The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

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Hendrik Proosa

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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 03, 2020 8:58 am

JMatic wrote:Everybody is talking that new M1x chips will have 12 cores, but CPU is not a problem for resolve on these M1 MBPs. It is GPU that is under performing and I don't think that apple can vastly improve there?
Any chance resolve will in the future utilize even more those M1 cores so GPU wont be that much of an issue? Or do I just buy new Ryzen CPU?
Thnx.

Only Apple knows this. Reason why gpus are so performant is not due to their superpowered cores or whatnot but simple instruction set combined with massive hardware level parallelism. What is interesting is if and how the reduced instruction set cpu and gpu would converge. It wouldn't actually be surprising if hardware logic is simplified and leveraged with parallelism instead, so all the antics for which most of cpu hardware is actually used is discarded and it just brute-forces through. Somewhat similar to how all the tricks render engines did became kind of obsolete with rise of hardware performance and brute-force pathtracing became feasible, simplifying both render logic and shaders.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 03, 2020 12:01 pm

JMatic wrote:Ok, did some tests myself to see all this hype. Got myself MBP 13 M1 8GB.

Second.. M1 MPB IS GREAT.

BUT....
problem starts when you apply more nodes, NR, grain.... then GPU just fall apart and cannot handle it.

My plan was to wait for new iMacs (PRO or not) with those M chips.. but I have doubts regarding GPU power.


Thanks, this is why there's a need for analysis that talks about more than playback and export.

I think that Apple's decision to go 100% with ARM means that it knows how to make ARM computers that have strong GPU performance. Not being an Apple hardware engineer, I have no idea how they're going to do it, but I think that we're going to see that in the higher-end Macs that are coming. If you think about Apple's last few June events, and what it has been doing in the last few years, it isn't likely that it's going to suddenly cede graphics performance to its competitors.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 03, 2020 12:06 pm

So, this youtube.com/watch?v=y_jw38QD5qY seems to show that we get a nice machine in the Apple M1 if you need to do basic tasks on the road without access to mains power. If you can plug it in, a PC laptop with the 2060 beats it.
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The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 03, 2020 12:21 pm

Those are entry level machines.... mbp 16, iMacs and next Mac mini will have better GPU for sure!
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 03, 2020 12:24 pm

Uli Plank wrote:So, this youtube.com/watch?v=y_jw38QD5qY seems to show that we get a nice machine in the Apple M1 if you need to do basic tasks on the road without access to mains power. If you can plug it in, a PC laptop with the 2060 beats it.



every computer with a dedicated GPU will beat the M1,
because the apple statement is so much faster than . . . affects the intel iris unit.

and the missing control for external GPU and eGPU is also the horsefoot of the M1
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 03, 2020 1:52 pm

Mark Foster wrote:
Uli Plank wrote:So, this youtube.com/watch?v=y_jw38QD5qY seems to show that we get a nice machine in the Apple M1 if you need to do basic tasks on the road without access to mains power. If you can plug it in, a PC laptop with the 2060 beats it.



every computer with a dedicated GPU will beat the M1,
because the apple statement is so much faster than . . . affects the intel iris unit.

and the missing control for external GPU and eGPU is also the horsefoot of the M1


Beat it on what?

In the video that Uli linked, Max Yuryev compares the M1 MacBook Pro and an Asus Zephyrus Gaming laptop. He says that the Asus has inferior resolution (the one he used is 1080p, although it's available for more money at 1440p) and poor colour accuracy, contrast and brightness range. It can't give 100% of its potential performance, including on graphics, unless it's plugged in. This kinda undermines one of the fundamental reasons why people purchase laptops. It weighs 272g/9.6oz more than the MacBook. On build quality, Tom's Hardware, which highly recommends the Zephyrus for laptop gaming, says that the keyboard is "shoddy". Max says that the trackpad is "terrible". Depending on configuration, it costs as much as US$2,000.

