shipping when?

I'd pay twice as much if they will ship it.

Why buy one when you can buy two for twice the price?

Raven's gonna be kinda crap like Scarlette is kinda crap. And kinda expensive crap.

No, if you want to go Red you go RED and get an Epic. You can even get one with a Dragon sensor and apply their new OLPF add-ons that drastically change their boring color science to match the sultry Alexa colorimetry. Or wait for the probably super-awesome Weapon. You'll pay dearly, and at those prices I'd rather buy an Amira, but hey you'll have a Red that's worth it. Getting a Raven cuz you're tired of waiting....no...better to wait for the better bang for your buck.

Ursa Mini's also less expensive in lots of ways. And the PL version's changeable mount and lens control interface means that camera has a lot of the customizability DSMC is known for. Again, without the cost. But, also without the RED!!!!! which is probably okay for some people.

I can't afford a Raven because I can't afford the Red...lifestyle. Sony's FS5 is a bit more affordable but it's too propriety and limiting technically. Nope. Ursa Mini 4.6K PL, please. I waited over a year for my BMCC. I can do the same here, too. BMCC wound up being completely worth it. This camera will also be and more so.

This thread has an enduring quality to it... no batteries required. I guess the only thing that will bring it to an end is when the final Mini has shipped.

This thread has an enduring quality to it... no batteries required. I guess the only thing that will bring it to an end is when the final Mini has shipped.

No need for you to be sensible, sir. Level-headedness has no place here! Be like the rest of us and keep saying the same thing over and over again to a surly crowd whose combined post count does not go past three figures.

This thread has an enduring quality to it... no batteries required. I guess the only thing that will bring it to an end is when the final Mini has shipped.

No need for you to be sensible, sir. Level-headedness has no place here! Be like the rest of us and keep saying the same thing over and over again to a surly crowd whose combined post count does not go past three figures.

This

But, also without the RED!!!!!

White Paint: $15
Skull Stencil: $5
Stripped off RED logo: $50
Gorilla Glue: $10
Clients thinking you have a RED: Priceless

There are some things money can't buy. But for everything else, there's the Ursa Mini. Soon™

This thread has an enduring quality to it... no batteries required. I guess the only thing that will bring it to an end is when the final Mini has shipped.

Are we there yet?

At least we've found a way to entertain ourselves...

Will it be shipping by NAB (April)? Embarrassing if not! Will it have the "traditional" $1000 price cut?

It seems like BM is literally giving birth to this camera. Announced in April, shipping in December? Nine months. I hope the camera has the gestation period of a human.

I will be patient until the Raven takes flight. Then bid BMD a permanent farewell. Not falling into this black hole again.

That's where I am at too. Yes, I completely understand that Raven is double the price,and yes media is triple the price. However reds customer service is amazing and they make really good cameras. Plus I'm extremely excited to see what the dragon sensor can do on the Raven.
Don't get me wrong I am a big fan of Blackmagic I have owned just about every one of their cameras, but I can't even tell you the amount of times that I've had clients, and producers tell me to rent a Red instead, and the good ol "you don't shoot projects you care about on blackmagic". Now clearly I don't believe in that but that's the unfortunate part of the world we live in, Red currently holds a higher place in people's minds and I don't see it going away anytime soon.
Like I mentioned in an earlier comment I'll be keeping my place in line at B&H but come April it is getting canceled, and to be honest with mass production not starting till February I don't see it arriving by then.

Speaking of preaching to the choir: documentary filmmaker published a post on his blog today that has much love for Blackmagic cameras in relation to Sony and Canon cameras. He says a lot of the same things many of us have said: Canon is blech and Sony is too video-y. Thie idea of never going back to DSLR is one I share and his article says everything I would but without the swearing. It's pretty much his perspective after a year of field work shooting 3 documentaries and how he came to his conclusions as he gushes over the Blackmagic cinema cameras. There's also gear recommendations like lights and sound equipment. Evolving article. Check it out here: http://www.daltonthomas.org/blog/2015/1 ... r-we-loved

Jason, couldn't agree more. However full disclosure, I'm pretty much a complete noob. The only other camera I have any experience shooting with is the VX2000 (which I still have). For me there is something about the graded footage from my BMPCC that I find very compelling. It's also been an interesting introduction to cinematography. The camera rewards my efforts to get a better image.

My directing partner and I were very excited to get the Ursa Mini once it was announced. We put our pre-order in May(since had to raise the money). We were very excited to possibly receive this in July when they had stated it would ship.

