Blackmagic Forum

Hi there,
I am looking to give my students that nexxt level experience and am going to ask for some legit camera equipment.
I need some advice... if the world could give you just what you need to teach high school kids how to create greate video, what Blackmagic camera would you ask for? And on a side note, I have a bunch of bluetooth Rode mic systems... can I use this with any blackmagic cameras?

Thanks in advance for the advice!
Jill

I would go with the BPMCC 4K. Inexpensive and uses MFT inexpensive lenses. Will introduce students to all the disciplines that any BM camera will, manual exposure, manual focus, manual white balance, composition via a nice monitor. Coupled with Davinci Resolve the b-raw files will allow them to experience color correction and color grading producing a deliverable that will exceed the specs of any distribution baring netflix.

jnowak wrote:Hi there,
I am looking to give my students that nexxt level experience and am going to ask for some legit camera equipment.
I need some advice... if the world could give you just what you need to teach high school kids how to create greate video, what Blackmagic camera would you ask for? And on a side note, I have a bunch of bluetooth Rode mic systems... can I use this with any blackmagic cameras?

Thanks in advance for the advice!
Jill

Hi! I recommend the Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera 6K Pro for top-notch video production. Unfortunately, it won’t directly connect to your Bluetooth Rode mics, but you can use an external audio recorder to sync audio in post.

It is a tall question.

It depends on whether you want them to have a single cam cinema type of experience or multi cam TV studio type of experience.

Blackmagic can offer both.

You need to be more specific in your question.

What Rode mics do you have?

It’s important to know if you want each student to be a sole operator in any environment (outdoors and indoors) or if you want to create small teams which might define a range of skill types including:
- external audio recording on something like a MixPre-6 II recorder using sync tools like a Tentacle Sync
- lighting
- camera operation of one or several cameras for a cinema shoot or studio shoot
- post editing
- colour grading
- audio mixing.

There are many skills to learn to create a good video. Definitely more to it than one person doing point and shoot and deliver that unedited result.

You can likely do all the post work they would need in the free DaVinci Resolve version 19.

I’d be hesitant to refer to the venerable Pocket 4k as next level. It has it’s advantages but it’s largely no better or worse than anything else out on the market. I’m thinking Ursa Broadcast for live or 12k for cinema.

Good Luck

Personally I'd love people to learn on an URSA Mini Pro camera. Most of the time I get annoyed working with people who don't know basic procedures. For example camera people who run the camera before sound when slating the shot. If they were trained on film they would know to let sound roll, the 2nd AC calls out the slate info, then camera rolls, and the slate is clapped.

But either way, the main thing is that I think learning procedure is important. Understanding that time is money is important as hard drive space is still money. Same with media card space. The URSA Mini Pro G2 was on discount for 3K earlier this year. That would be a great camera to learn on.

I think that leaning on the URSA is so good because it teaches you how to use a professional camera. Learning how to use it with the professional level I/O and proper PL lenses.

Sadly, we are talking high school program here. So, it comes down to basics of shot composition, lighting, and such. But the procedure of things is still valuable.

I'd say a Pocket 6K Pro is a fine middle ground. But, if Blackmagic could keep the UMPG2 in production for 3K purchasing then that would be amazing. It would far exceed what most people need to start learning on, but at the same time would teach so much. The PYXIS would be another option.

Either way, I'm probably in a different level. I worked on my first feature film junior year of high school, and that was shot on Super 16mm film. So... I learned on a real film set in high school.

timbutt2 wrote:... I worked on my first feature film junior year of high school, and that was shot on Super 16mm film. So... I learned on a real film set in high school.

That’s amazing and so rare!

Are you teaching them movie making or camera operation?
movie making: keep it cheep and simple
camera operation: URSA

What are the long term plans for this program ....

My concern is that if you need a robust camera that will be supported ... have an upgrade path
and hopefully an extended warranty ... BM may not be the ideal choice ...

For everything else it checks all the boxes ... BRAW, integrated Davinci Resolve support, streaming,
cloud access ....

However looking for a ten year investment may be a bit of a stretch .... many here have had no problems but then many have not survived the end of life for the product at 3 years.

Ursa Mini Pro G2 with PL mount would be ideal ... as long as you have the funds to deal with replacement
needs going forward.

The DR Speed Editor is so cheap I would recommend a couple ... and there is the question whether
the camera skills or the post process grading skills will better serve your students.

Sounds like a wonderful program ... best wishes for a pathway for those you teach to realize their vision
and to develop the skills to succeed in this present AI challenged environment.

jnowak wrote:if the world could give you just what you need to teach high school kids how to create greate video, what Blackmagic camera would you ask for?

Pocket 4K and a Meike 25mm lens, no question. It's a damn near perfect starter package.

The suggestion of a pocket 4k and Mieke lens is an excellent one for starting out basic filming. Just to get some professional type options in the camera along with practice working with a RAW format in post.

The next step, to get a fully top professional feel to camera use, settings, and practice would be the Ursa Mini Pro 4.6K G2 as also mentioned above. You can use Canon mount EF lenses with it for minimal cost that with that camera still produce amazing images.

I picked up one during the $3k pricing in May, and wow ... filming into the sun in late evening is glorious.

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jnowak wrote:I am looking to give my students that nexxt level experience and am going to ask for some legit camera equipment.
Jill

Jill, I have had some experience in this and if your intent is next level experience, I would assume that you meant giving your students the experience of emulating a filming set. Something like this is not just about what camera to have alone. Depending on your budget, I suggest having the “lab” mindset where you build teams and each has a role to contribute. Since it is a fact that feature film making is a collaborative effort, that should be the kind of experience your students should have.