If there's a laptop with the Zephyrus's AMD CPU/Nvidia GPU specs that someone might actually purchase for video or photo editing, and that can deliver on those specs without being plugged in, Max apparently couldn't identify it.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 03, 2020 2:52 pm

Rob, not quite sure what you are trying to achieve with this thread. You summed up these M1 products in your first few posts. You were correct. They are not powerful enough for some peoples needs. Was that a surprise? They are the lowest priced Mac's if they did everything Apple would have nothing else to sell. You keep disagreeing with almost everyone who provides an input. The whole point of a forum is to get other peoples view or help. Not everyone has the same point of view. That's OK.

Back to the topic, I think . Structurally the M1 products are lovely, light and low power I absolutely agree but do not confuse these attributes with cost and performance because on those there are other alternatives. In particular a more powerful GPU becomes essential for some tasks. If performance is more important then the inconveniences of size and weight needs to be accepted until there is a solution that meets all.

Of the three M1 products I still feel the Air is the best solution. Other than a fan they all are essentially identical at their core. It only falls short when under heavy load compared to the other two, because it does not have a fan and I know is short of a core. Can still use an external monitor and keyboard and if travelling can do some work on the plane etc not possible with the Mini. As a home based product the M1 Mini as you have said just is not powerful enough for some applications. That may change if it could use an eGPU. Will have to see what the future holds.

From a technology perspective it will be interesting to see the chip progress. Of interest AMD also hold an ARM license .
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 03, 2020 3:48 pm

Speaking of AMD their future in apple seems dark. they will probably develop an armed base GPU and maybe even an all-encompassing product that could include like Apple with GPU, CPU and RAM ram making the card the computer. Thus maybe we'll just need a case and some SSD drives. making for a true modular computer.

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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 03, 2020 4:43 pm

ricardo marty wrote:Speaking of AMD their future in apple seems dark. they will probably develop an armed base GPU and maybe even an all-encompassing product that could include like Apple with GPU, CPU and RAM ram making the card the computer. Thus maybe we'll just need a case and some SSD drives. making for a true modular computer.


Yes, it's going to be interesting to see who competes and how long it takes to happen.

I think that this is as much about Apple Silicon (Apple's System on a Chip) as it is about the ARM Instruction Set. Apple has been working on this for over a decade, having started down this road with the first iPad in 2010. Microsoft's ARM effort with the Surface resulted in a US$900 million write-down. Samsung also ran into difficulty. As far as I know, nobody has anything close to Apple's experience with a Silicon SOC/ARM architecture, which it has employed in its phones, tablets, watches and now computers for years.

Meanwhile, the ARM landscape is unclear. In September, U.S.-based Nvidia purchased Arm Holdings from Softbank. One might conclude that that gives Nvidia a significant advantage, but it isn't that simple. Apple passed on buying ARM, no doubt in part due to competition policy/antitrust concerns, and is going ahead with its Silicon System On a Chip anyway. It doesn't appear to be very concerned. It doesn't use ARM-designed chips. It designs its own SOC in part from the ARM Instruction Set. The Instruction Set is not a chip design.

Nvidia/Arm say that regulatory approval will take about 18 months. Given the number of jurisdictions involved, not least China, this may be optimistic. Approval, if granted, will undoubtedly include terms designed to preserve market competition. One of the founders of ARM, Hermann Hauser, is dead opposed to the purchase altogether, and is being vocal about it. He wants the U.K. Government to block the merger.

Who knows where AMD and Intel fit into this picture.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 03, 2020 6:06 pm

ricardo marty wrote:Speaking of AMD....they will probably develop an armed base GPU and maybe even an all-encompassing product that could include like Apple with GPU, CPU and RAM ram making the card the computer.


Unless AMD is planning on getting into the computer manufacturing business there are a lot of barriers for AMD (or Intel) to do something like this, the main one being that they do not have full vertical control the way that Apple does (control of OS/software and hardware). The article I linked in a previous post discusses all of this. This would not be impossible for AMD/Intel to do, but it would be very difficult. Look at all of the compatibility difficulties that Microsoft has had with its ARM version of Window as a slightly different example of this problem.

Here's the link again (it's worth reading): https://erik-engheim.medium.com/why-is- ... 62b158cba2 (see the section titled Why Don’t Intel and AMD Copy This Strategy?)

robedge wrote:
ricardo marty wrote:One might conclude that that gives Nvidia a significant advantage, but it isn't that simple...


