MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

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dgbarar

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MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 1:51 am

Hi All

would like to purchase a 16 MBP M1 Max. My work will be UHD HEVC 3 camera Multicam at 23.97 or 29.98 FPS. Also, a year down the road 8K may be a possibility. Work is generally simple with color corrections and animations that have been encoded UHD ProRes 4444 with alpha.

For this style of work, do I require 32 or 64 GB. I know that it hard to tell at this point as there are very few machines in the wild. But would very much appreciate a best guess.

Don

Currently, I own a 2016 MBP15 with 16 GP and the 2.9 GHx i7 processor. Optimization to ProRes 422 is very slow as is encoding. I tried an M1 Mini with 8 GB RAM and that was much better. I rarely had to optimize the HEVC files.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 5:34 am

64GB

"Too much memory" - does NOT exist in our vocabulary.

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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 6:08 am

With pc's, I usually buy the best I can afford. No telling what the future might bring, both in software requirementd but also with your interests/work.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 6:37 am

Check those videos by MaxTech: youtu.be/Un4gNs8spls

64 GB might not be needed.
If you can wait a few days, he has 8 (eight!) machines in different configs coming in.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 9:41 am

The price difference isn’t that great compared to the overall cost… I’d be looking at 64GB…

But I’d hold off until we see some real world tests…

I’d like to see how fast it can render 4448x3096 PR4444 with NR and grades to same size Pro Res.

Or how fast it can render full debayer 8K RED with NR to UHD Pro Res…

We should see those come out in the next week or so…
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 2:01 pm

HI All,

Thank you to everyone for writing. I have seen the MaxTech video. And, you are correct that the cost difference is not that much. Both of my orders will not be available until late November through mid-December. So there is time to see what those that have the machine think about performance before making a decision.

Don
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 2:41 pm

dgbarar wrote:Hi All

would like to purchase a 16 MBP M1 Max. My work will be UHD HEVC 3 camera Multicam at 23.97 or 29.98 FPS. Also, a year down the road 8K may be a possibility. Work is generally simple with color corrections and animations that have been encoded UHD ProRes 4444 with alpha.

For this style of work, do I require 32 or 64 GB. I know that it hard to tell at this point as there are very few machines in the wild. But would very much appreciate a best guess.

Don

Currently, I own a 2016 MBP15 with 16 GP and the 2.9 GHx i7 processor. Optimization to ProRes 422 is very slow as is encoding. I tried an M1 Mini with 8 GB RAM and that was much better. I rarely had to optimize the HEVC files.



I would go with 64GB for 2 main reasons. Remember that the memory is shared with the GPU and RAM is not upgradeable after purchase.
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TheBloke

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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 2:49 pm

Given the RAM in an M1 machine can never be upgraded, I wouldn't even think about less than 64GB. More RAM is always helpful; if not now, then in the future. And probably now, too.

If you use Resolve's Fusion page, or might in future, you'll want as much RAM as possible. And even if Resolve never needs it for what you use it for, more RAM means you can run multiple programs at once without needing to think about closing them down. Photoshop, Lightroom, Blender, Logic Pro, etc, etc. And even if you don't use those sort of programs, you're still likely to want a web browser with tabs, Preview, Mail, etc. It all adds up.

On top of that, any RAM you're not using can be used automatically by the OS as filesystem cache, speeding up access to files on disk - including Resolve's cache.

Here's a look at my current RAM usage:
Image

I have Resolve open using about 10GB, and Fusion studio using 6.3GB. But my total RAM usage is 43GB, on account of also having Firefox, a PDF viewer (for various manuals), Path Finder, email client, etc. And then I have 32GB of filesystem cache - most of which is Resolve's render cache. So my Resolve cache on disk is also being cached in RAM - meaning that when I play back my cached timeline clips, it's effectively like I have a RAM cache.

I know not everyone wants or needs to run so many programs. But IMHO more RAM generally means better performance, more flexibility, and less chance of running into problems in future years. Especially for a system where RAM can never be upgraded.

