Blackmagic Forum

javierdpvelez wrote:Had a friend over at NAB ask a BM rep about the MFT shipment- said should be moving through the backlog "soon." Means it will come at some point. When? Who knows, but at least it is not cancelled.

he have been hearing that the camera will ship soon for quite some time ....
The mft speedbooster was going to be out this month and recently pospone until june.... they may be waitting to release it at the same time than the mft camera... are we not going to see it untill june?

Blackmagic´s own words:



"....and THEN will we start supplying the MFT´s"

= there ain´t nothing moving soon!

bartman wrote:Blackmagic´s own words:



"....and THEN will we start supplying the MFT´s"

= there ain´t nothing moving soon!

With Adorama shipping EF cameras only weeks after order it seems like they must be getting close.

The frustrating thing is that all the suppliers have been told from Blackmagic 30 - 60 days, they have been told this for months.

i am the one wrote:

Pete Proniewicz-Brooks wrote:Except that one of those two new models uses a windowed version of the sensor on the BMCC, any lingering problems with supply on the BMCC will likely hurt the BMPCC.

Then I am worried about their ability to deliver on the pocket camera, because their getting it from the same problematic supplier.

I wonder if Pete is correct since in one of Tim's interviews at NAB, I believe he said that the sensor in the BMPC was different. Hard to discern the correct version of everything going on during the show excitement. By the performance characteristics regarding shutter and dynamic range, it sounds like the same sensor, but it may not be. We need to be patient I suppose as once the cameras are closer to shipping, the beta testers may be able to enlighten us. Would be simple if there was a factual comparison of the technical details of all cameras, but that's not BMD's style to date.

Rick Lang
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

rick.lang wrote:

i am the one wrote:

Pete Proniewicz-Brooks wrote:Except that one of those two new models uses a windowed version of the sensor on the BMCC, any lingering problems with supply on the BMCC will likely hurt the BMPCC.

Then I am worried about their ability to deliver on the pocket camera, because their getting it from the same problematic supplier.

I wonder if Pete is correct since in one of Tim's interviews at NAB, I believe he said that the sensor in the BMPC was different. Hard to discern the correct version of everything going on during the show excitement. By the performance characteristics regarding shutter and dynamic range, it sounds like the same sensor, but it may not be. We need to be patient I suppose as once the cameras are closer to shipping, the beta testers may be able to enlighten us. Would be simple if there was a factual comparison of the technical details of all cameras, but that's not BMD's style to date.

Rick Lang
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Can't remember where might have been JB's blog reading the BMPCC (the little one) had in essence either a smaller or cropped version of the BMCC's sensor and the BMPC (the 4k one) had a sensor from a different manufacturer. The acronyms may not be helping the confusion here, they should have thought of that really. The BMPC has a smaller dynamic range and a different sensitivity to the BMCC the BMPCC is the same. The BMPC also has a global shutter, which neither the BMCC or BMPCC do.

Pete Proniewicz-Brooks wrote:Can't remember where might have been JB's blog reading the BMPCC (the little one) had in essence either a smaller or cropped version of the BMCC's sensor and the BMPC (the 4k one) had a sensor from a different manufacturer. The acronyms may not be helping the confusion here, they should have thought of that really. The BMPC has a smaller dynamic range and a different sensitivity to the BMCC the BMPCC is the same. The BMPC also has a global shutter, which neither the BMCC or BMPCC do.

Pete, I just watched the video again with Tim talking about the pocket camera and he is confident and very clear it has a different sensor than the original BMCC. Of course it is difficult for us to know when we can't see the sensor.

Acronyms and camera names leave some clarity to be desired but here they are as currently announced:

BMCC EF and BMCC MFT describe the original Blackmagic Cinema Camera with custom sensor and active EF or passive MFT mount (2.5K raw 2400x1350 and HD ProRes and DNxHD);

BMPCC describes the Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera Super16 with active MFT mount (HD raw and ProRes);

BMPC4K describes the incredibly poorly named Blackmagic Production Camera 4K 'Super35' sensor with active EF mount (4K 3840x2160 UltraHD raw and ProRes). Apparently this camera no longer deserves to be referred to as a cinema camera.

Rick Lang
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

rick.lang wrote:... BMPC4K describes the incredibly poorly named Blackmagic Production Camera 4K 'Super35' sensor with active EF mount (4K 3840x2160 UltraHD raw and ProRes). Apparently this camera no longer deserves to be referred to as a cinema camera.

I suspect the "Production" part of the BMPC-4K's name is due to the camera's intended use in both 4K & 1080 broadcast video productions, and cinema-style productions. Among other things, the BMPC-4K can record & output live 1080i50/60 (interlaced), which will mostly find use in broadcast productions. Going forward its 4K record/live features will also find use in broadcast applications.