I doubt that this will have any impact on Apple's ARM licenses.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 03, 2020 9:14 pm

An interesting read but a few corrections I think. The Ryzen Zen3 clock is around 3.7 with boost to 4.7 (usually 1 core) and only some over clockers have managed to get the Ryzen 9 5950 to 5.0G to match Intel. To my knowledge from tests all the Zen 3 5000 series Ryzen will beat the M1 products in multithreaded performance by 3 times. The Ryzen 9 5900 and 5960 beat the M1 in single core too. So not just a little. Maybe why this rumour https://technosports.co.in/2020/11/13/a ... e-totally/ Clearly false but interesting anyway.

I think its wishful thinking to believe there will not be an industry response. Both X-Box and Sony PS5 are integrated products using AMD Soc parts. Actually Zen2 cpu too. Very fast and cheaper than the M1 products for complex games the M1 products could not attempt. Similar integration of fast NVME drives. In the case of the PS5 even a 4K Bluray drive which can play movies on the TV. These have all the pieces to make a Windows equivalent to the Mini at $200 less. I accept it will draw more power etc. PS5 has essentially a standard AMD part, there are variants in lots of Windows laptops and desktops, 16G RAM and a 825G NVME drive.

The advantage the M1 products have is they are small, low power and weigh less than mains powered products. Excellent. If Apple really dropped the price they would cleanup. But I do not think that is going to happen. So for those people where cost and performance is the priority there are other alternative products.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 03, 2020 11:04 pm

You forgotten about OSX. I'm happy to pay 100$ extra to have it instead of Windows.
Windows 10 still feels like: "Microsoft doesn't really know what to do with it".
Problem with PCs are not the components, but lack of a single company which would put them nicely in to good/polished product. All brands have tens of models (not idea what for) instead of focusing on few, but well done ones. Again- Apple doesn't do anything amazing, but somehow rest can't figure it out.

Current Apple pricing (specially for Air) is not anymore that unrealistic. You get solid product where every component is decent- not a mixture of randomly chosen (so different in quality) components badly put together.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostFri Dec 04, 2020 3:14 am

9.5 % of people agree with you Andrew and 87.6% of people are happy with Windows. Same goes for phones 86% Android , 14% iOS. So I think the majority of people like the big choice. I choose Windows for one reason. I like making my own PC's and have done so since 1982. That way I can choose everything about the hardware I want. There isn't a lot of choice in OS if you make your own ( at least legally ) I might have used Apple software if it was legally available since my priority was hardware choice first. Since I started early with DOS and Windows lots of the software I used was in this format. I have just continued. To date I have seen no reason to change. My PC's are cheaper to build than buy and are more powerful than most Mac's. Early editing software was Premiere and Vegas. I have continued with Vegas but not Premiere when they introduced the subscription they lost me. Still have CS6 Suite though. As you know Andrew from your EDIUS days I also use EDIUS. For the last couple of years I have been starting to use Resolve and this is my first opportunity to move between PC and Mac if I need to with the same software. Maybe why you see my preference for the Air as it would complement what I have in desktop PC hardware when using Resolve and would give me a very good and very competitive laptop.

When choice is involved there is the opportunity to really mess things up. You can see that in the response to Covid in various parts of the world. However that is what most people want and there are consequences.

I appreciate the integrated architecture of the M1 Soc from a hardware interest. Much like I think the same about the PS5 or X Box. They really are not that different and show what things will happen in the future. I think we will see some real interesting things to come.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostFri Dec 04, 2020 5:10 am

robedge wrote:If there's a laptop with the Zephyrus's AMD CPU/Nvidia GPU specs that someone might actually purchase for video or photo editing, and that can deliver on those specs without being plugged in, Max apparently couldn't identify it.


It was my impression that Max wanted to stay in a similar price range. If you spend more, you may get a better screen, or keyboard, or trackpad. But then Apple's prices don't seem to be that luxurious anymore, right?