So what does that mean for equipment to buy? Well, it all depends on what the budget is. It will be impractical to buy 30 Blackmagic cameras for 0 students. You might want to break them into smaller teams that will have camera operators, lighting people, and other factions that makes a filming crew. Assuming you have 30 students, if you arrange each group to participate in some of the common roles which are camera operator, gaffer, grip, sound operator, and boom, and PA for everything else (clapper, etc.), which totals about 6 per group, there you have 5 teams or groups. So each group can have the equipment set to operate on. And in terms of what to buy, you’re buying equipment for each group so you’ll be able to spread your spending and have different equipments not just cameras to provide that next level experience. For each group, here’s my suggestions as a starter set, however this is all depending on your budget and curriculum plans. There are always alternatives.
Each group gets:
1 - Cine Camera. I suggest getting a Blackmagic URSA 4.6K G2 or the BlackMagic Pyxis 6K. They have the form factor and features of true digital Cine cameras and are priced reasonably.
3 - Lenses. I suggest some cheap Cine lens from Meike or Rokinon. You’ll probably do well with a 16mm or 24mm, a 35mm or 50mm, and an 85mm or 105mm. I suggest getting different focal lengths that the teams can just share around.
3 - Lights and C-Stands. You’ll want bi-color LED monolights of different intensity. To keep cost down, some brands that make reasonably price lights are SmallRig, Godox, GVM. Par can lights are cheap too and can be useful if budget is limited.
You will also want scrims and flags of various sizes.
1 - Slider with stands
1 - Dolly and tracks
1 - Traveler’s crane with stand
Checkout Proaim for the above last 3 items.
1 - Shotgun mic, boom pole, and wind jammer with dead cat
1 - Sound recorder - like the Pre-Mix or similar.
Of course, you’ll need consumables like camera and sound recorder media, cables, etc.
This may be more than enough to start with but you’ll have the basics for making a set filming experience.

As I said, there are alternatives and others chiming in should give you ideas. If the students have iPhones and Android phones, they can use the BlackMagic Cinema Camera app which can be use for b or c cams where camera settings can be similar with the real Cine cams at a more individualized operation. This would give everyone their own handle with a camera - with something they already owned and the app is free.

The next piece is the post production part too but you can start with whatever works for you. Good luck to you endeavor.

Caution on integrating phone cameras. Most student phones will have minimal available storage to be useful beyond very short projects.

By now you understand these suggestions barely scratch the surface of the various roles and gear that may need to be involved. Ellory has a good point about the students learning about the collaboration of filmmaking. I don’t see teams of only five or six people. I see a single team of the class members that tackles one project employing many different roles possibly including a director and assistant director, a producer, a writer or two, a designer, costume, set builders, and more even for a short film intended to be a few minutes long. The class can determine many of the roles they think a particular project requires.

Keeping the deliverable goals modest, but embracing many roles, will keep costs lower and still develop many skill levels.

rick.lang wrote:Caution on integrating phone cameras. Most student phones will have minimal available storage to be useful beyond very short projects.

By now you understand these suggestions barely scratch the surface of the various roles and gear that may need to be involved. Ellory has a good point about the students learning about the collaboration of filmmaking. I don’t see teams of only five or six people. I see a single team of the class members that tackles one project employing many different roles possibly including a director and assistant director, a producer, a writer or two, a designer, costume, set builders, and more even for a short film intended to be a few minutes long. The class can determine many of the roles they think a particular project requires.

Keeping the deliverable goals modest, but embracing many roles, will keep costs lower and still develop many skill levels.

Rick, I was not suggesting integrating phone cameras other than for students to be able to get their hands on something that doesn’t cost then additionally (assuming everyone these days have smartphones - they’re high school students) so they can independently learn to frame, look at what happens when they make changes to exposure, etc.

I also was thinking just about the camera set crew as the OP was asking about camera use so small teams could collaborate on the technicalities of filming, not necessarily film production. However I totally understand and agree at your point that 5-6 students doesn’t make a production although I have had projects where the entire indie film only had less than 10 people (cast and crew). To emulate a full production, an entire class would need to collaborate on a single project, with assigned roles as you listed.

In all, Rick has given good pointers as well. I hope this thread helps the OP get somewhere.

Good luck Jill. Fill free to ask in this thread for help. Lots of good and talented cinematographers here in this forum. I too, have learned from others here.

Sorry to hijack the thread but I'm looking to purchase a new camera for my school's morning announcements.

We currently have a JVC 4k camera that works well for what we do with a greenscreen studio. We also have an ATEM Mini Extreme with Accsoon HDMI transmitters/receivers to record to a USB drive. All of this works, but the JVC cam is huge and I'm looking for something smaller and easy to use.

I was looking at the Studio Camera Plus 4k G2, but I have some questions.

1. What battery setups are available? Recommendations?

2. Which lenses should I get? This is something I really don't know about. We will have daily announcement recordings in my room, but will have assemblies in the gym with a lot of light and the auditorium with very little light.

Good point, Ellory; the OP is asking about video recording recommendations, not the full scale production of a short film as I was suggesting. It seems an extraordinary opportunity to have the class work together for several months though tapping many varied talents each student body would have. Tempting.

rick.lang wrote:It seems an extraordinary opportunity to have the class work together for several months though tapping many varied talents each student body would have. Tempting.

Totally agree, Rick.

rNeil H wrote:a pocket 4k...is an excellent one for starting out basic The next step...would be the Ursa Mini Pro 4.6K G2

Not a PYXIS?

Jim Simon wrote:

rNeil H wrote:The next step...would be the Ursa Mini Pro 4.6K G2

Not a PYXIS?

Either one would be a good choice.

Well, after they finally start shipping. We are finally seeing an example from that new camera. But no cameras yet ...

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You could get two PYXISes (PIXIES?) for one Ursa G2.

I got my new 4.6k for $2995 I think it was ...

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