Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

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Josef Pöllmann

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Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSat Oct 28, 2017 8:22 am

Just finished a 30 Minutes video in DaVinci Resolve Studio 14.0.1.008 which caused me a lot of Audio trouble.

Problem 1:

When I change the volume in the audio mixer on the edit-page there is no visible change in the volume of the clip in the timeline and no change in the volume-value in the inspector. It seems as if the mixer has no influence to the volume at all. The interesting thing is, that the volume at the speakers changes although the level-meter shows unchanged volume....
In editing systems I previously used changes in the mixer resulted in placing a key frame in the audio clip in the timeline with changed rubberband-volume-line.
Is this a bug or do I misunderstand something?

Problem 2: (was already discussed elsewhere and is mentioned here as a reminder)

Changing volume by copy and paste-attributes changes the visible volume and the value in the inspector but does not change the effective volume. The change of the volume is realized after an additional click to the volume-line in each clip. This should be corrected as soon as possible.

Problem 3:

Starting from minute 15 of my video adjusting volume didn't work correctly anymore. When I lowered volume in audio-track 1 (atmo) under a voice-over DR increased the volume of track one extremely although it showed correct values in the inspector.
The only way I found to correct this error was to replace the clip in the timeline with an identical copy of the source-video after restarting the complete system.
As said, until minute 15 everything was ok, the problems started after minute 15.
(The source video is Quicktime and the voice-over is a pcm-wav-file - both on the local harddrive)

Any idea if this is a bug or am I doing something wrong?

Thanks

Josef
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Tom Early

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSat Oct 28, 2017 9:41 am

Josef Pöllmann wrote:In editing systems I previously used changes in the mixer resulted in placing a key frame in the audio clip in the timeline with changed rubberband-volume-line.
Is this a bug or do I misunderstand something?


you should read the manual before posting things like this
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Josef Pöllmann

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSat Oct 28, 2017 1:23 pm

@Tom Early: And you think I didn't?

On page 485 of the manual is clearly stated: "Each track's vertical fader can be dragged with your mouse or other pointing device to adjust the volume of that track and perform automation recording. Dragging up increases volume, dragging down decreases volume".

Fact is however, in my case dragging the fader has no influence on any track. No matter which fader of which track I drag.

On the other hand a page before (484) there is the "Note: You cannot record automation in the Edit page..." Does this mean, the Audio mixer is still there although it is not in use anymore? This is very confusing.

Any helpful remarks?

Thanks

Josef
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Jean Claude

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSat Oct 28, 2017 2:20 pm

Josef Pöllmann wrote:@Tom Early: And you think I didn't?

On page 485 of the manual is clearly stated: "Each track's vertical fader can be dragged with your mouse or other pointing device to adjust the volume of that track and perform automation recording. Dragging up increases volume, dragging down decreases volume".

Fact is however, in my case dragging the fader has no influence on any track. No matter which fader of which track I drag.

On the other hand a page before (484) there is the "Note: You cannot record automation in the Edit page..." Does this mean, the Audio mixer is still there although it is not in use anymore? This is very confusing.

Any helpful remarks?

Thanks

Josef


Yes : go to Fairlight Tab.

Page 484 (completely) You can not record automation in the Edit page. Comprehensive mixing controls with full automation are in the Fairlight page.

Everything works well in Fairlight Page.

Edit : in edit tab : you can work with keyframe and volume.
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Josef Pöllmann

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSat Oct 28, 2017 2:40 pm

And more confusion....

As desribed above the faders in the mixer on the edit-page change the output volume although the meters and the volume line in the clip on the timeline show it unchanged.

So better to turn the mixer in the edit-page off, do basic audio in the timeline on the edit-page and the final audio-work in the fairlight-page. (It would be fine to have the possibility to add crossfades on the fairlight-page too.... )

BtW: The manual says there is a way to show the audiometers right to the timeline clicking to the context-menue of the mixer. This works only in single-monitor mode. In my dual-monitor setup I have to return to single-monitor to get the context-menue of the mixer. Then I can turn the meters on and return to the dual-setup. Also kind of funny....

Thanks for clarifying...

Josef
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Jim Simon

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSat Oct 28, 2017 2:57 pm

Problem 1. The meters are annoyingly pre-fader. If BMD offered any kind of Feature Request mechanism, I would point you to it so you could request that the mixer meters on both the Edit and Fairlight pages be converted to work like a real mixer, as post fader.
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Jean Claude

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSat Oct 28, 2017 3:03 pm

edit tab
- you adjust the output level of your entire audio channel and the result is in the control room.