Before I decided to get a Mac mini that I could use with my eGPU but also being mobile last year, I seriously looked into other options. I'm not a big fan of Windows (nevertheless have to use it regularly), but I tried different laptops with better GPUs. None of them was performing well without mains power. They all get throttled massively, obviously because they'd suck your battery empty before the plane you are sitting in has become airborne. In the end, I said to myself: if I need mains anyway, I'll get that mini. I have enough keyboards, screens and mice, and a tablet for checking footage and taking notes on the move. Very soon that mini will get retired, the eGPU stays connected to the iMac and I'll get a new laptop. You can guess the brand.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostFri Dec 04, 2020 10:03 am

SkierEvans wrote:9.5 % of people agree with you Andrew and 87.6% of people are happy with Windows. Same goes for phones 86% Android , 14% iOS. So I think the majority of people like the big choice. I choose Windows for one reason. I like making my own PC's and have done so since 1982. That way I can choose everything about the hardware I want. There isn't a lot of choice in OS if you make your own ( at least legally ) I might have used Apple software if it was legally available since my priority was hardware choice first. Since I started early with DOS and Windows lots of the software I used was in this format. I have just continued. To date I have seen no reason to change. My PC's are cheaper to build than buy and are more powerful than most Mac's. Early editing software was Premiere and Vegas. I have continued with Vegas but not Premiere when they introduced the subscription they lost me. Still have CS6 Suite though. As you know Andrew from your EDIUS days I also use EDIUS. For the last couple of years I have been starting to use Resolve and this is my first opportunity to move between PC and Mac if I need to with the same software. Maybe why you see my preference for the Air as it would complement what I have in desktop PC hardware when using Resolve and would give me a very good and very competitive laptop.

When choice is involved there is the opportunity to really mess things up. You can see that in the response to Covid in various parts of the world. However that is what most people want and there are consequences.

I appreciate the integrated architecture of the M1 Soc from a hardware interest. Much like I think the same about the PS5 or X Box. They really are not that different and show what things will happen in the future. I think we will see some real interesting things to come.


We got to the same point. One doesn’t rule them all and depending on your needs you can use what suits you the best. This is exactly the point - macmini is an internet machine not a workstation. Guess how many macs we use at work? I’m not a fanboy who is going to waste money and try to run transcoding clusters on macs.
I’m talking about Mac for home. If I can afford Mac I will still choose it over Win. Those % are due to pricing. Worldwide many can’t simply afford macs. In richer countries this % is different. In USA ratio is just 2:1, so for each Mac there are 2 Win users.
Think how useful could be Edius on M1 :D
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostFri Dec 04, 2020 2:52 pm

Yes in principle I agree Andrew. I found this site that has all the shares. Interesting site. https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-sh ... /worldwide This chart is interesting too. https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share I had original found this one https://www.statista.com/statistics/576 ... are-apple/
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostFri Dec 04, 2020 3:05 pm

Uli Plank wrote:Very soon that mini will get retired, the eGPU stays connected to the iMac and I'll get a new laptop. You can guess the brand.


There's plausible speculation about a 16" MacBook Pro in the next six months that would offer more memory, stronger processing and graphics performance, and more ports than the M1s. If it happens, it's a possible successor to my own mini and external graphics card. One of the reasons that I stopped using laptops was battery life and the constant nuisance of managing power. The power efficiency of these Silicon laptops could draw me back into the fold.


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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostFri Dec 04, 2020 4:19 pm

Steve Martin and Mark Spencer, whose Ripple Training offers courses in Final Cut Pro and DaVinci Resolve, are doing a live stream today at 11 a.m. Pacific/2 p.m. Eastern/7 p.m. GMT. The list of topics includes M1 Macs.


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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostFri Dec 04, 2020 7:52 pm

Further to the above post...

Mark Spencer has posted a video to Ripple Training’s YouTube channel that tests an 8GB RAM M1 13” MacBook Pro against his 32GB RAM 2019 16” MacBook Pro. He’s currently in Belize, hence the beach; cool that he was able to get his hands on an M1. For the tests, he uses Final Cut Pro and Motion, the latter from 07:20.

