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Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

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Sander de Regt

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Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostWed Jan 21, 2015 10:45 pm

Hi,

my name is Sander de Regt and I have been a Fusion user since 1998 and version 2.5 or something like that. I've used Fusion for personal projects, home videos and created over 700 shots for feature films with it. Relatively simple shots, but still.

You can see some of the things I've done in my showreel:



I still use Fusion and intend to keep using it for years to come.

My question for those of you new to Fusion: what kind of stuff would you like to see covered in video tutorials? There's lots of stuff available, but I'm considering doing some tutorials more or less 'on request'.

I am just a one man shop, so very complicated 3D WPP stuff isn't my specialty, but there are lots of things in Fusion that can be pretty initimidating for new users and I'd like to help.

So let me know what you would like to see and maybe I can create it for you.

Cheers!

Sander de Regt

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Sander de Regt

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Kyriakos Rissakis

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostFri Jan 23, 2015 2:42 pm

I would be interested in:
1. How to project a frame or plate on a mesh via a static camera.
2. How to go about and match motion blur and grade with the background's
in the above case.
Thanks in advance
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Stefan Ihringer

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostFri Jan 23, 2015 4:53 pm

Kyriakos Rissakis wrote:I would be interested in:
1. How to project a frame or plate on a mesh via a static camera.
2. How to go about and match motion blur and grade with the background's
in the above case.
Thanks in advance



Don't want to hijack Sander's call for ideas...
but the answer to 1) is part of a video I once made:


It does more than what you want but the basic steps (connecting footage to a projection camera and using texture projection) will be the same.


@Sander: great initiative!
blog and Fusion stuff: http://comp-fu.com/2012/06/fusion-script-macro-collection/
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Kyriakos Rissakis

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostFri Jan 23, 2015 10:52 pm

No, i am sorry Stefan this is the one i wanted

LOL i spent half an hour trying to find the catcher since i did not know
the CTRL-SPACE magic combo, that's how new i am to this.
You did a great job with this video, though i haben't got it all yet.
Sander do not worry you will have plenty of requests when we noobs
get familiar with the interface and start looking deeper.
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Stefan Ihringer

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostSat Jan 24, 2015 9:07 am

Thanks :D
blog and Fusion stuff: http://comp-fu.com/2012/06/fusion-script-macro-collection/
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Robert Siebert

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostSat Jan 24, 2015 7:25 pm

I would like to see complex Set Extension and combination of CG, Mattepainting and Live Action seamless intergration. Camera Projection, difficult Greenscreen integration.

vimeo com/116984635

Can also be a paid tutorial if it's good.To much :o
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Sander de Regt

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostSun Jan 25, 2015 1:26 pm

@stefan Don't worry about hijacking the thread. I'm sure any help will be appreciated. And your stuff is usually way more advanced than mine anyway, so it's all good.
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John Avenoso

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostSun Jan 25, 2015 7:33 pm

I could use some basic stuff on volume fog and smoke generation.
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Robert Siebert

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostMon Jan 26, 2015 6:04 pm

Sorry, but i would like to see more advanced lessons. There is enough basic stuff for FU, but not any difficult, complex, realism VFX shot solved in a tutorial.

It is easy to play around with some tools and say you can do this and those, but if you have to integrate for ex. volume fog and smoke generation in a real Footage that must have a realism look, this is quit another theme ....
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Sander de Regt

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostWed Jan 28, 2015 11:11 am

Robert,

You're definitely right. But since the fact that there are a lot of new users that don't know how to get footage into Fusion or save from Fusion I'm pretty sure there's a big need for 'getting started' stuff as well.
There will be a lot of people who will download and try Fusion for the first time, that are not VFX experts, who may want to know how to use Fusion for stuff in addition to their everyday routine i.e. editors, or directors or boutique shops.

My goal was to provide very specific answer to very specific questions. Realistic smoke generation is a specialty in itself.

We could also do it in a very hands on way. My demo footage for smoke won't look like your footage for smoke, so will my solution work for you?

