Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

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Charles Bennett

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Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 12:26 am

In response to two posters I tested these and found that the versions in the Inspector window are not functioning properly, introducing level jumps, sampling artifacts, and no waveform display in the box.
However, the track based versions in the Fairlight page are working as they should.
Track Based Voice Isolation and Dialogue Leveler in the Fairlight Page.jpg
Track Based Voice Isolation and Dialogue Leveler in the Fairlight Page.jpg (122.55 KiB) Viewed 3256 times

An Update.
Though the track based versions work when just playing the Timeline, rendering brings back the level jumping artifacts, so there are certainly problems with the Dialogue Leveler.
Last edited by Charles Bennett on Sun Nov 13, 2022 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 2:19 am

Hi Charles - great info.
Confirmed here - the features are working great, both on the track level and the clip level, in the Fairlight page.
The features are pretty busted on the Edit page - nice to see it working in the Fairlight page.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 4:24 am

Thank you, Charles. “If at first I don’t succeed,” looks like I’ll have to rebuild a few clips and “try, try again!”
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 4:52 am

I done tests on 5 interviews. Both extremely buggy. Fairlight & Edit. At times it just wouldn’t work & they were all on. Also took 2 seconds to hear audio everytime i pressed play & I have a fast computer. In one section it made a voice almost completely drop out. Super weird, i even re-tested several times to see if it was a buffering issue.
Unfortunately for now, if your going to render out professional work, I would have to listen to the WHOLE audio 1st incase of bugs like I had.


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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 5:10 am

Further clarification:
In the Fairlight page, applying either/both effects to the TRACK via the inspector seems to work properly after limited testing. (edit: also via the Mixer)
However, applying to a CLIP via the inspector - the wave form window no longer shows for the dialogue leveler, and the effects seem buggy/janky.
(edit: applying via the Mixer panel seems to work properly - so seems applying using the Inspector is the problem)
audio fx 2.jpg
audio fx 2.jpg (345.28 KiB) Viewed 2903 times

On the edit page - nothing really works properly.

((Also, the only controls I see for the Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation are in the inspector windows.
And when applied via inspector, they don't show in the Mixer panel, as your pic (Charles) shows.
They don't appear in the effects panel... How did you apply?)
** In the 3 dot Mixer menu (...) I had Track Effects unchecked - so never mind :) ** )
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 6:58 am

I am using the audio leveler from the Fairlight page and applying it to a single track of dialogue. I listen to the audio playback and it sounds great.

However, I render and I am getting occasional and sudden level increases for about half a second and then the level returns to normal.

The thing I want to stress is that when playing back the problem section, the level sounds as expected and completely normal.

It is only after rendering that the sudden level increases happen.

Lastly, if I go back to the "problem" areas and put in manual keyframes on the exact spot to lower the audio, the leveler no longer has a problem. However, this is not correct because the section that has the problem is not a louder part of the dialogue. It is completely flat compared to audio immediately surrounding it. This is an anomaly in the rendered output when using the audio leveler.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 8:33 am

IsraEliteMedia wrote:However, I render and I am getting occasional and sudden level increases for about half a second and then the level returns to normal.
Are renders via the Deliver page or Fairlight Timeline?
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 10:59 am

Renders are via the delivery page where I am encoding various formats with video and audio.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 11:53 am

I see it in the inspector, but where is it sitting in the track effects?

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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 12:31 pm

Enable the Track Effects block via the Fairlight Mixer's Additional Options (3 dots) menu.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 1:20 pm

ah, thanks. (Why) is there a difference between trackFX and effects (on a track)?

something else;
Under the audio tab, you can enable voice isolation for selected mono and stereo clips and tracks in the Fairlight, edit and cut pages. For tracks, it can also be enabled from the track FX section in the Fairlight mixer.

this is from the release notes/changelog. It kinda implies that the voice isolation can also be applied to an individual clip, but i can't find the option in the inspector when clicking an individual clip. should it be there?
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 1:23 pm

It's there for me. I'm understanding from a number of posts, though, that the clip version of the leveller and dialog isolation effects are glitchy while the track version of them seems to produce better results. Is that true?
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 1:33 pm

Rick van den Berg wrote:i can't find the option in the inspector when clicking an individual clip. should it be there?
With a Clip selected (on either the Edit or Fairlight page), the Clip Inspector provides the Voice Isolation and Voice Leveller modules below the Pan module.

By default both modules are bypassed and minimised. Module controls are exposed when the module is enabled. Enable the module and click the "Controls" icon to open that module in a dedicated window.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 1:42 pm

hm, that's weird, it's definitely not showing here. 18.1 build 16
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 3:31 pm

Charles Bennett wrote:In response to two posters I tested these and found that the versions in the Inspector window are not functioning properly, introducing level jumps, sampling artifacts, and no waveform display in the box.
However, the track based versions in the Fairlight page are working as they should.

