Blackmagic Forum

Justin Jackson wrote:For those with the BM4K (and I guess Ursa).. can you instantly go from 60fps to 24fps and back while recording? I read someone say (or so a video) that one of the custom buttons switches to 60fps.. I was wondering if that is possible in real time.. how does the video file come out.. does it start a new file with 60p... and if you switch back to 24p.. another new file? If so, is there any drop in frames during the switch? If not, then I assume the point of the button is to more quickly get in to 60fps/24fps modes, but you would still have to stop recording, switch, the start again?

You have to stop recording to change the frame rate / use the HFR button. The HFR button saves time having to go into the menu (around 5 taps I think).

OK.. I assumed it was like that.. but was hoping it had some instant real time switch going on.. so you can just go right in to slow mo record, then back again without having to stop and lose a few seconds in between.

Justin, it is possible the BMPCC4K could be an A camera to the URSA Mini 4.6K B camera in some situations especially when you need ISO 1600 or 3200. It could be the only camera, so that makes it an A camera. What might keep it a B camera is the smaller dynamic range. If you can keep the dynamic range of everything (except what you don’t care about) in frame to 10/11 stops, then it’s going to be compelling.


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I see many people indicate this BMPCC4K as a B camera...

Justin,

The Ursa MiniPro4.6K is a great camera, I've been using it for about a year and would not want to go without it. It has all the the things I want & need. I love the built in ND filters and use them all the time outdoors. The BM viewfinder is a must shooting in strong daylight for focus. It's great on a tripod or a slider, it's mass and easy access to all controls is a delight on set. I sync it's timecode to my Zoom F4 audio recorder and it gives me rock solid sync to external super quality audio etc etc. I swung for a good Tilta- follow focus with hard stops and it's a revelation. It's a true professional cinema camera. On the other hand, it is heavy on the shoulder after a while and a steady-cam set-up is $5K +-.

The Pocket will find an answer for almost all those things I list above and may make a very serviceable "A" camera for a lower priced, lighter footprint production. You will however, have to put up with a cascade of cables, power supplies, a cage, a daylight viewing monitor with hood etc that will bring you back close to the size and weight of the UMP. If you are used to doing all that with a DSLR, the Pocket will be an upgrade with a better image. For me it is worth giving up 2 stops of DR (I light most scenes a bit anyway) to be able to move the camera more and do quick "idea shots" without having to change lenses (I'm using the Oly 12-40 zoom). This is also where higher ISO and greater depth of field will be an asset.

I will likely use the Pocket for almost all hand held stuff, cranes, and gymbal/steadi shots. Even quick reverses in conversations and in small spaces. The fact that I can cut it into the UMP footage (eventually all in color science 4) without jumping through hoops just makes it even better.

Ric, sounds spot on. I would love to own the Ursa Mini Pro too.. though now that I will soon (come on BM/BH!!) have the BM4K.. I am really curious to see if a new camera is coming..e.g. maybe 6K or 8K from BM next year. As a hobbyist.. I truly have no use for that.. but I love all the tech and options it opens up, so who knows. Regardless.. I need to finish my kit before I think of a 2nd camera. Still need a couple Aputure 120/300 lights, some c-stands, and a couple lenses. Probably have to get the MetaBones too if this LensRegain doesnt work out, but its a good starter for only $150. Besides a lens, I am waiting on the Air X to see how well it ends up being before I spring for that or the LAB 3. I suspect DJI isnt sitting around either, by the time I am able to purchase one NAB will be here.. or wait maybe thats CES.

I do set up a rig.. e.g. the SmallRig frame, T5 SSD, and I am hoping some sort of hood option becomes available for the SmallRig frame for theBMPCC4K. If not I can rig something up with velcro, etc. I have the SmallRig cage + hood for my Atomos Inferno.. which I really like. So hoping they add something like this for this cage.. though this cage doesnt have any velcro holes like that one does, so who knows!

I am really really curious about audio sync with the BMPCC4K. I got stupid and bought the MixPre 10T, no clue why.. I dont do anything with sound.. not a sound guy.. but I wanted to be sure that when I record externally that I dont have to deal with syncing audio in post. I have never used timecode.. I hope it is as simple as attaching the timecode out of the SD to the camera and it just works? I assume it basically records TC data with the video so that drag/drop the audio to the timeline with the video.. it just syncs? Or do you need to do a lot of extra stuff in post (Resolve user) to get them to sync? I definitely need to watch some tutorials on that!

