In/Out Bugs

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Jim Simon

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In/Out Bugs

PostFri Dec 04, 2020 3:59 pm

If I set In/Out points on the Edit page, they carry over to the Deliver page. I like that, especially since Deliver doesn't use proper Edit page navigation, but the far more cumbersome Color page navigation.

However, when I switch to Deliver, the Render is incorrectly set to Entire Timeline rather than In/Out Range.

Additionally, even if I change the render to In/Out Range and add the render job to the Queue, the In/Out points are ignored, reset and the Entire Timeline is rendered.

A nice new feature having universal In/Out points, but definitely still buggy.

Studio 17 Beta (all versions so far) for Windows.
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostFri Dec 04, 2020 7:26 pm

To make matters worse, the behavior here is...inconsistent.
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brediknight

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostFri Dec 18, 2020 7:09 pm

to add on.. I don't think its setting the out point correctly either. many Renders have had a black frame at the end of the outputs.

yes. its inconsistent. which is worse! I also see this from Edit page to Color page; not going to parked clips on timeline.
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DanielBoist

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostWed Dec 23, 2020 11:01 pm

This drives me crazy... i hate this behavior. Please BMD, fix this! Thanks!
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostWed Dec 30, 2020 7:49 pm

Looks like this got fixed in Beta 6. :D

Twice I set In/Out points on the Edit page, and twice I got the correct export from Deliver.
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brediknight

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostMon Jan 18, 2021 9:46 pm

Ok so now I want it to default back to Timeline each time. This had gotten me too many times already. Rendering just the In/Out Range that may have been set in the timeline. Sometimes by an assistant. Resulting in having to render again for the full timeline.

If I want In/Out I'll change it to "In/Out Range". Don't guess for me based on the last time I or someone else loaded the timeline.

This is error prone. Especially in a workgroup or assistant environment.

Default to "Entire Timeline" please. Make one manually change it to In/Out. Then sure, inherent the timeline In/Outs from the Edit Page.


Good idea on paper, but not in practice.
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Dayne Relihan

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostTue Jan 19, 2021 2:55 am

I am new to Resolve, been using 16 studio for 4 months. I am nervous about moving to 17 studio. This group appears to be the most experienced with Resolve in general so I thought I would ask if 17 is 'stable' enough to switch to and when will it be released in its final version?
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostTue Jan 19, 2021 6:57 pm

brediknight wrote:Make one manually change it to In/Out.

I don't agree. If one has In/Out points set, the logical presumption is that one wants to use them.

If one doesn't want to use them, remove them. After which the option does go back to Entire Timeline.
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Tom Early

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostTue Jan 19, 2021 7:42 pm

brediknight wrote:Default to "Entire Timeline" please.


no thanks, not if in/out points have been set. Unless it became a user preference of course.
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brediknight

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostTue Jan 19, 2021 9:06 pm

well. I did think I would like it as well at first. But it keeps doing things I don't want too. Even if there is only one mark in or out, it defaults to In/Out Range. Which might be the gotcha. Maybe it should only go to "In/Out Range" if you actually have set BOTH an In AND an Out. Not just one and it guesses the other on the delivery page.
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostTue Jan 19, 2021 9:36 pm

You can't have just an In or just an Out. If you have one, there is automatically the other. It might be at the beginning or end of the timeline, but by necessity, it's still there.
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brediknight

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostWed Jan 20, 2021 12:58 am

Jim Simon wrote:You can't have just an In or just an Out. If you have one, there is automatically the other. It might be at the beginning or end of the timeline, but by necessity, it's still there.



But if you don't set an In AND an Out, it shouldn't default to In/Out Range in the Delivery page because one hasn't set an In and Out Range. That wouldn't be the intent and likely just a left over In point.

If only "Mark In" is set. Do Timeline. (one did not intend for a range)
If only "Mark Out" is set, Do Timeline (one did not intend for a range)
If "Mark In" AND "Mark Out" marks are both set, Do IN/Out Range.
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostWed Jan 20, 2021 5:36 pm

If you set one, you get both, so the logical presumption is that you want to use the In/Out range.

If you don't want to use In/Out, don't set them. Or if they're set elsewhere, delete them.
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brediknight

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostWed Jan 20, 2021 8:17 pm

Jim Simon wrote:If you set one, you get both, so the logical presumption is that you want to use the In/Out range.

Well then that is a flaw.

Jim Simon wrote:If you don't want to use In/Out, don't set them. Or if they're set elsewhere, delete them.


Right, an errant in or out point never happens when editing. Especially in a workgroup where multiple people work on the same projects.
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostWed Jan 20, 2021 8:58 pm

brediknight wrote:Well then that is a flaw.