When I bought 128GB RAM for this system I bought 4 x 32GB sticks instead of 8 x 16GB, so I would have the option to easily upgrade to 256GB RAM in future. Just in case I might ever need that much :)
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 5:44 pm

mpetech wrote:
dgbarar wrote:Remember that the memory is shared with the GPU


In a traditional discrete GPU architecture, textures (and other data being processed) need to be copied from the CPU's memory to the GPU's memory before the GPU can access them; thus if you have a 200 MB texture it is consuming 200 MB in system (CPU) memory and another 200 MB in video memory when the GPU is using it.

My understanding is that in Apple's M1 architecture, the CPU and the GPU access the texture from the same place in memory, so that it is only occupying a total of 200 MB, without having two copies of it in memory. If this understanding is accurate, the additional memory usage from the GPU sharing memory with the CPU is not likely to be as significant as you seem to be implying.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 6:39 pm

Significance depends. If Resolve needs lets say 10GB worth of vram for rendering a frame then it leaves 22GB for cpu side RAM on 32GB model. Whether this is enough or not depends.

To move data to gpu you don’t need to keep the duplicates in memory anyway, you can discard the cpu side buffer as soon as upload is done.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 6:52 pm

BaGRoS wrote:64GB
"Too much memory" - does NOT exist in our vocabulary.


+1
100% agree. However I do expect that Resolve will get smaller and faster for a while before it gets larger again. However the longer term trend is software always gets bigger. Beside how will you be able to process the essential (minimum) resolution of 16K in 2 years time... :-)
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 7:31 pm

jamedia wrote:Beside how will you be able to process the essential (minimum) resolution of 16K in 2 years time... :-)

And it will run at 120fps.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 8:16 pm

Frank Engel wrote:
In a traditional discrete GPU architecture, textures (and other data being processed) need to be copied from the CPU's memory to the GPU's memory before the GPU can access them; thus if you have a 200 MB texture it is consuming 200 MB in system (CPU) memory and another 200 MB in video memory when the GPU is using it.

My understanding is that in Apple's M1 architecture, the CPU and the GPU access the texture from the same place in memory, so that it is only occupying a total of 200 MB, without having two copies of it in memory. If this understanding is accurate, the additional memory usage from the GPU sharing memory with the CPU is not likely to be as significant as you seem to be implying.


No, my point is people can easily overlook that 32GB is not 32GB in a shared memory architecture. Grading 4K requires at least 8GB of VRAM. So that 32GB is now only 24GB. Even if frame buffer redundancy has been removed, 24GB of RAM can be hardly be described as "a lot" in modern computing.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 9:34 pm

TheBloke wrote:If you use Resolve's Fusion page, or might in future, you'll want as much RAM as possible.


I do use the Resolves Fusion page. On the 8 GB M1 Mini it worked far better but still on the "clunky" side when I skimmed through content and put in key frames.

However, on my 2016 16GB MBP15, it is almost impossible to put it keyframes into Fusion project when skimming through content. Hence, on the 2016 MBP, I use Fusion only for the of simplest task, i.e. titles, bring in sentences onto a black background, etc.

I would like to use Fusion more. So I want to make certain that I have enough CPU and RAM to be able to get the job done. This is one of reasons that I was asking about how much RAM.

Don
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 10:35 pm

If apps developers put more attention to RAM usage then there would be less issues.
Simplest solution is to dump a lot to RAM and 'never' clean it.
Adobe use to be champion of it (still probably is). Many years ago 32GB RAM in AE was still not enough and projects were at most HD :lol:

I still have in memory people saying that for every problem with Mac (or PC) solution is to buy 2x more RAM. Pure nonsense.

I would not compare M1 behaviour to older Mac or PC. It needs own evaluation and the best is to wait for people to do some tests. For 3D work 32G is good start. If you need 64 is not so easy to answer. If you have budget go for it, but if not then better to wait and read more (but real test not some advice based on how much older system need).