So is using a matte box with ND filters any better/worse than the built in ones? I assume the built in ones are just more of a convenience for outdoor sunny day shoots than having to add a matte box and filters? I did actually buy some ND filters for my matte box, but have never used them. If it isnt clear by now.. I spend way more than I should on stuff I will probably never use! But, I do believe.. having the gear makes it possible to do things that if you dont have it, you just cant do.

Justin,

I wouldn't wait for for 6K or 8K, I think that's pretty much the point of diminishing returns. We just had our feature (shot ProRes, UHD) shown at the Arclight Culver City, a really good system & screen, in 2K DCP and the unflattering detail on actors' faces 30' high was shocking. Trust me, deliverables in 8K will be hard to look at. 8K cameras will be useful for shooting plates for SFX and other special uses, but the average human can't tell the difference between 2K and 4K at normal viewing distance. Plus trying to edit 8K footage on a system that isn't liquid cooled will be kludgy and slow at best, and good luck buying storage and rafts of GPU's. Did you buy a 3D TV? There becomes a point where tech gets in the way of telling the story.

I hate to be the one to tell you this but the BM Pocket Cinema Cam does not jam sync time code. The Ursa does, sorta, but the pocket definitely does not. It has no TC in or out connectors. You will need a secondary system like a Tenacle Sync to record LTC on one of the audio tracks if you want to auto sync with your recorder. That said, I have used wave form sync in both Premiere and Resolve and it works pretty damn well about 95% of the time. Just record halfway decent "scratch track" audio on the camera, usually just the built in mic will be ok, just crank them up to 100%, as you don't really care if your scratch track gets clipped on occasion, you just want to identify the slate and hear the slap. Put them all in the same folder in Resolve and select "Audio Sync Waveform" and they should snap together. Just be aware that you need to do it before you start to edit, and if you do multiple tracks (boom, Lav 1, Lav2) be sure to record them as a single polywave file instead of separate isolated tracks. But that's a story for another thread.

The pocket 4k (P4k) DOES jam to an external TC source.

Feed a clock to the audio jack with TC and the TC will read “EXT” while it’s connected.

JB

Really!? I stand corrected. Will it hold sync like the Ursa or does it need to stay connected ?

Page 34 of the manual says "[Icon] Appears to the right of the duration display if the camera is running off an internal timecode after being ‘jam synced’ and disconnected."

Sounds like it’s similar to the Ursa which I usually sync to my Zoom F4 via BNC cable and will hold sync while disconnected until a battery change. I will try this as soon as I locate a bnc to 3.5mm adaptor of some type.

Dang Ric.. you scared me! It is too late to return my MixPre 10T.. coulda bet a good cine lens with that money.. well.. ok a decent one. .

I was certain I read that it can accept timecode, thought it generates it too? Not sure but as long as it accept it the primary reason I sprung for the 10T besides the hirose power plug vs battery only for 3/6 was the timecode capability. I doubt I will ever need more than 2 inputs for anything I ever do, but just in case I have the room now to do so.

I deeply apologize, and I am equally thrilled. The very idea of functional jam sync time code on a $1200 camera was beyond my imaginings. I have only recently started using the Ursa TC capability which is follow only, no TC Out, and found it quite effective. The only caveat is that TC integrity does not survive a shut down for battery change. On the Ursa that’s only 3 maybe 4 times a day. With the short internal battery life on the Pocket, that will be more of a pain, but still!

Justin,
The best thing about 2 system sound, is that it’s one less thing for you to worry about. A trusted sound person means camera dept. can concentrate on camera, usually resulting in better quality data from both. Also... with extra audio tracks available you can run one or even two mics into dual inputs, one hot, one -10db (scream track). Actors (and real life) loves to from a whisper to a scream.

Justin Jackson wrote:Dang Ric.. you scared me! It is too late to return my MixPre 10T.. coulda bet a good cine lens with that money.. well... the primary reason I sprung for the 10T besides the hirose power plug vs battery only for 3/6 was the timecode capability. I doubt I will ever need more than 2 inputs for anything I ever do, but just in case I have the room now to do so.

I have the stable of decent Cine lenses but I’d love that Sound Devices MixPre 10T. With yesterday’s purchases I’ve already thrown cautivo the wind; I don’t even now if I can still manage the MixPre-3! Thinking about it but the 10T is the boss.

