Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

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Robert Niessner

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Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 10:35 am

Just installed the update on my second PC4k and it is better than the release notes suggest!

The GUI was sensibly revised and cleaned up, the focus peaking finally strengthened and made well usable again.

Also the AF is actually better and faster now, I have the Metabones Speedbooster with the Sigma 18-35 on the PCC4k and the Push AF is now actually usable - before it was just cranking around and rarely found anything.

The audio levels can now be set in dB steps and there is a shortcut to the menu at the top right of the HUD display - so you don't necessarily have to use the menu button.

And in playback mode it now shows the current and total number of clips.

A missed opportunity:
Why can't I use the scroll wheel to jump from clip to clip in playback mode? Instead I still have to use the on screen forward and back buttons.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 10:42 am

Yeah, I installed the 7.9 update on both my P6K and P6KPro. AWESOME!

Definitely love the updates. The interface feels cleaner, more modern, and remains super easy to navigate. The focus peaking improvements are great.

I'm most excited for the next DaVinci Resolve update for the Stabilization update with the Gyro data in BRAW.
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Robert Niessner

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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 10:47 am

timbutt2 wrote:I'm most excited for the next DaVinci Resolve update for the Stabilization update with the Gyro data in BRAW.


I only hope that this update would come to Resolve 17 too! Because atm I won't update to 18 in the middle of a lot of projects going on. But I definitely could make use of this new feature.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 11:24 am

Robert Niessner wrote:
timbutt2 wrote:I'm most excited for the next DaVinci Resolve update for the Stabilization update with the Gyro data in BRAW.


I only hope that this update would come to Resolve 17 too! Because atm I won't update to 18 in the middle of a lot of projects going on. But I definitely could make use of this new feature.

Tough to answer that one. But a Resolve 18 Beta update feels right in line with this.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 11:48 am

Robert Niessner wrote:
timbutt2 wrote:I'm most excited for the next DaVinci Resolve update for the Stabilization update with the Gyro data in BRAW.


I only hope that this update would come to Resolve 17 too! Because atm I won't update to 18 in the middle of a lot of projects going on. But I definitely could make use of this new feature.


Has the camera been recording this data all along? Or does it only work with clips recorded with the 7.9 update?
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 11:50 am

Nick Heydon wrote:
Robert Niessner wrote:
timbutt2 wrote:I'm most excited for the next DaVinci Resolve update for the Stabilization update with the Gyro data in BRAW.


I only hope that this update would come to Resolve 17 too! Because atm I won't update to 18 in the middle of a lot of projects going on. But I definitely could make use of this new feature.


Has the camera been recording this data all along? Or does it only work with clips recorded with the 7.9 update?
That’s something I’ll test out. I have some footage from October that I’ll see if there’s any improvements with stabilization in the update.

Otherwise, it could be all the new BRAW files with the 7.9 update carry the metadata needed.


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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 11:59 am

Robert Niessner wrote:I only hope that this update would come to Resolve 17

So.. gyro doesnt work in actual version of Resolve 17?
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 12:09 pm

It will have to be recorded using cameras as running 7.9. This data is not being recorded previously.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 12:15 pm

Kristian Lam wrote:It will have to be recorded using cameras as running 7.9. This data is not being recorded previously.

Thank you for the clarification Kristian!
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 3:27 pm

How about adding gyro data to UMPro G2?
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 4:00 pm

Kristian Lam wrote:It will have to be recorded using cameras as running 7.9. This data is not being recorded previously.
Will gyro data recording be added to the 12K?
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 4:44 pm

I like how all three drives can now be accessed (4K pocket.) Also adds a nice slider for the focus assist strength. Looking forward to checking out the gyro feature once in Resolve.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 4:45 pm

What Jamie said. ^^^

Gyro data for the 12K, pretty please, I give you cookie.. :D
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 5:14 pm

Hi !

I have updated my p4k camera to 7.9 a couple of hours ago, and saw a little problem.
I can't set my off speed recording to 75fps, it only allows me to 60fps. ( 2:4:1 ) :cry:
Anyone having this problem in the p4k ?

Thanks !
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 5:32 pm

Just notice BMPCC4K 4096 x 1720 (4K 2.4:1) only goes up to 60fps not 75fps :?:
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 5:37 pm

WahWay wrote:How about adding gyro data to UMPro G2?

maybe on the UMPro G2-2
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 5:38 pm

Uhm to be honest I not like smaller font in interface, my old eyes not like it
All other Changee are great


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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 5:41 pm

WahWay wrote:How about adding gyro data to UMPro G2?
I wish! But, I have a feeling the Gyro wasn’t in it. If it is hidden in there then great! But from what I can tell not likely.


