Blackmagic eGPU

9to5mac test and comparison with upgradable egpu "Review: Blackmagic eGPU for MacBook Pro - is it worth $699?" :

Is this for HD or 4K project?
Waiting for export results for eg 4K 50p projects as this is where TB3 can start to be limiting factor.

One of the interesting mentioned points is about noise. Fact that eGPU is super quite is about pointless as Macbook Pro own fans will most likely kick in and make a lot of noise anyway (and they are far from quite when Mac is used heavily). This yet again reminder that laptops are not workstations.

@Derek, regarding HDR: do you mean the HDMI port?
The eGPU doesn’t have much to do with HDR capability.

Does anyone know how to force 60Hz on the HDMI out?
I have a nice BenQ display that can do UHD and i can only get 30Hz with the BMD eGPU.

Well- are you sure monitor has HDMI 2.0? Most older monitors are based on 1.4 chip, so 30Hz only for UHD on HDMI. DP should give you 60Hz, so what you need is TB3 to DP 1.2 adapter.
If it doesn't work by default it's unlikely to work at all.
Word "nice" is meaningless here. You need model number and check manual for HDMI supported modes.

@Derek, regarding HDR: do you mean the HDMI port?
The eGPU doesn’t have much to do with HDR capability.

On Nvidia's site the go on about how the RX580 supports HDR and opens up a whole new level of experience... well my question is does this mean that if I connect my HDR monitor to the HDMI port of the eGPU, will I be able to edit my Raw footage for HDR?

im thinking to buy Blackmagic egpu for my Macbook Pro 13” (2016) with touchbar. There isnt much information about using it with other software than davinci, premiere, fcp etc. of which almost all are talking about again, and again and again...

Can macbook utilize egpu for browser based applications? For example can safari utilize egpu rather than cpu/igpu? there are lots of browser games (flash or html5), does egpu help at all? when im playing flash based browser game on safari, macbook becomes terrible hot and the battery runs out quickly.

No, that isnt the only reason im buying it, but that came on my mind and i cant find an answer.


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No. This is not the way to go.
You need BM card with HDR support for proper HDR monitoring.
Fact that 580 "supports" HDR is not enough to have proper monitoring out of Resolve.

This. I compare Apple to a tuxedo company vs columbia jackets (PC market). The Columbia Jacket is better overall, keeps you warm, gives you a lot of pockets, looks nice, etc. While the tuxedo doesn’t keep you warm, doesn’t have any pockets, gives less options overall, but dang, does this suit look good! You feel like your James Bond just wearing it, and feels like it was tailed to your body to perfection. People see you and are like “Screw you and your $2000 suit! I got a Columbia Jacket....”

With Apple, your not just buying a computer, your also buying art for people to see. Like a statue on your desk. Thus why assesories try to match up, and blend in.

Well- here is more about the MacBook Pro, specially i9 model:

Sorry, but Apple seems to be so busy with emoji and other crap that they don't have time to properly design hardware anymore.
Looks like same story for 13inch model:

https://www.notebookcheck.com/Test-Appl ... 002.0.html

in German. Here is big discussion with more tests on different models:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/20 ... d.2127869/

Damning reports for both the i9 and i7 with a glimmer of hope, astonishingly, that the i5 paired with the eGPU may be the best performer due to the significant throttling of those processors caused by insufficient cooling in the 13” and 15” MacBook Pro laptops for 2018!

We all know how ‘Pro’ a computer is as it throttles down after only a few seconds of decent performance. Thin is beautiful? What’s beautiful is being able to get your work done! Shame on Apple.

Edit
If the test was using Resolve and CinemaDNG or ProRes media, the throttling may not have occurred quite so rapidly, but I’m skeptical until further testing results are published.

My 2015 iMac 27” constantly throttles and closes down while I’m trying to do work. I can often get around the problem, but it’s worse in the hot summer. I have no plans to buy another computer until I have seen the results doing what I need to do. I don’t need to be beguiled by slick ads and paper specs.

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Answering some of the questions you folks have had in the thread. This is information straight from the FAQ section of the product page.

Too bad it isn't for Windows too.