What I’d jump on is a MixPre-4T. Give us some of those added features on a simple box with three XLR In and one XLR Out. Really I don’t understand why SD can be so blind or manipulative about this. That would be their best selling box!

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Rick,

The Zoom F4 is on special at B&H last I looked. 4 or 6 XLR ins, back up track recording TC jam etc etc all under $500. If you don’t need the SD name, you can get a lot from Zoom. I’ ve Had mine for 2 years and very happy with it.

The SD, Sound Devices name is more than a label, you get world class leading high quality mic preamps in a rugged built system that is designed to support professional field productions, unlike the Zooms. You can hear the difference, and you get what you pay for with Audio equipment!
Cheers

Justin Jackson wrote:I am really curious to see if a new camera is coming..e.g. maybe 6K or 8K from BM next year. As a hobbyist.. I truly have no use for that..

You already are getting a great 4K camera... you won't be needing more resolution for a LONG time.

Odds are BMD will launch a new camera at NAB because it pretty much always does, but it's also probably that it's going to be an enhanced version of the Ursa Mini lineup. My guess would be that BMD's first priorities are the global shutter option and higher frame rates. BRaw will help with higher frame rate support. It wouldn't surprise me at all if that was part of the plan; BMD can enhance the internals of the camera since it owns those, but it can't drive updates to storage technology without compromising its price point. Braw gets around that limitation neatly.

Still need a couple Aputure 120/300 lights, some c-stands,

Those are on my list as well.

Besides a lens, I am waiting on the Air X to see how well it ends up being before I spring for that or the LAB 3. I suspect DJI isnt sitting around either, by the time I am able to purchase one NAB will be here.. or wait maybe thats CES.

I'm hoping that the Air X turns out to be as good as it looks. When I'm at NAB I might try to pester the Gudsen folks to get a review copy.

I am really really curious about audio sync with the BMPCC4K. I got stupid and bought the MixPre 10T, no clue why..

It's a phenomenal recorder, and you'll probably have some sound folks jealous... but you could also probably sell it and get a smaller one. I'm using a MixPre-6 + TentacleSyncs. Since they can generate timecode on an audio channel I can use JB's method. (And plan on trying it. No idea yet how well that will work on my Epic-W.)

I assume it basically records TC data with the video so that drag/drop the audio to the timeline with the video.. it just syncs? Or do you need to do a lot of extra stuff in post (Resolve user) to get them to sync? I definitely need to watch some tutorials on that!

It's very easy. Put 'em all in the same bin. Right click the bin, select the appropriate sync option, and go. I always use one of the append options, and so far haven't had much success wit the waveform sync, but the mics on the Pocket might be sensitive enough for that to work.

Sync by waveform HAS worked when there was enough signal in the scratch track... so a Tentacle sync might do it for me that way, since each one has a built in scratch mic. Clever, those guys

So is using a matte box with ND filters any better/worse than the built in ones? I assume the built in ones are just more of a convenience for outdoor sunny day shoots than having to add a matte box and filters? I did actually buy some ND filters for my matte box, but have never used them. If it isnt clear by now.. I spend way more than I should on stuff I will probably never use! But, I do believe.. having the gear makes it possible to do things that if you dont have it, you just cant do.

Internal NDs are a bit more convenient, but also less flexible; you have only the options that are built in, and that's that. You'll definitely need the NDs for oudoor filming though. Otherwise you'll ONLY have the deep focus option.

Rakesh.. you are def right about the camera. I just read somewhere that the big thing right now in music videos and in some other lines of video is 4:3 again. Because most people watch video on their phones, vertically now. WTF is the world coming too! The screen is already too small at 5" to 6" in my opinion.. though I do admit to watching youtube when I am out and about sometimes. Still.. I cant stand trying to watch video in vertical mode, and I despise recording video in that manner. One of my fav video of all time () haha.. cracks me up every time I watch it. Yet it is so true! Star Wars..the skinny edition! Just say no to vertical video! But what I read really points to what many of you have said.. 4K is more than enough for a long time to come. I am sadly.. as some of you can no doubt tell by my hobby purchase of a MixPre 10T that I may never get to use.. or at least near its potential.. I tend to want the "better stuff" within a decent level of affordability. I tend to think the BM4K is plenty good for any sort of video I will ever do.. heck beyond. But, for some stupid reason I got it stuck in my head having 8K now would allow me to be ahead of the curve. For example, I was hoping, years ago, to get the first Ursa 4K the big one..and start shooting tons of RAW 4K footage for stock sites and make some money. Never happened. Now, my thought is if I could get a RAW 8K recording camera I could work on 8K RAW stock footage. Meh.. its a pipe dream and one I know I am a long ways off from.. too much other crap in life to focus on still! Maybe when 16K comes out Ill be in a better position to afford that. haha.