I don't think so.
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostWed Jan 20, 2021 8:59 pm

brediknight wrote:an errant in or out point never happens when editing.

Exactly.
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostFri Feb 05, 2021 6:20 pm

Jim Simon wrote:Looks like this got fixed in Beta 6.

Just want to report this bug is back in Beta 8.

I set In/Out points on Edit, Queued a Job on Deliver, and as soon as I hit Render, I lost those In/Out points and it started processing the entire timeline.
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostFri Feb 12, 2021 7:45 pm

Seems to be corrected in Beta 9 again. The In/Out points I set on the Edit page are respected on the Deliver page.
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brediknight

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostFri Feb 12, 2021 8:30 pm

This isn't working for me in b9. It is still inconsistent.

When I want in and out on the timeline, Delivery page sets it to "Timeline"
When I clear In/Out in the timeline, Delivery Page sets itself to "In/Out".

I'm baffled. it is not consistent. sometimes it works, sometimes not.

I really wish it would just default to "Timeline" since that is the most used output. "In and Out" is good for manual control of sections only, obviously.

There is no harm in "accidentally" rendering the entire timeline.
But when you set a feature length render and go to lunch, and come back to see a partial render because accidentally there was an "In Mark", it really sucks! Especially when the previously rendered Timeline was set to "Timeline".
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostSat Feb 13, 2021 5:59 pm

Yep, still inconsistent.

Today I set In/Out on Edit, added to my Queue on Deliver, and Resolve proceeded to ignore the In/Out points and render the entire timeline. :cry:
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Jeremy Dallek

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostSun Feb 14, 2021 3:43 am

Like brediknight mentioned, I am also seeing the out point applied one frame after the playhead/intended position in the edit/deliver tabs. I'm having to manually drag it back 1 frame (snap has to be off for this to work) before rendering. Win10, Studio Beta 9
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Tom Early

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostSun Feb 14, 2021 2:09 pm

Jeremy Dallek wrote:Like brediknight mentioned, I am also seeing the out point applied one frame after the playhead/intended position in the edit/deliver tabs.


Can you provide a screenshot?
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostSun Feb 14, 2021 5:15 pm

Jeremy Dallek wrote:I am also seeing the out point applied one frame after the playhead/intended position

That's just how NLE's work. Not related to this thread.
Last edited by Jim Simon on Mon Feb 15, 2021 11:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Jeremy Dallek

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostSun Feb 14, 2021 6:43 pm

Thank you Jim, it looks like that behavior is indeed how Premiere works as well. (You can see the play head even indicates a little blue line extending through the frame.)

I migrated from primarily using Vegas Pro, where the out point is visually placed exactly where the play head is, even though it may be effectually including the rest of the frame.
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostMon Mar 22, 2021 6:20 pm

Just want to report this still isn't working consistently in Studio 17.1 for Windows.

Needs a fix, BMD.
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostThu Apr 01, 2021 11:31 pm

Still not working in 17.1.1. :(
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bellerandre

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostThu Apr 29, 2021 3:24 am

I'm having the same problem: I never know when Resolve will Deliver based on In/Out

I literally have to quadruple-check. In my Edit timeline, in the Deliver timeline, after I press "add to queue", and after I press "render".
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brediknight

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostTue May 04, 2021 12:26 am

This is getting bad. Making more mistakes on the deliver page that ever before.

how about this.

Default is "Entire Timeline" like it was before.
Then, if you have an In and Out in your timeline set, switching to "In/Out Range" pulls your set in and out points. As the starting point. Still being able to overide them if needed.

This way, it ALLWAYS has a default behavior, and one is in control of the In/Out Range option,, rather than BMD guessing based on your timeline.
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostSat May 22, 2021 3:50 pm

Just want to report I'm still seeing unpredictable behavior in Studio 17.2 for Windows.
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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostSun May 23, 2021 7:47 am

Same here!
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostThu Jun 03, 2021 6:35 pm

Still seeing inconsistent behavior here in Studio 17.2.1 for Windows.
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Marc Wielage

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostFri Jun 04, 2021 1:08 am

If all else fails: before you set an In point, try clearing the in/out register by hitting Option-X (or Alt-X), and then hit the In point. I confess we're using a dedicated "In" and "Out" button on the Advanced Panels, but it's not anything more than doing a Mark -> Mark In and Mark -> Mark Out with the menu controls or clicking the GUI buttons.

I have run into In/Out weirdness on the Deliver page many times, but usually Option-X solves it. Usually.
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostFri Jun 04, 2021 4:18 pm

Thanks Marc.

That might be a work around. But I'm still hoping to get it working properly.
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Shrinivas Ramani

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostFri Jun 04, 2021 10:57 pm

Hi

Please note that I've requested scenarios in this thread. Please feel free to chime in.