We had stories with Chrome on Mac that it would use gigs of RAM, just because it had it available and it liked caching video there. In reality it did not have to really do this in such a intensity.
There seems to be tendency for OSes to use RAM whenever it's available, but it doesn't meant it really needs it. With 3D apps this may be very different story as quite often these apps NEED a lot of RAM.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostTue Oct 26, 2021 10:48 pm

TheBloke wrote:Here's a look at my current RAM usage:
Image

I have Resolve open using about 10GB, and Fusion studio using 6.3GB. But my total RAM usage is 43GB, on account of also having Firefox, a PDF viewer (for various manuals), Path Finder, email client, etc. And then I have 32GB of filesystem cache - most of which is Resolve's render cache. So my Resolve cache on disk is also being cached in RAM - meaning that when I play back my cached timeline clips, it's effectively like I have a RAM cache.


Yes this caching eats it I think. And if you had way less RAM this would be cleaned.
This is what I said- OSes like to eat RAM when it's available, but it doesn't meant they can't live without it.
Last edited by Andrew Kolakowski on Wed Oct 27, 2021 9:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostWed Oct 27, 2021 8:17 am

dgbarar wrote:
TheBloke wrote:If you use Resolve's Fusion page, or might in future, you'll want as much RAM as possible.

I do use the Resolves Fusion page. On the 8 GB M1 Mini it worked far better but still on the "clunky" side when I skimmed through content and put in key frames.

The reason why it is "clunky" is probably because it is using the M2 drive for page swapping. This is thrashing the M2 drive. This has been discussed previously. IT drastically shortens the life of the computer. Estimates are to just outside the 3 years support period. So second hand M1 Macs with 8 and 16GB of RAM will have zero resale value.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostWed Oct 27, 2021 9:38 am

Andrew Kolakowski wrote:Yes this caching eats it I think. And if you had way less RAM this would be cleaned.
This is what I said- OSes like to eat RAM when it's available, but it doesn't meant they can't live without it.

Reading from RAM is a lot (at least order of magnitude) faster than from ssd even in M1 Max Pro Enhanced Better so filling up RAM is a good thing. It is not good when applications start competing with one another for ram and OS must constantly free ram for one then another through swapping to ssd. Using less resource is "a thing" only when end outcome is the same, speed or whatever the measure is. Using less to do less isn't an objective imho.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostWed Oct 27, 2021 10:02 am

I think quite often user experience doesn't really suffer. This was my point.
Are you going to see a difference when data is stored in cache vs. on SSD when it comes to simple playback of eg. ProRes frames?
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostWed Oct 27, 2021 10:55 am

Andrew Kolakowski wrote:I think quite often user experience doesn't really suffer. This was my point.
Are you going to see a difference when data is stored in cache vs. on SSD when it comes to simple playback of eg. ProRes frames?
It's a fair point. But my point was that even if one is not actively using all the RAM, it's not going to waste. And then they may well need it all later.

For me the big issue with the M1 machines is they are completely un-upgradeable. If the OP was asking about a regular laptop or desktop, I'd say "If you're confident it's enough, get 32GB now - you can always swap it out any time later."

But with that being completely impossible in an M1, I believe that someone using Resolve with a bit of Fusion should get the most RAM they can. It's "only" another £400 or so to get the 64GB. But if they get 32 and find later that they're it's too little, they'll have to sell the machine and buy another, which is likely to cost more - in inconvenience if nothing else. And as someone said earlier, who knows what we'll consider a reasonable amount in 2 or 4 years time.