As shown at 07:05, his 16" MacBook sells for US$3300. The version of the 13" M1 MacBook that he uses in the video (8GB RAM, 1TB SSD) costs $1700.


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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSun Dec 06, 2020 12:51 pm

Steve Fishwick wrote:Intel's projected Alder Lake 12th Gen processor, if it ever sees the light of day, is a similar


Intel's future is bleaker than most people realize (the result of terrible mismanagement imo): (1) manufacturing problems and delays of next generation products, (2) other chip manufacturers moving ahead of them (AMD etc), (3) contemplating outsourcing their chip manufacturing overseas (to companies that have surpassed them technologically in the manufacturing process). That last one is unprecedented for a company that was the leader in processor manufacturing in the world. Now they can barely get out their new products. TSMC is killing them.

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Andrew Kolakowski wrote:You forgotten about OSX. I'm happy to pay 100$ extra to have it instead of Windows.


Same, but they both have their strengths/weakness. I manage a tv studio and a multimedia lab. The computers that we have in the studio are performing tasks that can be done by cheap PCs and it would make no sense to get Macs for this. I prefer macOS, so the lab has mac pros and iMacs. So as you mentioned Andrew, price is a huge factor when choosing between the two.

SkierEvans wrote:9.5 % of people agree with you Andrew and 87.6% of people are happy with Windows.


Those market share numbers are a reflection of a lot of different factors, not just the relative superiority or weakness of one platform or another: e.g., different business models, price, and the fact that most people prefer what they are familiar with (ie. you with DOS/Windows). If you look simply beyond price and personal preferences, sometimes Windows PCs are better (hobbyists, gaming, live streaming, pc only applications), and sometimes Macs are (subjective, but I prefer macOS). Why does the choice between the two have to be mutually exclusive? Why not both?

Anywho, the M1x Macbook pro is going to be a killer.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSun Dec 06, 2020 2:10 pm

Carlos Garcia-Diaz wrote:
.... If you look simply beyond price and personal preferences, sometimes Windows PCs are better (hobbyists, gaming, live streaming, pc only applications), and sometimes Macs are (subjective, but I prefer macOS). Why does the choice between the two have to be mutually exclusive? Why not both?

Anywho, the M1x Macbook pro is going to be a killer.



Total agree. I know Mac users are sensitive about anyone criticizing a Mac but I think that also applies to Windows users. One size does not fit all. Personal choice plays a bit part but that should not be confused with hard facts. Intel I think are in trouble but I am sure they are big enough to fight back. We should not ignore Google either as they are reputed to be also working on their own silicon for phones and Chrome books. That may be Apples biggest challenge in the future as Chrome books may be the competition for the M1 Air for day to day use and also the iPad in the future.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 10, 2020 11:12 am

Adobe has announced that Lightroom is now a native M1 application. Lightroom Classic, Photoshop and Camera Raw to come: https://blog.adobe.com/en/2020/12/08/de ... #gs.npgcyq
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 10, 2020 3:05 pm

My 2 cents here is that if we're just talking about Resolve and the M1 computers, and assuming that the branch of Resolve 17.1 beta and its future lineage is coded efficiently to use the M1 RISC architecture, then this branch and version of Resolve will be as performant, if not better, than Resolve on a PC with a dedicated GPU. How BMD approaches this will be more interesting here because the cost, portability, and low power of M1 computers will become the ideal companion for a dedicated NLE/Color Grading system for the individual home and mobile users of DVR. Note: I said home and mobile users because there will still be the need for ultra fast PC workstations in production houses.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostThu Dec 10, 2020 10:58 pm

There are PC options which are somehow portable, yet fairly powerful (different league than Mac mini), but they cost adequately:
https://www.engadget.com/intel-nuc-9-ex ... n_0RCfLrz8

"At this point the NUC 9 Extreme might sound too good to be true. It's fast and almost as flexible as a normal desktop. But there's a downside, and it's a big one: It'll cost you dearly. The high-end Core i9 kit we reviewed starts at $1,639, and that's without a graphics card, memory, storage and an OS. Everything else in our system -- an RTX 2070 GPU, a 320GB Intel Optane SSD, a 2TB Kingston SSD, 16GB of DDR4 RAM, and a copy of Windows 10 Professional -- brings the total cost to an eye-watering $3,100."
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostFri Dec 11, 2020 12:44 am