There are no limitations for the Blackmagic eGPU to work on the Windows platform. However, at the time of writing we believe there are some compatibility issues with the Windows platform, which means that we don't recommend using the Blackmagic eGPU with the Windows platform yet. We expect these limitations to be fixed in future updates from Windows computer vendors.

hello Dear
it Blackmagic eGPU support Mac Pro LATE 2013
PLEASE I NEED ANSWER

The Blackmagic eGPU will work with all Thunderbolt 3 based Apple computers that are running macOS 10.13.6 or later. This includes MacBook Pro computers from the 2016 model year and later, 2017 iMac and iMac Pro.

to BMD : why my post is on post produzione section ? i posted it on resolve forum. so why u move it ?
totally unfair

This is not just for use with Resolve. You can also use it with other applications and thus, this was consolidated.

Would this actually work with a Mac Pro, though (the trashcan model shown in the photos above)? The MacPro only has Thunderbolt 2, and while you can use an adapter to connect to TB3 devices I wonder if the bandwidth of TB2 is high enough to be worthwhile for eGPU applications?

No, the Blackmagic eGPU won't work with Thunderbolt 2 computers as they don't support the speed required for good eGPU performance.

And this could be a key enhancement for professional users for whom $699 x 2 is justified:

“Performance can be greatly improved in DaVinci Resolve Studio by connecting multiple Blackmagic eGPUs, however it’s recommended that you don't daisy chain the Blackmagic eGPUs to each other, but connect each Blackmagic eGPU to the computer directly with its own independent Thunderbolt 3 connection.”

Edit
Didn’t see Joshua also posted this from the FAQ!

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So can I connect this to a Thunderbolt Display using a TB3»TB2 adapter? 

That would be amazing for my situation.

With 2 eGPUs your CPU will start to be bottleneck (specially if i9 is so heavily throttled) and overall cost will be simply huge. Expensive toys

Four questions:

1) Do the 4 USB ports work with the MacBook Pro 15? I have a USB ethernet that does not even light up when plugged in (works plugging directly into MacBook.

2) Is there meant to be any improvement when just moving windows around in OSX on a 4K monitor? That is, I see a little lag and bluring with both no EGPU and EGPU. I do see some activity on the EGPU when I move windows but I can't tell for sure. (and should it only affect the 4K monitor plugged directly into the EGPU)

3) Should HDMI run at 60mhz from the EGPU? I have a dell 3216 4k monitor that has 2.2 installed, yet it only shows 30mhz when I look at switchresx

4) I only get a 5% improvement when encoding with Adobe Premiere Pro. I saw some notes about running a command line utility to tell the EGPU to engage on certain programs. Will that help with Premiere?

Thanks

1. In theory it should work, so sounds like a bug.
2. No idea what you're talking about.
3. It says it's HDMI 2.0, so if monitor also has 2.0 chip then it should work at 60Hz.
4. With Adobe you can't specifically choose GPU, so if you have internal and external I have no idea how Adobe chooses which one to use. 5% is not going to be related to 2nd GPU, but most likely just testing/case error. Other than this- Premiere uses GPU only for specific tasks, so you have to know what to do if you want to measure GPU performance within Premiere.

Do the 4 USB ports work with the MacBook Pro 15? I have a USB ethernet that does not even light up when plugged in (works plugging directly into MacBook.

The USB 3 and Thunderbolt 3 ports on this can be used in the same fashion as a hub. There should be no reason why you couldn't use a USB>Ethernet adapter to connect to the network.

I am considering adding this to my iMac 5k i7 2017 with Radeon 575 pro.

Would Resolve be able to take advantage of both GPU ?

I think it can but need more expert opinion.

Thanks for your assistance.

The ideal combination is the iMac with the same GPU.
If you activate both GPUs, you will be limited to the 4 GB VRAM of the 575.
If you only activate the eGPU, you'll be able to handle larger resolutions, but loose the extra speed.

Thanks Uli

Just purchased it,will report on how it works with IMac.
Cheers,

FYI, I'm getting about 80% speed gain on average for sequences in UHD with not too heavy codecs, a few grading nodes and some heavier effects here and there, like NR.

Just having play with it,there is option for auto switching GPU in Resolve.
Would this be better option rather then manual selection of duel GPU considering they are different GPU.
My IMac reckonise eGPU as RX480.

Thanks Uli.

Make sure your OSX is at correct level. You need 10.13.6+ if I'm correct.

Andrew you are right,it was 10.13.2.

Cheers.

For anyone considering an eGPU, strongly recommend buying a model that does not add "hub ports" and which has a large PSU. Sonnet 650, Sonnet 550 / OWC Helios FX, and a couple others would be a better choice and better long-term investment than this BMD device.

