Support for ProRes Raw

Why wont apple make fcpx run on. Windows?

Ricardo Marty

Due to the same reason why BM doesn't want to support ProRes RAW (owning own RAW format).

A pro res raw license costs money a bear doesn't. The new ios is a controlled e
nvironment and no pluging is accepted without apples permission which maybe include some some cash.


Ricardo Marty

Decoder SDK is free, but you need to sign an agreement with Apple (on their rules).

Vegas Pro 18 will eventually support ProRes Raw when approved by Apple.

Confirmed by a Magix employee here: https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/prores-raw-and-zraw--122601

So with the announcement of the a7sIII being capable of recordring RAW 16 bit over HDMI (With a full size HDMI port My desire to use prorewRAW is now even larger than before. Please black magic. please support it!

Agreed. It's time for Resolve to support ProRes raw. And I think they will eventually, especially if they want folks to continue using Resolve Products for post and color.

Aaaaannnyy daaay noooww...

I also wonder if they're waiting until their Blackmagic Cameras can also shoot it.

definitely

Tried using 5.9K ProRes RAW footage from the S1H inside Assimilate Scratch.
It's incredibly fast and I can also change white balance/tint and ISO levels and colors space.

Works great, will dig around further.

ProRes RAW is now available for the Panasonic S1H, and I've been working with this. With ProRes RAW from my Sony FS5 I transcode the ProRes RAW into ProRes 4444 with Compressor, and this runs successfully in Resolve. I tried this with the S1H footage and sadly it doesn't work, this crushes the blacks, so it's not useable in Resolve. So it's back to FCPX with S1H ProRes RAW for now.

There is one potential workaround - load the clips into a FCPX timeline, boost the shadows up a little, and export the timeline with ProRes 4444. The blacks look okay in Resolve this way, but this is so cumbersome it is not very workable. I really hope someone like EditReady or perhaps Atomos steps up with a converter. Or better, that ProRes RAW gets incorporated into Resolve.

Finally with the recent Resolve update we got the native support for ProRes RAW. I have been playing around the features and it looks amazing and works seamlessly!

There's no ProRes Raw support in any public version of DaVinci Resolve at this time. So what do you mean?

What version are you talking about? Using 16.2.5 and can’t open ProRes RAW files.
4 minutes too late...

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ProRes RAW is now available for the Panasonic S1H, and I've been working with this. With ProRes RAW from my Sony FS5 I transcode the ProRes RAW into ProRes 4444 with Compressor, and this runs successfully in Resolve. I tried this with the S1H footage and sadly it doesn't work, this crushes the blacks, so it's not useable in Resolve. So it's back to FCPX with S1H ProRes RAW for now.

UPDATE. COCKPIT PROBLEM. ProRes RAW to ProRes 4444 conversion works okay with Compressor.


First, for my Resolve workflow I edit in HDR and ACES. With VLog clips on the S1H I use Panasonic V35 for the Input Device Transform. Unfortunately I had used this same transform with the ProRes 4444 clips. Compressor outputs Rec.2020 PQ for the ProRes RAW to ProRes4444 conversion. So I changed the transform to P3-D65 ST2084, and no more crushed blacks.

I also checked Adobe Media Encoder (on a Mac) for this conversion. If you check Render Max Depth and then select Rec.2100 PQ (instead of Rec.709) you also get a good conversion, with a little different gamma but very workable. This could be a path for PC users to run ProRes RAW with Resolve.

I add the Panasonic VLOG_RAWGamut_to_VLOG-VGamut_forS1H_ver100 LUT and get colors that to the eye look like VLog ACES colors. Over the next days days I'll compare ProRes RAW to VLog out of the camera.

Question: does FCPX support playing back BMD Raw? (Asking for a friend.)

Maybe BMD can make a higher tier version of resolve at a higher cost to address the prores issue. Basically the same as studio only that it includes prores raw and any other expensive licensed codec for both coding and encoding on a windows machine. Or sell an add on to all existing DR studio owners.


Ricardo Marty

100th time- ProResRAW decoding and ProRes decoding/encoding licensing is free. Please stop spreading this crap about some high costs without having any real info about it. It's all myth spread all over again. For BM it's purely strategic/'political' decision.

100th time- ProResRAW decoding and ProRes decoding/encoding licensing is free. Please stop spreading this crap about some high costs without having any real info about it. It's all myth spread all over again. For BM it's purely strategic/'political' decision.

yep.

Question: does FCPX support playing back BMD Raw? (Asking for a friend.)