Meanwhile, studio & location video productions comfortable with cinema-style shooting & post will make use of its 1080p & 4K record/live features.

The "Production" part of the name makes sense to me. In any event, they could've called it anything and I'd still be interested in buying one (I currently have both a BMCC-MFT & a BMPC-4K on pre-order). Cheers.

Peter J. DeCrescenzo wrote:
The "Production" part of the name makes sense to me. In any event, they could've called it anything and I'd still be interested in buying one (I currently have both a BMCC-MFT & a BMPC-4K on pre-order). Cheers.

If the BMCC MFT models ship in the next couple of weeks, it will end up being perfect timing for me. I got recruited to DP a 30-minute film that's going to be in production in a few weeks, and I'm also DP for a web series... however, I haven't made any promises about what camera I'll be shooting the 30-minute film with, so if they get to take advantage of the BMCC then they'll just get a pleasant surprise.

I put in a preorder for the pocket camera, but I'll hold off on the production camera for both the PL mount version and for me to grow into being able to benefit from 4K. Right now 2K is more than enough for my needs as well as my post capabilities, and I don't have lenses I can use on an EF mount anyway.

Peter J. DeCrescenzo wrote:

rick.lang wrote:... BMPC4K describes the incredibly poorly named Blackmagic Production Camera 4K 'Super35' sensor with active EF mount (4K 3840x2160 UltraHD raw and ProRes). Apparently this camera no longer deserves to be referred to as a cinema camera.

I suspect the "Production" part of the BMPC-4K's name is due to the camera's intended use in both 4K & 1080 broadcast video productions, and cinema-style productions. Among other things, the BMPC-4K can record & output live 1080i50/60 (interlaced), which will mostly find use in broadcast productions. Going forward its 4K record/live features will also find use in broadcast applications.

Peter, I agree with that rationale but still feel it is strange to drop the 'cinema' from the name when it is even more suited to be a true cinema camera than the pocket cinema camera. Of course they could have called it the Devil and we would still want it.

Rick Lang
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

There is another unanswered question:

will the delayed MFT-CC, when it finaly is released, actually contain the original (amazing) sensor
after all the problems BM have had with that supplier?

There is no indication that it won´t, but considering it is being beta tested at the moment, who knows?

Also, in one of the videos Dan mentioned that the PC 4K is a little "softer" than the original EF.
What does this mean? This is my dilemma, do i still go with the MFT´s or upgrade?

I'm pretty sure it will be the same sensor, blackmagic are obviously happy with the supplier now as they are using either the same sensor or another sensor of the same design from the same manufacturer in the Pocket Cam.

The Production Cam has a different model sensor, rumors are that its sourced from a different company and therefore will have different characteristics.

They wouldn't have created the pocketcam if the sensor manufacturer was a bottleneck any longer.

Still they must be about ready to ship the MFT models. With the upgradability a second hand FS700 is looking pretty atractive at the moment. Hopefully everyone waiting for an MFT model has cancelled their order and moved on to the Production Cam or Pocket Cam so the queue will be nice and short.

not dead.. but in coma

To update myself on my previous post in this thread (and anyone that had similar concerns): It looks like my first concern has sort of been addressed by Grant in the Marco Solorio interview. Great to hear that there are definite plans to offer compressed for the BMCC.

@rick.lang Thanks for the reply to my comments. Just to clarify, I wasn't hoping for the impossible feat of MFT on a sensor that's too big for it. But as you outlined as well, I was just stating that I hope all three "formats" will continue to live in future Blackmagic camera developments. I personally really like the MFT(-ish) sensor size in between S35 and S16.

Review of the Blackmagic Cinema Camera Micro Four Thirds

actually speedbooster for mft won't be ready till august according to metabones.

josechu wrote:

javierdpvelez wrote:Had a friend over at NAB ask a BM rep about the MFT shipment- said should be moving through the backlog "soon." Means it will come at some point. When? Who knows, but at least it is not cancelled.

he have been hearing that the camera will ship soon for quite some time ....
The mft speedbooster was going to be out this month and recently pospone until june.... they may be waitting to release it at the same time than the mft camera... are we not going to see it untill june?

Read on another forum that the MFT model has started shipping in small quantities with production ramping up shortly.

http://www.personal-view.com/talks/disc ... ries-2/p31

Ryan McCarvill wrote:Read on another forum that the MFT model has started shipping in small quantities with production ramping up shortly.

http://www.personal-view.com/talks/disc ... ries-2/p31

I looked there, but it could just be a rumor. We know that a few beta version BMCC-MFT cams are in use for some weeks.

Until someone from BMD confirms it, or multiple credible reports start appearing all over, it's probably a rumor.

