Key and Fill

So I can stack BG FG and KEY in the timeline - and create a Fusion clip and patch the KEY to MASK the FG. But now I can't easily reuse the KEY & FILL, or retime it, without stepping into the Fusion (compound) clip.

I can also add the KEY via the Color page (having added the source as a matte and then 'add matte' on the node in Color) - this has the advantage of then being easy to move around the timeline as KEY & FILL over different BG shots. But retiming this way is tricky (if fill and key do not line up).

I take it there is no way to add a 'matte key' effect in the Edit timeline?

No, there is no kind of masking or mattes directly on the Edit page. This would definitely be a useful feature, and I hope they one day implement this by providing a way to directly apply Fusion masks on the Edit page, which could include full support for keying and the like. With the option to then go into Fusion to tweak it or expand it further.

In the meantime, it needs to be done in Fusion or Color as you've already tried.

Can you give an example of what you're trying to re-use? Do you need to use the same matte on multiple different timeline clips or something like that?

Incidentally, it is possible to do Edit page retiming on top of a Fusion Clip or Fusion Composition, or a standard clip with Fusion composition on it ("single-clip composition"). You don't have to do retiming in Fusion, though personally I probably would do it in Fusion as I much prefer the Fusion page for anything requiring precise control.

Can you give an example of what you're trying to re-use? Do you need to use the same matte on multiple different timeline clips or something like that?

Replay wipes (in sport - the bit that goes over the edge wipe between 'live' and 'replay') are classic for using several times down a timeline. Those I can setup in Color then reuse down timeline as it stands - it's less than intuitive but I think fine once you use it.

Some GFX wipe transitions might have multiple fills but a common key (again Color workflow works).

Need to play around with Fusion to see if I can use a fusion comp to be composited (i.e. with alpha) on higher video tracks but I feel like it's not allowed (i.e. Media In can't be 'the tracks below'?)

Need to play around with Fusion to see if I can use a fusion comp to be composited (i.e. with alpha) on higher video tracks but I feel like it's not allowed (i.e. Media In can't be 'the tracks below'?)

Adjustment Clip with a Fusion composition on it. That's exactly what that does - MediaIn1 is all layers below the Adjustment Clip.

The Adjustment Clip composition will only have that single MediaIn, which will see a single image containing a composite of all the video layers under the adjustment clip - the same image that Edit would display for those layers.

If you need to use other media in the composition, it will need to be dragged in from the Media Pool or (if it's a still image or still image sequence, ie not video footage) loaded via a Loader node.

This means that additional media for an Adjustment Clip timeline can't be edited on a timeline. That's fine for standard mattes and the like, but be aware that it's not like a Fusion Clip where you can have multiple layers of timeline media and edit them all on the timeline and then see them all in Fusion.

Personally I hope we will one day have an Adjustment Clip type that sees all layers under the Adjustment Clip as separate MediaIn nodes. This would remove the need for a Fusion Clip, and simultaneously allow all media on any timeline to be manipulated in Fusion. It would effectively create a "Timeline composition", and be really powerful.

Two things to be aware of when using Adjustment Clip compositions:

1. There's an annoying bug related to Adjustment Clips with Fusion compositions and frame numbers. If you drag an Adjustment Clip to a timeline then put a Fusion composition straight on it, the frame numbers will be bizarre, like 108000 or something weird like that.

The workaround and general workflow is as follows:

> Drag an adjustment clip from the Effect Library to any timeline.
> Then drag it from the Timeline into your Media Pool.
> Delete the one on the timeline.
> Now any time you need an Adjustment Clip, drag the one from your Media Pool.
> Now place a Fusion composition on the Adjustment Clip on the timeline (right-click on the Adjustment Clip -> Open In Fusion)
> The frame numbers will now start from 0 on the Fusion composition

Note that if you have an Adjustment Clip composition that you wish to re-use, you can drag that Adjustment Clip from the timeline to your Media Pool, and then if you drag it to any other timeline, it will copy that composition to the timeline. You can also use standard copy and paste to copy the Adjustment Clip, and its composition will copy with it.

2. You may have problems using retiming controls inside Fusion, when the Fusion composition is on an Adjustment Clip. At least I did when I tried it for the first time last week. Using a TimeStretcher node, sometimes I got the right result, and sometimes I got a completely incorrect result, eg displaying frame 150 when it should have displayed frame 50.

I've not yet investigated it further, but my current impression is that retiming may be broken inside Fusion when using an Adjustment Clip.

This would mean that no retiming of Adjustment Clip compositions is possible without nesting the whole timeline, because the Edit page doesn't show Retiming Controls / speed controls on an Adjustment Clip. And of course you can't Compound Clip just the Adjustment Clip, because then it wouldn't see the media below it.

You could however Compound Clip the Adjustment Clip along with all the media under it, and then retime the whole lot.

I've not yet investigated it further, but my current impression is that retiming may be broken inside Fusion when using an Adjustment Clip.

I had another play with this and my initial results are confirmed.

I can't get either TimeStretcher or TimeSpeed to do anything useful on an Adjustment Clip composition.

TimeStretcher sometimes displays just black, or else it displays the last frame of the clip.

TimeSpeed set to 0.1 speed seems like it was working at first, but when scrubbing through it would sometimes display the wrong frame. Eg on frame 669, when it should have been displaying frame 67, it actually showed frame 270. Then after clearing the cache, it started displaying the input frame, and not adjusting the speed at all.

Finally I tried two community Fuses, TimeMachine and ReTimer, and both literally displayed nothing but a black screen. What's interesting is that on some frames they also caused MediaIn1 to display black, rather than the Timeline content. As if the act of trying to retime an Adjustment Clip composition actually causes Fusion to lose its link to the MediaIn, at least on certain frames.

So it seems any kind of Fusion retiming is currently impossible with Adjustment Clips, which is a shame.

There are plugins in Avid that can access layers below separately (eg like having MediaIn 1 through 6 for V1 through V6. Could be a way for fusion comp to go.

I’ve had fun and games with timestretcher - related to comp not starting at 0 *and* fusion not able to access frames outside those in timeline (kind of understandable).

Thanks for your feedback - really helpful in getting my head round Fusion.

Now back in Avid world for next 2.5 weeks - have Resolve on the PC though so may be able to dip into Fusion a bit. Especially if I manage to find some templates I can repurpose.

I’ve had fun and games with timestretcher - related to comp not starting at 0 *and* fusion not able to access frames outside those in timeline (kind of understandable).

Yeah this is a bit of a pain.

The only way that I think works reliably is a bit of a hack:

1. Make the clips in question into a Fusion Clip. A Fusion comp placed on this Clip will always start at frame 0.

2. As you say, Edit won't display anything beyond the end of the clip, and it won't allow extending any timeline-like Clip beyond the length of the media it contains. So we need to artificially increase the length of the clip.

To do that, add some junk media to an unused layer in the Fusion Clip. I'd do this by dragging a Solid Color generator onto an unused layer and extending its length to an hour. Make sure it's an unused layer so there's no chance of it affecting any MediaIn you're accessing in the Fusion comp.

3. Now on Edit this Fusion Clip can be extended to whatever length is required, and in the Fusion comp that's on that Clip you can timestretch into these extra frames using TimeSpeed, TimeStretcher, or the excellent community Fuses TimeMachine and ReTimer.

Just revisited this - things did improve massively in v17 but not entirely intuitive...

FG clip must be above:-
Masking cllip must be above:-
BG clip in timeline

change FG clip to 'foreground'

change Masking/Key/Alpha/Hicon clip to 'alpha' or 'lum' depending if key info is in alpha channel or RGB channels.

- guide