Aren't they exactly the same thing? As long as we're talking about using it on track level, not clip level I mean. If I go to Fairlight, turn on the Dialogue Leveler in the Track FX, and then go back to the Edit page, it is becoming turned on in the Inspector. Turn it off in the Inspector - it turns off in the Track FX as well.

For me, the Dialogue Leveler interface is working properly both from the Inspector and on the Fairlight page. However, the tool itself works only for playback. Apply the Leveler, hit Play - and the magic happens, the levels became much more even. But when I render the clip (via the Delivery page), and import it back, the audio levels are all over the place, with random louder/quieter parts all of a sudden. Way worse than the original audio, and nowhere near to what I'm hearing before exporting the clip. Exactly the same issue as IsraEliteMedia described above. Bouncing the mix in Fairlight also doesn't work, the Leveler has absolutely no effect like it's not even turned on.

I suppose there's something wrong at the core of the tool. It works well only in real-time but fails to bounce.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 8:17 pm

I get the same result when rendering as you Andrew.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 13, 2022 8:56 pm

When we are confident that stereo and mono CLIP usage of Voice Isolation and Dialogue Leveler are working on playback and after rendering from the Inspector in either the Edit page or the Fairlight page, then I’ll gladly incorporate in my workflow when appropriate. I think they’re great tools for Resolve to offer.

I don’t need these FX tools working at on TRACKs or in the Mixer, but still unpredictable or failing in CLIPs. I see them as correcting an occasional momentary production or recording mishap, not a fix for an entire video.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostMon Nov 14, 2022 5:42 pm

image_2022-11-14_184216466.png
image_2022-11-14_184216466.png (269.1 KiB) Viewed 2393 times

I do the 18.1 update but i don't see the voice isolation panel. Any solutions ?
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostMon Nov 14, 2022 7:33 pm

I also found that the dialog leveler creates all sorts of artifacts and drop-outs when bounced to another track (i.e., rendered) but the realtime playback sounds really good. This is for application on the entire track. I haven't tested it with clip effects.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostWed Nov 16, 2022 4:06 am

On Edit page, when adjusting ‘Track’ level volume by hovering mouse over the numbers ‘0.00’ to slide & adjust, Davinci crashes instantly.
But adjusting the slider is fine


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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostWed Nov 16, 2022 5:18 am

Whether it's either track or clip with the Voice Leveller, I am hearing distortions, usually too high level followed by too low output, until it plateaus to where it should be, for a while, after which it goes rogue again! .
This is for Mono voice-over clips, whether it's preview playback or Delivered/Rendered audio. Not usable for me.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostWed Nov 16, 2022 12:39 pm

Mylonas Films wrote:On Edit page, when adjusting ‘Track’ level volume by hovering mouse over the numbers ‘0.00’ to slide & adjust, Davinci crashes instantly.
But adjusting the slider is fine


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Saw the same with level for the new dialog isolation track/clip effect on my MacBook - some users thought it might be macOS Ventura as the culprit but your report suggests something else may be at foot.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostWed Nov 16, 2022 8:20 pm

Steve Alexander wrote:
Mylonas Films wrote:On Edit page, when adjusting ‘Track’ level volume by hovering mouse over the numbers ‘0.00’ to slide & adjust, Davinci crashes instantly.
But adjusting the slider is fine


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Saw the same with level for the new dialog isolation track/clip effect on my MacBook - some users thought it might be macOS Ventura as the culprit but your report suggests something else may be at foot.
Yeah it’s just buggy as hell. I’m just using it for viewing/listening purposes while editing, apparently they all don’t render properly either.



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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Nov 20, 2022 8:33 pm

Well, I used the dialogue leveler thing on a 20 mins video, I bounced the whole mix on a new track to have a faster render, I was just listening to it now, man it's pretty bad.

How is this even possible. Weird noise, audio glitches, sometimes the left or right side (it's a stereo track) goes super quiet for less than a sec to a sec. And that's the bounced mix, so it's backed in the wav file.

Can't trust this tool yet for even basic work :/

In this case, it's not a big of a deal for me because I edited videos without these tools anyway, so it's fine. But I was excited to have an easier time to clean up the trash audio I have to use, with the audio level of voices all over the places, and background noise.