Meanwhile, I hope the BMCC-MFT starts shipping very soon, and also that folks waiting for BMCC-EF & BMCC-MFT cams get their's ASAP.

Cheers.

The silence about the MFT is still unexplained.

Will ship soon in small numbers, when?
Beta testing still, why?

Soooo... I got a call from a certain retailer telling me that they should have my MFT model in-hand today or tomorrow

Mindsphere wrote:Soooo... I got a call from a certain retailer telling me that they should have my MFT model in-hand today or tomorrow

please let us know about it

Mindsphere wrote:Soooo... I got a call from a certain retailer telling me that they should have my MFT model in-hand today or tomorrow

That sounds fantastic!

Which country?

Don't get excited.
We've had several false alarms in the past. They turned out to be EFs, not MFTs.

I would hope the BMD would make some sort of an announcement when they started shipping MFTs.

(Also, I hope they are postponing shipping because they are trying to implement an active mount.)

as long as they don´t change the sensor!

Peter J. DeCrescenzo wrote:

Ryan McCarvill wrote:Read on another forum that the MFT model has started shipping in small quantities with production ramping up shortly.

http://www.personal-view.com/talks/disc ... ries-2/p31

I looked there, but it could just be a rumor. We know that a few beta version BMCC-MFT cams are in use for some weeks.

Until someone from BMD confirms it, or multiple credible reports start appearing all over, it's probably a rumor.

Meanwhile, I hope the BMCC-MFT starts shipping very soon, and also that folks waiting for BMCC-EF & BMCC-MFT cams get their's ASAP.

Cheers.

Just to clarify, that was my post and it is not a rumor but an actual response I got from Josh Turner "Technical Support Consultant at Blackmagic Design EMEA". I'm not blaming you though, I'm also having a very hard time trusting any claim BM makes..

Mindsphere wrote:Soooo... I got a call from a certain retailer telling me that they should have my MFT model in-hand today or tomorrow

I believe this is another false alarm. Just received confirmation from the product manager that no MFT cameras have shipped yet, except to the beta testers. A few other customers have posted in the past few weeks believing they were about to receive an MFT camera, but it was actually a mixup with the reseller and they were sent an EF camera. Maybe that's what happened here again?

Hi Christine,

Is it possible to give some sort of shipping date? Even the recently announced cameras have a date of July whereas the MFT camera is an unknown.

Christine Peterson wrote:

Mindsphere wrote:Soooo... I got a call from a certain retailer telling me that they should have my MFT model in-hand today or tomorrow

I believe this is another false alarm. Just received confirmation from the product manager that no MFT cameras have shipped yet, except to the beta testers. A few other customers have posted in the past few weeks believing they were about to receive an MFT camera, but it was actually a mixup with the reseller and they were sent an EF camera. Maybe that's what happened here again?

Hmm.. That's depressing. Maybe one slipped through the system somehow? (I know that's ridiculously unrealistic if the product manager says nothing has shipped) And I still haven't got a call from them yet to process final payment so I'm guessing they haven't received stock.

Finaly some confirmation!
NO MFTs SHIPPED!

Christine Peterson wrote:

Mindsphere wrote:Soooo... I got a call from a certain retailer telling me that they should have my MFT model in-hand today or tomorrow

I believe this is another false alarm. Just received confirmation from the product manager that no MFT cameras have shipped yet, except to the beta testers. A few other customers have posted in the past few weeks believing they were about to receive an MFT camera, but it was actually a mixup with the reseller and they were sent an EF camera. Maybe that's what happened here again?

Followup to my previous comment - yep looks like the retailer made a mistake and was told the wrong thing by someone. Siiiiigh.

Christine, just wondering - as you are able to get a confirmation from the product manager that it hasn't shipped, are you able to get an indication of when it will ship? I mean, are we talking weeks or months? Because if it's months I may just pick up the EF model. Would greatly appreciate clarification on this as I'm sure many others would as well. Some information - even if it's hazy - is better than no indication at all.

bartman wrote:Finaly some confirmation!
NO MFTs SHIPPED!

Given BMDs policy so far is to update us when there is a change, that is not news, that is what we already knew....

I'm hoping we start hearing about shipping this week - someone said that it was shipping a week after NAB - although I haven't read that anywhere officially.

Lets hope so!

Yeah, I know . . . I'm a dreamer, but I hope we don't hear anything until they announce that they're shipping an ACTIVE M43 mount. Not an original idea . . . people have suggested this before but:
While it won't cover the 4K it will cover the 2.7k.
Would make the choice for the 2.7 between two active mounts at the same price.
You could still adapt the same lenses as one would have used on the "dumb" mount, and more.
They're already going with an active m43 on the pocket cam so *I think* that makes it a no-brainer on the original, the 2.7k version . . .

Call it "Christmas in JULY" . . . everybody wins!