Thanks
Shrinivas
Shrinivas Ramani wrote:Hi

Since the last few releases have addressed issues with in-out range persistence, it would be useful if you can post see specific examples of remaining issues of the range not being persisted.

As an example report, this deterministic step-by-step format is useful:
* Load this project (attached)
* Go to the edit page, select this timeline, this clip, mark clip.
* Go to the deliver page, switch to this timeline, switch back.
* The in-outs follow from the previous timeline (as an example).

Thanks in advance
Shrinivas
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brediknight

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 5:55 am

its simple.

The percentage of times you want to output the ENTIRE timeline far exceeds the times for specific in/out marks durations. Furthermore, the failure in outputting just a section or just short of the entire timeline has greater consequences than just the in and out.

what if... you are short a few seconds for a 120min filme? and waited 60 min for the output. or you upload it and its short for a broadcast by 1 sec cause you had an out mark you or an assistant set?

vs
having control, knowing the default is ALWAYS one thing. the entire output.
Usually, one knows that they intend to output a duration, so they select the duration.

I will always assume the output SHOULD BE the entire timeline.


Default "ENTIRE TIMELINE"

Option
IN/OUT that pulls the in/out point in the current timeline or allows you to set your own or overide in the Deliver page.


this really isn't that complicated. One is error prone, the other is a standard.
Knowing the standard, one knows to change it if that is their intent.

but if the intent is "ENTIRE TIMELINE" and the software guesses your intent wrong. that is bad UI/Software design.


Launch codes.
T-minus 10 sec.
or
T-Minus variable x seconds. What time is it??????
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 1:38 pm

brediknight wrote:I will always assume the output SHOULD BE the entire timeline.
Only when there are no In/Out points.
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brediknight

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 9:32 pm

Jim Simon wrote:
brediknight wrote:I will always assume the output SHOULD BE the entire timeline.
Only when there are no In/Out points.


If I set in and out in the deliver page sure.
But the problem is it pulls from the timeline even if only one mark is there.

I'd still prefer the default be entire timeline and manually set the in and out point in the delivery page, not pull from timelines. Especially on versioning projects where we could have as many as 300 timelines to output and just one mishap can screw up a broadcast delivery.

These mishaps also happens on multi editor jobs, where one editor or assistant sets an in point and doesn't clear the in/out points before closing.
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Jim Simon

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostMon Jun 14, 2021 5:03 pm

brediknight wrote:If I set in and out in the deliver page sure.
If you set them anywhere.

To deliver the entire timeline, remove In/Out points or change the Render range before adding to the Queue.

Quite simple and elegant, I think.
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brediknight

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostMon Jun 14, 2021 5:18 pm

yep. just one more thing to remember, stop go back and change.

problem with the unified timeline is it really isn't. nor is it obvious that there are in/out marks. specifically, on the color page. resulting in loops not working or clips jumping somewhere else in the timeline. then AFTER you realize there is an in or out you clear it. but you maybe 40 min down the timeline.

its just poorly implemented.
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Andy Mees

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostMon Jun 14, 2021 7:36 pm

I'm very much a fan of the unified timeline, I find it's implementation both sensible and intuitive, but I do consider it odd that, in the Deliver page, if I set Render Range to 'Entire Timeline' it actually clears my selected In/Out range rather than simply flagging that range to be ignored. I'd argue that the In/Out range should always persist unless or until the user explicitly makes the choice to change or clear that range, and that setting Render Range to Entire Timeline is not making that choice.

With respect to Brendan's issue, I'd suggest an elegant approach might be to make 'Render Range' part of the 'Presets' options. Doing so would allow users who might want or need to ensure that their renders always default to one thing or the other, to include that choice as as part of their export presets.
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Peter Cave

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Re: In/Out Bugs

PostTue Jun 15, 2021 1:32 am

Andy Mees wrote:I'm very much a fan of the unified timeline, I find it's implementation both sensible and intuitive, but I do consider it odd that, in the Deliver page, if I set Render Range to 'Entire Timeline' it actually clears my selected In/Out range rather than simply flagging that range to be ignored. I'd argue that the In/Out range should always persist unless or until the user explicitly makes the choice to change or clear that range, and that setting Render Range to Entire Timeline is not making that choice.

With respect to Brendan's issue, I'd suggest an elegant approach might be to make 'Render Range' part of the 'Presets' options. Doing so would allow users who might want or need to ensure that their renders always default to one thing or the other, to include that choice as as part of their export presets.


This is always going to be an issue as there are many people who dislike the unified timeline. I prefer all in/out marks to be completely independent across pages. I would like to see a user option to enable/disable this "unified" behaviour.
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