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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 5:43 pm

Jamie LeJeune wrote:
Kristian Lam wrote:It will have to be recorded using cameras as running 7.9. This data is not being recorded previously.
Will gyro data recording be added to the 12K?
I’m 100% Positive that “YES” the updates to the UI and the Gyro data will come to the UMP12K because it has the horizon tool, and thus a gyroscope has to be hidden in there. This update may be a month or two away.


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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 6:17 pm

timbutt2 wrote:I'm most excited for the next DaVinci Resolve update for the Stabilization update with the Gyro data in BRAW.



And here I was about to purchase a GoPro Hero 5 for the explicit reason to capture gyroscope data for Gyroflow software. This addition alone to the firmware is significant than the last few firmware updates in my humble opinion. Why BMD isn't highlighting this feature a lot more is beyond me. Sony makes it it's own selling point.

Damn awesome potential here. Of course, let's see how it performs, right? If all goes well, this takes DR's stabilization features/tools to the next-next level.

Go ahead, give Warp a slap in it's ridiculous face.
Last edited by filmbuddy on Thu Jun 23, 2022 6:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 6:39 pm

Can anyone confirm their BMPCC4K at 4k 2.4:1 now only goes up to 60fps and no longer does 75fps after this fimware update?
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 6:51 pm

Confirmed, 60fps max in 4K 2.4:1 (with Off Speed enabled) in Blackmagic Raw on all quality settings. The new manual still claims 75fps.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 6:57 pm

roger.magnusson wrote:Confirmed, 60fps max in 4K 2.4:1 (with Off Speed enabled) in Blackmagic Raw on all quality settings. The new manual still claims 75fps.


That a big balls up. 4k 2.4:1 at 75fps was a big plus over the BMPCC6K. Going back to the old firmware.

They need to fix this!!!!
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 8:12 pm

Can anyone speculate how the gyro stabilization performance might differ between the P4K and P6K? I'm wondering if sensor size will make a difference in stabilization effectiveness or if that's not a concern.

I don't have any EF lenses or any lenses that can be adapted easily to EF, so the 6K would require a big investment if I got one. I would be all set for lenses for the P4K but if the stabilization isn't great there's no point in me upgrading from what I currently use (BMMCs and original Pocket with glidecam or tripod).
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 8:19 pm

When I change ProRes formats ( to say 1080p) I have to remember to change the sensor area to 6k if I don't want it windowed.. was it always like this? I don't remember it!
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 8:41 pm

Brad Hurley wrote:Can anyone speculate how the gyro stabilization performance might differ between the P4K and P6K? I'm wondering if sensor size will make a difference in stabilization effectiveness or if that's not a concern.


The main difference will be the quality in the final output. Since the stabilization will crop the footage, you can shoot 6k and still deliver in 4k that looks 4k. If you shoot 4k and crop, you might see a slight quality drop compared to non cropped/stabilized footage. I imagine it'll be hard to tell, but technically you are enlarging the image to fit the frame.

If you're delivering 1080p, then the difference won't be noticeable between the cameras. I can't imagine sensor size having much, or any impact on the stabilization.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 8:43 pm

Nick Heydon wrote:If you're delivering 1080p, then the difference won't be noticeable between the cameras. I can't imagine sensor size having much, or any impact on the stabilization.


Good to know, thanks.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 9:52 pm

Trying to install the update - but the setup utility just sits at 0%. going on now for about 30min. How long does this take? Just stuck with a Updating Software.. Don't unplug the camera message....
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 11:05 pm

Brad Hurley wrote:Can anyone speculate how the gyro stabilization performance might differ between the P4K and P6K? I'm wondering if sensor size will make a difference in stabilization effectiveness or if that's not a concern.
When it comes to post stabilization, I'd say sensor scan rate is far more important than K count. The 6K Pocket has a slower scan rate than the 4K. Slower scan rate = more jello = more artifacts in the stabilized result. Whether BMD is correcting for jello in their new post stabilization calculation of the gyro data in Resolve, we'll have to wait and see.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 11:16 pm

Rolling shutter is accounted for in Resolve's gyro stabilisation, what is not and cannot be is motion blur. So you likely need to shoot at faster shutter speeds to reduce motion blur if you plan to stabilise. I've found for my preferences 45° at 24fps to be "safe" and 90° can be okay depending on the original motion. The footage Grant showed was 45° @50/24fps. I would also suggest monitoring and framing using safe area guides, maybe 10%-20% depending on movement etc.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostThu Jun 23, 2022 11:28 pm

That is great to know! Thank you for the details Hook!
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 1:09 am

CaptainHook wrote:Rolling shutter is accounted for in Resolve's gyro stabilisation, what is not and cannot be is motion blur. So you likely need to shoot at faster shutter speeds to reduce motion blur if you plan to stabilise. I've found for my preferences 45° at 24fps to be "safe" and 90° can be okay depending on the original motion. The footage Grant showed was 45° @50/24fps. I would also suggest monitoring and framing using safe area guides, maybe 10%-20% depending on movement etc.