To be honest, and with all due respect, FCPX is a sub-productline of MacOS platform (and video production solution is the only professional market remained profitable to Apple), but DaVinci Resolve is an industrial standard solution for post production, not a sub-productline of Blackmagic cameras, it doesn't make sense and it's not realistic to kidnapping the advantage of Davinci (the color grading) to compensate the competetion of the cameras and standards, while the Davinci Resolve as a whole solution (NLE+Color+etc.), still is a newcomer and trying to convince more market share.

Please BMD Make VA capture BRAW from sony a7s lll

Ricardo Marty

... DaVinci Resolve is an industrial standard solution for post production, not a sub-productline of Blackmagic cameras...

Perhaps.

Well it would be nice if they surprised us with ProRes raw any time now. #fingersCrossed

Final Cut Pro X v10.4.9 was released today and for the first time ProRes Raw now has controls for ISO and color temperature in an Apple app (Scratch had some extra controls a bit earlier).

If BMD wants to be considered a professional company they need to tell us catagorically whether or not they WILL support Prores Raw.

As it stands I'm avoiding making the switch from Premiere because I don't want to deal with a company that refuses to support popular standards going forward.

If BMD wants to be considered a professional company they need to tell us catagorically whether or not they WILL support Prores Raw.

As it stands I'm avoiding making the switch from Premiere because I don't want to deal with a company that refuses to support popular standards going forward.

Bye

Ricardo Marty

If BMD wants to be considered a professional company they need to tell us catagorically whether or not they WILL support Prores Raw.

As it stands I'm avoiding making the switch from Premiere because I don't want to deal with a company that refuses to support popular standards going forward.

Bye

Ricardo Marty

Fanboi.
Btw. there are cameras that are not made by Blackmagic and more and more are supporting ProRes RAW - just in case you didn't know.

And especially a color grading suite should be camera-agnostic, don't you think?

In the meantime FCP X gets standard RAW controls for ProRes RAW.

If BMD wants to be considered a professional company they need to tell us catagorically whether or not they WILL support Prores Raw.

As it stands I'm avoiding making the switch from Premiere because I don't want to deal with a company that refuses to support popular standards going forward.

So prores raw makes you professional?


Ricardo Marty

In the meantime FCP X gets standard RAW controls for ProRes RAW.

Yep, finally full WB/Tint and ISO metadata support.
Also noticed manufacturers are free to provide plugins for their own codecs for FCPX, there's a well documented input API for that...

And the new iMac is quite tempting also. Right now looking into Assimilate Scratch and the IQ on the S1H using PRR is simply fantastic.

If BMD wants to be considered a professional company they need to tell us catagorically whether or not they WILL support Prores Raw.

As it stands I'm avoiding making the switch from Premiere because I don't want to deal with a company that refuses to support popular standards going forward.

So prores raw makes you professional?


Ricardo Marty

No, but the demand for ProRes RAW support in the professional post production market far outpaces that of Blackmagic RAW. This is why there are more cameras implementing ProRes RAW support, and more NLEs implementing ProRes RAW support - while very few are implementing Blackmagic RAW support.

So, asking if FCPX support BM RAW is cute, but completely misses the point and attempts to pass the buck over to Apple when there really isn't any buck to pass.

ProRes RAW is needed not because Apple made it, but because it's what professionals in the market are asking for. BM RAW isn't in FCPX because almost no one is asking for it. There is already a solution that is more widely supported, and which is being taken up at a much better rate than BM RAW: ProRes RAW.

IMO, they were a bit late bringing this to market, because Apple is fairly "reliable" with these things and professionals tend to trust their solutions.

At some point, this IS going to start to hurt the Resolve product - especially when we look outside of the Colorist market.

Inventing ways to argue with people who want this, for obvious reasons, doesn't change the situation - or the facts of the matter.

If BMD wants to be considered a professional company they need to tell us catagorically whether or not they WILL support Prores Raw.

As it stands I'm avoiding making the switch from Premiere because I don't want to deal with a company that refuses to support popular standards going forward.

So prores raw makes you professional?


Ricardo Marty

No, but the demand for ProRes RAW support in the professional post production market far outpaces that of Blackmagic RAW. This is why there are more cameras implementing ProRes RAW support, and more NLEs implementing ProRes RAW support - while very few are implementing Blackmagic RAW support.

So, asking if FCPX support BM RAW is cute, but completely misses the point and attempts to pass the buck over to Apple when there really isn't any buck to pass.

ProRes RAW is needed not because Apple made it, but because it's what professionals in the market are asking for. BM RAW isn't in FCPX because almost no one is asking for it. There is already a solution that is more widely supported, and which is being taken up at a much better rate than BM RAW: ProRes RAW.

IMO, they were a bit late bringing this to market, because Apple is fairly "reliable" with these things and professionals tend to trust their solutions.

At some point, this IS going to start to hurt the Resolve product - especially when we look outside of the Colorist market.