So it's mostly about the future, but I also think that there's a good chance they'll see some benefit to 64 versus 32 right now, even if they don't technically need it for their workflow. Even if that's just the convenience of never needing to worry about closing down any other apps when running Resolve, and marginal benefits from filesystem caching, that's still useful.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostWed Oct 27, 2021 11:02 am

Yep, you have to be careful. Those £400 may cost you a lot more later :D
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostWed Oct 27, 2021 11:02 am

It depends on what the data rate is. For prores it makes no difference because data rate is so low. You don't see any difference playing it back sequentially from platter hdd either. Playing back prores clip isn't exactly the reason why one needs M1 Pro or Max anyway, could do with random years old computer well enough.

Cpu can not live up to its computational power with low-speed data access during compute-intensive tasks. 7GB sec which is advertised as maximum M1 Max SSD can do is too low for compute. If it weren't, there would be no cpu cache levels, and RAM would be way smaller. GPU vram for example gets hammered by all the texture, shader, geometry and whatnot calls gazillion times per second and cpu isn't different in this regard.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostWed Oct 27, 2021 11:05 am

TheBloke wrote: But my point was that even if one is not actively using all the RAM, it's not going to waste. And then they may well need it all later.

For me the big issue with the M1 machines is they are completely un-upgradeable. If the OP was asking about a regular laptop or desktop, I'd say "If you're confident it's enough, get 32GB now - you can always swap it out any time later."

But with that being completely impossible in an M1, I believe that someone using Resolve with a bit of Fusion should get the most RAM they can. It's "only" another £400 or so to get the 64GB. But if they get 32 and find later that they're it's too little, they'll have to sell the machine and buy another,.....


The problem is that low memory M1 MACs (8/16GB certainly but also 32GB if used for film editing) will have little or no resale value as people will be worried that the M2 drives will have been thrashed as swap pages to near end of life. None of the drives or memory are replaceable.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostWed Oct 27, 2021 11:13 am

In the meantime P3 screen coverage seems to be very good:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/The-new-M ... 327.0.html
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostWed Oct 27, 2021 11:16 am

jamedia wrote:The problem is that low memory M1 MACs (8/16GB certainly but also 32GB if used for film editing) will have little or no resale value as people will be worried that the M2 drives will have been thrashed as swap pages to near end of life. None of the drives or memory are replaceable.
Well, maybe. It's not guaranteed, and will depend on the amount of RAM and what the user is doing.

Resolve's RAM allocation sliders are always relative to the total amount installed. Maxing both sliders will tell Resolve to cap at 75% of the total RAM installed (which means the more RAM you have installed, the more Resolve can't access - on my 128GB system, Resolve will only use 96GB; but that's a whole different annoyance.)

Therefore on an 8GB system, Resolve won't use more than 6GB. This leaves 2GB for the OS, which is just about enough. On a 16GB system it'll use 12GB, leaving 4GB for the OS and other programs - which would be enough for a web browser and maybe an email client as well.

macOS also implements RAM compression, so when memory gets tight, it starts to compress data/programs on a least-used basis. It uses some CPU cycles to enable more to fit in RAM before swapping needs to occur.

So it's not guaranteed that Resolve is causing swapping even on an 8GB system. But yes, it could occur if the user wants to also run a web browser, email client, image viewer, especially if they also have some background programs running like backup agent, anti-malware, productivity tools, etc.

Also I'm not sure it's correct to say the M2 drive is completely irreplaceable. Not user replaceable of course, but I believe a repair shop could do it - researchers in China have proved it's possible, so I imagine over the next couple of years it'll become a process that third-party repair shops will be able to do.
Last edited by TheBloke on Wed Oct 27, 2021 11:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostWed Oct 27, 2021 11:20 am

TheBloke wrote:Also I'm not sure it's correct to say the M2 drive is completely irreplaceable. Not user replaceable of course, but I believe a repair shop could do it - researchers in China have proved it's possible, so I imagine over the next couple of years it'll become a process that third-party repair shops will be able to do.


Apple is working very hard to stop 3rd Party repair shops. Apple is moving more and more to Apple specific parts (even where they are not needed) and restricting the supply of them to only Apple.