Are there stabilization samples at varying shutter angles and FPS for us to see?
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 1:10 am

CaptainHook wrote:Rolling shutter is accounted for in Resolve's gyro stabilisation, what is not and cannot be is motion blur. So you likely need to shoot at faster shutter speeds to reduce motion blur if you plan to stabilise. I've found for my preferences 45° at 24fps to be "safe" and 90° can be okay depending on the original motion. The footage Grant showed was 45° @50/24fps. I would also suggest monitoring and framing using safe area guides, maybe 10%-20% depending on movement etc.

This! Thank you Hook. I usually keep my safe areas to 95% when not doing a ton of movement, then 90% for stabilized movement on a slider/dolly/jib. Sometimes for Steadicam I'll use 85% just so that I have that extra room to be safe.

Good to note that the faster shutter speeds can be helpful. The wonderful thing is that it's easy to add motion blur back into a shot these days in post. So shooting at 45° and then stabilizing, and then adding motion blur is very doable.

Please, please, bring these firmware updates to the URSA Mini Pro G2 and 12K! I'd be so thrilled if you guys can do that. My UMPG2 feels like it needs the new UI. But I think the 12K needs the new UI as well. The 12K definitely has the gyroscope, but I wonder if the G2 might secretly have it as well. Please update the URSA line soon as well.

Love the Blackmagic Camera Development Team! You guys rock!
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 1:34 am

timbutt2 wrote:Please, please, bring these firmware updates to the URSA Mini Pro G2 and 12K! I'd be so thrilled if you guys can do that. My UMPG2 feels like it needs the new UI. But I think the 12K needs the new UI as well. The 12K definitely has the gyroscope, but I wonder if the G2 might secretly have it as well. Please update the URSA line soon as well.

Love the Blackmagic Camera Development Team! You guys rock!

+1000!!!
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 1:37 am

Murphymd9 wrote:Trying to install the update - but the setup utility just sits at 0%. going on now for about 30min. How long does this take? Just stuck with a Updating Software.. Don't unplug the camera message....


What version were you on before? It should not take that long.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 4:28 am

Reading the description of Camera Update 7.9, I don't see where they are talking about the stabilization data feature. Why not? That's actually the key feature of interest here.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 5:34 am

Murphymd9 wrote:Trying to install the update - but the setup utility just sits at 0%. going on now for about 30min. How long does this take? Just stuck with a Updating Software.. Don't unplug the camera message....

It took forever on my computer.
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 5:45 am

ShaheedMalik wrote:
Murphymd9 wrote:Trying to install the update - but the setup utility just sits at 0%. going on now for about 30min. How long does this take? Just stuck with a Updating Software.. Don't unplug the camera message....

It took forever on my computer.



I have tried to download this update but it has now been downloading for 3 hours and I still have only 20% of the update.
Did anyone else have that problem besides Murphymd9 and me?
Regards,

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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 6:02 am

Please, please, bring these firmware updates to the URSA Mini Pro G2 and 12K! I'd be so thrilled if you guys can do that. My UMPG2 feels like it needs the new UI. But I think the 12K needs the new UI as well. The 12K definitely has the gyroscope, but I wonder if the G2 might secretly have it as well. Please update the URSA line soon as well.

Love the Blackmagic Camera Development Team! You guys rock!


+1
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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 7:25 am

Arie van der Winden wrote:
ShaheedMalik wrote:
Murphymd9 wrote:Trying to install the update - but the setup utility just sits at 0%. going on now for about 30min. How long does this take? Just stuck with a Updating Software.. Don't unplug the camera message....

It took forever on my computer.



I have tried to download this update but it has now been downloading for 3 hours and I still have only 20% of the update.
Did anyone else have that problem besides Murphymd9 and me?


He did have a problem with installation - you got a problem with the download.