Andrew Kolakowski wrote:There are PC options which are somehow portable, yet fairly powerful (different league than Mac mini), but they cost adequately:
https://www.engadget.com/intel-nuc-9-ex ... n_0RCfLrz8

"At this point the NUC 9 Extreme might sound too good to be true. It's fast and almost as flexible as a normal desktop. But there's a downside, and it's a big one: It'll cost you dearly. The high-end Core i9 kit we reviewed starts at $1,639, and that's without a graphics card, memory, storage and an OS. Everything else in our system -- an RTX 2070 GPU, a 320GB Intel Optane SSD, a 2TB Kingston SSD, 16GB of DDR4 RAM, and a copy of Windows 10 Professional -- brings the total cost to an eye-watering $3,100."


Yes, I've research this and the cost is the deterring factor. Otherwise I would go with a Windows system.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostFri Dec 11, 2020 1:33 am

I think it depends what you mean by portable. I view portable as a laptop , I know Rob has a different use case, and the ASUS Zephyrus is faster than the M1 products as long as you are on mains power for encoding ( which the Mini would need too ). See Max Tech review. If you have a nice big machine at home then the Air is great I think. You can get the best of both get an Air for travel and have a powerful Windows machine at home for all the grunt work. Though if you want to stay Windows then the ASUS Zephyrus is fast and only suffers a little on battery for encoding. I can see the next version of Zephyrus using Zen3 parts may be even faster and use less power. The Zephyrus G14 that Max tested was $300 more than the Macbook Pro.

EDIT : I have the prices wrong I think as I took them from Max Tech. The Zephyrus is actually cheaper the difference depends where you buy things of course.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostFri Dec 11, 2020 5:25 pm

Regarding the innovation aspect, has anyone done a comparison with PS5 for example which is a fairly powerful SOC system to put it mildly and cheaper than Mac Mini. Only thing missing is a general purpose OS.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSat Jan 02, 2021 2:13 pm

Seems such a mixed bag out there in terms of results using the M1 stuff to work with BRAW.

I've seen a lot of very negative videos showing 4.6/6k braw struggling with timeline playback at 5fps on both the air/pro/mini with a mix of 8 and 16gb variants. Admittedly some use different versions of resolve, some use different BRAW compression, some have different effects, some aren't using optimised media/proxy mode etc. But still very tricky to judge on YouTube alone.

I'm toying with a 16gb 13" pro as an 'on the road' laptop for reviewing rushes/making rough cuts/running live streams etc to replace my current intel 13" mbp (2.7ghz dual core i5, 8gb, iris 6100 ) but if the replacement still struggles then I don't see much value in replacing just yet apart from battery etc.

Some of the projects I do on the road involve multiple layers of video / picture in picture which I suspect would be an issue.

I'm hopeful that by the time they update the rest of the line I'll be able to replace my late 2015 iMac 5k (4ghz quad core i7/32GB/R9 395X 4GB) but for now it's the most efficient thing I have as an editing machine, as slow and noisy as it is.

My aim is to wait for a laptop that can outperform the iMac and use it as my main machine/on the road machine so I don't have to mess around with backup up resolve databases/projects etc if I have to travel in the middle of an edit. Was looking at a 16" intel with 5600m but not in a great rush so I'll see what 2021 brings.

(That said the 13" pro is (relatively) cheap so might be worth an experiment).
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSat Jan 02, 2021 11:01 pm

robedge wrote:Beat it on what?

In the video that Uli linked, Max Yuryev compares the M1 MacBook Pro and an Asus Zephyrus Gaming laptop. He says that the Asus has inferior resolution (the one he used is 1080p, although it's available for more money at 1440p) and poor colour accuracy, contrast and brightness range. It can't give 100% of its potential performance, including on graphics, unless it's plugged in. This kinda undermines one of the fundamental reasons why people purchase laptops. It weighs 272g/9.6oz more than the MacBook. On build quality, Tom's Hardware, which highly recommends the Zephyrus for laptop gaming, says that the keyboard is "shoddy". Max says that the trackpad is "terrible". Depending on configuration, it costs as much as US$2,000.