So you end up with only Apple repair-shops and they will be doing motherboard swap outs.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostThu Oct 28, 2021 4:36 pm

Will the 32gb version also have the full 400gb bandwith?
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostThu Oct 28, 2021 6:25 pm

You just need M1 MAX to have 400GB/s bandwidth. It can have 32GB RAM.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostFri Oct 29, 2021 1:55 pm

Well, it seems I was wrong.
If you want to denoise 12K BRAW in a 12K timeline you can get close to 32 GB needed by DR.
So, if you want this as your main machine, get 64.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostFri Oct 29, 2021 7:49 pm

since it is not possible to exchange the memory later,
I always recommend to take the maximum configuration!
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Oct 30, 2021 7:03 am

Mark Foster wrote:since it is not possible to exchange the memory later,
I always recommend to take the maximum configuration!


I don't understand that recommendation. Yes it makes sense in some cases, but if – after evaluation – you don't really need it, 400$ is a lot of money. Yes you might need in the future...but then again; when was the last time you kept a laptop 5 years?
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Oct 30, 2021 7:50 am

Janis Lionel wrote:I don't understand that recommendation. Yes it makes sense in some cases, but if – after evaluation – you don't really need it, 400$ is a lot of money. Yes you might need in the future...but then again; when was the last time you kept a laptop 5 years?


If you're already paying well over 3K for the 32bit version, it's not a lot of money extra and since the one disadvantage with Mac laptop hardware is their very limited upgrade possibilities, it makes very good sense to me. I have a Lenovo laptop approaching 8yrs, as good as new and I can still edit basic Avid on it and my Main ZBook workstation laptop is 3yrs now, and will be used for at least 2 more but then I was able to go from 32gigs ram to 64, 2 extra NVme 2TB drives, and from 6GB Quadro to 16GB in it without needing much in the way of any tools or huge costs. I would expect any outlay of more than 3K to last at least 5yrs.

It's a bit like buying a premium car, fully specced with cloth seats, after 6 months it really bugs you (for those of us who are not Vegan) :D
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Oct 30, 2021 11:17 am

Janis Lionel wrote:
Mark Foster wrote:since it is not possible to exchange the memory later,
I always recommend to take the maximum configuration!


I don't understand that recommendation. Yes it makes sense in some cases, but if – after evaluation – you don't really need it, 400$ is a lot of money. Yes you might need in the future...but then again; when was the last time you kept a laptop 5 years?


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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Oct 30, 2021 11:40 am

Janis Lionel wrote:
Mark Foster wrote:since it is not possible to exchange the memory later,
I always recommend to take the maximum configuration!


I don't understand that recommendation. Yes it makes sense in some cases, but if – after evaluation – you don't really need it, 400$ is a lot of money. Yes you might need in the future...but then again; when was the last time you kept a laptop 5 years?


I keep all my laptops over 5 years and still use them.

On the new MAC's where the Ram and SSD is soldered on the the motherboard they will have no resale value after 3 years.

The point is you ALWAYS need more RAM. Ram usage had never in the field of human history decreased.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 9:45 am

I would like to see side by side comparisons and not just for 1 Min.

At least those two videos suggest, that there is no performance gain with upgraded ram and that apple copes really well with the ram available. Also interesting how more ram is used when it's there but no difference in performance.


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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 10:51 am

RAM in these machines will not make them faster, but will protect your SSD from too much swapping (if it's needed).
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 11:45 am

Uli Plank wrote:RAM in these machines will not make them faster, but will protect your SSD from too much swapping (if it's needed).

+1

This is why low RAM Mac M1's will have zero resale value after 2 years.

There have been several independant test run that shows in the lower ram machines they are page swaping vertuall memroy to the "hard Drive" except these are M2 flash drives with a finte number of erase/write/read cycles that is well below that of spinning HDDs.
The m2 drives used are fast ehough that the speed deridation is minute compared to the spinning HDD's so that people hardly notice.

