REQUEST OF ADDING SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

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Francesco Bollorino

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REQUEST OF ADDING SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

PostSat Apr 10, 2021 10:26 am

As it happens with OBS (but with no problem of crash during a streaming section) It'd be nice and really usefull that ATEM MINI could accept NDI sources from Skype as in this way we'd connect to our live streamings also REMOTE PARTECIPANTS (connected with Skype) seen as individual audiovideo sources.
I DO THINK that this kind of feature (I repeat to be clear: as it happens with OBS) is mandatary in these days of webinars to be added to ATEM MINI PRO controll app
Is it possible?
Of course I know that NOW it is unpossible BUT I'd like to know from BMD if they are working on this kind of upgrade (as it happens with OBS we need that the control app can see and incorporate NDI Sources as "further alternative sources" to be added to the mixer - feed I think throught the ethernet port - in order to make streamings with also remote partecipants)
Last edited by Francesco Bollorino on Sat Apr 10, 2021 3:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Francesco Bollorino
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David_Anderson

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Re: SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

PostSat Apr 10, 2021 1:05 pm

I'm sure BM can do anything they want but considering they've resisted NDI support to this point I'd be surprised to see it in the Mini.

Best,

David

Francesco Bollorino wrote:As it happens with OBS (but with no problem of crash during a streaming section) It'd be nice and really usefull that ATEM MINI could accept NDI sources from Skype as in this way we'd connect to our live streamings also REMOTE PARTECIPANTS (connected with Skype) seen as individual audiovideo sources.
I DO THINK that this kind of feature (I repeat to be clear: as it happens with OBS) is mandatary in these days of webinars to be added to ATEM MINI PRO controll app
Is it possible?
Of course I know that NOW it is unpossible BUT I'd like to know from BMD if they are working on this kind of upgrade (as it happens with OBS we need that the control app can see and incorporate NDI Sources as "further alternative sources" to be added to the mixer - feed I think throught the ethernet port - in order to make streamings with also remote partecipants)
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Francesco Bollorino

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Re: SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

PostSat Apr 10, 2021 3:34 pm

Dear David I dont understand why they'd not support NDI Sources as IT doesnt damage any of their products and most of all adds an important feature to the MINI as the MINI works, in simple words, as an hardware driven OBS so the NDI support expecially for remote skype connection is mandatary most of all in PRO enviroment.
IMO a MINI PRO ISO with multiple NDI sources from remote is what you need in order to make "safe and professional webinars" as most of webinars by nature are managed with remote partecipants and a solution of this kind is BY FAR better the using ZOOM or OBS.
As the former is not born for webinars feed to youtube and has a lot of limitation in online editing during a streaming event and the latter has problems of stability... (I had two crash during a webinar... )
Life is strange....

David_Anderson wrote:I'm sure BM can do anything they want but considering they've resisted NDI support to this point I'd be surprised to see it in the Mini.

Best,

David

Francesco Bollorino wrote:As it happens with OBS (but with no problem of crash during a streaming section) It'd be nice and really usefull that ATEM MINI could accept NDI sources from Skype as in this way we'd connect to our live streamings also REMOTE PARTECIPANTS (connected with Skype) seen as individual audiovideo sources.
I DO THINK that this kind of feature (I repeat to be clear: as it happens with OBS) is mandatary in these days of webinars to be added to ATEM MINI PRO controll app
Is it possible?
Of course I know that NOW it is unpossible BUT I'd like to know from BMD if they are working on this kind of upgrade (as it happens with OBS we need that the control app can see and incorporate NDI Sources as "further alternative sources" to be added to the mixer - feed I think throught the ethernet port - in order to make streamings with also remote partecipants)
Francesco Bollorino
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Francesco Bollorino

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Re: SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

PostSun Apr 11, 2021 5:34 am

and we have to add that adding NDI capability to the control app of the MINI seems a very simple job.....

[quote="David_Anderson"]I'm sure BM can do anything they want but considering they've resisted NDI support to this point I'd be surprised to see it in the Mini.

Best,

David
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Re: REQUEST OF ADDING SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

PostSun Apr 11, 2021 7:24 am

Adding NDI support to the control app won't get the signals into the Atem Mini though. You'd be needing a major architecture change in the actual hardware for that to happen, for which there may well not be enough resources available or physical links between chips on the circuit boards.

The Atem range of mixers are not based on general purpose processors that can be repurposed for whatever new feature people desire and they don't have a surplus of resources waiting for new ideas. They are cost optimised hardware switchers, with the components selected based on the features desired at the time of design.

