BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with SB?

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otaku-house

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BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with SB?

PostTue Dec 31, 2013 4:16 am

First up, love love love the Metabones Speed Booster. With it the BMPCC reminds me most of the Arriflexes I started shooting film on. In some ways I'm glad to have a cinema camera that has autofocus / aperture disabled. Makes me think like I used to.

However - cannot find any information on whether IS via switch on the lens will work with the BMPCC speed booster.

One huge drawback to a very stripped down BMPCC is the sensor size / weight / ergonomics leads to extremely jittery handheld. I thought a perfect combination would then be the Sigma 17-50mm 2.8 - love Sigma's optics but unlike the 18-35mm, this one has an image stabilization with switch on the lens! I thought I'd found a holy grail.

(With a shoulder rig and the Tokina 11-16 with a speedbooster you're so wide that it helps eat up some of the jitters, and this lens fits right in covering next range of focal lengths)

Here's the thing though - I don't think it's working. I don't have a Nikon camera body to test it out. On the BMPCC there seems to be no real discernible affect to having it switched on or off, and I hear no noise whatsoever.

What I can't find on metabones site is how passive their BMPCC Nikon mount Speed Booster is - is no power going to the IS function of the lens perhaps? Or is Sigma's "OS" just not robust enough for video operating?

It's such a beautiful lens I'll keep it, but god if I could find a way to make that work...

(One final aside - if Panasonic made that 14-42mm pancake with functioning IS or even just the 14mm with IS they'd sell a lens to every BMPCC owner out there)

Aaron Stewart-Ahn
Last edited by otaku-house on Tue Dec 31, 2013 4:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Denny Smith

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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostTue Dec 31, 2013 4:36 am

The Speed booster is a passive adapter, IS does not work. Only MFT lenses with external IS switch on them have working IS.
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Ryan Jones

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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostTue Dec 31, 2013 4:38 am

I was under the impression IS was only supported on native M4/3 lenses, so I bought a 12-35 2.8. Good investment.

If you can get IS working that would be a real plus. Have you asked Metabones?
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otaku-house

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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostTue Dec 31, 2013 4:52 am

Thank you Geoff, that's what I was assuming, just needed verification as there's no info on Metabones' site. Otherwise I'd see those bumped contacts inside the Speed Booster, yeah?

That sucks.

Reckon I'll still keep this lens though, very pleased by its image and where its range sits next to the Tokina.

Oh well, back to camera operating the way I and 85% of the shooters who ever lived had to. Practice, technique, endurance, tenacity, and being relaxed enough.
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otaku-house

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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostTue Dec 31, 2013 4:54 am

Likewise, when I was wondering about passivity, I knew that meant that no electronic signals were being communciated, but was holding out hope that at least a current was going to the lens.
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adamroberts

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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostTue Dec 31, 2013 7:19 am

Not all Speed Boosters are passive. The EF to E mount Speed Booster is an active adaptor. The soon to be released EF to MFT Speed Booster will also be active.

But none of the others are... So no IS on Nikon lenses.
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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostTue Dec 31, 2013 2:55 pm

Geoff Baxter wrote:
adamroberts wrote:Not all Speed Boosters are passive. The EF to E mount Speed Booster is an active adaptor. The soon to be released EF to MFT Speed Booster will also be active.

But none of the others are... So no IS on Nikon lenses.


Yes, correct. But on the Metabones site, the EF to E mount adapters for the Sony are called Smart Adapters, and I said they were active.


No.

Metabones do a Smart Adaptor:
http://www.metabones.com/products/details/MB-EF-E-BM3

And a Speed Booster:
http://www.metabones.com/products/details/MB_SPEF-E-BM1

2 different products both offering electronic control of EF lenses.

When the EF to MFT Speed Booster ships it will be similar the the EF to E-Mount Speed Booster.
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otaku-house

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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostTue Dec 31, 2013 4:19 pm

adamroberts wrote:
Geoff Baxter wrote:
adamroberts wrote:Not all Speed Boosters are passive. The EF to E mount Speed Booster is an active adaptor. The soon to be released EF to MFT Speed Booster will also be active.

But none of the others are... So no IS on Nikon lenses.


Yes, correct. But on the Metabones site, the EF to E mount adapters for the Sony are called Smart Adapters, and I said they were active.


No.

Metabones do a Smart Adaptor:
http://www.metabones.com/products/details/MB-EF-E-BM3

And a Speed Booster:
http://www.metabones.com/products/details/MB_SPEF-E-BM1

2 different products both offering electronic control of EF lenses.

When the EF to MFT Speed Booster ships it will be similar the the EF to E-Mount Speed Booster.


Adam,

Are you basing this on information you've gotten from Metabones?
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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostTue Dec 31, 2013 4:58 pm

What info? That the EF to MFT Speed Booster will be an active mount similar to the EF to E-mount Speed Booster?

That is what they've been saying all along. If it was going to be a passive mount it would be available already.