Don't get me wrong: I'm glad BMD is in the market and taking this tech seriously but bluntly this is design flies in the face of what an eGPU is supposed to be and ignores the main benefit it it supposed to provide over time (i.e. the customer's ability to upgrade their GPU in order to continue using their existing computer and software setup).

If they were going to do this they should've at least started with the Vega RX 56 as the GPU, not the RX 580. It's a card that performs much better than the RX 580 and is not that much more expensive. My advice is to steer clear of this product until they rev it with a more robust card and/or make it upgradeable.

I agree it’s much more desirable for the consumer if a manufacturer designs a product with upgradable or replacement components. It could be a feature of the device that sets it apart from the competition and really future proofs the device at least through the next generation. I don’t know if BMD has ever considered this approach.

It seems that there products are usually priced low enough with simpler designs that when they reach the end of their usefulness, it’s cheaper for the consumer to just buy the next great thing in a few years rather than pay upfront for the additional design required to support future upgradeability that may well prove to be unfeasible.

It seems a shame not to do what you suggest, but at least the chassis is highly recyclable.


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On a related (but slightly different) note, is there a way to do HDMI or usb-c monitor pass-through for earlier MacBooks? I am using a 2018 MBP with the eGPU, with two monitors attached to the eGPU (one to HDMI, one via Thunderbolt-to-DVI). This configuration works, however there are a few times I will need to attach a 2015 Macbook 12" to the monitors, and while I know the primary eGPU functionality is not supported, if at all possible I'd like to figure out a way to do some sort of video pass-through to at least one of the monitors via the eGPU connection (using it effectively as a temporary docking/charging station). I would prefer not to have to unplug one of the monitors (and keyboard/mouse) from the eGPU and plug it into the Macbook 12" 2015 every time I need to use it for a few hours.

Thanks!

Answering some of the questions you folks have had in the thread. This is information straight from the FAQ section of the product page.

hello Dear
it Blackmagic eGPU support Mac Pro LATE 2013
PLEASE I NEED ANSWER

The Blackmagic eGPU will work with all Thunderbolt 3 based Apple computers that are running macOS 10.13.6 or later. This includes MacBook Pro computers from the 2016 model year and later, 2017 iMac and iMac Pro.

Would this actually work with a Mac Pro, though (the trashcan model shown in the photos above)? The MacPro only has Thunderbolt 2, and while you can use an adapter to connect to TB3 devices I wonder if the bandwidth of TB2 is high enough to be worthwhile for eGPU applications?

No, the Blackmagic eGPU won't work with Thunderbolt 2 computers as they don't support the speed required for good eGPU performance.

Can I use this new product with a mid 2015 MacBook Pro which only has Thunderbolt 2? And if so, will it provide significant improvement. I'm finding that Resolve 15 is struggling on this laptop, especially when using Fusion.

Any input would be gratefully received.

Thanks!
Andrew Neighbour

Read FAQ provided by BM. Answer is there.

Why in god's name would anyone buy this thing? Thunderbolt 3 only has enough bandwidth for 4 pci lanes. Any modern GPU uses 16. Add to it that it's a pretty weak gpu to begin with and you have an almost pointless effort. Since apple switched over to the magic trashcan form factor - another stroke of unexpandable lunacy, it's virtually impossible to make a mac of any sort even remotely competitive with a Windows based machine, money be dammed. Heck, on a Threadripper based machine, you can put in 2 1080ti's running on 16 lanes each and a THIRD still running on 8 lanes. The only downside is Windows 10. But it's no longer terrible.

It's incredible how slow macs are to work on. They're a complete joke. Even in laptop world. The more projects you can do, the more $$ you make.

You all do understand how restrictive Thunderbolt 3 is, right?

GPUs not always need x16 PCI-E. x4 is far from ideal case, but in case of Resolve you definitely won't hit problems for HD projects. When you move to 4K+ then at some point you will hit TB3 bandwidth bottleneck.
It really depends on Resolve internal design when you will hot problems. If it passes 32bit float data in all cases then it will be around 4K 30p data.

Whole debate about real values of eGPU with MacBooks Pro is another matter

The eGPU in my tests performed exactly as well as the identical one inside my iMac, so there is no bottleneck with TB-3. It would not be a great idea, though, to loop a 4K movie on the screen attached to it's HMDI while rendering. Or to have fast drives attached to all USB ports and the second USB-C and be using all of them at the same time.

Much faster GPUs might experience some bottlenecks, but that applies to all the eGFX boxes out there. I second the notion that Apple has no real 'pro' machine at this time and that you can build a much faster PC for less. Who could deny that?