Man, if they had a MixPre 4T..def would have bought that instead! That would be perfect.. and smaller too! As long as it has the hirose power input and they could rework the on/off switch away from USB port.. that would be fantastic!

So.. Sigma 18-35.. I think that is a good first lens right especially with the 1 stop boost and that it actually works with the LensRegain focus/iris controls.

hahaha, that video is hilarious! awesome!

Justin, don't feel so bad about having purchased that SD...it's an amazing device and even if you don't use it to its full potential now, just the thought alone of being able to tackle *any* audio situation life might throw at you, should make you feel good...and yes, you probably could sell it at a small loss and get something else, but hey, you're a perfectionist, like me, and it's unlikely that you'd be happy with anything less than omnipotent and at the tp of its line...so put a check-mark next to your "get awesome audio capture device" to-do list item and stop thinking about it or feeling bad about it. DONE!

Speaking of which, after my disappointing experience with the Weebill LAB (already returned it to B&H) I am now also looking at the MOZA Air-3...wow, what I gimbal! Any of you know what price point they are aiming for, and whether/where it can be pre-ordered here in the USA already? Since Zhiyun failed so miserably at meeting their advertised potential, I lost a lot of faith in them and their upcoming LAB-3, which also looks great. So I am now looking toward MOZA to come through.

Ric, thanks for the advice regarding the Zoom 4. I wanted a device with analogue audio limiters when using the Sennheiser MKH416 (even though I’ll put digital audio into it when using the Sennheiser AVX). I spend a lot of time dealing with clipped audio that I feel will gracefully be managed by the MixPre-3/6.


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tillkrueger wrote:@Justin Jackson

Justin Jackson wrote:Can you list the power pack you use? I was thinking of getting the CORE PowerEdge battery to mount under/to the side of cage/camera to power it
Does anyone know whether it is possible to both power the PCC4K via USB-C while also using it to capture to an external USB-C SSD? some sort of bi-directional USB-C splitter, or is that a pipe-dream?

I guess if I solve the power issue with a 2 pin cable connected to a power bank, then that wouldn't be necessary.

You can only charge via the USB-C / powebank scenario - you can’t run the camera through USB power

Craig, I was referring to powering the SD, not the camera. I will use USB-C on camera to my SSD recorder. I have a nice VMount setup.. Wooden Box distribution box (cost a crap load), CORE dual vmount battery mount.. can hot swap vmount bats.. though the weight of two on a rig may not be ideal unless it is tripod or arm/vest rig held. If the Moza air X comes through and can truly gimbal 6KG of weight.. I am sure I could fit the camera rig with rails on it.. though that may end up being way too big to fit within the area the gimbal fits the camera.

Justin Jackson wrote:Rakesh.. you are def right about the camera. I just read somewhere that the big thing right now in music videos and in some other lines of video is 4:3 again. Because most people watch video on their phones, vertically now. WTF is the world coming too! The screen is already too small at 5" to 6" in my opinion..

It's a bit of a bummer if you ask me. It's contributing to the whole "why we really don't need 8K yet" argument, IMO.

Well, that plus the fact that the minority of the people who are clamoring for 8K are really just clamoring for an excuse to be sloppier in production... much like the majority of the people who want raw want to push off the creative decisions that the cinematographer is supposed to be responsible for to the post team.

For example, I was hoping, years ago, to get the first Ursa 4K the big one..and start shooting tons of RAW 4K footage for stock sites and make some money.
Never happened. Now, my thought is if I could get a RAW 8K recording camera I could work on 8K RAW stock footage.

Most stock footage sites still only accept HD (not even 2K). Only a few are starting to adopt 4K right now... and there are only a couple that accept 8K -- to be honest, only two that I know of.

Man, if they had a MixPre 4T..def would have bought that instead! That would be perfect.. and smaller too! As long as it has the hirose power input and they could rework the on/off switch away from USB port.. that would be fantastic!