I believe the hold up is getting the commands from the MFT mount translated so that the EF lens does what the MFT mount is telling it to do. The E mount version took them a long time to get right. It's not as simple as you might think. IMF it was there would be many options available already.
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otaku-house

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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostTue Dec 31, 2013 5:26 pm

Adam,

Not inferring anything or assuming anything about complexity, just curious if you'd heard this from them directly as you stated that it's going to be released soon. Of course, everyone is debating what mount lenses at this point in time, and it's a big decision & investment for many, so firsthand information is appreciated.

It's funny how Blackmagic just created a market that makes Panny Lumix lenses near essential and they can't get them to let them know how to fully communicate with their lenses. The 14-42 would become a no brainer for most buying this camera.

I wouldn't be surprised, and this is entirely my speculation, that somewhere in Canon corporate it's been decided they're not going to be sharing any info with Metabones.

Cheers,
aaron
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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostTue Dec 31, 2013 6:33 pm

otaku-house wrote:The 14-42 would become a no brainer for most buying this camera.

There's a 14-45 with an external IS switch which works but I get your point. I was lucky to be able to borrow a 14-42 and find out for myself IS didn't work. Rather glad I didn't buy it.
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otaku-house

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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostTue Dec 31, 2013 8:57 pm

JustinD wrote:

There's a 14-45 with an external IS switch which works but I get your point. I was lucky to be able to borrow a 14-42 and find out for myself IS didn't work. Rather glad I didn't buy it.[/quote]

Justin,

The great thing about the 14-42mm with this would be how ridiculously small it is for a zoom with IS. But this is perhaps one of the reasons there is no external IS switch?

I definitely see this camera as either one that needs to be built up or as minimal as possible.
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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostWed Jan 01, 2014 9:39 am

Geoff Baxter wrote:
adamroberts wrote:I believe the hold up is getting the commands from the MFT mount translated so that the EF lens does what the MFT mount is telling it to do. The E mount version took them a long time to get right. It's not as simple as you might think. IMF it was there would be many options available already.


So are Metabones implementing some sort of controller chip inside the frame of their Speedbooster? If so, this would seem an odd thing to do because it would make the firmware of the Speedbooster vulnerable to firmware changes by the camera maker.

I would have though a simple pass-thru connection would make the device more future proof, leaving the burden of implementing lens control on the shoulders of the camera maker.


Both the EF to E mount Smart Adaptor and EF to E mount Speed Booster have a circuit board with a chip that translates the Sony commands to Canon commands.

This has firmware that can be updated by sending the mount back to Metabones.

This is how the EF to MFT Speed Booster will work.

MFT cameras don't send Canon commands. Why would they?

You can't simple pass through the MFT commands to the Canon lens as the lens has no idea what they mean.

So there has to be some sort of translation. That's what they are working on.
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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostWed Jan 01, 2014 10:35 am

But USB is a standard. It's used by many companies.

Canon uses its own proprietary software to control its hardware. As do most camera makers.

MFT cameras have software that recognises MFT lenses. They have no way of recognising Canon lenses... Or any other lens for that matter.

If they did we would already have dozens of adaptors to choose from.
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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostWed Jan 01, 2014 3:15 pm

An EF mount Speedbooster without electronics wouldn't make any sense, as there would be no way to control the iris of the canon lenses. Nikon lenses control the iris mechanically, that's why it is way easier to build adaptors for Nikon lenses. Canon would be very ill advised not to disclose their communications protocols to Metabones & others.

otaku-house wrote:The great thing about the 14-42mm with this would be how ridiculously small it is for a zoom with IS. But this is perhaps one of the reasons there is no external IS switch?

I own(ed) both lenses, they are almost identical in size, the 14-45 lens is even a little shorter (it's wearing an UV-filter in this image):
Image
The 14-42 is lighter, but it also feels less "solid built", and i found it to be not quite as sharp in all situations as the older 14-45 - but that could also be subjective, and wouldn't matter much on the Pocket cams limited resolution, it might indeed reduce moiré a little...

The lack of OIS switch on the 14-42 caused me to buy the 14-45 in addition, so now i'm selling the 14-42 on ebay...

Or were you talking about the pancake 14-42 ?! Of course that's even smaller to carry around, but once activated it gets a lot longer...
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otaku-house

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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostWed Jan 01, 2014 5:06 pm

Yeah I meant the 14-42 pancake vario.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=&sku=818962&Q=&is=REG&A=details

Which has been noted in another thread will not enable OIS.

Hope Panasonic realizes that such a combo or similar - wide-ish pancake with IS - would lead to sales for pretty much anyone with a BMPCC. Would make it truly pocket. Maybe we should contact them and let them know.

I am getting beautiful results with the camera on a rig with Metabones and wide lenses. But I'd love for a super discreet IS option even if optical quality / speed is the trade off.
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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostWed Jan 01, 2014 9:16 pm

Yeah, i had the pancake for testing for a couple of days, but as it had the same OIS-issue (or rather: the Pocket cam has the issue...), i returned it in favour of the 14-45. OIS makes the 14-45 very useable, at the wide end anyway.
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Re: BMPCC + SpeedBooster + Sigma 17-50mm - does IS work with

PostWed Jan 01, 2014 10:29 pm

Just noticed that the new Lumix 12-32mm which comes stock on their new camera does not have an IS switch...

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