We had no projects that were booked due to this camera, we both have Panasonic GH4's, so we patiently waited. We wanted to be able to step up our game when it came to film-making but without killing our bank accounts. Excitement was not the word when it came to wanting this camera.

Then July came and went, then August came and went, etc. Now we would not have a problem with waiting even longer BUT the extreme lack of communication is what we did have a problem with.

Everything I have read on this board has been nothing but hearsay. It's extremely difficult to know if a camera is going to be good or not if no one really has one. Yes I know there are the beta testing ones out there, but let's be honest they are prototypes. In fact from what I have read on here about the history of BMD is that they have always been prototypes even in the hands of consumers, that we are their R&D. If the camera was out en mass and it was amazing THEN there are valid points to defend it. Case in point, people thought that the Phantom Menace were excited with the Phantom Menace coming out. People waited in lines, had rumors here and there, the build up was there, people were defending some of the bits of the trailers that they saw(Jar Jar). Then it came out.

The Ursa Mini is already a disappointment, in the fact of how they have treated their customers. They knew it was not ready, but got the excitement there. Also let's be honest that by the time it comes out it will not be the one pitched, or since it's a year later, it has given others the time to jump on BMD's steam from NAB.

The one thing that BMD needs to do to save face in the eyes of their customers and fan base, is they need to wait until they are ready to release it, and then announce it. Otherwise you become like, and yes this is a gamer reference so if you don't know look it up, a Peter Molyneux. Such as this camera has everything even a toothpick and fold out comb, and when it comes out it had to remove items to make the ship date. This has already been done with the Ursa Mini. It's the boy who cried wolf scenario.

I hope the Ursa Mini succeeds and is the camera everyone hopes it will be, but it won't be for me and my co-director. Quite frankly, it scared us, we don't have a lot of money to throw around so 5-6k is a huge investment, if they cannot even communicate to their customers about a release for their camera, then what happens if the camera needs to be repaired. Will we get the same quality of communication?

So we jumped ship at the end of September when the website still said shipping in August. We ended up buying the Canon C100 MKII. I am not here to promote it, just saying that we found out it was the camera for us. We film in a very run and gun style, also we film a lot of night scenes and the ISO range for the mini as we read would not work for us. Also the lack of having to buy vlock batteries, cfast cards, etc. Saved us much more money in the long run.

Let's face it though, NO camera will ever be the end all, beat all, of cameras but does it work for you?The biggest thing I have found in my 22 years of film-making is that there are really only one thing someone cares about, not the gear, not what you shot it on, but the story or the story you are trying to tell.

I look on here now and it's beginning of December and their website still says shipping in November. Not a good sign. I understand completely to why people are cancelling pre-orders, anyone would be the same they paid for something and nothing has come from it. It seems like a scam that way.

That's just my two cents anyways

Yeah but it's not a scam because look at all the product that's come before, some of it later than projected, as well. Quite a few products right on time. And Blackmagic is silent about things like release dates and upcoming firmware updates, but their customer service is always open and helpful and they get the job done. $5-6k is a lot of money for a lot of people, myself included, so to choose to invest it wisely in a really great tool means sometimes havig to wait when that tool is brand new and late to the party. But Ursa Mini, particularly the 4.6K version is simply a better camera than the C100 on spec alone. The C100 needs to be rigged out the same way a BMCC does and it is hell to work with on your shoulder. Ursa Mini with a few options (being that I'm getting the 4.6K PL version) amounts to over $7k worth of base camera. Not a decision to be made lightly. And sometimes you just can't wait nine damn months. So, I understand. Sad story. And I don't see how a C100 is a big step up from a GH4. I would have waited. Oh, That's right, I still am! And will continue to do so. Because a few months will be made up for by the next 4-5 years of constant use I know that camera will give me. And the fact that the camer will pay for itself within 3 months. All of this has happened before with my BMCC. Patience pays dividends. And there's no way I'm throwing my money at those....fine Canon people...whose business ethics are actually unresponsive to their clientelle. But they're so big they don't care. Thanks for feeding the beast. I choose to root for the underdog who continues to rattle the cage of mediocrity. So what if they're a little late.

The DaltonThomas article is for the most part full of holes. In their own words "don't tell anyone, but we have no idea what we're doing". I have shot eight docs using BMC cameras and right now I am in Indonesia shooting with my A7s2 and A7R2 plus FS7.
I cancelled my Ursa Mini which I ordered in April and it was the right choice. My FS5 is waiting when I get back to the states. I dismiss all claims of Sony looking video-ish as I think that is user error. The big mistake is to use Slog-3 and have no idea why... for some scenes/light it is not the best choice at all - especially low light ones.