But if you want to work with MacOS, IMHO the eGPU is a viable solution. Both the combination of an iMac (non Pro) with it's excellent screen and the same Radeon Pro 580 inside it, or to be on the road or on location with a MBP 13". There's a reason why the eGPU is sturdy and it's definitely lighter than a desktop machine.

OTOH, it wouldn't make much sense to attach any eGFX to a desktop PC, it's true you'll be better off with 2-3 internal cards.

There won't be bottleneck until you pass some "magic" number.
Try exporting 4K at 50/60p from 1 node simple project (from and to fast codec eg. ProResLT) and then you most likely will hit it.

Data have to come back from GPU back to CPU for export, so depending on frame size/frame rate and in what format it travels back you will hit at some point 3.5GBytes/sec which is about what TB3 data link can do. If Resolve sends from GPU to CPU 32bit float RGB data then this will happen at around 4K 30p. If Resolve pre-converts data to pixel format good for export codec (eg. v210 for ProResLT) then this will be more like 4K at 150fps (or equivalent).

I'm sure there is a bottleneck you could provoke.
But who is buying such a device if he/she has only very light grades? You'd probably consider it for heavier effects, like NR, and then it has to do some serious crunching before sending the image back.

Bottleneck is on the data transfer, not GPU internal processing (processing is not affected). These are 2 separate things.
As I said- even when you have simplest node you will hit bottleneck for bigger frame sizes/fps. This will not happen with "internal" GPU and this is main TB3 "problem".

This also may be the reason why Apple disabled use of eGPU for export in FCPX.

eGPU definitely will help in many cases, but for quite high price though.

Why in god's name would anyone buy this thing?

if you want to work with MacOS, IMHO the eGPU is a viable solution. Both the combination of an iMac (non Pro) with it's excellent screen and the same Radeon Pro 580 inside it, or to be on the road or on location with a MBP 13".

Asked and answered IMO.

jPo, CSI

And the price is a question of sober calculation for any pro. This unit is plug-and-play, no fiddling with an empty box, getting the right adapters and cables and hunting down a fast card while all the cryptominers are hunting too. Plus fiddling with drivers if you want to have Nvidia, sometimes the latest one is not working well with Resolve and you have to try older ones. Plus, every system update will cause another round of that.
How much you loose with unpaid work in one hour? What about a cheap box having problems with connections or some components? I'm sure vendors will resort to the usual mantra: "but you didn't buy the box from us, only the card" and vice versa.

If you can't expect to make that thing pay for itself in one or two gigs, don't buy it!

Only 700$

When you're comparing buying an eGPU so you can run Resolve on your existing computer vs. spending $3,000 or more on a new MacBook Pro (that still wouldn't be able to run Resolve very well, even the new models released today), or spending $6,000 or $7,000 on an iMac Pro that will run it with no problems, $700 seems like not much money.

Everything is relative.

+100
#WowJustWOW.
Brad, I believe you've *nailed* it -- and in such a pithy style, the eGPU's disappointing lack of upgradeability from its now-not-so-formidable RX580 GPU card, notwithstanding.

I just wish I could add an eGPU to our humble Thunderbolt 2 equipped, 27-inch, non-Retina, late 20123 iMac Core i5 Quad w/32GB RAM and add to that setup, an AKAI APC 40 Resolve Edition surface controller.

But WAIT.
What alternative to eGPU exists, that's upgradeable yet silent-running, and works with TB2 on Macs and on PCs?

[i7]Edited to reflect the fact the iMac 27" here does only Thunderbolt 2 here.[/i]

[Re]Peter

ResolveStudio 14.3...014 | MiniMonitor | DTV 10.9.7 | Win8.1 x64 | ROG G751JL, 2.8GHz Intel i7HQ, 24GB DDR4, 1TB HD, 500GB EVO 850, 2GB GTX965M | Mackie MCU Pro | Softube Console 1 Mkii | Shuttle Pro 2

Are you sure your 2012 iMac has Thunderbolt 3? I doubt that.

Me too, my late 2013 IMac 27 does not have Thunderbolt 3. Me thinks he has his Thunderbolt versions backwards.