Sure, it's easy to use a few more MB of code space, a few more MHz of CPU use and a bit more RAM on your PC when OBS adds a new feature, but impossible to do so if those extra resources don't exist in your hardware switcher.
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Re: REQUEST OF ADDING SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

PostSun Apr 11, 2021 8:52 am

I do think that the controll app can be modified in order to feed NDI Skype connection to the MINIs with ethernet connection or USB port as something like a virtual cam like it happens for graphics. I understand that the hardware in not apt to be modify but firmware if necessary YES

codedeltajames wrote:Adding NDI support to the control app won't get the signals into the Atem Mini though. You'd be needing a major architecture change in the actual hardware for that to happen, for which there may well not be enough resources available or physical links between chips on the circuit boards.

The Atem range of mixers are not based on general purpose processors that can be repurposed for whatever new feature people desire and they don't have a surplus of resources waiting for new ideas. They are cost optimised hardware switchers, with the components selected based on the features desired at the time of design.

Sure, it's easy to use a few more MB of code space, a few more MHz of CPU use and a bit more RAM on your PC when OBS adds a new feature, but impossible to do so if those extra resources don't exist in your hardware switcher.
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Re: REQUEST OF ADDING SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

PostMon Apr 12, 2021 11:20 am

Francesco Bollorino wrote:I do think that the controll app can be modified in order to feed NDI Skype connection to the MINIs with ethernet connection or USB port as something like a virtual cam like it happens for graphics


That's not how the media players work.

The software copies the images for the media player into memory on the ATEM and they are "played" from there (from the memory of the ATEM itself). The Mini series does not currently have any functionality that allows video input from the USB or Ethernet connections, nor would I expect that they could easily add that using a firmware update.
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Francesco Bollorino

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Re: REQUEST OF ADDING SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

PostMon Apr 12, 2021 2:24 pm

I have understood Frank BUT admitedly : IT's A PITY as with NDI input from Skype the devide could be PERFECT to be use to manage webinars in real world, as in real world the patecipants attending a webanar are in remote always.... and webinars are the businness of today


Frank Engel wrote:
Francesco Bollorino wrote:I do think that the controll app can be modified in order to feed NDI Skype connection to the MINIs with ethernet connection or USB port as something like a virtual cam like it happens for graphics


That's not how the media players work.

The software copies the images for the media player into memory on the ATEM and they are "played" from there (from the memory of the ATEM itself). The Mini series does not currently have any functionality that allows video input from the USB or Ethernet connections, nor would I expect that they could easily add that using a firmware update.
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Re: REQUEST OF ADDING SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

PostMon Apr 12, 2021 2:44 pm

IF you want NDI.. Get a software mixer. Or go hybrid by using your atem as a capture device and use Vmix / OBS to run the NDI stuff.

As far as known BMD will never commit to NDI.. As it's heavily licensed on hardware devices while it is free of charge for any computer software developer..

A NDI license for a Camera or decoder must be paid to Newtek and is about $300 dollars for each license..
So do still want BMD to include NDI in there devices and you pay $300 or $600 extra for your Atem mini :lol: :lol: :lol:

Just run it on your computer and playout to HDMI or whatever..

BTW BMD is in the TICO alliance.. Which "was" the IP way that BMD wanted to go.. But due to all the high demand of network load for an almost lossless TICO codec you cant do a lot of IP streams in TICO before your network is maxed out..

I bet there will be a new OPEN and free Standard that is better / free instead of NDI that will be supported in a lot of hardware in a few years.. That does not include mayor license fee's to an external party..

Same applies to Dante intergration.. License fee's are just wicked high..
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Francesco Bollorino

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Re: REQUEST OF ADDING SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

PostMon Apr 12, 2021 3:39 pm

I understand, Daniel, BUT: as the licence of NDI is free on software side (As for OBS) why is it unpossible to imagine a solution via the control app? the "only" problem could be in this case to alllow Ethernet input to support NDI sources, seen as "VIRTUAL CAM", to be added to the workflow as further sources to be mixed and streamed as well.
In my opinion a solution of this kind is better the the use of OBS to mke streaming with remote partecipants as it happend ALWAYS AS YOU KNOW.
I figure only harware problem I dont know if this solution it will be unpossible as also in the commercial field this addon could be really usefull to BMD



Xtreemtec wrote:IF you want NDI.. Get a software mixer. Or go hybrid by using your atem as a capture device and use Vmix / OBS to run the NDI stuff.

As far as known BMD will never commit to NDI.. As it's heavily licensed on hardware devices while it is free of charge for any computer software developer..

A NDI license for a Camera or decoder must be paid to Newtek and is about $300 dollars for each license..
So do still want BMD to include NDI in there devices and you pay $300 or $600 extra for your Atem mini :lol: :lol: :lol:

Just run it on your computer and playout to HDMI or whatever..

BTW BMD is in the TICO alliance.. Which "was" the IP way that BMD wanted to go.. But due to all the high demand of network load for an almost lossless TICO codec you cant do a lot of IP streams in TICO before your network is maxed out..