Anyway no time to get into details but it's another case of not getting too swayed by what people write on the web and instead go get the cameras and spend many hours shooting and handling them.

To those who are surprised by the lack of communication, delayed shipment, and questioning how will they respond once the camera is out in the wild and it starts having issues... Look at history. They have never shipped their flagship cameras on time. Consistently the original BMCC was late, the 4k was late, the Ursa was late, the Ursa mini also late. If you are questioning how they will support the camera when it gets released look at their current cameras. I have a BM4K and bought it early on when it started shipping. First there was no RAW like they said there would be when they announced it. They ended up making it a FW update later. There was no way to format the card in the camera, they eventually patched that. Then there was the black sun. No FW to date exists to fix it and yes I know DVR 12 has a fix, but that didn't exist at the time. Also the FPN on the camera is obnoxious. I got a model that it wasn't that bad at first could hardly tell. Over time I think it has been either getting worse or just getting more on my nerves knowing I can't really fix it and it won't ever be fixed.
TL;DR I'm not holding my breath for this camera and while I'd like to believe in it I'll wait till camera ships and reviews are in before buying again.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

Otherwise you become like, and yes this is a gamer reference so if you don't know look it up, a Peter Molyneux.

In the spirit of the times, with all the constant rumors, wild speculation, cryptic communication, and massive hype, I had a different famous name in the gaming industry in mind...

Think about it. The Ursa Mini 4.6K's defining feature is its 4.6K sensor. The Ursa Major constellation has 17 stars and Ursa Minor has 7. A female bear, Ursa in Latin, has an average gestation period of 220 days, or 7.33... months, compared with the Ursa Mini's of 9 months.The Mini 4.6K, by my count, will be the 9th camera BM's shipped (after the BMPCC, BMPC4K, BMSCHD,, BMSC4K, Ursa 4K, Mini 4K, and BMMSC if I recall correctly). So, what does that leave us with?

4.6K = 46
46 - 17 - 7 = 22
22 * (9/7.33...) = 27
27 / 9 = .......
3
3
3

And, to clinch it, we expect the mini to have at most half the lifespan of its bigger brother, since the latter's sensor can be upgraded. All this all can only mean one thing, that another much anticipated and long awaited product may finally see the light of day, at least before the 4.6K does...any guesses?

The DaltonThomas article is for the most part full of holes.

And every post of yours is about how good Sony is. If you've moved onto Sony, why stay here instead of sticking to Sony forums?

He says a lot of the same things many of us have said: Canon is blech and Sony is too video-y.

Jason, while I normally find myself agreeing with you (silently ;o) 99.9% of the time... and would also agree with this statement. Have you by any chance seen the doc "Cartel Land"? It's all Canon, mostly C300.. and looks pretty much awesome imho (although quite dark subject matter)

A poor craftsman blames his tools.

Can anybody tell if Ursa mini 4K (not 4.6)has global shutter?

Yes the 4K mini already has global shutter..the 4.6k has a mode to switch between Rolling shutter and global shutter.

December 10th and still no word from Blackmagic. How insulting. Worse still, is that when asked they refuse to say anything. Slap in the face. I don't care how great their products are, I can't stand the company, and would rather have an inferior product or a more expensive one and know the company has my back.

It's not even about a camera. It's about loyalty, values, respect, integrity and honesty. If a merchant doesn't possess those qualities, your going to get mistreated.

I am angry that it is December and not only 4.6K isn't announced so the Micro doesn't exist and Ursa mini is limited.
I decided not to invest in Micro Cinema because i will receive it next year and it is pointless to invest in fullhd in 2016

Just being a few months away from delivery of this marvellous camera is a fantastic thing. It could easily be that such a camera would not exist at this price point without BMD.

Just count yourself lucky. Indeed I pinch myself. Glass is more than half full. Positively overflowing.


Jules

It doesn't exist yet. So we can't argue if this camera is fantastic or bad. I watched a lot of videos about micro cinema and i realised that almost in all videos it is either turned off or it is studio camera.

Yup, all this and more will be revealed when BM has finished all its product BMs.

And, to clinch it, we expect the mini to have at most half the lifespan of its bigger brother, since the latter's sensor can be upgraded. All this all can only mean one thing, that another much anticipated and long awaited product may finally see the light of day, at least before the 4.6K does...any guesses?

The Sputnik?