I only use the Voice isolation, seems okay especially if the audio is backed in. I had problems when I rendered videos with the effect on a track and not baked in (and I have a pretty powerful computer).
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostWed Nov 23, 2022 6:46 am

DaVinci Resolve 18.1.1 has multiple fixes targeting the voice isolation and dialog leveler effects. Please take a look and let us know if there are other issues.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostWed Nov 23, 2022 9:53 am

Just tested with 18.1.1 and all is now well. Both are rendering without artifacts. :)
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostWed Nov 23, 2022 2:42 pm

A number of people have noted that they couldn't find the isolation and leveler controls. I found the Edit page solution after lots of trial-and-error, and Reynaud helded me with the Fairlight page solution:

- In the Edit page, if you have more that a single mono track linked to the video track you have to unlink them. Then the controls will show up in the Inspector pane.

- On the Fairlight page, use the mixer's 3-dot menu to enable "Track FX." The controls will then appear in the mixer strips for each track.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostThu Nov 24, 2022 12:43 am

For unlinked clips where the audio attributes have been changed, it's still the case that neither Dialogue or Isolation controls show up in the inspector in 18.1.1.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSat Nov 26, 2022 12:06 am

Do any of your audio tracks have more than two channels (i.e. stereo)? I did notice some ponderous wording in the manual for both tools saying they support "any mono or stereo (or multi-mono) audio track, but is not supported on greater-than- stereo tracks."
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSat Nov 26, 2022 10:21 pm

dcolacino wrote:Do any of your audio tracks have more than two channels (i.e. stereo)? I did notice some ponderous wording in the manual for both tools saying they support "any mono or stereo (or multi-mono) audio track, but is not supported on greater-than- stereo tracks."


My tracks are multiple mono. Sometimes 2, sometimes three with a linked file.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSat Nov 26, 2022 10:36 pm

My suggestion would be to try changing the clip attributes of your source clips to break each channel out into a separate track. Also, be sure to unlink all the audio tracks. Then when you select any single audio track the inspector should show the two new controls.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSat Nov 26, 2022 11:32 pm

dcolacino wrote:My suggestion would be to try changing the clip attributes of your source clips to break each channel out into a separate track. Also, be sure to unlink all the audio tracks. Then when you select any single audio track the inspector should show the two new controls.


That's exactly the way my clips and tracks are set. So no joy.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostMon Nov 28, 2022 1:06 pm

David Cherniack wrote:
dcolacino wrote:My suggestion would be to try changing the clip attributes of your source clips to break each channel out into a separate track. Also, be sure to unlink all the audio tracks. Then when you select any single audio track the inspector should show the two new controls.


That's exactly the way my clips and tracks are set. So no joy.


In fact it's the unlinked state that seems to me a major part of the issue. Perhaps it's caused when a project created in 18 with these kind of audio clips is opened in 18.1.
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Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostWed Nov 30, 2022 6:03 pm

I had a Huge Project loss, V18.1.1 - editing a 1hour TV special & i’ve never had a crash or any ‘major issues’ since 18.0…. For the 1st time i put dialogue leveller across individual audio clips on a 5min segment, & I clicked ‘ Cache AUDIO FX ‘ across the 5min segment.
After 10mins it Crashed, & I couldn’t open the project at all, not even copies of it after the fact. .
Lucky I had AUTO project backups turned on & there was one from the day before. Strangely no backups were made that day which is Odd
Warning, without project backup you will lose all your work.
BM it looks like more work needed in new dialogue FX

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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostThu Dec 01, 2022 7:45 am

is this effect "better" than for example waves clarity?
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostThu Dec 01, 2022 9:52 am

Rick van den Berg wrote:is this effect "better" than for example waves clarity?
I honestly think it is. I use both.
But… at the moment on DaVinci’s dialogue isolate, the ‘Amount’ slider doesn’t work in Davinci. At least not for me. Buggy.
Stuck on 100%


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David Cherniack

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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostThu Dec 01, 2022 12:14 pm

Rick van den Berg wrote:is this effect "better" than for example waves clarity?


My comparisons show Isolate is better than everything on the market. If only it wasn't hampered by not being available for most of my clips that require it,
David
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ohimbz

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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostThu Dec 01, 2022 12:46 pm

Quick question.

Voice Isolation performs wonderful, but it makes live editing a chore, in the sense that it slows down reaction time when editing. It takes time to kick in and it has quite the latency on the program while editing, after 1-2 seconds passed the playback is realtime with no issue but each time you stop and do an edit and play i have to endure again 1-2 seconds of delay

Is this a thing for everybody or just me?
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostThu Dec 01, 2022 10:34 pm

ohimbz wrote:Is this a thing for everybody or just me?