Maybe we could do some case studies from the field. Show me a piece of footage. Tell me what you'd like to do with it and I'll try to make it happen. This way it's applicable to your situation 1 on 1.
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Pieter Van Houte

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostThu Jan 29, 2015 6:39 am

Robert Siebert wrote:Sorry, but i would like to see more advanced lessons. There is enough basic stuff for FU, but not any difficult, complex, realism VFX shot solved in a tutorial.

It is easy to play around with some tools and say you can do this and those, but if you have to integrate for ex. volume fog and smoke generation in a real Footage that must have a realism look, this is quit another theme ....


Of course it would be great to see real world examples of hugely complex setups and comps that would be of a level that every major studio would be proud of. I would love to see those as well, sure.

The fact is that creating that kind of work usually has a serious price tag. Artists are often being paid thousands of dollars for work an a single such shot, and studios are obviously very protective of the workflow and intermediate results, meaning that it's impossible to share that work. That is assuming that the artist would even want to share his best recipes. After all, if you spend two decades working hard to learn everything you know - which is your bread and butter - what is the advantage of sharing it with everyone?

There is this notion nowadays that everything should either be free or cost 99 cents (thanks for starting that, Apple). Which I think is a huge problem. People complain about tutorials or books that cost 35 bucks. Or 10. Or 1000. Or sometimes even when it's a mere dollar - it doesn't seem to matter. "Hey man, this is the internet, just give me the stuff already or I'll download it".

It's a real problem. All it does is either lower the quality of what is being offered, or kill it entirely. It's just not worth investing thousands into making the greatest teaching material ever if all that's going to happen is people just stealing it because they can't be arsed to spend a hundred dollars on material to watch on their two thousand dollar gaming rig.

So don't immediately diss the "simple" tutorials, especially when they are kindly being offered. Even the greatest, most complex shots start with, and are built upon, little nifty tricks and workflow tips that people keep sharing every single day.

And lastly, if at some point someone is brave enough to do something absolutely stellar, like sharing a career's worth of insight and knowledge that can actually make you money, please support them. With your money. When that becomes a viable market again, we all benefit.
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Eric Westphal

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostThu Jan 29, 2015 7:24 am

Hey Pieter.

I can't tell you how much I agree. Very well put!

Plus, even if someone would show and explain his stellar work on a particular shot,
one thing we learned over the years is that the brilliant technique
you developed for shot A, B, and C (or even for the entire Feature A)
suddenly doesn't work anymore on shot D (or Feature B),
because the lighting has all changed, or somebody screwed the camera-settings,
or they used a different Film-Stock (man...that's old....:-)),
or maybe there are some new additional wrinkles in the GreenScreen.
(Although KAK deals with that pretty nifty...:-))

So, yeah, the basic tutorials teach you the tricks.
After that it comes down to real-live experience to combine those tricks together
and make your way through the darkest valley of compositing....:-)

Cheers.

Eric.
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John Avenoso

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostThu Jan 29, 2015 5:03 pm

I have to agree, since Fusion went free, many of us newbs are just getting our feet wet. I'm reasonable proficient with Vegas Pro and Mocha Pro, but Fusion is completely new to me. I'm currently using fusion to import shapes and tracking from Mocha and seem to understand what I'm doing when it comes to inserting, masking and tracking. Where I'm really in the dark is using particles to generate effects and using 3D camera's for anything. Some of the tutorials assume we know more than we really do. What would be really nice is downloadable content to support the tutorials (footage / comps). At this point I'm still going back to Hitfilm when I need smoke, fire and lightning.
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Kyriakos Rissakis

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostThu Jan 29, 2015 6:07 pm

To get back to topic how about creating the bump map, using video
as texture and bump map as displace3d image? I mean faking a river
or moving trees or fire on a simple plane? That would be an interesting
and relatively "easy" tutorial.
(i mean for the viewer not the instructor).
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Rony Soussan

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostThu Jan 29, 2015 6:38 pm

I'm going to clean up some demo comps and post them shortly..
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Eric Westphal

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostThu Jan 29, 2015 11:17 pm

Hi Kyriakos.

Your requests have been heard...:-)
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... 92269524D4
should shed some light.

Especially

answers the bump-map question.

Cheers.