If there's a laptop with the Zephyrus's AMD CPU/Nvidia GPU specs that someone might actually purchase for video or photo editing, and that can deliver on those specs without being plugged in, Max apparently couldn't identify it.


max yuryev is a clueless chatterbox - who is only out for clicks

all actualy M1 sucks with BRAW - they are optimised for H264/H265
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSun Jan 03, 2021 1:02 am

Mark Foster wrote:max yuryev is a clueless chatterbox - who is only out for clicks



Of the YouTube videos on the M1 computers, the ones that I found useful were those by Marques Brownlee, David Lee and Mark Spencer. Brownlee's and Lee's videos were published just after the launch, with no testing, but gave what I think is sound advice about getting on the bandwagon. In my view, Mark Spencer knows what he's talking about.

I'm surprised that Jonathan Morrison has so far been silent on the M1 computers.

I think that Max Yureyev means well, but there's no denying that he is trying to build a YouTube channel, and I think that his videos, and their frequency and style, reflect that. There's also a backstory that's maybe worth being aware of. About three years ago, Yuryev had a rough time with YouTube as a company that came close to ending his channel. Leaving aside the rights and wrongs about that episode, he's fought back from close to zero.

Yuryev at least makes an effort to be independent. YouTube is quickly becoming a modern version of the Shopping Channel. For example, right now there are several videos being published that purport to be reviews of Portkeys's US$400 L-EYE EVF. With one exception, every maker of these "reviews" received the Portkeys EVF for free, indeed may have been paid. Also, every one of these people claims, at the beginning of his video, that getting the EVF for free has no impact on his review.

Apparently there would be nothing wrong if Pete Wells, the dining critic for the New York Times, got free food from the restaurants that he reviews, as long as the restaurants don't require the New York Times to publish a positive review in exchange for the free food/payment.

My personal view, going back to what I thought I learnt in high school, is that YouTube "reviewers" and their apologists who keep asserting this position on ethics think that we're all half-wits.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSun Jan 03, 2021 10:11 am

just, you should question everything as well as much else
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostWed Jan 13, 2021 4:41 pm

I've stayed out of this thread for awhile. That was a lot to catch up on.

While most of this was focused on using the M1 for post production work (editing, Logic, etc), that is not where I am leaning. My '09 Mac Pro, after some significant upgrades, is still going strong and has no issues with Logic, Resolve, FCPx, Motion or Blender. Most of my work does not involve super tight turn arounds so I don't mind walking away while renders run. My '18 MacBook Pro (32gb ram) is perfect for being on the road. The '09 will probably be replaced at some point later this year.

For me, the M1 mini is intriguing for running my flight case for live production. Has anyone used one in a live production environment? Theatre, music, corporate?

I have clients that ask for streaming. For some clients, I can use my Teradek box to send to YouTube, FB, Twitch, etc. For others, mainly corporate, they want me for Zoom productions. With those, I use OBS.

How is the performance with OBS and Zoom running? Maybe with ATEM Software Control running too? Although, I'd probably leave the ATEM control on my laptop and still use my iPad Pro for running my X32.

As for Apple vs Microsoft, in a past life I was a software engineer. All the way from down in the trenches code monkey to a demo jockey... um... I mean sales engineer. I've written code for Windows, OS X and iOS. I've always used Apple mostly because things just work. Sure, every system has quirks but, in my experience, those quirks are less frustrating in OS X than they are in Windows.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostWed Jan 13, 2021 5:06 pm

For things like OBS and anything live streaming (live encoding) M1 should be good as their chip for h264/5 decoding/encoding is decent (also whole unified memory idea is good for those cases). Of course it's a matter of those apps using it properly, but this is just a matter of time.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostFri Jan 15, 2021 5:36 pm