I do experience a bit of audio startup latency, but I haven't yet noticed any UI latency. That lag will likely be bothersome with I reach a fine cut stage, but it only occurs when I have stopped playback, not between clips.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostFri Dec 02, 2022 3:41 pm

ohimbz wrote:Quick question.

Voice Isolation performs wonderful, but it makes live editing a chore, in the sense that it slows down reaction time when editing. It takes time to kick in and it has quite the latency on the program while editing, after 1-2 seconds passed the playback is realtime with no issue but each time you stop and do an edit and play i have to endure again 1-2 seconds of delay

Is this a thing for everybody or just me?

You're not alone, we can't edit if it's enabled unfortunately, I wish there was added to the "bypass" buton. I use it all the time when I have heavy effects and grades on clips and I still need to cut and move things around.

Resolve should automatically cache audio with effects, at least the first 20 secs. Or give an option for it.
I mean, nobody could edit music if DAWs were working like this lol, so there is so much BMD could do to get it better in Resolve
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostFri Dec 02, 2022 5:16 pm

Yeah, a Bypass audio effects button would be lovely to have.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostSun Dec 04, 2022 12:33 pm

Hippolyte wrote:I do the 18.1 update but i don't see the voice isolation panel. Any solutions ?

If you are using the free version, there is no Voice Isolation. In the paid version it should be there.

I noticed another problem with the Dialogue Leveler, though it may be my quirky workflow, but I would expect it to work. Also I need to check I'm on the latest verion when I get back to work.

I shot a series of interviews between 4 people who were in 2 locations (I actually didn't shoot at the other location, as I can't be 2 places at once). Each had their own mic. There were 3 cameras, one at the remote studio and 2 at mine.
So I edit a 3 cam multi cam peice on a timeline, then chequer board the 4 audio (dialogue) tracks on the same timeline.
For the next stage I want to add B-roll and graphics, without interfering with the multi-cam edit. So I make a new timeline and add the multi-cam edit timeline to it as a clip, then put all the B-roll and graphics on a track on top.

Now when I learn there is now a Dialogue Leveler I want to try it. I go back to the multi-cam timeline and apply the leveler to all 4 tracks. It works great, I think this is a real time saver as I previously had to keyframe manually.
But when I go back to my final edit timeline, the leveling is lost. It has not carried through from the first timeline. If I apply leveling to the audio track from the nested timeline in the final edit timeline, it doesn't do a great job, not treating the 4 voices as individuals.
Again, I need to check I'm on the latest version now I learn here that 18.1.1 has fixed some things with it. Also I've not yet tried rendering out the results.
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostWed Dec 14, 2022 11:55 am

ohimbz wrote:Quick question.

Voice Isolation performs wonderful, but it makes live editing a chore, in the sense that it slows down reaction time when editing. It takes time to kick in and it has quite the latency on the program while editing, after 1-2 seconds passed the playback is realtime with no issue but each time you stop and do an edit and play i have to endure again 1-2 seconds of delay

Is this a thing for everybody or just me?


Same for me. A bypass option would be nice.
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Mylonas Films

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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostWed Dec 14, 2022 12:25 pm

Same with everyone cause it’s not a live FX. Just bounce the file, problem solved.


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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostWed Jan 04, 2023 2:10 pm

Updated to 18.2 but issues still remain. Also tried what @Samab6 did above. It seems that the effect is not transferring to the nesting timeline.

Any workarounds?
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostThu Jan 05, 2023 6:43 pm

here something "similar": voice isolation does not work at all, neither in timeline nor on clip, it is just nothing happening. :( also no cracks and pops or anything....
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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostWed Jan 11, 2023 4:28 pm

It is the same for me wirh audio isolation in edit or Fairlight, in a clip or in a track.
Every time after press play there is a 3 Sec. delay and the audio jump from left to right or viceversa.

I found a workaround, left click on the clip, aply voice isolation via properties panel and with right click on the clip choose "cache sound effects"

It works for me until BMD find a solution or i buy the latest an most expensive graphic card.



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Re: Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation Problems

PostThu Jan 12, 2023 8:31 pm

DaVinci/Fairlight/BMD People & Product Manager:

Thank you for conceiving and implementing Dialogue Leveler and Voice Isolation. They are superbly useful tools, even magical.

I look forward to when their settings will be retained (not defaulted as in 18.1.2) when copying and pasting between clips, consistent with EQ and plugin behavior.

To improve usability of "near-realtime" effects while editing, have you tested something like an option to auto-cache (in background without visible shading motion) just enough of the clip ahead of (and/or behind?) a stopped playhead to reduce the play delay?

And of course, if there are hardware choices or settings users can make to accelerate processing of these effects, please let us know.

Thanks again for your brilliant work!

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