Sputnik? Why not, everybody else has a private space program.

5 days shy of EIGHT months from my order of the URSA Mini 4.6k camera, I have decided to cancel my order. With no word from BMD about the status of this camera or a new realistic shipping date, they have lost yet another costumer before the camera is even released.

I look on here now and it's beginning of December and their website still says shipping in November. Not a good sign. I understand completely to why people are cancelling pre-orders, anyone would be the same they paid for something and nothing has come from it. It seems like a scam that way.

That's just my two cents anyways

Actually, no, they aren't paying anything to pre-order. f they are, they should consider another vendor.

3...

half the lifespan

The Sputnik?

I actually don't even play video games (no time haha) but what I''m referring to has become probably the most relevant and popular reference on the internet when it comes to a long anticipated and much rumored (but never clearly communicated) product.

Actually, no, they aren't paying anything to pre-order. f they are, they should consider another vendor.

Obviously we are all eager to get our 4.6Ks, and its certainly disappointing to see that it hasn't come out yet. The lack of communication from BM certainly has put people off. However, given that this isn't some kickstarter that people have permanently invested in, I'm just not sure how folks can be "angry" at BM or call them a "scam." Its not like they took people's money and ran away with it, they aren't getting anything from preorder deposits as far as I know. It only hurts them to release the camera later than planned since they loose customers, so obviously they are under tremendous pressure to deliver both soon, and an excellent product that lives up to the considerable hype.

I can't blame anyone for choosing another camera system in the meantime if that's what your circumstances dictate. However, I'm not sure how it does anything but use up your valuable time and energy to come here and post a long diatribe about why you cancelled your preorder and are going with another brand, and how you'll never buy BM or the Ursa again. If that's the best course of action for you, then you don't need to come here to defend it. But at the same time, once the 4.6K is out and if it turns out to be as good as most folks seem to think it will be, I also don't see the harm in making the purchase at that point, no matter how late the camera was, if it delivers the very impressive image and capabilities it promises at a price well under significant competition.

3...

half the lifespan

The Sputnik?

I actually don't even play video games (no time haha) but what I''m referring to has become probably the most relevant and popular reference on the internet when it comes to a long anticipated and much rumored (but never clearly communicated) product.

Actually, no, they aren't paying anything to pre-order. f they are, they should consider another vendor.

Obviously we are all eager to get our 4.6Ks, and its certainly disappointing to see that it hasn't come out yet. The lack of communication from BM certainly has put people off. However, given that this isn't some kickstarter that people have permanently invested in, I'm just not sure how folks can be "angry" at BM or call them a "scam." Its not like they took people's money and ran away with it, they aren't getting anything from preorder deposits as far as I know. It only hurts them to release the camera later than planned since they loose customers, so obviously they are under tremendous pressure to deliver both soon, and an excellent product that lives up to the considerable hype.

I can't blame anyone for choosing another camera system in the meantime if that's what your circumstances dictate. However, I'm not sure how it does anything but use up your valuable time and energy to come here and post a long diatribe about why you cancelled your preorder and are going with another brand, and how you'll never buy BM or the Ursa again. If that's the best course of action for you, then you don't need to come here to defend it. But at the same time, once the 4.6K is out and if it turns out to be as good as most folks seem to think it will be, I also don't see the harm in making the purchase at that point, no matter how late the camera was, if it delivers the very impressive image and capabilities it promises at a price well under significant competition.

THANK YOU!!!!!
By the way do you guys want to hear something funny.. after having a conversation a while back with someone at BM ..we we're on the conversation about some of the posts and topics on the forum ..he said to me they are aware that some other camera manufacturers have been having people post on this forum.
I'll leave it to you guys to see thru those posts ..They must really be worried about what BM is doing to the market

That being said, I took a little time to look back at some of the other threads in this forum and found this:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1288#p6671

Grant Petty
Blackmagic Design
Posts: 46
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 2:55 am
Update on Camera Shipments
PostTue Sep 25, 2012 11:18 pm

Hi,

I wanted to give everyone an update on where we are with Blackmagic CinemaCamera shipments.

As you know, we have been dealing with a supplier delay which has stalled our ability to build cameras. I thought it might be a good idea to explain in more detail what is going on, and do a technical "brain dump" on the problem so everyone understands the nature of the delay and what we have been doing about it.

...

So keeping the customer up to date has been done before. I wonder why it isn't being done now?

The color science is still being tweaked, I rather see a sensor being ready instead of half a camera. I want my 4.6k when it's ready.

I can wait as well. I'm just wondering why no communication?