Anyhow, my guess is this is where it's going and, in the spirit of not upsetting the folks that don't want anything new (that isn't already shipping in massive quanities) to be announced, the silence should satisfy them on that count. (then of course there will always be people that didn't install the latest firmware upgrade to their crystal ball and will complain about not knowing about it light years ahead of time)

Good guess! but for me "the best glass is manual"

dregenthal wrote:Yeah, I know . . . I'm a dreamer, but I hope we don't hear anything until they announce that they're shipping an ACTIVE M43 mount. Not an original idea . . . people have suggested this before but:

The beta testers already have the passive mount.
BMC don't need to update us every step of the way, just like any other camera company. Once they've tweaked whatever they needed from the feedback of the beta testing, they'll just announce and ship it in my opinion, without any fanfare.

Jules

The thing is this, they don't need to update us every step of the way - however - they are now in the position where they have been building the EF cameras and shipping them very regularly, they have announced two new models with release dates. They should know an updated release date on the MFT model.

People are putting off other purchases in order to get this.

On another forum they are saying that the MFT model was supposed to be shipping the week after NAB, it's now the week after the week after NAB - maybe we will see them shipped?

Any shipped?

BMCC EF orders from July 2012 have still not shipped in Europe.

Should only be a matter of time I would have thought - seems like the rest of the world has caught up.

Regardless the EF camera is available, even if you order it in from overseas. The MFT camera is 6 months late and is still not available anywhere.

We gave up and finally cancelled our orders for the BMCC MFT. Hope it helps others in line. We'll wait and see if they start shipping anything that works and go from there.

One thing I've noticed is that where it used to say "Available December" it now says find a reseller:

http://www.blackmagicdesign.com/product ... emacamera/

In fact I can't find reference to the MFT not shipping yet at all.

Before the 9th it was saying Shipping in December and the EF model was saying Limited shipping.
http://web.archive.org/web/201304061901 ... emacamera/

DEAD!
http://johnbrawley.wordpress.com/2013/0 ... ur-pocket/

Fulgencio wrote:DEAD!
http://johnbrawley.wordpress.com/2013/0 ... ur-pocket/

I disagree.

jb

John Brawley wrote:

Fulgencio wrote:DEAD!
http://johnbrawley.wordpress.com/2013/0 ... ur-pocket/

I disagree.

jb

Mft pasive.. so i can´t use many lenses i have
need for external battery solution.. i need to invest a lot more
that makes BMCC MFT about 4 times more expensive than this one
i can buy 4 pocket cameras with the same money!!
And i can use my eclair acl lenses!!!

well... indeed i can not buy any of them.. becuase Blackamgic cameras never arrive..so probably pocket camera will also dead before arrival

You can tell me about the 2,5k.. but the best use i´ve seen from BMCC is a this long feature shoot on prores..

soooo..
could they have shoot it with the pocket one?
i think the answer is yes

Fulgencio wrote:Mft pasive.. so i can´t use many lenses i have
need for external battery solution.. i need to invest a lot more
that makes BMCC MFT about 4 times more expensive than this one
i can buy 4 pocket cameras with the same money!!
And i can use my eclair acl lenses!!!

well... indeed i can not buy any of them.. becuase Blackamgic cameras never arrive..so probably pocket camera will also dead before arrival

You can tell me about the 2,5k.. but the best use i´ve seen from BMCC is a this long feature shoot on prores..

soooo..
could they have shoot it with the pocket one?
i think the answer is yes

If you'd like to switch your order from the BMCC MFT to the Pocket Cinema Camera, I'm sure your reseller would be able to assist you.

Yet it has a lot more resolution.

It depends what is important for you.

I think the pocket is too small to use for studio style drama use. No HDSDI for monitoring either. No RAW yet...

it depends what you need.

jb

John Brawley wrote:Yet it has a lot more resolution.

It depends what is important for you.

I think the pocket is too small to use for studio style drama use. No HDSDI for monitoring either. No RAW yet...

it depends what you need.

jb

Sorry.. i forgot about the hdmi output... i can get cheaper EVF
aspect ratio is S16mm i have already shoot 2 long feature films with this format and never heard a complaint
resolution is 1080p.. well.. George Lucas shoot a few features with this "poor" resolution
i´m not a pretentious guy, so if it is good enough for George.. maybe it is good enough for me.. i guess

This was just passed on to me,
and came from blackmagic support yesterday:

I can tell you that we are getting closer to shipping as the Beta versions have gone out to our testers a month or so ago. Unfortunately I do not have any information other than that, no estimates on shipping dates or anything like that. I do understand your frustration and will make that clear to the product manager but I simply do not have any shipping information on the MFT Cinema Camera right now.

I'm giving them 1 more week for information then buying the GH3.

Bird in hand and all.