Eric.
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Kyriakos Rissakis

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostFri Jan 30, 2015 9:47 pm

No, i actually meant something like water or fire or stone walls with 3d displacement
based on luma or bump map of a footage or photo depending on the case.
Besides i avoid tutorials with text like the plague for some reason.
When i find the time i will try to prepare an example comp with such
effects.
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Kyriakos Rissakis

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostWed Feb 11, 2015 10:23 am

https://www.sendspace.com/file/dnmzxj
In the above comp one tree uses displace by luma and the
other a bumpmap material, but the first looks like crap and
i am not sure the bump map affects the plane at all. So a
tutorial about all these issues would be nice.
Let's say a "Fake 3d via displace and bump maps" tutorial.
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Sander de Regt

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostWed Feb 11, 2015 8:19 pm

The bumpmap does affect the surface, but as far as I know, a bumpmap works by modifying the normals of a material to scatter the light in a way that simulates bumps. Since you have no light source in your setup, the bumpmap effect doesn't show. If you view the shader itself (the example sphere) there's a light source there for demo purposes and you'll see that the bumpmap does show up in that sphere.

I don't know why you feel the displacement looks like crap, but since the source material is really really low resolution, that might have something to do with it.

So you're well on your way to what you want to achieve.
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michael vorberg

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostWed Feb 11, 2015 8:48 pm

Kyriakos Rissakis wrote:No, i actually meant something like water or fire or stone walls with 3d displacement
based on luma or bump map of a footage or photo depending on the case.

you can also look around here:



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ronviers

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostThu Feb 12, 2015 1:07 am

i am looking for techniques to create convincing reflections on 3d surfaces integrated into footage that has no hdr environment. Maybe animating a probe to move across parts of the footage, then using its output to drive whitebalance and gain nodes could do something for diffuse but when it comes to specy stuff i don't have any ideas.

thanks:)
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ronviers

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostThu Feb 12, 2015 2:04 am

i was just thinking about this, probably asked too soon. Using a camera to project another part of the footage and using a probe to drive nodes for color matching would probably work. Is that how experienced compositors do it?
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Kyriakos Rissakis

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostThu Feb 12, 2015 2:54 pm

Sander de Regt wrote:The bumpmap does affect the surface, but as far as I know, a bumpmap works by modifying the normals of a material to scatter the light in a way that simulates bumps. Since you have no light source in your setup, the bumpmap effect doesn't show.

You are right, i confused bump with displacement, which is BTW an inexcusable mistake.
Michael thanks but particles are out of the question, i do not have the proper hardware at the moment.
So let's stick to displacement.Is there an easy way to create a usable displacement or depth map
from footage, nothing fancy maybe what we do with crazybump or insanebump for stills? My mind
is on imitating fire, fluids or even trees affected by wind.
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Win Conway

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostMon Feb 16, 2015 1:01 pm

Pieter Van Houte wrote:
Robert Siebert wrote:Sorry, but i would like to see more advanced lessons. There is enough basic stuff for FU, but not any difficult, complex, realism VFX shot solved in a tutorial.

It is easy to play around with some tools and say you can do this and those, but if you have to integrate for ex. volume fog and smoke generation in a real Footage that must have a realism look, this is quit another theme ....


Of course it would be great to see real world examples of hugely complex setups and comps that would be of a level that every major studio would be proud of. I would love to see those as well, sure.

The fact is that creating that kind of work usually has a serious price tag. Artists are often being paid thousands of dollars for work an a single such shot, and studios are obviously very protective of the workflow and intermediate results, meaning that it's impossible to share that work. That is assuming that the artist would even want to share his best recipes. After all, if you spend two decades working hard to learn everything you know - which is your bread and butter - what is the advantage of sharing it with everyone?

There is this notion nowadays that everything should either be free or cost 99 cents (thanks for starting that, Apple). Which I think is a huge problem. People complain about tutorials or books that cost 35 bucks. Or 10. Or 1000. Or sometimes even when it's a mere dollar - it doesn't seem to matter. "Hey man, this is the internet, just give me the stuff already or I'll download it".