For what it's worth I saw a post on Reddit the other day complaining that the 8gb pro asked to shut down apps as it ran out of memory on a live gig but they were also running dmx as well as zoom/atem/OBS etc
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSat Jan 16, 2021 2:28 am

That could be asking a bit too much from the poor thing.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSat Jan 16, 2021 3:21 pm

I’ve heard 8GB is the new 64 because architecture, how come?
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSun Jan 17, 2021 2:16 pm

edward_mantle wrote:For what it's worth I saw a post on Reddit the other day complaining that the 8gb pro asked to shut down apps as it ran out of memory on a live gig but they were also running dmx as well as zoom/atem/OBS etc


Good to know although, I wouldn't ever be doing DMX. Just Zoom/ATEM/OBS.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSun Feb 07, 2021 1:43 pm

Intel starts to panic:
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple-M1- ... 176.0.html

Also- what was the machine used for these tests? Theoretical CPU results itself are meaningless, specially when it comes to laptops.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSun Feb 07, 2021 8:39 pm

Andrew Kolakowski wrote:Intel starts to panic:
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple-M1- ... 176.0.html


Sounds like Steve Ballmer on the iPhone, back in 2007:

"Team Blue’s new CEO, Pat Gelsinger, already dismissing the rival as a “lifestyle company in Cupertino”."

Here's Ballmer on his regrets, the Surface and having control over the whole of the product (Rose doesn't rub Ballmer's nose in his 2007 iPhone comment):

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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSun Feb 07, 2021 9:40 pm

Funny enough that what he is talking about is still done only (about) by Apple (even if we know this is exactly what at least currently works). Yet, 90% of companies are doing 10s of about the same products (with many flaws) and then next year repeat exactly the same.
For me in laptops as well as in phones you need about 3 well designed and polished models.

Well- if new CEO is that "smart" then good luck for Intel.
Intel is no way in position to dismiss any rivals and definitely not Apple.

Sounds like they all fall into same trap- "it's working now, so it's going to always work".
No, it won't. You have to keep adapting as current reality is so crazy dynamic. One missed turn and you may be gone for good.
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSat Mar 13, 2021 4:39 pm

This is a bit of a drag. It's rumour mill stuff, but Nikkei Asia says that Apple has rescheduled mass production of the new MacBook Pros from May/June to the second half of the year (i.e. after July 1).
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostSun Mar 14, 2021 1:25 am

Why should Apple not be affected by the supply chain issues from the virus and only graphics cards or Speed Editors?
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Re: The New Mac M1 Computers: Real World Performance

PostMon Mar 15, 2021 7:09 pm

I'm no hardware expert, but I can give my experience as a low budget editor who switched from PC to Mac mini M1.

My last project was edited on the computer that is in my signature. I was to the point in my last project where I had to render out the project in order to see it play in real time. My next step for performance was to upgrade my graphics card to see how that would improve my editing experience. Instead of continuing to upgrade my PC, I moved to M1 to see how that works for me.

Project:
1080 24 FPS.
Mix of BRAW and H.264.
Playback slowdown comes from speed warp, stabilization, noise reduction, and a few other GFX nodes

I moved my SSD with my 'in progress' projects to my M1, and I was actually surprised that my M1 Mac was able to play back my last project in real time even before the render files were finished being created. I've had a few quirks where my video would freeze up, but I'm not sure if this was due to beta software, Mac bugs, or a backup I had running. So far I'm happy with the switch for my level of work.

This is the first time I've had a Mac in my price range that was actually powerful enough for me to use as my editing machine.

The downsides for me as a PC user going to M1:
I need more USB-C for external drives but quality USB-C hubs seem to be hard to find at the under $100 price range and most seem to be made for laptops with connections I don't need.
I like to use three monitors, so for the M1 Mini I needed to add a USB-A Displaylink adapter for my 3rd monitor.

The biggest upsides:
No noise. The only time my PC was quiet was when it was turned off.
Apple ecosystem. I'm in an Apple house, and my PC was the last holdout besides two Amazon Echos.
No more building computers. I'm pretty sure my PC could have been modified or configured to perform better, but I'd prefer to have someone else build my computer if it's still affordable.
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