Blackmagic Forum

Using the 4k Mini to convert some old Betacam SP tapes to digital. Working well enough in the media express but is not pulling the original time code from the tape.

Interestingly on the media express screen (pic attached - 1:12;20;10), the time code is coming up and I verified that it matches the original time code from the tape. But once it's captured and in my editing program (tried it in resolve and premiere pro) the time code reverts to a 0:00:00:00 from the start.

I tested it additionally by removing the remote cable (where the TC is 'fed' from) and the time code on the screen pauses. And then plugging it back in and the time code on the screen jumps ahead to match the time code form the deck.

Any ideas?

I think the problem may be that Media Express does not capture to native NLE video codecs, such as Prores and DNxHD/R. I am not at my machine but I think it is things like AVI, DPX and a very old BMD codec - these codecs may not incorporate TC. I think it is always better to capture within the target NLE, at it's preferred codec. It seems to me Media Express is a rather old programme that was perhaps intended for archive or playout. If it reads TC from your RS422 cable then I don't think there is any problem with your deck or I/O device.

Media Express is simple software to provide bare minimum functionality for free (but it lacks features).
If you do a lot of ingest then invest into better capture app like ToolsOnAir for Mac or METUS for PC.

You can always overwrite MOV startTC (if MediaExpress doesn't set it properly) with Alex Mogurenko AMCDX app. I think MediaExpress use to set start TC properly.

The in and out timecode boxes on your example picture show no timecode. They should match the timecode on tape. It looks like no timecode is available to Media Express.

Steve Fishwick wrote:I think the problem may be that Media Express does not capture to native NLE video codecs, such as Prores and DNxHD/R. I am not at my machine but I think it is things like AVI, DPX and a very old BMD codec - these codecs may not incorporate TC. I think it is always better to capture within the target NLE, at it's preferred codec. It seems to me Media Express is a rather old programme that was perhaps intended for archive or playout. If it reads TC from your RS422 cable then I don't think there is any problem with your deck or I/O device.

I capture using Media Express to ProRes without issue. It's been available for many years.

Mac only of course.

Peter Cave wrote:The in and out timecode boxes on your example picture show no timecode. They should match the timecode on tape. It looks like no timecode is available to Media Express.

This means captures may be done as crash capture, not batch based on TC in/out. Maybe this is why TC is not preserved.

I would be looking for why the timecode is not getting to Media Express.
Media Express can log with timecode and batch capture. BetaSP can have both VITC and LTC so it is important to set the deck timecode settings to use the correct TC source.

Peter Cave wrote: would be looking for why the timecode is not getting to Media Express.
Media Express can log with timecode and batch capture. BetaSP can have both VITC and LTC so it is important to set the deck timecode settings to use the correct TC source.

Very true about setting the deck, but I still recommend actually capturing within the NLE of choice. I have no problem with legacy decks and Avid Media Composer using the US 4K Mini. Previously I had to use an Addendum Rosetta serial to RS422 convertor with I/O but now the RS422 on the BMD device works fine for batch capture and control. And yes there is no Prores capture with Media Express on Windows here, neither is there DNXHD/R.

Peter Cave wrote:The in and out timecode boxes on your example picture show no timecode. They should match the timecode on tape. It looks like no timecode is available to Media Express.

Thanks Peter. I was meaning the 01:12:20:10 that is the overlay. That is the correct timecode coming from the Betacam tape. So it seems to me it is 'seeing' it. When I capture and then play back in Premiere pro it does not have those numbers embedded.

I have made some progress though - added the Hyperdeck Studio HD plus into the mix and it is pulling the correct time code from Betacm. The only issue here is that once it starts recording it doesn't 'check back'. So if there is a break in the tape of a few seconds where no time code was recorded (was using rec run) it keeps going forward and then the code runs off.

Basically, it refers to the time code at first and then doesn't check back.

Does embed it though when I check it in Premiere Pro.

If this is an ongoing task, try to get any old Mac and FCP 7. It was very good at that task, even handling TC breaks, and I sometimes miss it. It‘ll be grabbing ProRes, which can also be edited in DR under Windows.

What happens if you use the LTC input rather than harvesting TC from the 422 CTL track? In my experience 422 was only ever used for reading LTC.

The rec run is basically fixing the TC breaks because 422 editing falls apart with non consecutive TC. In the day you had to stripe the destination tapes with TC or risk sending the machine off into space looking for TC that either didn’t exist or was duplicated.

Good Luck

Exactly. We used to call it 'black striping' and not doing it was considered a reason to get fired.