IF you plan to keep the laptop more then 3 years you need to go gfor the larger amount of RAM.
Note that the low RAM MAc laptops will have zero resale value after 2 years because people will assume the mothertboard will fail due to the flash memory failing.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 12:03 pm

Or you get Apple Care for three years and have them tax deducted during that time.
If you use it for work.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 12:14 pm

Uli Plank wrote:Or you get Apple Care for three years and have them tax deducted during that time.
If you use it for work.


That's true. However the laptop will have zero value ot anyone alfter 3 years.
So much for sustainability in these days of climate change. You would have thought Apple would would be trying to save the planet.
How things have changed sicen Jobs took his hand of the controlls.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 12:50 pm

jamedia wrote:
Uli Plank wrote:RAM in these machines will not make them faster, but will protect your SSD from too much swapping (if it's needed).

+1

This is why low RAM Mac M1's will have zero resale value after 2 years.

There have been several independant test run that shows in the lower ram machines they are page swaping vertuall memroy to the "hard Drive" except these are M2 flash drives with a finte number of erase/write/read cycles that is well below that of spinning HDDs.
The m2 drives used are fast ehough that the speed deridation is minute compared to the spinning HDD's so that people hardly notice.

IF you plan to keep the laptop more then 3 years you need to go gfor the larger amount of RAM.
Note that the low RAM MAc laptops will have zero resale value after 2 years because people will assume the mothertboard will fail due to the flash memory failing.


Is the knowledge or half-knowledge? I mean Mac OS is constantly writing on these m.2 drives with temporary files. Also: I am convinced they will have a great resale value.

Read this – in his calculation TBW is 16 years with a massive 660GB a day:
https://medium.com/codex/the-apple-m1-s ... 0002ee23d0

https://www.macworld.com/article/338844 ... espan.html
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 1:05 pm

Was about to write the same.
It looks more like a myth than well calculated fact.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 1:08 pm

It's a myth if you're running low ram applications that never need to swap.

Was it last week somebody posted about a memory leak on the M1 ? I don't remember the number but it wasn't a myth.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 1:16 pm

Any memory leak or badly written up quickly come live and people know about it.
You’re not going to live with it for years, but maybe days or weeks. In this time it won’t kill your drive for sure.
Based on that article even with 1TB written every day you have many years befor you kill drive. Remember that these calculations are based on fact that it happens every single day. In real world this is unrealistic.

Do people sell Macs owned more than 5 years? I have one like this and 0 plans to sell it. I rather use it as spare machine.
Last edited by Andrew Kolakowski on Sat Nov 06, 2021 1:31 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 1:28 pm

Andrew Kolakowski wrote:Do people sell Macs owned more than 5 years? I have one like this and 0 plans to sell it. I rather use it as spare machine.


Would be the same for me – i sell after 2 or 3 years and otherwise keep the device around.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 1:33 pm

Well, my comment was mildly sarcastic. Modern SSDs last longer than early generations.
Until now, all my Macs had better resale value than my PCs.
Regarding ecology, I think that less power for the same computing power is a very good thing.
But who’s gonna stop those idiots turning energy into virtual money and driving the prices of GPUs higher and higher?
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 2:02 pm

A lot of conjecture from people that don't appear to actually use M1 Macs.

In addition to an M1 MacBook Air (16GB RAM) and an M1 Max MacBook Pro (64GB RAM) I own a workstation with 128GB RAM and 2 16GB GPUs.

While it is seems counter intuitive that M1 systems can work better with less RAM considering this RAM is shared between CPU and GPU cores...they simply do. It feels like magic, but SOC design tightly coupled with OS insures it is so.

On my workstation, running Resolve and Photoshop together requires 64GB to do so comfortably. I get the same or better performance on my 16GB MacBook Air.