Inventing ways to argue with people who want this, for obvious reasons, doesn't change the situation - or the facts of the matter.

For a codec the just became fully supported in fcpx and not to many cameras using it sounds like you are just bragging.


Ricardo Marty

No, but the demand for ProRes RAW support in the professional post production market far outpaces that of Blackmagic RAW. This is why there are more cameras implementing ProRes RAW support, and more NLEs implementing ProRes RAW support - while very few are implementing Blackmagic RAW support.

So, asking if FCPX support BM RAW is cute, but completely misses the point and attempts to pass the buck over to Apple when there really isn't any buck to pass.

ProRes RAW is needed not because Apple made it, but because it's what professionals in the market are asking for. BM RAW isn't in FCPX because almost no one is asking for it. There is already a solution that is more widely supported, and which is being taken up at a much better rate than BM RAW: ProRes RAW.

IMO, they were a bit late bringing this to market, because Apple is fairly "reliable" with these things and professionals tend to trust their solutions.

At some point, this IS going to start to hurt the Resolve product - especially when we look outside of the Colorist market.

Inventing ways to argue with people who want this, for obvious reasons, doesn't change the situation - or the facts of the matter.

For a codec the just became fully supported in fcpx and not to many cameras using it sounds like you are just bragging.


Ricardo Marty

Bragging about what? I don't use FCPX. I don't even own a Mac, anymore. What are you going on about?

ProRes RAW may have just gotten "full support" in FCPX, but it's actually supported in 4-5 Professional Cutting systems, without reliance on dubious plugins to force support into them.

No one cares to brag about a CODEC. They just want it to work so that they don't have to waste time and drive space transcoding Terabytes of media to be compatible with Resolve (when other NLEs do not require this workflow complication) - a process that strips them of much of the flexibility inherit in acquiring a RAW CODEC in the first place.

If that is something to brag about, then you need to go troll those people.

I don't have time for fanboys, so I'll silence you, moving forwards.

Bye.

Anyone following the camera market will know there is a lot of ProRes Raw footage coming our way soon.

If BM don't want to support the format for commercial reasons that's their prerogative. What would be respectful to their users would be to communicate this so we can make informed choices.

If BM don't want to support the format for commercial reasons that's their prerogative. What would be respectful to their users would be to communicate this so we can make informed choices.

I think this is a very fair comment that should hopefully be enough to end this thread.

BMD can really do whatever they want. It may be to their peril, but that's clearly their choice to make.

But users are also free to pursue other alternatives if ProRes RAW support is a make-or-break feature they can't live without. And if enough people move away from Resolve because of this, BMD will surely change their tune if the only reason they don't support it is purely political.

Please pretty pretty please add Resolve/Fusion support for ProRes raw. It is extremely important for a number of us. If not get braw on as an option atomos products. Better yet, do both.

get braw on as an option atomos products

Probably not going to happen, here's why.

get braw on as an option atomos products

Probably not going to happen, here's why.

Oh man this explains so much. There is a really wierd NAB interview from one of the Atamos guys where they really badmouth BM. I never realized the companies were so intertwined.

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+1 For ProRes Raw support in Resolve. My Sony A7sIII is coming soon. Would love to also use the 12g Monitor as well. I still use my pocket cinema camera and will probably get the 12k Ursa. But the Sony is looking like a good general purpose camera with great autofocus that will solve so many day-to-day things for me.

Now if 12g could record BRAW from Sony camera, then that would be even better solution in my book.

Final Cut Pro X v10.4.9 was released today and for the first time ProRes Raw now has controls for ISO and color temperature in an Apple app (Scratch had some extra controls a bit earlier).

Unfortunately not for S1H ProRes RAW. I was eagerly awaiting this ability but it has not come yet. Am I missing something? No real reason as of yet to shoot PR RAW with S1H if I want to maintain an FCP X workflow, which is what I want to do.

The S1H should be supported according to this list:

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT211277

I am disappointed that the Z6 gets no support at all. Tried Assimilate Scratch and don’t think that I want to switch.
I think that Atomos is quiet successful pushing this codec / combination. But there are still some downsides - the biggest for me the lack of support in Resolve.


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The S1H should be supported according to this list:

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT211277

Yes, it is supported but there are no controls available for adjusting RAW data. It's no different than working with ProRes files. I've seen demos of ProRes RAW from other cameras that do have the RAW controls available.

The S1H should be supported according to this list:

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT211277

Ah. I figured it out. I had to edit the meta data view of the inspector palette and add those options.

ProRes RAW is now available for the Panasonic S1H, and I've been working with this. With ProRes RAW from my Sony FS5 I transcode the ProRes RAW into ProRes 4444 with Compressor, and this runs successfully in Resolve. I tried this with the S1H footage and sadly it doesn't work, this crushes the blacks, so it's not useable in Resolve. So it's back to FCPX with S1H ProRes RAW for now.