It's a real problem. All it does is either lower the quality of what is being offered, or kill it entirely. It's just not worth investing thousands into making the greatest teaching material ever if all that's going to happen is people just stealing it because they can't be arsed to spend a hundred dollars on material to watch on their two thousand dollar gaming rig.

So don't immediately diss the "simple" tutorials, especially when they are kindly being offered. Even the greatest, most complex shots start with, and are built upon, little nifty tricks and workflow tips that people keep sharing every single day.

And lastly, if at some point someone is brave enough to do something absolutely stellar, like sharing a career's worth of insight and knowledge that can actually make you money, please support them. With your money. When that becomes a viable market again, we all benefit.


Wow, what a terrible way to think, i am so glad that After Effects users have had no issues passing on advanced knowledge, i can see now why Fusion struggled so much over the years if this is the attitude towards sharing advanced techniques "took me years to learn this, you struggle too"
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Pieter Van Houte

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostMon Feb 16, 2015 6:32 pm

Yeah, the Fusion community is known for never sharing anything.

Me, especially. I'm a real bastard.
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Mike Harrington

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostMon Feb 16, 2015 7:44 pm

Krokodove, KAK, hundreds of scripts and macros, hundreds of tutorials

I would wager 90% of Fusion only plugins are free, and all of the community created tutorials..

You just have to dig....this doesn't have the critical mass behind it like AE does.

AE tutorial guys can make a very healthy living making free tutorials and selling you plugins and stock footage.

Guys making fusion ones still have full time composting jobs, and have to squeeze in the time when they can....on top of making free plugins/scripts and answering every little question on a forum they run, from someone who could not be bothered to read the manual.

No one would withhold 'advanced knowledge' if asked...the problem is some people don't even know the question they should be asking....
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Sander de Regt

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostMon Feb 16, 2015 8:09 pm

For some reason this thread is becoming something else than I intended it to. Some very good points are being made though.
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Win Conway

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostMon Feb 16, 2015 9:19 pm

Pieter Van Houte wrote:Yeah, the Fusion community is known for never sharing anything.

Me, especially. I'm a real bastard.


Wow again, so you read what i said took 2+2and made 76, i never said you dont share, i never said Fusion users dont share, i said if that was the attitude in terms of sharing advanced techniques "because it took me years, screw you"
I suspect a lot of that attitude will change if people want to sell tutorials (free should never take any complaints)
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Lucas Pfaff

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostMon Feb 16, 2015 10:05 pm

Win Conway wrote:
Pieter Van Houte wrote:Yeah, the Fusion community is known for never sharing anything.

Me, especially. I'm a real bastard.


Wow again, so you read what i said took 2+2and made 76, i never said you dont share, i never said Fusion users dont share, i said if that was the attitude in terms of sharing advanced techniques "because it took me years, screw you"
I suspect a lot of that attitude will change if people want to sell tutorials (free should never take any complaints)

I think the frustration in the answers comes from the fact that people try to sell you every little effect as a plugin instead of teaching you how to build it yourself (take a step to aescripts, for example) while so much free effects/tools/gizmos/macros are shared among the node based compers
The real advanced tutorials for any software might be needed to pay, at least I never came across really complex high-end tutorials for AE either (VCP aside, that's special). At least not on a fxphd/Gnomon level
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Rony Soussan

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostMon Feb 16, 2015 11:13 pm

Hi guys,

I will be doing a webinar tomorrow morning on moviola.com
It's close to one hour in length, and targeted to new fusion users.
Nothing advanced, a lot of core fusion workflow and UI.
Should be perfect for those new to nodes and Fusion.
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Tommy Campbell

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostTue Feb 17, 2015 2:22 am

Thanks for the heads up Rony. I just registered to watch tomorrow.
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Paulo Barrelas

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Re: Tutorial Request Question for those of you new to Fusion

PostTue Feb 17, 2015 5:14 am

Rony Soussan wrote:Hi guys,

I will be doing a webinar tomorrow morning on moviola.com
It's close to one hour in length, and targeted to new fusion users.
Nothing advanced, a lot of core fusion workflow and UI.
Should be perfect for those new to nodes and Fusion.

Although I'm not completely new to Fusion, I'll try to attend! I like all Fusion related stuff!

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