I bought 64GB for the usual reason ... future proofing (can't upgraded later) ... but I did so knowing it gives me zero benefit running Resolve today.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 2:32 pm

I’d expect an advantage for Fusion, but not for Resolve.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 2:35 pm

joe12south wrote:A lot of conjecture from people that don't appear to actually use M1 Macs.

In addition to an M1 MacBook Air (16GB RAM) and an M1 Max MacBook Pro (64GB RAM) I own a workstation with 128GB RAM and 2 16GB GPUs.

While it is seems counter intuitive that M1 systems can work better with less RAM considering this RAM is shared between CPU and GPU cores...they simply do. It feels like magic, but SOC design tightly coupled with OS insures it is so.

On my workstation, running Resolve and Photoshop together requires 64GB to do so comfortably. I get the same or better performance on my 16GB MacBook Air.

I bought 64GB for the usual reason ... future proofing (can't upgraded later) ... but I did so knowing it gives me zero benefit running Resolve today.


Great real world input! I wonder: where do you see the future proofness in? Different Resolve Architectures – because in terms of resolution and codec I don't know what else to expect in the next 5 years.
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSat Nov 06, 2021 3:56 pm

Janis Lionel wrote:Great real world input! I wonder: where do you see the future proofness in? Different Resolve Architectures – because in terms of resolution and codec I don't know what else to expect in the next 5 years.

For $400 extra it seemed like the wise thing to do, but I honestly don't know. I'm already pushing around 8K footage, and I really don't see resolutions beyond that becoming more than a fringe case. Clearly the GPU cores are what limit what I can do now, so I'd have to upgrade in the future, anyhow.

I don't do a ton of heavy work in Fusion or After Effects, but those can definitely eat-up RAM. Ditto for 3D work. If for some reason I get into more of any of that, I'll probably be glad I maxed the max. ;)
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Re: MBP16 M1 Max 32 or 64 GB

PostSun Nov 07, 2021 8:41 pm

dgbarar wrote:
TheBloke wrote:If you use Resolve's Fusion page, or might in future, you'll want as much RAM as possible.


I do use the Resolves Fusion page. On the 8 GB M1 Mini it worked far better but still on the "clunky" side when I skimmed through content and put in key frames.

However, on my 2016 16GB MBP15, it is almost impossible to put it keyframes into Fusion project when skimming through content. Hence, on the 2016 MBP, I use Fusion only for the of simplest task, i.e. titles, bring in sentences onto a black background, etc.

I would like to use Fusion more. So I want to make certain that I have enough CPU and RAM to be able to get the job done. This is one of reasons that I was asking about how much RAM.

Don

2016 MBP is like... 6th Gen Intel, assuming an i7 in your case (at least)?

Not to mention the GPUs from back then are probably something that modern iGPU can compete with.

Not really comparable.

I do have a 2020 Laptop with a 2060 (6GB) and 24GB RAM (Async Dual Channel) and I don't really have any issues working with HD or UHD on that, within [obvious] reason... but it has a Ryzen 9 4900HS APU, and both that CPU and GPU are a LOT stronger than anything in a 2016 MBP - and more comparable to an M1 SoC (and stronger on the GPU end, easily).

Anyone using a machine like that, or that old, have more things to worry about than how much RAM they have. You cannot really make any determinations, because your baseline CPU/GPU for comparison are so old (and weak, by association).

Additionally, newer machines are going to have faster RAM, on both the CPU and GPU. This is going to provide a performance uplift even at the same RAM capacities for any application that moves tons of data between these two components.

Fusion in Resolve has generally performed worse than Fusion Studio because it's emcumbered by Resolve's image processing pipeline. Not sure if this has changed. But I generally do not use the Fusion Page in Resolve at all. I only use Fusion Studio, and then bring that stuff back into Resolve Later.

Fusion Connect is available as a workflow, but I prefer not running two applications this heavy concurrently. I queue the Fusion stuff for a time when I will just sit in Fusion and get it done, anyways.

I do the same with Audio work. I use Resolve pretty much only for editing and color, these days.
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