Thunderbolt 1 just came out in 2011, but not available on IMacs until 2012. T2 became available in Late 2013 on the MacBook Pro in October. T3 (USB/C) became available in 2016 and was not included on an IMac until 2017. Somit would not be possible for a 2012 IMac to have Thunderbolt 2, let alone Thunderbolt 3.
Cheers

Apple posted a list of which models (desktop and laptop) can be used with eGPUs earlier this year when they added official eGPU support to MacOS: https://support.apple.com/en-ca/HT208544

To cut to the chase: "eGPUs are supported on any Thunderbolt 3-equipped Mac: MacBook Pro notebooks released in 2016 and newer,1 iMac computers introduced in 2017 and newer, and iMac Pro. Your Mac must also have macOS High Sierra 10.13.4 or later installed."

Edited to add the footnotes: . If you're using a 13-inch MacBook Pro from 2016 or newer, always plug eGPUs and other high-performance devices into the left-hand ports for maximum data throughput.

2. For optimal performance, eGPUs should be connected directly to your Mac and not daisy-chained through another Thunderbolt device or hub.

And while TB-2 can be hacked to use an eGFX, it's a waste of time.

And while TB-2 can be hacked to use an eGFX, it's a waste of time.

Thanks all for the needed wake-up call to reality: My Apple computers all suck eggs.
[Re]Pete

ResolveStudio 14.3...014 | MiniMonitor | DTV 10.9.7 | Win8.1 x64 | ROG G751JL, 2.8GHz Intel i7HQ, 24GB DDR4, 1TB HD, 500GB EVO 850, 2GB GTX965M | Mackie MCU Pro | Softube Console 1 Mkii | Shuttle Pro 2

Me too, my late 2013 IMac 27 does not have Thunderbolt 3. Me thinks he has his Thunderbolt versions backwards.

Thunderbolt 1 just came out in 2011, but not available on IMacs until 2012. T2 became available in Late 2013 on the MacBook Pro in October. T3 (USB/C) became available in 2016 and was not included on an IMac until 2017. Somit would not be possible for a 2012 IMac to have Thunderbolt 2, let alone Thunderbolt 3.
Cheers

I have Late 2013 iMac for certain as well. Still not suitable for that quirky unupgradable, but stately and silent-running eGPU.
[Re]Pete

ResolveStudio 14.3...014 | MiniMonitor | DTV 10.9.7 | Win8.1 x64 | ROG G751JL, 2.8GHz Intel i7HQ, 24GB DDR4, 1TB HD, 500GB EVO 850, 2GB GTX965M | Mackie MCU Pro | Softube Console 1 Mkii | Shuttle Pro 2

Are you sure your 2012 iMac has Thunderbolt 3? I doubt that.

I'm now sure it does *not* sport TB3.

ResolveStudio 14.3...014 | MiniMonitor | DTV 10.9.7 | Win8.1 x64 | ROG G751JL, 2.8GHz Intel i7HQ, 24GB DDR4, 1TB HD, 500GB EVO 850, 2GB GTX965M | Mackie MCU Pro | Softube Console 1 Mkii | Shuttle Pro 2

Silent running is nice, but....your Mac will be loud anyway when used heavily
Besides- eGPU doesn't need to be on your desk, next to your face.

Silent running is nice, but....your Mac will be loud anyway when used heavily
Besides- eGPU doesn't need to be on your desk, next to your face.

...Exactly right, Andrew, unless of course I needed the additional heat on my face while in the edit suite on a cold winter's night.️ [Shivers]

ResolveStudio 14.3...014 | MiniMonitor | DTV 10.9.7 | Win8.1 x64 | ROG G751JL, 2.8GHz Intel i7HQ, 24GB DDR4, 1TB HD, 500GB EVO 850, 2GB GTX965M | Mackie MCU Pro | Softube Console 1 Mkii | Shuttle Pro 2

And while TB-2 can be hacked to use an eGFX, it's a waste of time.

Do you think the Blackmagic eGPU could be "hacked" as you described (or rather some driver could be loaded or setting changed) to just enable the same USB-C port functionality that is provided by a standard Apple USB-C Digital AV Multiport Adapter?

This is to address my earlier question ( #p426886 ) for use with a secondary Macbook with USB-C to be able to access the keyboard and at least one of the attached screens (HDMI or USB-C-with-a-USBC-to-HDMI-cable) without unplugging everything.

Per the FAQ I don't want to access the eGPU functionality - rather I want to (effectively) leverage the hub functionality.....

Thanks!

There must be cheaper solutions for that. Just ask the question in the forum at egpu.io, they should know.
I know there are USB-C to Display Port adapters for less than 50 bucks.