I bet there will be a new OPEN and free Standard that is better / free instead of NDI that will be supported in a lot of hardware in a few years.. That does not include mayor license fee's to an external party..

Same applies to Dante intergration.. License fee's are just wicked high..
Francesco Bollorino
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http://www.youtube.com/PsychiatryonlineITA1
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David_Anderson

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Re: REQUEST OF ADDING SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

PostMon Apr 12, 2021 3:43 pm

Several people here have made recommendations to you. Several have told you that it's very unlikely for BM to add this feature set and told you why but you continue to argue.

Strongly suggest you contact BM directly with your request. They rarely monitor these forums. It is doubtful that they will include this.

Best,

David

Francesco Bollorino wrote:I understand, Daniel, BUT: as the licence of NDI is free on software side (As for OBS) why is it unpossible to imagine a solution via the control app? the "only" problem could be in this case to alllow Ethernet input to support NDI sources, seen as "VIRTUAL CAM", to be added to the workflow as further sources to be mixed and streamed as well.
In my opinion a solution of this kind is better the the use of OBS to mke streaming with remote partecipants as it happend ALWAYS AS YOU KNOW.
I figure only harware problem I dont know if this solution it will be unpossible as also in the commercial field this addon could be really usefull to BMD



Xtreemtec wrote:IF you want NDI.. Get a software mixer. Or go hybrid by using your atem as a capture device and use Vmix / OBS to run the NDI stuff.

As far as known BMD will never commit to NDI.. As it's heavily licensed on hardware devices while it is free of charge for any computer software developer..

A NDI license for a Camera or decoder must be paid to Newtek and is about $300 dollars for each license..
So do still want BMD to include NDI in there devices and you pay $300 or $600 extra for your Atem mini :lol: :lol: :lol:

Just run it on your computer and playout to HDMI or whatever..

BTW BMD is in the TICO alliance.. Which "was" the IP way that BMD wanted to go.. But due to all the high demand of network load for an almost lossless TICO codec you cant do a lot of IP streams in TICO before your network is maxed out..

I bet there will be a new OPEN and free Standard that is better / free instead of NDI that will be supported in a lot of hardware in a few years.. That does not include mayor license fee's to an external party..

Same applies to Dante intergration.. License fee's are just wicked high..
David Anderson
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Francesco Bollorino

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Re: REQUEST OF ADDING SKYPE NDI SOURCES TO ATEM MINI

PostMon Apr 12, 2021 4:45 pm

I have done it, David: I have written to BMD of course but it's a pleasure to me to be helped to understand better from people skilled like you. My aim as many I think is to find simpler solutions (and the hypothesys I have proposed is in this way) for my webinars (very important in my field... actually I run almost 3 o 4 webinars/week with very respected scientists (all in remote connection) who deserve a very respected technology) considending also that my work in psychiatric field is on voluntary base so also the economic side is absolutely mandatary to me..... ;-)

David_Anderson wrote:Several people here have made recommendations to you. Several have told you that it's very unlikely for BM to add this feature set and told you why but you continue to argue.

Strongly suggest you contact BM directly with your request. They rarely monitor these forums. It is doubtful that they will include this.

Best,

David

Francesco Bollorino wrote:I understand, Daniel, BUT: as the licence of NDI is free on software side (As for OBS) why is it unpossible to imagine a solution via the control app? the "only" problem could be in this case to alllow Ethernet input to support NDI sources, seen as "VIRTUAL CAM", to be added to the workflow as further sources to be mixed and streamed as well.
In my opinion a solution of this kind is better the the use of OBS to mke streaming with remote partecipants as it happend ALWAYS AS YOU KNOW.
I figure only harware problem I dont know if this solution it will be unpossible as also in the commercial field this addon could be really usefull to BMD



Xtreemtec wrote:IF you want NDI.. Get a software mixer. Or go hybrid by using your atem as a capture device and use Vmix / OBS to run the NDI stuff.

As far as known BMD will never commit to NDI.. As it's heavily licensed on hardware devices while it is free of charge for any computer software developer..

A NDI license for a Camera or decoder must be paid to Newtek and is about $300 dollars for each license..
So do still want BMD to include NDI in there devices and you pay $300 or $600 extra for your Atem mini :lol: :lol: :lol:

Just run it on your computer and playout to HDMI or whatever..

BTW BMD is in the TICO alliance.. Which "was" the IP way that BMD wanted to go.. But due to all the high demand of network load for an almost lossless TICO codec you cant do a lot of IP streams in TICO before your network is maxed out..

I bet there will be a new OPEN and free Standard that is better / free instead of NDI that will be supported in a lot of hardware in a few years.. That does not include mayor license fee's to an external party..

Same applies to Dante intergration.. License fee's are just wicked high..
Francesco Bollorino
Editor of Psychiatry on line Italia
Thematic Channel on Youtube
http://www.youtube.com/PsychiatryonlineITA1

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