For me, I'm annoyed. Would probably be less if Mr. Petty did release a statement or an update.

Bla bla bla.
Blackmagic announced that they will make all dreams come true in July 2015. Its December....
So I understand why people are angry.

Are they promised July at Nab? They can keep the promise by realising the camera at July'16. Hehe.

:D

That is sooo funnnyyyy

I get it, it is annoying. It would be great to hear something from BMD about it.
Honestly, I think we have to wait a few months more.

Bla bla bla.
Blackmagic announced that they will make all dreams come true in July 2015. Its December....
So I understand why people are angry.

I have discovered through my in depth research that July is actually November in Aussie land. So they are really only 10 days late. It has to do with the Solstice and being on the underside of the Equator and penguins.

I wonder if we would be more understanding and forgiving if the company was called WhiteMagic Design.

I remember growing up with Black Magic chocolates. I wonder if this is the same company??????

We do have free will. No one is forcing us to purchase BMD products.
I understand the frustration. I have had to RMA the VA I purchased a few weeks back.
But I like what this company stands for, so I am willing to go along for the ride.(and keep my fingers crossed)
I believe the problem to be that it is hard to accept that Robin Hood(read Grant Petty) and his Merry Men and Women have feet of clay.

Let's be real, what is NAB without BMD. (I am running out of alphabet soup)(did someone mention Google?)

VIVA BMD

That is sooooo stream of consciousness.

Duke Nukem Forever, anyone? Half-Life 2: Episode 3, anyone? I am a gamer and Half-Life 3 might be the greatest game ever but it's not even confirmed and I bet it's 5 years away still. And Nukem, after 15 years of development, sucked. HL2E3 is most likely dead and will become HL3...again, years away. The fourth Doom is coming at some point. The GTA games? I mean, I wait YEARS for games to release. And the I play the good ones for years and years. A few months late for a camera I will use for years and years is just fine. See? Waiting for vaporware loosened me up for BMD's products being sometimes late. And when they're late they're REALLY late! lol

He says a lot of the same things many of us have said: Canon is blech and Sony is too video-y.

Jason, while I normally find myself agreeing with you (silently ;o) 99.9% of the time... and would also agree with this statement. Have you by any chance seen the doc "Cartel Land"? It's all Canon, mostly C300.. and looks pretty much awesome imho (although quite dark subject matter)

I have not, but I will now. I like dark subject matter.

A poor craftsman blames his tools.

See, again I bring up "28 Days Later." It's shot on miniDV on a PAL Canon XL-1..... by Anthony Dod Mantle, BSC. Using SD as a stylistic choice and shooting the movie, you know, like a movie...28 Days looks just fine. Of course the camera is just a tool. Sure someone who sucks could blame the tools for their suckiness (happened yesterday, actually. I was shooting the same event and all my photos were fine. And it's not because I had 5D Mark III and L lenses and a Profoto B1 whilst she had a Nikon 7000-something. It's because she sucks at photography, doesn't care to learn and has a misanthropic attitude about life in general.), but it's usually not the tool's fault. I've made some very nice videos with a T2i and some really crappy ones with a Red Epic. The camera's just a piece of the puzzle. So, ABSOLUTELY a poor craftsman blames their tools. But I will still blame a tool if the tool sucks and it's hindering me, but that also doesn't mean you give up. And at the end of the day I prefer the Blackmagic image.

And remember I own Sony and Canon cameras, too! So when I say they're blech it's in relation to how I feel about that BMCC image. I love my Sony and Canons just fine...I hate my BMCC in ways, too....but I just like my BMCC image a bit more. With Ursa Mini I might find less and less reasons to use the others...I don't know. But I'd rather own an Amira and a set of Cooke Panchros. But, ya know...

For me the Blackmagic Ursa mini is the one camera on market for low price and raw shooting. I dont know camera for in same category with same specs. And i planned to start my videography learning process with this camera and now i am just waiting and reading books. Not shooting. So i am bit angry too.

For me the Blackmagic Ursa mini is the one camera on market for low price and raw shooting. I dont know camera for in same category with same specs. And i planned to start my videography learning process with this camera and now i am just waiting and reading books. Not shooting. So i am bit angry too.

Well, a good camera doesn't make you a good shooter. If it's your first camera, you are good to go with the pocket cam, or bmcc, or any other model.

Get shooting, way more important then waiting for the next camera.

Just my 2 cents.

Yeap. I know that but i'd rather learn how to drive on ferrari in desert rather than bicycle in a city