That's why I went with a MixPre-6, even though the 10T was out when I made that purchase. What swayed me from the 3 to the 6 was that Ambisonics requires a minimum of four recording channels.

So.. Sigma 18-35.. I think that is a good first lens right especially with the 1 stop boost and that it actually works with the LensRegain focus/iris controls.

Those are excellent lenses.

rick.lang wrote:Ric, thanks for the advice regarding the Zoom 4. I wanted a device with audio limiters when using the Sennheiser MKH416 (even though I’ll put digital into it when using the Sennheiser AVX). I spend a lot of time dealing with clipped audio that I feel will gracefully be managed by the MixPre-3/6.

For the record, the Zooms *DO* have limiters. The catch is that they're digital, or some hybrid or some such. The Sound Devices limiters are all analog, so they sound cleaner.

rick.lang wrote:Ric, thanks for the advice regarding the Zoom 4. I wanted a device with audio limiters when using the Sennheiser MKH416 (even though I’ll put digital into it when using the Sennheiser AVX). I spend a lot of time dealing with clipped audio that I feel will gracefully be managed by the MixPre-3/6.


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Rick, you are aware that the Sennheiser AVX has some kind of auto leveling similar to limiters?

Rakesh, my brain was thinking “analogue” but my fingers typed “audio” do I’ll fix the preceding post. No idea what Ambisonics is so I need to look that up. I had pretty much decided to go with the MixPre-3, but now I know you moved to MuxPre-6, I’ll rethink that.

Robert, thanks for the reminder re AVX limiters.


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Ambisonics is an amazing recording technique that, in a nutshell, uses a mic-capsule array to capture x, y, z and sound-pressure signals of sound, capturing a true 3-dimensional image of sound, allowing for decoding to anything from mono to 7.1 and beyond...as a matter of fact, you can even *move* the microphone after the fact, since it is a true 3d image of the sound environment that was captured...I guess it's somewhat similar to lightfield recording, in photography, where you can re-focus the camera after the photo was taken.

Rakesh, that is so cool that you're dealing with that eclectic artform! what microphone are you using, and what encoder/decoder? Any experience with any of the low-cost solutions that have hit the market and the indiegogo/kickstarter scene in the past few years? I remember that when I started to collect everything necessary to do ambisonics, I gave up when the only microphone at the time would have set me back over $3000...but with today's sub-$1000 mics it seems to get achievable again, and I even saw that one indiegogo project created a little $150 capsule that claims to be able to do it.

I wanted a device with analogue audio limiters when using the Sennheiser MKH416 (even though I’ll put digital audio into it when using the Sennheiser AVX).

Rick,
We best not start up the limiter wars that have been fought on every audio forum I'm on, but after owning the Zoom F4 for 2 years, many projects done, including a feature that recently played the LA Film Festival, I can tell you there is no better bang for the buck than the F4. I use mine with an MKH 416 and an MK-50 Senn, and the sound is great.
SD's ARE better products, but you will pay a great deal more for sound that only a very few people can tell apart. If you are doing your job as a sound mixer, you shouldn't be relying on limiters anyway. The hybrid digital limiters in the F4 are very capable when I have used them, but for truly challenging situations there is nothing like recording a "safety" track 10db below your main track. The F4 allows you to do that internally with no additional wiring, and that option beats ANY limiter as it maintains full dynamic range throughout. Overly "limited" audio sounds bad no matter how good the limiters are. If the SD equivalent is worth it to you, buy it, but mic technique is 90% of good sound. I would rather spend my sound dollars on good mics than expensive limiters.

It's very easy. Put 'em all in the same bin. Right click the bin, select the appropriate sync option, and go.

Be aware that in Resolve you can only sync 1 audio file with 1 video file using auto sync via waveform or TC. If, like me, you record iso tracks from several mics in one take (lav & boom & safety) you will have to find and sync track 2&3 by hand. The way to avoid this issue is to record your iso's in one polywave file instead of individual .wav's. I didn't find that out until after I recorded a sizable project. What a pain.

Till, thanks!


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Ric.. wait.. that is some damn good info there. You said a bit of that before and I didnt quite know what you mean. So.. like.. on my 10T, if I have 8 mic inputs.. recording to separate files.. with TC feeding to the camera.. it wont auto sync up all 8 of those in post? That is news to me.. me having never done this before and assume TC basically solved that issue regardless of tracks. Is it that the 10T, F4, etc dont add TC to each of the audio tracks? I would have assumed it would do that, and all 8 separate tracks would sync perfect in post.

