ryan Earl wrote:Should the independent or low budget filmmaker live behind the curve? In HD?


But what curve? Audiences don't care. HD or 8K -- it will make no difference, least of all for a low-budget movie. Review the annals of low-budget production and it's impossible to argue that production value, much less resolution, is crucial to success. If anything, high resolution without money is the enemy of fiction. You won't have the production design to survive it.

Consider also that a very low budget movie which looks great may only succeed in establishing expectations it doesn't have the resources to fulfill, and the audience won't make the allowances it might for a cruder or more haphazard production. One of the excitements of "indie film" used to be the rough, improvisatory alternative to market tested, exhaustively produced and deathly predictable Hollywood movies. I'm not sure that excitement is available any longer -- too many bad indie movies -- but resolution? Nobody cares. Do you dream in HD, much less 8K? Of course not. It's murky as hell. And realer than real.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostFri Jan 14, 2022 10:45 pm

John Paines wrote: I'm not sure that excitement is available any longer -- too many bad indie movies -- but resolution? Nobody cares. Do you dream in HD, much less 8K? Of course not. It's murky as hell. And realer than real.


That much abused phrase...the democratisation of media...

Means that almost anyone now gets to "tell their story" because the cost of entry is so low....

I'm just not sure "the audience" cares to see everyone's story....

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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostFri Jan 14, 2022 11:40 pm

Great point John - and I might add, even if we were interested we do not have the time. There are so many great stories out there. I have to constantly say, "well, sounds great, but sorry I have to focus."

And, I might agree with someone else on this forum who wished we had a "Like" button.

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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSat Jan 15, 2022 12:24 am

John Brawley wrote:
Means that almost anyone now gets to "tell their story" because the cost of entry is so low....

I'm just not sure "the audience" cares to see everyone's story....

JB


That is a good point JB. Indie films are so saturated in the market but there are good ones made and there are audiences watching them. Also, although many thinks of indie as zero to low budget films and there are many making them due to the low cost of entry, there are indie films that have budget, not Hollywood level budgets, but it still is in the mid/high 5 and mid six figure budgets. I've been involved in a number of indie films for US and Euro production companies over the years and I will say that most, if not all (since some of them I'm not privilege to the accounting) of them have a decent budget for cast, crew, rentals, legal, production design, and post. However, they are more aggressive in their production and genres are limited and sometimes very specific.

Just to add, gears are usually rented. Cameras we've used range from Blackmagic (~15%), Red (~50%), Canon C200/300 (~15%), Sony F series and A7S (10%), and on bigger budgets Arri Alexa (~8%) and others (DJI Drone cams, DSLR - 5D, GH5, FujiFilm XT, etc) makes for the rest of the percentage (~2%).

Capture usually is in 4K DCI, 4.6K, and a very few 6K but delivery is mostly 2K DCI and some HD (1080p). I still have to be involved in an indie project that captured > 6K and was delivered in 4K or anything greater than that.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSat Jan 15, 2022 4:31 pm

John Paines wrote:To use your analogy, it's unlikely a top-ranked tennis player would ever inquire what racket another top-ranked tennis player uses, since everyone at that level knows what (and what not) to expect from a racket.


Why do you alter what I said to reinforce your point? I never said "top ranked" tennis player. For being such an accomplished professional, you sure seem to have a fairly thin skin about how people perceive you.

I understand what you're saying, and yet I still feel that in many cases that's not why people ask about equipment. When people ask me what camera I shot something on, I don't immediately go thinking "oh no, they're not valuing my skillset as a filmmaker."
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSat Jan 15, 2022 4:43 pm

Kays Alatrakchi wrote:
John Paines wrote:To use your analogy, it's unlikely a top-ranked tennis player would ever inquire what racket another top-ranked tennis player uses, since everyone at that level knows what (and what not) to expect from a racket.


Why do you alter what I said to reinforce your point? I never said "top ranked" tennis player. For being such an accomplished professional, you sure seem to have a fairly thin skin about how people perceive you.

I understand what you're saying, and yet I still feel that in many cases that's not why people ask about equipment. When people ask me what camera I shot something on, I don't immediately go thinking "oh no, they're not valuing my skillset as a filmmaker."



I'm with John Paines here.

Of course the equipment matters at some level, but the majority of the time when I'm asked this question, it's because they've just watched a well staged, well acted, well designed shot, well lit, well operated, WELL DIRECTED well produced, well edited scene. A million other MORE IMPORTANT choices than the camera.

Something that has resonated with the person asking that question for almost every other reason than the camera it was shot with. That is my experience with this question.

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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSat Jan 15, 2022 5:36 pm

There are so many assumptions people jump on without thinking through reasonable alternatives.

As someone dealing professionally with cameras for over 40 years I can easily think of several reasons one would ask about the cameras involved in any project. That have absolutely nothing whatever to do with the stupid assumptions mentioned previously.

Such as, if you're considering a project and perhaps wondering which cameras, asking this to find if maybe the full workflow used would be useful information for you.

Or if you've had some projects with problems with a camera or two, checking to see if they used one. And if so, how they handled it either on set or in post.