For example :
you have only one audio channel you set the fader to -50db.
You look in the Main 1 (the control room) it's at -50db.
You make a delivery: the sound = -50db.
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Charles Bennett

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSat Oct 28, 2017 5:02 pm

A mixer meters show inputs pre fade.The main outs are usually post fader. Have a look at the meters in Pro Tools for example. This so you can see a signal present when the faders are down as well as the level of the incoming signal. An option to switch between pre and post fader would be the ideal option.
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Jean Claude

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSat Oct 28, 2017 5:32 pm

Hi charles,
Maybe post fader is the fader that can be activated in the control room? (ie Main x) + with the new option in the v14.01 project: audio metering => it makes sense. No ? :)
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Charles Bennett

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSat Oct 28, 2017 10:38 pm

Yes, Jean Claude, Control Room and Main Out should be post fader, which they are.
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Josef Pöllmann

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSun Oct 29, 2017 9:19 am

Having done some more research I found a possible reason to my above mentioned problem 3:

Since DR does not show the numerical change of the volume of an audio clip on the edit page if there are key frames in the audio clip, I cannot prove the following observation:

If I pull down the first part in a clip with key frames it seems as I cross the zero-line and go to minus what DR handles like absolute values and increases the volume again.

If I carefully pull the volume down, DR decreases the volume to a certain point and increases it if I pull farther down.

Again: This is just an observation and not proven by facts. Therefore my question if anybody else has the same observation.

Thanks

Josef
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Jean Claude

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSun Oct 29, 2017 9:32 am

Josef Pöllmann wrote:.../...
Since DR does not show the numerical change of the volume of an audio clip on the edit page if there are key frames in the audio clip, I cannot prove the following observation:
.../...
Josef


Edit tab : open inspector pannel : you can show the numerical change of the volume.
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Charles Bennett

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSun Oct 29, 2017 10:53 am

Josef, I think you are missing some of the principles here. When moving a fader on the mixer in the Edit page you are merely altering the audio output of the track or tracks, not the actual volume of the clip itself. That is why the waveform does not change. To change the volume of the clip itself you need to use the trim function, that is raising or lowering the white line in the clips. Though you cannot record fader automation in the Edit page, you can set up a rough balance while editing and then refine your mix in the Fairlight page. This is exactly the way I would expect the system to work. It is intended that you do your audio work in the Fairlight page. As to the mixer being visible in the Edit page, I have a Mixer icon in the top toolbar when in dual screen mode. Are you not seeing this?

Just to add some context to my posts, recording and mixing audio since 1970, and a Pro Tools user since 1994.
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Josef Pöllmann

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSun Oct 29, 2017 12:14 pm

Thank You Charles and Jean Claude.

Charles, that is exactly the conclusion I came to in my reply above. I am however waiting for more development to the fairlight page by BMC and am sure they're working on that.

Jean Claude, I know. But: If you alter the volume in the edit page in an audio clip without key frames DR shows you in a tooltip the difference of your changes in dB. If there are key frames DR does not show you this value. That is the point why I cannot proof my observation.

Anyway - I corrected my video and published it with proper audio.

Just for your understanding, I am Journalist publishing a TV program. Video editing is for me just neccessary to do my work... And I am by no way an audio specialist... ;)

Thanks again

Josef
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Jean Claude

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSun Oct 29, 2017 2:00 pm

Josef Pöllmann wrote:Jean Claude, I know. But: If you alter the volume in the edit page in an audio clip without key frames DR shows you in a tooltip the difference of your changes in dB. If there are key frames DR does not show you this value. That is the point why I cannot proof my observation.
Josef


Hi Josef,

That's what I do not understand: here I can see everything or we do not talk about the same thing?

TimeLineMovie.gif


(agree that it would be better if the tooltip followed a little closer to the mouse pointer)
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Josef Pöllmann

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSun Oct 29, 2017 3:07 pm

In fact we didn't talk about the same thing.

I referred to manipulating the volume-line in the audio track only.

Image

Didn't think about opening the keyframe editor yet and check there. Thank you for the kick.... :-)

Checking this way it turned out that my observation was wrong what again leaves me with the above described problem nr. 3...

Have a nice rest-sunday.

Josef
Last edited by Josef Pöllmann on Sun Oct 29, 2017 3:16 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Olivier MATHIEU

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Re: Big Audio problems in DR 14 Studio

PostSun Oct 29, 2017 3:11 pm

Hello Joseph, everybody ...
i assume you're new to Davinci Resolve
back in Davinci Resolve 12.5 it has a track mixer AND a clip Mixer ...
The clip Mixer was there to easily adjust the Clips' Volume' that appears in in inspector of the EDIT page.
You can also see the Volume of track in the inspector by clicking en empty space in the track header. But no key framing as the manual mention !!
Hope this help
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