Just in case you're still having troubles, I have uploaded it to my transfer page, download it here:
https://laufbildkommission.filemail.com ... qgjnhbxczd

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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 8:09 am

VILTROX SPEED BOOSTER/ADAPTER

Tested Viltrox EF-MFT Speedbooster, as well as adapter with their latest FW 4.0 and BM Camera 7.9

i can confirm full functionality - AF, Iris, IS where applicable on the following lenses:

Sigma 18-35
Canon 10-18
Canon 50mm 1.4
Canon 18-135

@kristian lam

Any idea when we would see a Resolve update that incorporates Gyro data for stabilization?

THANKS!
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xchrisx

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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 11:38 am

The brand new DaVinci Resolve 18 Public Beta 5 update released today contains the gyro.

My question: with this update can you finally view taken dng stills in camera?
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francesco.dadamo

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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 1:12 pm

I just tried using the gyro data to stabilize footage filmed this morning with the 6kPro (on the new davinci beta release) and the results are excellent, very smooth and natural. As written above it's better to keep a safe area at the frame edges. I am curious now to try it also with stabilized lenses and see what the outcome is, I didn't expect this improvement, very happy of it!
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xchrisx

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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 1:28 pm

if any of you could do some test footage I would really appreciate :)
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ksilva

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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 2:07 pm

filmbuddy wrote:
timbutt2 wrote:I'm most excited for the next DaVinci Resolve update for the Stabilization update with the Gyro data in BRAW.



And here I was about to purchase a GoPro Hero 5 for the explicit reason to capture gyroscope data for Gyroflow software. This addition alone to the firmware is significant than the last few firmware updates in my humble opinion. Why BMD isn't highlighting this feature a lot more is beyond me. Sony makes it it's own selling point.

Damn awesome potential here. Of course, let's see how it performs, right? If all goes well, this takes DR's stabilization features/tools to the next-next level.

Go ahead, give Warp a slap in it's ridiculous face.

I agree 110%, the gyroscope data stabilization should be the top highlight of this update. I'm so happy this feature exist for these cameras. This is a game changer for a lot of people. I've seen a lot of reviews where people mark these cameras down for lack of stabilization. It's not a perfect solution but it's definitely a big improvement that will get a lot more people to buy these cameras. I wish it would have came sooner but hey, it's better later than never.
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kontrakatze

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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 2:32 pm

Regarding the gyro stabilizer, I just made a quick comparison video on yt (nothing fancy):

This is just a quick test to compare the in-lens stabilization of canon ef-l lenses to the new gyro stabilization of Davinci Resolve 18.

You will see each clip 4 times:
1. No stabilization, just hand held
2. Just hand held + DR gyro stabilizer
3. Canon ef-l Image Stablizer only
4. Canon ef-l Image Stabilizer + DR gyro stabilization

All shots were done hand-held (25fps) with Canon Image Stabilizer off/on, gyro stabilization was applied in Davinci Resolve 18

Stephan Schoenharting
Berlin, Germany
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9HVF-6TcKDkavfcqu0lFMQ/videos
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Jeffrey D Mathias

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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 2:57 pm

Just gave the gyro stabilizer a try with pocket 4K, 24fps, 180o, Q0. It seems to work well. I know that what was stated earlier about Grant using 50 fps and 45o (which will make sense when I am shooting wildlife at 60fps 1/500 sec)... but I wanted to try it with 1/48 sec for the motion blur. I moved slow and steady and the gyro still did a good job of taking out jittering.

Question: Is this always on (gyro stab)? There is a switch in the settings but it seems to always be on and not able to turn off. When on I would be interested to know how much the bit-rate will be influenced by having the extra data... thinking of when pushing cameras to best quality and highest speed (also thinking of with my 12K.)

Also I am adding edit: Also tested sound... am using the Rode video NTG mic which works well on the camera. I did notice that the controls were changed a bit and some new meters. Was anything else done in this area?
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muriloresende

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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 4:20 pm

I did some tests with the gyroscope and looks like some lenses are not compatible. It would be great to have a list of compatible ones or maybe some way to calibrate them
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MrHotter

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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 4:41 pm

If you have any stabilization in your lens, do you need to turn that off? It seems that would fight the gyro data.
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GeoffreyKenner

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Re: Camera Update 7.9 for Pocket Cameras

PostFri Jun 24, 2022 4:43 pm

Jeffrey D Mathias wrote:Question: Is this always on (gyro stab)? There is a switch in the settings but it seems to always be on and not able to turn off. When on I would be interested to know how much the bit-rate will be influenced by having the extra data... thinking of when pushing cameras to best quality and highest speed (also thinking of with my 12K.)


Shouldn't be much since process happens in post.
It's likely 3 numbers corresponding to the strength of a vector in space
(A number for X, Y and Z) per frame.
A photosite in raw is probably way more data expansive than this.
https://www.geoffreykenner.com/
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