These two as simply a starting point.

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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSat Jan 15, 2022 6:11 pm

The matter as raised doesn't concern professionals with a need to know. The question, as referred to here, is coming from "equipment enthusiasts" and would-be filmmakers.

This unholy passion ("what did he shoot it on"?) will be familiar to anyone acquainted with 'indie" film and the enormous aspirational cadre of camera obsessives which goes with it. Even people who know better -- who know that the camera is the least essential element, not the most -- indulge this vice.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSat Jan 15, 2022 7:00 pm

I find it ironic that the people who say that the camera doesn't matter are often the ones who have access to some of the best equipment that money can buy.

I also find it ironic within the context of what is being said on this thread that, in just about every interview I've ever read in American Cinematographer, the DP seems to often fall over themselves to make sure to mention exactly what camera and lens package a certain project was shot on.

I'm sorry but camera and gear very much matter to the final image. To say that it doesn't is, quite frankly, absurd and pretentious.

Go and explain Robert Richardson why he's wasting his time by shooting Tarantino films on vintage Panavision glass and 65mm film, and that he might as well shoot on a Pocket 4K because "the camera is the least essential element" and see how well that goes.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSat Jan 15, 2022 7:06 pm

Kays Alatrakchi wrote:I find it ironic that the people who say that the camera doesn't matter are often the ones who have access to some of the best equipment that money can buy.

.


I don't think anyone said it doesn't matter.

It's just asking the wrong question (most of the time)

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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSat Jan 15, 2022 7:10 pm

John Paines wrote:The matter as raised doesn't concern professionals with a need to know. The question, as referred to here, is coming from "equipment enthusiasts" and would-be filmmakers.

This unholy passion ("what did he shoot it on"?) will be familiar to anyone acquainted with 'indie" film and the enormous aspirational cadre of camera obsessives which goes with it. Even people who know better -- who know that the camera is the least essential element, not the most -- indulge this vice.

This is quite an assumption and ridiculous at all. Professionals, whatever your definition is of one, many ask and do need to know. Indie films are not aspirational cadre of novices. Many are professionals who care about their craft and make a decent living making indie films. Being passionate about what they do, made enough films to be good at their craft, and being paid for it, for the majority part, is the meaning of being a professional. Dropping big names does not make them any better and I bet you my dirty pants they ask about what others used for equipment.

BTW, this is really getting off the rails from the original topic. We all need to calm down with being overly knowledgeable with assumptions and get back on topic.
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSat Jan 15, 2022 7:15 pm

Kays Alatrakchi wrote:I find it ironic that the people who say that the camera doesn't matter are often the ones who have access to some of the best equipment that money can buy.

I also find it ironic within the context of what is being said on this thread that, in just about every interview I've ever read in American Cinematographer, the DP seems to often fall over themselves to make sure to mention exactly what camera and lens package a certain project was shot on.

I'm sorry but camera and gear very much matter to the final image. To say that it doesn't is, quite frankly, absurd and pretentious.

Go and explain Robert Richardson why he's wasting his time by shooting Tarantino films on vintage Panavision glass and 65mm film, and that he might as well shoot on a Pocket 4K because "the camera is the least essential element" and see how well that goes.



For people who don't have tens of millions of dollars and (in many cases) have never actually directed a movie (or one anyone would care to watch), I think it's safe to say the camera choice is way down on the list of what's important.

We could continue upping the ante -- has a little more money, has a little more experience, etc. -- quite a long ways until we reach the point where, say, 35mm v. 65mm might be significant. And only if we're talking about a high-level of production, in all aspects.

If pointing this out is "pretentious", what 's sound and sensible?

And if anything's ironic, it's that this preoccupation with the camera continues even when astonishingly good cameras with world-class finishing software and computer are available for well under $5000. Some folks are still worried that their unmade no- or low budget masterpieces won't achieve immorality, thanks to the wrong choice of camera. The production lacks every other essential -- which is the case with the vast majority of indie productions -- but the main worry is, the camera's "only" 4K.... Or it's not "good enough" for Quentin on a $100 million production, so why me?
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Re: Great recent Movies Shot in 1080p or 2K ?

PostSat Jan 15, 2022 9:15 pm

And yet here we are discussing in another thread why Netflix won't approve Blackmagic cameras (and we haven't even brought up the fact that, yet again, no Blackmagic cameras were used in any of this year's Oscar nominees). If a $5000 camera is more than sufficient, why aren't all those DP's using them?!

Hop on over to the Resolve part of this forum and you'll find plenty of colorists who will tell you that you can't grade on a non-professional monitor. Not a single one will say that they can grade on anything and that gear is the least important consideration.

Cameras (and other equipment) do matter, for several reasons; including the ability to achieve a desired look.

So what if someone is asking that question for the "wrong reason"? It's really not up to us to speculate why a person might want to know. We can either choose to provide that information or not -- but trying to read into the motivations of why the question was asked in the first place is IMHO poor form.

Anyhoo...I agree that this tread has gone off the rails and we should probably go back to the OP's question regarding resolution.
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