So.. like.. on my 10T, if I have 8 mic inputs.. recording to separate files.. with TC feeding to the camera..

Yes, that is precisely the circumstance I am describing, and I was stunned as well, as I believe this procedure works in Premiere for multiple tracks. I was told that this situation in Resolve is not a bug, but a choice to keep from getting various audio tracks synced to incorrect video.

I am not familiar with the 10T, but on the Zoom F4 you have a choice of recording individual .wav files of each track or what's known as a polywave file that is one file on disc that contains all the tracks individually. The F4 can record single tracks to one SSD card, and polywave to it's second SSD, a great feature. The single polywave file w timecode will then sync to your video file in Resolve. The trick is that there is a panel (and not easy to find) in Resolve that you must use to assign the various embedded tracks from the polywave to specific channels in Resolve. All this needs to be done in the media panel before you start editing (another mistake I made on the project in question). Another interesting "feature" is that meta data from the audio tracks (scene, take etc) over writes the metadata from the video file (electronic camera slate). I had to get all the audio tracks together, erase any scene-take-good take metadata in the audio files, and THEN sync w TC.
You can make single track files into polywaves after the fact with "Wave Agent" a free software from SD, but that just adds an extra step.

Now, all this was in Resolve 15 Beta and I have not done this procedure in later versions of Resolve, so some of the above may have changed. I would assume the 10T gives you the option of recording polywave files, but again I have no knowledge of SD workings.

Yes, the MixPre-x can record polywave.


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When researching this issue I did read some comments in audio forums about polywave files being slightly more prone to corruption. For that reason when I am shooting 2 system sound since then I set the Zoom F4 to record polywave on one card and single .wav's on the other. That way I can always reconstruct a poly file with Wave Agent from the individual tracks if necessary. I have not, as yet, run into any corrupted files. Oh and the F4 is below $450 at B&H these days. You can buy 2 for the price of an SD and have a backup.

What's the weight of the camera? Couldn't find it on the site anywhere.

Look here, under products, Pro Cameras, Pocket 4K, Specification Page: https://www.blackmagicdesign.com

Like I said, no weight listed under Tech Specs. Finder can't even find anything with the word "Weight" or "Pound". LB didn't pull up anything either. Manual I can't seem to pull up anything either.

So unless there's something I'm missing, can someone please give me the weight of it?

Chris Chiasson wrote:What's the weight of the camera? Couldn't find it on the site anywhere.

About 750g.


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And 1700 kg if it sits in a car

rick.lang wrote:Rakesh, my brain was thinking “analogue” but my fingers typed “audio” do I’ll fix the preceding post. No idea what Ambisonics is so I need to look that up. I had pretty much decided to go with the MixPre-3, but now I know you moved to MuxPre-6, I’ll rethink that.

No worries... I was just aiming to prevent confusion.

tillkrueger wrote:Ambisonics is an amazing recording technique that, in a nutshell, uses a mic-capsule array to capture x, y, z and sound-pressure signals of sound, capturing a true 3-dimensional image of sound, allowing for decoding to anything from mono to 7.1 and beyond...as a matter of fact, you can even *move* the microphone after the fact, since it is a true 3d image of the sound environment that was captured...I guess it's somewhat similar to lightfield recording, in photography, where you can re-focus the camera after the photo was taken.

Yeah, that's the general idea. First-order Ambisonics requires four microphones. Sennheiser gave me a demo using a headset with VR glasses and binarual audio, and it was quite impressive. They'd used their own Ambisonics mic (which is a 1st order mic), and the sound field was remarkably authentic, even as I turned around.

Rakesh, that is so cool that you're dealing with that eclectic artform! what microphone are you using, and what encoder/decoder? Any experience with any of the low-cost solutions that have hit the market and the indiegogo/kickstarter scene in the past few years? I remember that when I started to collect everything necessary to do ambisonics, I gave up when the only microphone at the time would have set me back over $3000...but with today's sub-$1000 mics it seems to get achievable again, and I even saw that one indiegogo project created a little $150 capsule that claims to be able to do it.

I'm not yet, it's just in planning right now. I'm hoping to do some VR stuff using Ambisonics in the next year, and leaning toward the Rode sound field mic, since it might actually have better sound quality than Sennheiser's yet it's also quite a bit less expensive. I've been pretty pleased with the sound quality of Rode mics in general (basically, the audio version of BMD, IMO) so that's where I'm leaning.