Hello forum, new kid on the block here. Recently switched from Premiere to Resolve and I think i'm gonna stick around. Roughly at the same time, I got an S1H and was very happy to start shooting ProRes Raw with the Ninja V.

Charles et al. - what's been your experience transcoding ProRes RAW to 4444? Does Compressor do a better job than Media Encoder? Is 4444XQ overkill? Should I just stick to V-Log and ProRes HQ for now?

Thanks for your help

The S1H should be supported according to this list:

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT211277

Yes, it is supported but there are no controls available for adjusting RAW data. It's no different than working with ProRes files. I've seen demos of ProRes RAW from other cameras that do have the RAW controls available.

Dave could give us more info about it?
me too i downloaded some demos of prores raw, but no more control than exposure and wb.
I can have the same exact result on the same footage with exposure in resolve (gain in a linear node) and wb balance, or same footage converted in common prores 12bit.

I'm very interest to know if is camera related the ability to have more control, or recorder related.
Sometimes seems i'm against the prores raw, i'm supporter of every raw if it give me more control than a simple prores, if there is ability to have more control on prores raw this change all.

The S1H should be supported according to this list:

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT211277

Yes, it is supported but there are no controls available for adjusting RAW data. It's no different than working with ProRes files. I've seen demos of ProRes RAW from other cameras that do have the RAW controls available.

Dave could give us more info about it?
me too i downloaded some demos of prores raw, but no more control than exposure and wb.
I can have the same exact result on the same footage with exposure in resolve (gain in a linear node) and wb balance, or same footage converted in common prores 12bit.

I'm very interest to know if is camera related the ability to have more control, or recorder related.
Sometimes seems i'm against the prores raw, i'm supporter of every raw if it give me more control than a simple prores, if there is ability to have more control on prores raw this change all.

In Assimilate Scratch and FCPX you have all the RAW options ProRes RAW offers.
White balance, tint, ISO, exposure, different color spaces etc.

And it's actual RAW with all the bells and whistles such as debayering in post.
Which means that white balance, transfer and gamut aren't burned in either, just linear RAW data.

I would say it could be that way. I own a Nikon Z6 and it seems that Nikon does not provide all the needed metadata.
So, in Scratch you can edit WB and ISO, but you always get 5600 and 800 as a starting point no matter how you set the camera.
According to a friend and the provided Apple document you get no options in FCPX at all.
So it’s obviously depending on the camera and not the recorder.


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In Assimilate Scratch and FCPX you have all the RAW options ProRes RAW offers.
White balance, tint, ISO, exposure, different color spaces etc.

And it's actual RAW with all the bells and whistles such as debayering in post.
Which means that white balance, transfer and gamut aren't burned in either, just linear RAW data.

Debayering before/after has little effect on wb, transfer function and gamut. These can be changed after with practically identical results given that image is debayered to format with enough quality to hold the data. Problem is usually the latter, cameras store debayered data with quality loss. Best thing raw data offers is reduced storage need.

ProRes Raw is gaining insane traction - now its a matter of deciding whether to go with BRAW or ProRes RAW - but here's the thing - people are not going to buy BlackMagic cameras so they can use resolve.

Its the other way around - people are ditching Resolve beacuse it doesnt support ProRes RAW. Assimilate is poised to eat their lunch - SCRATCH is an insanely capable app which is now priced super aggressively - FCP, Premiere Pro, AVID, Baselight - lots of alternatives.

BlackMagic needs to support ProRes RAW or see the rapid spread of Resolve grind to a halt.

We were looking at transitioning from Premiere to resolve but thats obviously off the table for now.

Again, even if you shoot BRAW who would like to be boxed into a corner where you need to go "sorry, cant do that" when someone needs you to work with ProRes RAW ? For any NLE to be taken into serious consideration (in this marketspace) it needs to be able to handle all MAJOR formats.

ProRes Raw is gaining insane traction - now its a matter of deciding whether to go with BRAW or ProRes RAW - but here's the thing - people are not going to buy BlackMagic cameras so they can use resolve.

If you don’t buy BMD hardware you are not useful commercially anyway, so why bother with adding prores raw? Prores raw users don’t buy BMD stuff, this is money down the drain. Resolve only brings in money once in a lifetime from a user, but people buy new gear all the time.

I have found a petition. Please everyone sign it. https://www.change.org/p/add-prores-raw ... m=copylink

Well maybe they'll add ProRes RAW support in the upcoming 17.0

Premiere just added full native Prores Raw support with color management even.

Nikon Z x series II will support BRAW via HDMI capture from BM VA - but I would still like Resolve to be able to read ProRes RAW.