I'm actually in pretty much the same boat as you; I didn't buy the MixPre-D 6 just for Ambisonics, I bought because I needed quality audio and the 633 was just excessive for my needs (size, features)... USB recording will be more useful for my needs than XLR outputs, and I'll be ready for when I jump into VR and Ambisonics. Otherwise I'd have gone with the MixPre-D 3 instead. Other than Ambisonics, it would have served my needs just fine.

Ric Murray wrote:The F4 allows you to do that internally with no additional wiring, and that option beats ANY limiter as it maintains full dynamic range throughout. Overly "limited" audio sounds bad no matter how good the limiters are. If the SD equivalent is worth it to you, buy it, but mic technique is 90% of good sound. I would rather spend my sound dollars on good mics than expensive limiters.

That technique works fine, so this is not a criticism of it but rather a preference. I know a few people who've been using F4/8 on film sets, and the results have been fine -- as usual of course, that has a lot to do with the fact that the people using them knew what they were doing.

The SD recorders DO have a backup track in the form of dual gains (input + fader) on each track. I always configure mine to record a pre-fader isolation tracks along with mix tracks, and have yet to run into a case for dialog that lead to clipping on the isolation tracks.

Either way though, as long as the person operating the mixer isn't a bozo and the person operating the boom is paying attention, you can get excellent results with either Zoom's F-series or with SD mixers.

Just avoid the F-series' predecessors. The H-series are really only acceptable if you're feeding them inputs from professional mixers. The F's were a quite a surprise given the crappiness of the H4n and the mediocrity of the H6.

Rakesh.. I think you are too harsh on the H6. I mean, for what it was typically used for (that I saw) it worked great. I wouldnt look to use it on film/shorts/tv shows. But an indy film with a little control, or an interview.. it does just fine. I have not heard any problem with the audio from it. No extra hiss, etc. What am I missing that you are bagging on it so hard for (which is fine.. just wondering why you say it is so bad)?

Thanks for all the informative posts above. Just a note on syncing multiple tracks. I found a way to do this that works fine in Resolve:

1. Sync first track.
2. Make a compound clip
3. Sync next track.
4. Make a compound clip again. Repeat as needed.
5. When all tracks are synced, decompose the compound clip in place.

All tracks synced and available on separate audio tracks.

Thanks, nice tip.
Cheers

My BMPCC4K ordered 10 months ago has arrived at my dealer’s Vancouver site and I’ll likely have it tomorrow in Victoria BC.

Unfortunately they have none of the cable and storage accessories ordered last summer. So looks like I’ll learn all about the efficacy of those pair of genuine Canon batteries I bought ages ago. I hope I have the minimal bits and pieces to rig this up and might actually use it as I continue the narrative shoot the evening of July 1 if I trust it and myself. Will order the things I need ASAP (Wise and BMD). The cage and timecode sync order will go elsewhere.


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Great news Rick, it is about time it came in.
Cheers

Cables, Wise Portable SSD, Shape cage/handles/rigging ordered Friday. Other stuff can wait a bit.

I’ve shot lots of BRAW mostly Q0 and pixel peeking against ProRes 422 HQ it’s slightly better in areas that you might notice and might not in a motion picture.

One thing I learned about BRAW is that the most important exposure decision is whether you will be in the 400 band or the 3200 band. To illustrate why it’s really all about the band and not the ISO, here’s what I found, say if you’re in the 3200 band.

You can set the ISO anywhere that’s convenient such as 1250, 3200, 6400. If you do not touch any other setting such as T-stop, the recorded exposure is identical. So if you need to brighten the monitor to see the scene, turn it to 6400.

Now if you use False Colour to ensure you have no yellow but no red in a scene at ISO 3200, and then turn the ISO to 1250, your monitor is going to darken and your False Colour display may show you no yellow at all. However your recorded exposure is the same as the scopes will prove to you. But if you open the iris a stop or more to bring back that yellow at ISO 1250, you have a different exposure, one with more light and better shadows.

Edit
The description above applies to the behaviour shooting BRAW. The behaviour in Prores 422 HQ is quite different in that changes to the ISO do affect the recorded image as well as the monitor without the operator having to adjust the iris. WYSIWYG as a change to ISO only is baked into the recorded image. Of course you can still make changes to the iris if you want.





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